Never to the dark side Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08flw2v Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 In 2009 I watch a game in the top division of Russian football between zenit st Petersburg v Cska Moscow , truly one of the most scariest 90 minutes of my life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Exile Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 We'll be giving Russia a miss! Started planning for the next Euros though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Went to Moscow a few years ago with some mates who are Chelsea fans for Champs league. Ended up in a part of the city we should not have been in, how we got out alive, I will never know. Scary place when football is on. Far worse than Millwall away at the Old Den, Cold Blow Lane. Police just watched, you had to fight or be beaten. No place to go if you can't look after yourself. Do your homework before you travel would be my advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cider-Head23 Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Fair play to anyway who's planning on going, you shouldn't have to fear for your safety when going to follow your national team at a tournament. But these Russians are brutal, it's going to be an eye opener for some I'm sure. Hopefully the Russian police are out in force knowing full well what their hooligans are capable of. I see full blown mayhem in Russia 2018 though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 We get the same scare stories every 2 or 4 years. 'Don't go to Ukraine' they said - 'you'll come home in a coffin' were Sol Campbell's words during a BBC documentary about Ukrainian hooliganism shown just before the tournament - but a great time was had by all in Donetsk and Kiev, and I certainly didn't see any trouble. Apparently there were very small pockets of trouble when we played in Dnipropetrovsk in 2009 but I didn't see any of it, and the Euros 3 years later passed by very peacefully There were similar stories before South Africa ('you'll get car-jacked', 'mugged at knifepoint', 'murdered in cold blood') and Brazil four years later ('guaranteed to get robbed', 'shot if you go anywhere near a favela') but again everyone had a great time at both, aside from some highly depressing football from England. I didn't see any trouble at either tournament. And now, surprise surprise, we have the same stories about Russia. Moscow in 07 (when Pavlyuchenko scored twice) was certainly a hostile environment but I never really once felt threatened. If England qualify I'm really hoping to see St Petersburg and / or some of the other host cities further east and south - it will be another great travel experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 8 minutes ago, North London Red said: Edit: double post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 31 minutes ago, North London Red said: We get the same scare stories every 2 or 4 years. 'Don't go to Ukraine' they said - 'you'll come home in a coffin' were Sol Campbell's words during a BBC documentary about Ukrainian hooliganism shown just before the tournament - but a great time was had by all in Donetsk and Kiev, and I certainly didn't see any trouble. Apparently there were very small pockets of trouble when we played in Dnipropetrovsk in 2009 but I didn't see any of it, and the Euros 3 years later passed by very peacefully There were similar stories before South Africa ('you'll get car-jacked', 'mugged at knifepoint', 'murdered in cold blood') and Brazil four years later ('guaranteed to get robbed', 'shot if you go anywhere near a favela') but again everyone had a great time at both, aside from some highly depressing football from England. I didn't see any trouble at either tournament. And now, surprise surprise, we have the same stories about Russia. Moscow in 07 (when Pavlyuchenko scored twice) was certainly a hostile environment but I never really once felt threatened. If England qualify I'm really hoping to see St Petersburg and / or some of the other host cities further east and south - it will be another great travel experience. The difference being that the Russian firms do not resemble football firms like we know it. They are more like paramilitaries in their own right who will be organised, quick, indiscriminate and in numbers. In addition, the English fans will be the biggest target imo. You are correct that most will see no trouble but I feel this is the most dangerous WC as they'll actually be waiting for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 4 minutes ago, Welcome To The Jungle said: The difference being that the Russian firms do not resemble football firms like we know it. They are more like paramilitaries in their own right who will be organised, quick, indiscriminate and in numbers. In addition, the English fans will be the biggest target imo. You are correct that most will see no trouble but I feel this is the most dangerous WC as they'll actually be waiting for us. I read very similar things before going to Moscow in 2007 and also about eastern Ukraine in 2012 before we played twice in Donetsk (a Russian speaking city that was supposedly full of maniacs waiting to attack us). These stories almost always amount to nothing. Perhaps this time I'll be wrong but I've also heard "this time it will be different" before, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Cloud Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 FIFA's new man decreed immediately Russia & Qatar would keep the World Cups - the bungs paid must have been enormous! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Bill Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Having read "The Dirty Game" by Andrew Jennings I would be reluctant to go to either Russia or Qatar (not that I could afford to anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 7 hours ago, North London Red said: I read very similar things before going to Moscow in 2007 and also about eastern Ukraine in 2012 before we played twice in Donetsk (a Russian speaking city that was supposedly full of maniacs waiting to attack us). These stories almost always amount to nothing. Perhaps this time I'll be wrong but I've also heard "this time it will be different" before, too. I was in Marseille and you were fine if you were in a group - they just picked off ones and twos like cowards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS15_RED Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 With the current diplomatic situation with the UK and Russia, I wouldn't recommend any one going over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 8 hours ago, North London Red said: We get the same scare stories every 2 or 4 years. 'Don't go to Ukraine' they said - 'you'll come home in a coffin' were Sol Campbell's words during a BBC documentary about Ukrainian hooliganism shown just before the tournament - but a great time was had by all in Donetsk and Kiev, and I certainly didn't see any trouble. Apparently there were very small pockets of trouble when we played in Dnipropetrovsk in 2009 but I didn't see any of it, and the Euros 3 years later passed by very peacefully There were similar stories before South Africa ('you'll get car-jacked', 'mugged at knifepoint', 'murdered in cold blood') and Brazil four years later ('guaranteed to get robbed', 'shot if you go anywhere near a favela') but again everyone had a great time at both, aside from some highly depressing football from England. I didn't see any trouble at either tournament. And now, surprise surprise, we have the same stories about Russia. Moscow in 07 (when Pavlyuchenko scored twice) was certainly a hostile environment but I never really once felt threatened. If England qualify I'm really hoping to see St Petersburg and / or some of the other host cities further east and south - it will be another great travel experience. I agree with what you have said. But I will add that I read a lot on theCardiff City forum after a lot of Cardiff had gone to watch Russia v Wales a few years ago. Basically they could not leave their hotel for the duration of their stay. Groups of moody Russians waiting day and night to pick them off. The Police wouldn't do anything at all. They had coaches to and from the game, that's the only time they were able to get out of their hotel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfOfWestStreet Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Fancy it to be fair. People said france was a terrorist target and not to travel but it was a great trip and i want to look back on life and say ive seen then world. Russia looks interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 6 minutes ago, Portland Bill said: I agree with what you have said. But I will add that I read a lot on theCardiff City forum after a lot of Cardiff had gone to watch Russia v Wales a few years ago. Basically they could not leave their hotel for the duration of their stay. Groups of moody Russians waiting day and night to pick them off. The Police wouldn't do anything at all. They had coaches to and from the game, that's the only time they were able to get out of their hotel. Very similar happened when England were last in Moscow. I also have a mate who went, stayed in a hostel. An English girl who was just traveling and nothing to do with football was set upon by a group of Russians and suffered bruised ribs and a knife wound to the face. I probably wouldn't have gone to Russia anyway but after seeing how well organised they were in Marseille in June I would say it's very likely England fans will be targeted again (esp given political situation) and the results could be even worse this time. The Russians have no morales and will attack anyone, beat people on the floor etc. I'll be interested to see what this programme shows of Marseille tonight as the whole day was a bit of a blur. Wonder if they'll show the English actually running the Russians for a good half hour back and forth on Vieux Port! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 20 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said: Very similar happened when England were last in Moscow. I also have a mate who went, stayed in a hostel. An English girl who was just traveling and nothing to do with football was set upon by a group of Russians and suffered bruised ribs and a knife wound to the face. I probably wouldn't have gone to Russia anyway but after seeing how well organised they were in Marseille in June I would say it's very likely England fans will be targeted again (esp given political situation) and the results could be even worse this time. The Russians have no morales and will attack anyone, beat people on the floor etc. I'll be interested to see what this programme shows of Marseille tonight as the whole day was a bit of a blur. Wonder if they'll show the English actually running the Russians for a good half hour back and forth on Vieux Port! I know from reading the England fans forum that a few fans here and there got attacked and I know that some Russian fans tried to attack the infamous Hotel Cosmos the night before the game (but were repelled) - but I'd wager that the vast majority of the 4,000 or so England fans who went there in 2007 had a trouble-free trip. We stayed in a hotel slightly out of the centre, spent 2 nights in Moscow, and were out and about throughout our stay, including a few beers on the Arbat. We also took the metro to the stadium along with the locals (another thing we were warned would be suicidal) - and didn't encounter any bother at all, nor did the regulars that I know. Clearly some did come under attack (e.g. the stories on the EF forum and the girl that your mate knew) but I honestly think these were in the very small minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North London Red Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 1 hour ago, Rob k said: I was in Marseille and you were fine if you were in a group - they just picked off ones and twos like cowards Marseille was certainly a lively trip. Not sure I've ever been anywhere where so many of the people in the city (locals, police, opposition fans) wanted to beat you up! That photo of the French woman throwing a bottle at England fans summed the place up pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashton_fan Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 Anyone who goes over there needs their head examining. It's not as if England are going to do any good in any case. You could be arrested just for being in the wrong place at the wrong time even if innocent and then you'd be in a really bad place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oops Posted February 16, 2017 Share Posted February 16, 2017 I say we gather a 'Dirty Dozen' style hooligan squad to go and teach these mugs a lesson. We have a prowed history of violence, and I for one would rather watch a minor skirmish in a Volgograd cafe than an entire tournament of England playing football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunnyfunt Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 18 hours ago, Red Exile said: We'll be giving Russia a miss! Started planning for the next Euros though... The Russians will find you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SARJ Posted February 17, 2017 Share Posted February 17, 2017 My favourite quote of that programme last night was the top Russian boy saying "if you're with a woman or your family, you'll be fine, but if you're with your male friend, not even a hooligan, expect trouble." In short, they will indiscriminately attack any males. Good luck to anyone going out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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