The threshold..a tale of three penalties?

[Mr Popodopolous]

What exactly is the threshold for a penalty at Championship level.

The criteria.

I know the rule but there is amazing inconsistency at least in terms of severity of infringement.

This is quite a low bar for Swansea.

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12973560/millwall-0-3-swansea-sky-bet-championship-highlights

The contact is quite light for Sunderland?

Therefore...?

[W-S-M Seagull]

Look at the referees position. No way did he have a clear view of that with the Stoke player blocking his view. 

[Sleepy1968]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Look at the referees position. No way did he have a clear view of that with the Stoke player blocking his view. 

The lino was several metres away, just out of shot. You like to think he could've seen that far, and mentioned it to the ref. But who knows - he certainly wasn't indicating fouls to the ref missed by waving his flag.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Sleepy1968

[GrahamC]

3 hours ago, Sleepy1968 said:

The lino was several metres away, just out of shot. You like to think he could've seen that far, and mentioned it to the ref. But who knows - he certainly wasn't indicating fouls to the ref missed by waving his flag.

That linesman on the Dolman side was embarrassing, the same one who missed the clear foul on Sykes at 1-0.

I don’t think they do wave their flag to attract the ref these days but he gave us absolutely nothing, abysmal.

[Jose]

I think it would have been soft. The max one too. 

[GrahamC]

Swansea one looks a penalty to me, the Sunderland one is definitely more marginal.

Having finally ended that record breaking run without one by getting the clear one at Sunderland & then getting a much more arguable one the week afterwards against Hull, I do worry we are back to a situation where we just aren’t going to be awarded them.

I’m sure the foul on Sykes was one, I have seen the nudge on Pring given to other sides too, so despite the “it all evens itself out” bollocks we seem to be back to what is sadly normal for us.

[W-S-M Seagull]

8 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Swansea one looks a penalty to me, the Sunderland one is definitely more marginal.

Having finally ended that record breaking run without one by getting the clear one at Sunderland & then getting a much more arguable one the week afterwards against Hull, I do worry we are back to a situation where we just aren’t going to be awarded them.

I’m sure the foul on Sykes was one, I have seen the nudge on Pring given to other sides too, so despite the “it all evens itself out” bollocks we seem to be back to what is sadly normal for us.

I was thinking the other day we are now getting into the territory of this again being a thing. 

Two penalties in about 700 days isn't good!

[Sir Geoff]

Wow, how was a penalty not given for the Sykes foul. Wasn't sure from the South stand, but the linesman was in line with it. Shocking decision.

[formerly known as ivan]

Certainly looked a pen at the time, but then so did the fact be following MO’Ls in the second half. Would have been interesting to see that one again as well.

[Guest]

The threshold and I watched both games is our players who let Stoke back in by missing chances and defensive mistakes, Sunderland didnt and took all the points, we opened the door invited them in then made them tea ffs..

We can blame the ref, poor subs, whatever, we lost because we were not good enough to win on the day.

Tough month coming up we have to take all the points v Rotherham, to set up for tougher games ahead, seems to me our needs are still the same and still not addressed yet, a midfield boss and a goalscoring talisman.

[Red Army 75]

Expect Nige will get another apology for yesterday. They are certainly stacking up on his desk. 2 stonewall penalties yesterday again 

[E.G.Red]

21 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Wow, how was a penalty not given for the Sykes foul. Wasn't sure from the South stand, but the linesman was in line with it. Shocking decision.

And the BBC Sport in game text had it as a penalty 

Edited October 1, 2023 by E.G.Red

[Bristol Rob]

 

 

[GrahamC]

32 minutes ago, E.G.Red said:

And the BBC Sport in game text had it as a penalty 

What sort of evidence is that?

Someone on here wants to “see it again” because he “isn’t sure” it was inside box.

That’s the BBC report & our match day feed both saying it was, hardly conclusive, is it?

[TheReds]

From the replay I seen yesterday it looked like he didn't get the ball and looked like he put his foot on front of Sykes and caught/tripped him.

[Super]

10 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

What sort of evidence is that?

Someone on here wants to “see it again” because he “isn’t sure” it was inside box.

That’s the BBC report & our match day feed both saying it was, hardly conclusive, is it?

Get a grip ffs. I thought it looked outside I asked to see it again and it looks inside. I guess you never get things wrong.

53 minutes ago, Red Army 75 said:

Expect Nige will get another apology for yesterday. They are certainly stacking up on his desk. 2 stonewall penalties yesterday again 

When was the second one?

[1960maaan]

7 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Look at the referees position. No way did he have a clear view of that with the Stoke player blocking his view. 

If he hasn't got a clear view of the man running into the area with the ball, he should be struck off the Refs list. 
He has ran all the length of the pitch and his one job, the entire reason to be on the pitch, is to make sure he can see as much of the play as possible. You see top Refs running sideways and making strange shapes just to make sure he can see everything. I get your point , there is a player close but I will give the Ref the benefit and say he can see round/past the player. He has been lazy not making a better angle , but the Lino is that side and I think he would have the best view.
Looking at it the defender doesn't seem to get any of the ball or it would have traveled further. 
I've long lost the will to get excited about it, Penalties are things other teams get.

[Mr Popodopolous]

I suppose my argument is less, Sunderland and Swansea weren't there is a reasonable case for both to be awarded, but the bar or threshold for us appears to exceed this more often than not.

[cidercity1987]

13 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

If he hasn't got a clear view of the man running into the area with the ball, he should be struck off the Refs list. 
He has ran all the length of the pitch and his one job, the entire reason to be on the pitch, is to make sure he can see as much of the play as possible. You see top Refs running sideways and making strange shapes just to make sure he can see everything. I get your point , there is a player close but I will give the Ref the benefit and say he can see round/past the player. He has been lazy not making a better angle , but the Lino is that side and I think he would have the best view.
Looking at it the defender doesn't seem to get any of the ball or it would have traveled further. 
I've long lost the will to get excited about it, Penalties are things other teams get.

It was right in front of me in the Dolman, same view as the Lino. The defender was nowhere near the ball

[sludge]

2 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

Wow, how was a penalty not given for the Sykes foul. Wasn't sure from the South stand, but the linesman was in line with it. Shocking decision.

At the very least it’s in the ‘seen them given’ category. 

Lots of our penalty shouts fall into this category. 

If you analyse them individually you can often make a case either way. 

What I find baffling is that you’d expect to get a 50:50 decision to go your way some of the time.

We seem to get those big 50:50 calls go our way nearly 0% of the time. 
 

 

 

[Red-Robbo]

We aren't really comparing like for like, the two given were shirt pulls, the contact on Sykes was a shoulder barge, but I'm sure the defender - and every Stoke fan in existence - would argue they were both going for the ball, there was contact and Syksey lost his footing.

I thought it was a pen, as he jumps into the challenge with no real hope of getting the ball, but we've all seen those not given.  If he'd tripped him, it would've been a pen awarded 

[GrahamC]

2 hours ago, Super said:

Get a grip ffs. I thought it looked outside I asked to see it again and it looks inside. I guess you never get things wrong.

 

Looks inside?

Its miles inside, dear oh dear, you wouldn’t accept the BBC or official feed’s word, it isn’t remotely close.

[Super]

16 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Looks inside?

Its miles inside, dear oh dear, you wouldn’t accept the BBC or official feed’s word, it isn’t remotely close.

Ffs just give it up.

[1960maaan]

2 hours ago, sludge said:

At the very least it’s in the ‘seen them given’ category. 

Lots of our penalty shouts fall into this category. 

That's the thing, most Clubs after a while will get a few go their way.
We don't get those few. 50/50 calls can go either way, until it's our shout it seems.

[Dr Balls]

It looked a penalty at the time from the other end of the Lansdown, on the basis that the Stoke player was nowhere near the ball and flattened Sykes inside the penalty area. The ref was directly behind Sykes so should have seen it and as for the person dressed as an “assistant referee” in front of the Dolman, he was useless pretty much the whole game, so no chance he was going to flag for it. It would be interesting to see how the penalty count changed with VAR in the Premier League, because at this level, the decisions are often baffling and don’t seem to stand up to even the briefest analysis.

[Mr Popodopolous]

There are tbh less penalties awarded as a whole in the Championship than a few years ago, but irrespective we break the model and the mould.

Our figures are not just off the charts but actually  break the charts.

League only we have been awarded 3 in 35 months and of those at home just one in said 35 months.

Including home and away, it is 5 across the entirety of 2020-21, 2021-22, 2022-23 and the first 9 games of 2023-24.

Or 1 per 29.4 games.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[1960maaan]

4 minutes ago, Dr Balls said:

the person dressed as an “assistant referee”

[BCFCGav]

I wouldn’t look too deep at it. There is one rule that seemingly comes first and foremost - no penalties for Bristol City. The stats show this is no coincidence!

[Mr Popodopolous]

Meanwhile in the case of another City, Leicester.

That's 3 in 3 games! Would have to wait to see it until I can judge of course.. 

Edited October 1, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[W-S-M Seagull]

Wrong thread.

Edited October 1, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull