Lose % last 12 managers

[MattWSM]

More stats...last 12 managers in order of lose % - after Saturday loss now 2nd to Steve Coppell.

Manager-played/lost/%

1. SCoppell - 2/2/100

2. NP - 64/33/51

3. DM - 63/32/50

4. SoD - 44/20/45

5. DH - 43/19/44

6. KM - 69/29/42

7. LJ - 217/79/36

8. JP - 58/19/32

9. GJ - 239/74/30

10. BT - 61/17/27

11. DW - 226/64/28

12. SCotterill - 63/11/17

[And Its Smith]

Pretty irrelevant really. What would be better to see is percentages after it could be deemed to be that managers squad.  Judging a manager from day one they take over is nonsense 

[bcfc01]

 

Stats like that mean nothing without context. 

Bit like us - pointless. 

[Harry]

Am I being stupid? I’m sat here trying to work out who JP is, who managed 58 games?? 
The only JP I can think of is John Pemberton, but he certainly didn’t manage us for 58 games? 

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Harry said:

Am I being stupid? I’m sat here trying to work out who JP is, who managed 58 games?? 
The only JP I can think of is John Pemberton, but he certainly didn’t manage us for 58 games? 

He might mean TP Tony Pulis?

[Wiltshire robin]

2 minutes ago, Harry said:

Am I being stupid? I’m sat here trying to work out who JP is, who managed 58 games?? 
The only JP I can think of is John Pemberton, but he certainly didn’t manage us for 58 games? 

Maybe joe palmer from 1919 to 1921

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, And Its Smith said:

He might mean TP Tony Pulis?

@Harry scrap that I can see TP did less than 58 games as well. 

[TonyTonyTony]

Pretty damning that.

The context is that now, NP pretty much has his own defence. Naismith, Atkinson, Klose, Wilson, Sykes are all NP signings

When is it right to judge how shit our defending is? How much longer do we just say "ah give Nige time"

We have 2 difficult away games and a severnside derby in the next 4 games - unless we pull out fingers out we could be sat at the bottom of the league then things will turn toxic

[redsince1994]

4 minutes ago, Harry said:

Am I being stupid? I’m sat here trying to work out who JP is, who managed 58 games?? 
The only JP I can think of is John Pemberton, but he certainly didn’t manage us for 58 games? 

Just googled and for some reason Soccerbase thinks Pemberton managed us for 58 games, I assume this is where the data came from.

Can't for the life of me work out why though!

 

Edited August 8, 2022 by redsince1994

[headhunter]

29 minutes ago, redsince1994 said:

Just googled and for some reason Soccerbase thinks Pemberton managed us for 58 games, I assume this is where the data came from.

Can't for the life of me work out why though!

 

I think that should read 14 Jan 2016 when he, Wade & Wilbs held the fort for a few weeks until LJ started

[Harry]

2 hours ago, redsince1994 said:

Just googled and for some reason Soccerbase thinks Pemberton managed us for 58 games, I assume this is where the data came from.

Can't for the life of me work out why though!

 

Ah ok. 
So, can the OP verify the rest of these stats are accurate? 

[Davefevs]

If we want to use “stats” of all City managers, then shouldn’t we do it for games at this level only?  It’s effing futile imho, even if you do that, but at least means you have a fairer comparison.

[Harry]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

If we want to use “stats” of all City managers, then shouldn’t we do it for games at this level only?  It’s effing futile imho, even if you do that, but at least means you have a fairer comparison.

Exactly 

[Tinmans Love Child]

2 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

He might mean TP Tony Pulis?

Doubt it TP didn’t finish a season did he?

[REDOXO]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

If we want to use “stats” of all City managers, then shouldn’t we do it for games at this level only?  It’s effing futile imho, even if you do that, but at least means you have a fairer comparison.

I know it! 
 

It’s always difficult to make comparisons as circumstances differ wildly. The only thing that counts is Nigel Pearson has two years of a three year contract left. The guy was tasked to get rid of players on high wages whether that be to re-sign them on lower pay at the end of their contract or in overwhelmingly the case show them the door….Then rebuild the playing side making us as competitive as he can as quickly as he can, specifically through the academy, while not spending until money has been created by asset sale or pray to the lord almighty that one or two sell ons make it out of someone else’s door. 
 

LJ tasked himself with making the Europa League in five years (with assistance blowing money to the point we are still dealing with now)

SOD was tasked with keeping us up (nil point for that) and bringing us back up (also nil point)

SC tasked with get us up and make us decent (great job until he and Mr Lansdown fell out)

Etc etc etc etc. 

Many don’t like the fact we have been a crap football club for the best part of fifty years and fair enough, I know I Don’t. However, crying about being crap, afterlosing two games by the odd goal, is as pointless as we are.
 

Accept that even if Mr L wanted to splash more cash he can not until we are not in danger of a points deduction and thus we have to sign from the OOC market until further notice and build a team. But hey I’m old enough to remember that Alan Dicks was nearly fired (and That Paul effing Cheesley was the target of the boo boys initially) so the only thing new is this place where we can all express our opinions in the safety of living rooms! (or in my case a cruise ship in the North Atlantic…fLick it was rough this morning) 
 

 

[WarksRobin]

5 hours ago, MattWSM said:

More stats...last 12 managers in order of lose % - after Saturday loss now 2nd to Steve Coppell.

Manager-played/lost/%

1. SCoppell - 2/2/100

2. NP - 64/33/51

3. DM - 63/32/50

4. SoD - 44/20/45

5. DH - 43/19/44

6. KM - 69/29/42

7. LJ - 217/79/36

8. JP - 58/19/32

9. GJ - 239/74/30

10. BT - 61/17/27

11. DW - 226/64/28

12. SCotterill - 63/11/17

Pointless comparison, unless you think we acted too quickly to sack Brian Tinnion

[handsofclay]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

If we want to use “stats” of all City managers, then shouldn’t we do it for games at this level only?  It’s effing futile imho, even if you do that, but at least means you have a fairer comparison.

I couldn't agree more. The top three, effectively, on that list for least percentage of losses include two, Brian Tinnion and Danny Wilson, who never managed a game at this level and one, Cottrell, who had a half season at this level that was so bad that he was relieved of his duties despite having walked the League One title just months earlier. It's daft as it's not a level playing field 

[Peter Coles]

5 hours ago, MattWSM said:

More stats...last 12 managers in order of lose % - after Saturday loss now 2nd to Steve Coppell.

Manager-played/lost/%

1. SCoppell - 2/2/100

2. NP - 64/33/51

3. DM - 63/32/50

4. SoD - 44/20/45

5. DH - 43/19/44

6. KM - 69/29/42

7. LJ - 217/79/36

8. JP - 58/19/32

9. GJ - 239/74/30

10. BT - 61/17/27

11. DW - 226/64/28

12. SCotterill - 63/11/17

GREAT INFO NOW PUT UP THE SPEND EACH MANAGER HAD AT HIS DISPOSAL

[Marina's Rolls Royce]

I don't think that any stats are useful when using them to compare one Manager with another. What did they inherit/where were the team placed and at what point of the season and what was their budget and how many windows?

When looking at Holden's tenure- he had an injury crisis pretty much unrivalled and never played a game in front of a crowd- should that play a part?

Ultimately, it's us fans not stats that judge a manager and usually based on what we see and how we feel given the general circumstances like signings and performances.

 

 

9 minutes ago, Peter Coles said:

GREAT INFO NOW PUT UP THE SPEND EACH MANAGER HAD AT HIS DISPOSAL

NO NEED TO SHOUT

[Bar BS3]

11 hours ago, And Its Smith said:

Pretty irrelevant really. What would be better to see is percentages after it could be deemed to be that managers squad.  Judging a manager from day one they take over is nonsense 

That's about the only possible way NP's record cam read worse than his overall record..! 

 

[Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan]

Cotterill only lost 11 games?

That’s not correct.

We lost 5 in the L1 title winning season for a start let alone the first half of our first season back in the Championship.

Edit: I figure we lost 24 League games under Cotterill. Pretty sure he managed more than 63 games as well.

Edited August 9, 2022 by Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan

[GrahamC]

5 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

Cotterill only lost 11 games?

That’s not correct.

We lost 5 in the L1 title winning season for a start let alone the first half of our first season back in the Championship.

They’re nonsense.

Cotterill lost more than 11 in his last season with us, let alone the year & a half before.

The point about games at Championship level & League One is spot on too.

Wilson’s stats always look better because he was incapable of getting us promoted in 4 attempts. Ward, GJ & Cotterill all did it in their first full seasons..

[steveybadger]

So apart from inaccuracy of the stats and even the actual managers, any context in relation to spend, state of the club at the time and division we were in, this is quite interesting

(sorry MattWSM, know you were only trying to start a debate).

Edited August 9, 2022 by steveybadger

[MattWSM]

3 minutes ago, steveybadger said:

So apart from inaccuracy of the stats and even the actual managers, any context in relation to spend, state of the club at the time and division we were in, this is quite interesting

(sorry MattWSM, know you were only trying to start a debate).

haha  no problem, indeed I was but clearly some data issues here.

Yes agree with all comments, i trusted Soccerbase but clearly holding wrong data as SC lost more than 11.

If i have an hour later might do a quick factual check.

Anyway...hopefully we get a better 'performance' tonight as not worried about the odd loss, just like last year I felt we were in it for many games but Sat thought we were well beaten generally in all areas

 

 

[redsince1994]

Made a quick table from Transfermarkt, seems to be more accurate (no 58 random games for Pembo) 

Manager	Games	Losses	Percentage
Nigel Pearson	64	34	53.13%
Derek McInnes	63	32	50.79%
Keith Millen	57	27	47.37%
Sean O'Driscoll	44	20	45.45%
Dean Holden	41	18	43.90%
Lee Johnson	217	80	36.87%
Gary Johnson	237	74	31.22%
Brian Tinnion	58	16	27.59%
Danny Wilson	142	39	27.46%
Steve Cotterill	116	28	24.14%

 

 

[MattWSM]

1 hour ago, redsince1994 said:

Made a quick table from Transfermarkt, seems to be more accurate (no 58 random games for Pembo) 

Manager	Games	Losses	Percentage
Nigel Pearson	64	34	53.13%
Derek McInnes	63	32	50.79%
Keith Millen	57	27	47.37%
Sean O'Driscoll	44	20	45.45%
Dean Holden	41	18	43.90%
Lee Johnson	217	80	36.87%
Gary Johnson	237	74	31.22%
Brian Tinnion	58	16	27.59%
Danny Wilson	142	39	27.46%
Steve Cotterill	116	28	24.14%

 

 

Thanks, my only consolation is the order is the same except KM has jumped up a couple of places

 

 

[Bs4Red]

On 08/08/2022 at 11:37, And Its Smith said:

Pretty irrelevant really. What would be better to see is percentages after it could be deemed to be that managers squad.  Judging a manager from day one they take over is nonsense 

He has his own back 4, James, King.

We concede a ridiculous amount of goals and goals that you’d be disappointed conceding at a much lower level. 
 

So many excuses for a bloke who’s taken this club backwards

[And Its Smith]

7 minutes ago, Bs4Red said:

He has his own back 4, James, King.

We concede a ridiculous amount of goals and goals that you’d be disappointed conceding at a much lower level. 
 

So many excuses for a bloke who’s taken this club backwards

I’m not making excuses for him at all. He’s got his squad now so over the next 10 games I’m expecting to see a rapid improvement.  He cannot slag off the ability or mentality of people he signed 

[pongo88]

On 08/08/2022 at 14:06, Davefevs said:

If we want to use “stats” of all City managers, then shouldn’t we do it for games at this level only?  It’s effing futile imho, even if you do that, but at least means you have a fairer comparison.

I agree with you that it’s a bit meaningless,  even if you only use stats for games of this level, as circumstances change. For example, the standard of the Championship now is far higher than that of the old Division 2 in the mid 60s and 70s when Alan Dicks was manager. Financial it is as also different, as in those days as City didn’t have to complete with teams who had enormous parachute payments. 

[Davefevs]

4 hours ago, Bs4Red said:

He has his own back 4, James, King.

We concede a ridiculous amount of goals and goals that you’d be disappointed conceding at a much lower level. 
 

So many excuses for a bloke who’s taken this club backwards

The analogy is he’s had to knock down the building to relay the foundations.  It takes time.  Just because they’re his players, doesn’t mean they are who he’d ideally get if he different funds available to him.  He’s scrapping around free transfer and Lg1 / Lg2 players (also on frees).  He can’t generate transfer funds from Vyner, Moore, etc…nor can he generate them from Wells, etc, because they won’t forego their huge wages (allegedly).  Without transfer money, we are a huge loss making entity.  The answer to that it to cut costs in the playing side…which he’s done.

Sometimes you have to go backwards (summer 2022) to go forwards (end of last season).  Oh, let’s shit the bed because we’ve lost the first two games.

He is working with a thin squad with little depth , because the finances won’t allow it to be thin, but with depth / cover.

He took over a mess.

Yes, results are frustrating…but he hasn’t taken the club backwards…he’s rebuilding it with RG.