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Match Report: City recreate Robins Uncut training exercise in blazing sun


Olé

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4 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Rob  did Andi play more as a midfielder than a 10 tonight?

He drifted around a fair bit. Dropped deep and/or right at times, and in attack was running from deep. That dropping was more than just to defend. Saying this there were also occasions where it was Andi who pressed their keeper.

I'm not sure I'd call him in a true midfield role but it was at least a second striker role with instructions to drop back at times. 

Rob might disagree but that is how I saw it.

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53 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

He drifted around a fair bit. Dropped deep and/or right at times, and in attack was running from deep. That dropping was more than just to defend. Saying this there were also occasions where it was Andi who pressed their keeper.

I'm not sure I'd call him in a true midfield role but it was at least a second striker role with instructions to drop back at times. 

Rob might disagree but that is how I saw it.

I think that with the form he is in the coaches should let him do what he feels is right, he seems to be in the zone as they say. The only cavaet being that his team mates need to be in tune with him.

I was more interested in how we played without Martin, a lot of people on here on Saturday saying that without him we had no outlet ball/target, so how did we manage yesterday?

I'd like to think that we kept the ball on the deck and played through midfield like other teams that don't play with a target man.

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20 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

I think that with the form he is in the coaches should let him do what he feels is right, he seems to be in the zone as they say. The only cavaet being that his team mates need to be in tune with him.

I was more interested in how we played without Martin, a lot of people on here on Saturday saying that without him we had no outlet ball/target, so how did we manage yesterday?

I'd like to think that we kept the ball on the deck and played through midfield like other teams that don't play with a target man.

This is a bit of a cop-out but as @Olé says, Coventry offered so little in the first hour or so that it's hard or even dangerous to read much into how we played.

Did we pass it around ok? Yes we did, but you can pass around cones easily, even without Chris Martin.

We did keep it on the deck more (although if someone could stat-check that it would be useful), and were comfortable keeping possession in their half during the first 45.  Massengo and King saw a fair bit of the ball in the middle and were able to use it effectively. Conway's movement was enthusiastic if not always precise.

Ultimately I'd say we were good without Martin...because we didn't need Martin against that particular Coventry defence. We may need him against better organised teams.

Edited by ExiledAjax
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4 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

I think that with the form he is in the coaches should let him do what he feels is right, he seems to be in the zone as they say. The only cavaet being that his team mates need to be in tune with him.

I was more interested in how we played without Martin, a lot of people on here on Saturday saying that without him we had no outlet ball/target, so how did we manage yesterday?

I'd like to think that we kept the ball on the deck and played through midfield like other teams that don't play with a target man.

I grew up (after the First Division days of Royle) on a diet of Neville and Riley, and that formed a lot of my “philosophy” that you don’t have to play with an old-English Target-Man.  Fwiw I don’t think Martin is one either.  There can be more to an out-ball than hitting it up in the air down the middle of the pitch, e.g. sometimes hit channel, turn them round and press up the pitch, etc.  As a generalisation most Champ CBs are of the “hairy-arsed” variety, and hate movement (e.g. Flint), but love a physical battle.  From what I’ve seen of Conway (I wasn’t there so didn’t see last night), he is very good (for a fledgling 20 year old making his way in the pro game) at playing as a pair.  Never gets too far away from his partner, almost like he is on a bungee rope with Wells, always in-touch, one short, one spins and vice-versa.  A lot of young strikers play 90% on the shoulder, and I’m always looking for those youngsters that look to play both ways.  Conway is a good example of that.

Will continue to monitor.

Just looking at last nights passing map (average position of passes made):

427D983F-FAEB-4A46-9020-D7964FC58232.thumb.jpeg.2c6c48430339b18f15416a673cdee9f2.jpeg

Kane Wilson making his passes high

Weimann drifting into the right “half-space” (urgh…horrible phrase, given myself a slap)

Atkinson high too.

Seems like we played higher on the right than on the left.

Did it feel like that to those who were there?

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22 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I grew up (after the First Division days of Royle) on a diet of Neville and Riley, and that formed a lot of my “philosophy” that you don’t have to play with an old-English Target-Man.  Fwiw I don’t think Martin is one either.  There can be more to an out-ball than hitting it up in the air down the middle of the pitch, e.g. sometimes hit channel, turn them round and press up the pitch, etc.  As a generalisation most Champ CBs are of the “hairy-arsed” variety, and hate movement (e.g. Flint), but love a physical battle.  From what I’ve seen of Conway (I wasn’t there so didn’t see last night), he is very good (for a fledgling 20 year old making his way in the pro game) at playing as a pair.  Never gets too far away from his partner, almost like he is on a bungee rope with Wells, always in-touch, one short, one spins and vice-versa.  A lot of young strikers play 90% on the shoulder, and I’m always looking for those youngsters that look to play both ways.  Conway is a good example of that.

Will continue to monitor.

Just looking at last nights passing map (average position of passes made):

427D983F-FAEB-4A46-9020-D7964FC58232.thumb.jpeg.2c6c48430339b18f15416a673cdee9f2.jpeg

Kane Wilson making his passes high

Weimann drifting into the right “half-space” (urgh…horrible phrase, given myself a slap)

Atkinson high too.

Seems like we played higher on the right than on the left.

Did it feel like that to those who were there?

I do agree, my point was that people seemed to think that playing with Martin makes us one-dimensional and a long ball team, but I see a lot of variety in our attacks, especially with WSM.

I think the only issue I have at the moment is that without the strength and central direct running of Semenyo, we only seem to have two outlets, Martin or the wingbacks, both of which I think Sunderland eventually negated. I might be wrong, but I don't think Martin won a ball cleanly until just before halftime and even then it was out toward the Dolman touchline. That left us with the wingbacks, which they then started to target more effectively.

Funnily enough it was my wife, who has little interest really and is easily distracted, who pointed out that Alex Neill was a) outside his technical area (much to her annoyance) and b) was "flapping his arms like a nutter" . As the 3nd half unfolded I think it became clear what that was indicating to the team. 

The Riley and Neville partnership which you mentioned was a great example of how movement can compensate for size, one of the few times I have ever agreed with Bobby Gould was when he said in commentary once, that they were like beggars living on scraps, and made a meal of every single morsel that came their way 

Edited by Port Said Red
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8 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Just looking at last nights passing map (average position of passes made):

427D983F-FAEB-4A46-9020-D7964FC58232.thumb.jpeg.2c6c48430339b18f15416a673cdee9f2.jpeg

Kane Wilson making his passes high

Weimann drifting into the right “half-space” (urgh…horrible phrase, given myself a slap)

Atkinson high too.

Seems like we played higher on the right than on the left.

Wilson was pushing up yes. Weimann then often dropped wide and right to fill in the hole left in Wilson's wake. Hence Andi's average pass position is deeper and more to the right. I saw him playing anywhere in a band from where Vyner is on that map up to where Wells and Conway appeared. He was kinda playing a whack-a-mole role, covering the gaps as they appeared in that area, and allowing others to push on. Basically running around a lot!

Atkinson appears high there because Coventry's "midfield" seemed happy for him to do his Beckenbauer/Webster/Ayling style forward runs into midfield, where he'd then lay off to Pring or one of the CMs. Naismith and Vyner were the ones sweeping up as the map shows.

Hard for me to answer your last question, wasn't really something I watched for or noticed.

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1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

I grew up (after the First Division days of Royle) on a diet of Neville and Riley, and that formed a lot of my “philosophy” that you don’t have to play with an old-English Target-Man.  

To be fair, for the first season that Riley and Neville played together Steve Neville couldn’t buy a goal.  My memory is that Neville fared best next to Trevor Morgan….

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3 minutes ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

To be fair, for the first season that Riley and Neville played together Steve Neville couldn’t buy a goal.  My memory is that Neville fared best next to Trevor Morgan….

Initially you are right, he struggled for goals, but all partnerships aren’t necessarily equal in goals output…

Taylor and Turner

Owen and Heskey

Beardsley and Lineker 

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1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

To be fair, for the first season that Riley and Neville played together Steve Neville couldn’t buy a goal.  My memory is that Neville fared best next to Trevor Morgan….

Neville I think was a converted winger so took a while to get into the goals. I think a lot of his goals came away from in breakaway style. He scored a beauty taking the ball on the run away to Gillingham and a really good one at Newport as I remember.

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