BetterRedthanBlue Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 2 hours ago, 1960maaan said: What position is he playing ? We signed him as a CB but didn't he start playing at Cheltenham at FB/WB ? I imagine he needs to build up strength and physique , but I think he could be decent from the little I've heard and seen. He's doing a Bailey Wright just not as well. He does need to bulk up if he wants to play CB failing that if he gets his positioning right then he could be a decent FB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitchurch1966 Posted January 20, 2018 Report Share Posted January 20, 2018 Cheltenham season ticket holder I know thinks he is quality and could definitely play at a much higher level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 Joe was on loan in league two at his age and Bobby when he was older than Moore is now, give him time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You Do The Dziekanowski Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 hours ago, JamesBCFC said: O'Neil was a free wasn't he? Loss will be just wages. Hegeler we could still probably regain what we paid, was about 300k Course he was! Feels like a loss as he’s hardly played!! Hegeler will be difficult to recoup due to not having game time and suffering from a serious injury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nest Egg Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 hours ago, You Do The Dziekanowski said: Course he was! Feels like a loss as he’s hardly played!! Hegeler will be difficult to recoup due to not having game time and suffering from a serious injury Hegeler is a write off unless we can cart him off to some lower division German team. A good player but only suits their league. The Leeds game showed how he could be absolutely torn apart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Fred Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 8 hours ago, BetterRedthenBlue said: He's doing a Bailey Wright just not as well. He does need to bulk up if he wants to play CB failing that if he gets his positioning right then he could be a decent FB That's where I see him,could be a very tidy right wing back/full back as he's got the legs picks a decent pass.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 What position do we foresee for him? Defensive minded right back, small ball playing centre back, or Dier style defensive midfielder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 12 hours ago, Fiale said: Keep forgetting O'Neil is even at the club And Pisano Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 Moore was one of three sent off in that game , four more got yellows whilst GJ was sent to the stands. Love the fact that certain posters choose this game as a yard stick of Taylor Moore's progress and future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashton_fan Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 Sounds like Mansfield, managed by Steve Evans were particularly obnoxious and Moore lost it with one of them (as did Gary Johnson in the technical area and was sent to the stands). Moore isn't a dirty player, it's all part of his education. I still think he's got a role to play with us, Pisano isn't young and we're not especially well covered at right back, Moore could play for the first team in the next couple of seasons if we don't get promoted to the Prem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinMan's left peg Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 I thought this season would have made it abundantly clear that we need to give players time to develop and not jump to write them off completely at a young age. Presumably those slating Moore were also wanting rid of Bobby and Joe Bryan last season. Thank God you’re nowhere near the running of our club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 20 minutes ago, ashton_fan said: Sounds like Mansfield, managed by Steve Evans were particularly obnoxious and Moore lost it with one of them (as did Gary Johnson in the technical area and was sent to the stands). Moore isn't a dirty player, it's all part of his education. I still think he's got a role to play with us, Pisano isn't young and we're not especially well covered at right back, Moore could play for the first team in the next couple of seasons if we don't get promoted to the Prem. Good to hear he`s developing a bit of an `edge` IMO. He always seemed a bit too nice to be a really good defender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 9 minutes ago, TinMan's left peg said: I thought this season would have made it abundantly clear that we need to give players time to develop and not jump to write them off completely at a young age. Presumably those slating Moore were also wanting rid of Bobby and Joe Bryan last season. Thank God you’re nowhere near the running of our club! After Brownhill and O'Dowda I thought that would be enough to teach those eager to write off the young guys to give them time. As a club, that 19-23 year old age bracket of 'ones for the future' wasn't really an area we'd recruited in so I can understand it being a culture shock to some to see us paying as much as 7 figure sums for these players. Not every single one will work - but these guys need time to develop. The level they're playing at isn't even necessarily a reflection on their ability but rather to give them experience in playing in a tough league and learning men's football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Red Homer said: Fixed that for you. He was only captain of the U19s though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: After Brownhill and O'Dowda I thought that would be enough to teach those eager to write off the young guys to give them time. As a club, that 19-23 year old age bracket of 'ones for the future' wasn't really an area we'd recruited in so I can understand it being a culture shock to some to see us paying as much as 7 figure sums for these players. Not every single one will work - but these guys need time to develop. The level they're playing at isn't even necessarily a reflection on their ability but rather to give them experience in playing in a tough league and learning men's football. This is the thing IMO. We still have an awful lot of fans who think that if we`re paying £1m+ for someone they should be ready to go straight into the first team and tear it up straight away. They don`t realise things have moved on so far and fees like that aren`t the budget busters they used to be but are lower end now. A mate of mine is exactly the same, he thinks anyone over £500k should be a world beater, can`t get his head around us loaning them out, and goes on and on about a `waste of money` all the time - drives me mental at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 8 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: This is the thing IMO. We still have an awful lot of fans who think that if we`re paying £1m+ for someone they should be ready to go straight into the first team and tear it up straight away. They don`t realise things have moved on so far and fees like that aren`t the budget busters they used to be but are lower end now. A mate of mine is exactly the same, he thinks anyone over £500k should be a world beater, can`t get his head around us loaning them out, and goes on and on about a `waste of money` all the time - drives me mental at times. It is part of the gulf developing between The Championship and League One. Clubs like Burton and MK Dons can get promoted and cling on for a while but will soon fall back without the requisite infrastructure and financial clout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 25 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: This is the thing IMO. We still have an awful lot of fans who think that if we`re paying £1m+ for someone they should be ready to go straight into the first team and tear it up straight away. They don`t realise things have moved on so far and fees like that aren`t the budget busters they used to be but are lower end now. A mate of mine is exactly the same, he thinks anyone over £500k should be a world beater, can`t get his head around us loaning them out, and goes on and on about a `waste of money` all the time - drives me mental at times. It's part of the bigger picture of how we do things now- players bought in to develop who will be taught to play a certain way and essentially it was the failure to do this that was a factor in our downfall after GJ's departure. When we were last in this league prior to relegation, each change of manager led to a new way of playing, new style of player.. there was no plan and no consistency. As a result, we ended up with a squad full of journeymen and no identity. No wonder we were relegated - 5 years ago we were a shambles. Embarrassing looking back really but shows how far we've come. I think the other thing is inflation. Since 2015 inflation has been enormous and has grown faster than fans have been able to process it. We had a consistent period between around 2003-2014 where value largely stayed the same. £1m was par for a good Championship first teamer, £2.5 for someone very very good and >£1m for general squad players. It was easier for fans to link 'value' to 'quality'. When things started to inflate, suddenly you're paying the same fees for unproven players. Understandably a shock to the system for some! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Homer Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 37 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: He was only captain of the U19s though? Captained more of his countries than I have though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveF Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 How come Moore gets off so much lighter than Engvall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Phileas Fogg said: After Brownhill and O'Dowda I thought that would be enough to teach those eager to write off the young guys to give them time. As a club, that 19-23 year old age bracket of 'ones for the future' wasn't really an area we'd recruited in so I can understand it being a culture shock to some to see us paying as much as 7 figure sums for these players. Not every single one will work - but these guys need time to develop. The level they're playing at isn't even necessarily a reflection on their ability but rather to give them experience in playing in a tough league and learning men's football. Too right. I posted once before that I think players are developing slightly later (on average) than 10-15-20 years ago. Why? I think the demands and pace of the modern game require our young players to not just have stopped growing, but also be developed and muscular. Both Joe and Bobby are fine examples of players who stopped growing a good few years ago, but it’s taken them time to build the physique to play consistently and lots of games. It’s well documented that Reid had used a specialist fitness regime this summer (might not have been his first visit, unsure), and look at not just his physique but his strength too. The Jamie Paterson-physique types are few and far between these days. But also look what a bit of flu did to his strength! The lines of Leko will dominate in age-group games, but you put him up against the opposition equivalent of say a Bailey Wright and they struggle to compete. Back to Taylor Moore, almost 6’2’, not 21 til May, been developed through the technical French system, out on loan, trying to learn how to play "men’s football". I don’t see the rush with him. Get him back in the summer, evaluate whether he can complete in the first team squad and take it from there. He’s contracted to summer 19, so still time to decide what we want. Might even need another loan for first half of next season. I think City are playing the long-game with Taylor Moore. I would also do the same with Gustav Engvall, but he has to commit to giving it a go here, if the stories of him being unsettled here are true. Finally, Lukas Nmecha (rumoured loanee From Man City), looks like a player who still needs to develop physically. Got a great build and good technique, but won’t be pushing Championship CBs around like the similarly built but fully developed Che Adams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Red Homer said: Captained more of his countries than I have though! How many countries has he got?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 Looking at the higlights it's difficult to tell whether there was much in his sending off. http://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/competitions/league-two/11216424/mansfield-3-2-cheltenham Both Cheltenham sending offs looked like arms being used to hold off a Mansfield players rather than deliberate elbows. The Mansfield sending off was a frightener of a tackle though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Grim Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Spoons said: I take it with a comment like that you've been watching him regularly ? Well if you read the posts you would have seen I hadn't, just what I've been told. No need to get your knickers in a twist. I stated it was early days, but plying his trade fighting relegation in league two is not what I would of hoped after signing him. Especially after his Hull performance when he was outstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 17 hours ago, Spoons said: Takes a swanker to know a swanker !! How much did he cost and how many games has he played for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Red Right Hand said: This is the thing IMO. We still have an awful lot of fans who think that if we`re paying £1m+ for someone they should be ready to go straight into the first team and tear it up straight away. They don`t realise things have moved on so far and fees like that aren`t the budget busters they used to be but are lower end now. A mate of mine is exactly the same, he thinks anyone over £500k should be a world beater, can`t get his head around us loaning them out, and goes on and on about a `waste of money` all the time - drives me mental at times. If your mate is Martk Ashton, then we are screwed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, swanker said: How much did he cost and how many games has he played for us? £1 million ? 4/5 games and a few subs appearance. He wasn't bought to play straight away ! I'm still convinced he will go on to play 100 plus games for us. Just a bit confused by yourself a so called city fan not giving the lad a chance and writing him off straight away, having Probaly not even wAtched him!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swanker Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, Spoons said: £1 million ? 4/5 games and a few subs appearance. He wasn't bought to play straight away ! I'm still convinced he will go on to play 100 plus games for us. Just a bit confused by yourself a so called city fan not giving the lad a chance and writing him off straight away, having Probaly not even wAtched him!! I have seen him play and thought he did quite well against Hull in the cup. Since then he career seems to have taken a nosedive. A million is a lot of money in my book for someone to be shipped out to a struggling league two side. If he is going to come good he'd better start putting in some performances soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinMan's left peg Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 1 minute ago, swanker said: I have seen him play and thought he did quite well against Hull in the cup. Since then he career seems to have taken a nosedive. A million is a lot of money in my book for someone to be shipped out to a struggling league two side. If he is going to come good he'd better start putting in some performances soon. Mate with respect do you realise his age? You seem to think he’s 26 in which case I would agree with your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiderEyed Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, swanker said: I have seen him play and thought he did quite well against Hull in the cup. Since then he career seems to have taken a nosedive. A million is a lot of money in my book for someone to be shipped out to a struggling league two side. If he is going to come good he'd better start putting in some performances soon. Do you want to read back this thread for explanations of our transfer business? It's not "shipping out". Get the blinkers off for a minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted January 21, 2018 Report Share Posted January 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, Spoons said: £1 million ? 4/5 games and a few subs appearance. He wasn't bought to play straight away ! I'm still convinced he will go on to play 100 plus games for us. Just a bit confused by yourself a so called city fan not giving the lad a chance and writing him off straight away, having Probaly not even wAtched him!! If he needs, say, 3 years to develop - or maybe not - 1m seems a very high gamble. In that time the likes of Kelly and Vyner - plus forthcoming academy graduates we are as yet unaware of - could develop more and push him out of 1st team contention anyway. He may turn out to be a very good player, but I suspect his unusual French upbringing, and England youth caps, were a big factor in City taking a gamble on TM rather than an English based player of similar age. Many highly capped youth players fall by the wayside and do not end up in the higher echelons of the game. I haven't been particularly impressed on the few occasions I've seen him, i.e. Hull, when he was dominated in the air, but of course he could still develop at AG providing our league placing and other inevitable signings as the club moves on allow him the opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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