Time for Manning to go

[REDOXO]

3 hours ago, redsquirrel said:

the only way we can hope to see any improvements anywhere in any dept would be if Steve decided to take control again. his ******** son and turd brain td havent got a clue what they are doing

That is our best hope fella! 
 

Just give junior wedge for boats, birds and blow and re-employ a Johnson.  

[Redrascal2]

He might be happy with some new crayons and colouring book.

[Ivorguy]

His after match comments should mean gone by tomorrow

An utter disgrace

[bexhill reds]

3 hours ago, Tecknical Director said:

Blokes buried his son a few weeks ago, and we are talking about sacking him at Christmas. 

Never have I questioned supporting this football club until today. Actually speechless.

Its ******* football 
 

And everyone is only talking about the football (although there is another thread where posters including myself have hoped that the club are checking in on his mental health), but ultimately it remains a results business and the current coaching / management regime have achieved a very similar position and set of points that got the last guy sacked. Indeed as a local litmus test we have won just as many games as the Rovers this year and their manager was relieved of his duties just last week.

Absolutely LM has experienced such heartbreak as we would not wish to endure, and perhaps moving him on (i.e contractually pay him off) will give him and his family time to mourn and give him the chance to find a role and level that best suits his talents.

[RedGrucky]

1 hour ago, RollsRoyce said:

At what point does Steve L accept he has failed ? He has the money to keep playing with “ his club” . But what is he getting out of it ? He would love to get a crazy buyer to give him 100 m plus . But people know the score . Will he ever be able to accept he is holding to the club to ransom . Prices it too high yet uses it as a toy for his son to prove his son has zero ability to be anything in the real work without daddy paying the bills . Does he get embarrassed ? I don’t think so .

The club will remain as it is until he either runs out of money , someone offers a stupid number or he gets hounded out. 
 

If he thinks he is creating a legacy he is deluded . He has screwed up continually, everyone he gets a little success he fails to understand why it happened and goes off at a tangent as he thinks he knows better. 

Moan all you want about Manning and Tinnion but the issue is the owner and his terrible decisions . 
 

I still like Steve , I wish he could have got us to the Prem. But he has never understood why we are a failure and his major role in that failure . He just loves playing with the club . 
 

 

At what point, you say? Maybe he doesn't have to accept it. Maybe there's a level of wealth I can't conceive, where he's fine with an expensive pet project for his son, which doesn't need a proper board, or scrutiny, or development plan? Where getting an inexperienced head coach who parrots all the right things (at least at first) is deemed enough to offset whatever garbage Messrs Tinnion and Lansdown Jr come out with? None of this is new, but by god the water's been circling around the plughole a lot faster since they exited Pearson. We are not a serious football club. Who are we attractive to right now - from potential buyers, to a decent manager, a proper CEO, Tech Director etc? I can only guess they're doubling down on their decision to appoint someone who won a couple of League One manager of the month awards and believes his own hype, whilst keeping a Technical Director on the payroll who's more interested in self-preservation than genuine progress and success for the club. Guess we need to hang on in there for a better 2025 - send some seasonal hope my way...

[Swede]

Its rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat. We are going nowhere with LM in charge. He's reached his ceiling and can't propel us into the top six. In fact we are starting to slip back from starting to look dynamic, into a slow passive borefest. I really think Twine unbalances the side when he plays, but he is compelled to play him as he's  his golden boy, after all of the money spent on him and the public wooing of him. I also have a little sympathy for him because of the strikers we got in last summer as they are clearly not our first targets and we're suffering now for it.

I looked at that squad today and thought that's a banker home win, & also how unbalanced the subs bench looked. That's down to Manning.

Mayulu up top when he's done less to impress & no Cornick either! Baffling.

There's obviously more going on than public knowledge behind the scenes but the treatment of Cornick is nothing short of embarrassing, irrespective of some opinions on here.

A head coach/manager should be able to stamp his authority & motivate his team. I just don't see it with Manning and, more importantly, I don't think he can. Win, lose or draw, we should be competitive at the very least but performances like today are creeping in more and more. We are starting to go backwards.

[Cityboy1954]

6 hours ago, Denbury Red said:

What will Manning's excuse be this time!!!!!

Same as every game not sure why hes interviewed just get a pre recorded tape .

[EX8 Red]

1 hour ago, bexhill reds said:

And everyone is only talking about the football (although there is another thread where posters including myself have hoped that the club are checking in on his mental health), but ultimately it remains a results business and the current coaching / management regime have achieved a very similar position and set of points that got the last guy sacked. Indeed as a local litmus test we have won just as many games as the Rovers this year and their manager was relieved of his duties just last week.

Absolutely LM has experienced such heartbreak as we would not wish to endure, and perhaps moving him on (i.e contractually pay him off) will give him and his family time to mourn and give him the chance to find a role and level that best suits his talents.

Agree,things need to be changed,but considering Manning’s personal tragedy recently,sacking the guy right on Christmas would be pretty heartless.

Somethings wrong at the club but it has been for some time.

3 big winnable games coming up but Luton and Portsmouth are in pretty good form and Plymouth are harder to beat at home

[Fuber]

7 hours ago, Jacki said:

You can sack as many managers as you like but while we have the Lansdowns and Tinnion in situ, any change in manager is absolutely pointless. We’re where we’ll always be under these idiots. 

Before Tinns - Gould was fine.

Need an experienced manager - shame Mowbray has the health issues as I'd have loved him in charge of us.

[Mr Popodopolous]

9 minutes ago, EX8 Red said:

3 big winnable games coming up but Luton and Portsmouth are in pretty good form and Plymouth are harder to beat at home

Plymouth I will agree on.

Luton are in pretty good form at Home. I expect I have jinxed it now but they've lost their last 7 Away Games conceding 22 Goals in those 7.

Portsmouth are quite porous on the road, both in respect of Chances and Goals Against.

Edited December 23, 2024 by Mr Popodopolous

[Mr Popodopolous]

Last 7 Away Games- Luton

Away side ie Luton score first!

Plymouth (A) 1-3 L

Sheffield United (A) 0-2 L

Coventry (A) 2-3 L

Middlesbrough (A) 1-5 L

Leeds (A) 0-3 L

Norwich (A) 2-4 L

Blackburn (A) 0-2 L

P7L7

Edited December 23, 2024 by Mr Popodopolous

[fgrsimon]

6 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Surprised that he actually took some sort of accountability! 

He's run out of anything else to blame!

[DaveF]

21 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Last 7 Away Games- Luton

Plymouth (A) 1-3

Sheffield United (A) 0-2

Coventry (A) 2-3

Middlesbrough (A) 1-5

Leeds (A) 0-3

Norwich (A) 2-4

Blackburn (A) 0-2

They've won all 7?!

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 minutes ago, DaveF said:

They've won all 7?!

Sorry no, lost all 7.

Can swap the numbers round if you like. I've clarified.

Edited December 23, 2024 by Mr Popodopolous

[Superjack]

47 minutes ago, fgrsimon said:

He's run out of anything else to blame!

Not quite. 

The day is coming.

[Silvio Dante]

6 hours ago, EX8 Red said:

Agree,things need to be changed,but considering Manning’s personal tragedy recently,sacking the guy right on Christmas would be pretty heartless.

Somethings wrong at the club but it has been for some time.

3 big winnable games coming up but Luton and Portsmouth are in pretty good form and Plymouth are harder to beat at home

It would be, I’d agree, but you do need to separate the professional from the personal.

As I think Fevs said, this wouldn’t be a scenario like in the normal world where you lose your job and your income. His contract would continue to be paid in full or he’d negotiate a payoff.

I completely understand how difficult Christmas will be for him - and be in no doubt, every time of the year will be in different ways. Holidays, kids starting school, all of it - you’ll never get over something like Liams been through, you just manage it. What I’m saying there is from a personal perspective there will always be a reason not to make the decision, so you do need the separation.

I also have some sympathy with the argument of giving Liam compassionate leave over Christmas. But there are two factors there from a professional perspective - firstly, if Hogg acts as cover and there is a stylistic/results uptick as prior, the questions just get bigger against Liam. Secondly, I could get on board with it if the underperformance professionally could be directly pinned to the personal tragedy - but it can’t. We’re performing exactly as we typically have for long terms over Liam and - crucially - seem to be back in the tactical straitjacket that wasn’t there under Hoggs brief spell. Compassionate leave would be just kicking the can in this case.

The final professional aspect is that we have a transfer window coming up. Sacking the coach now means that he doesn’t have a say in shaping that window and, considering the last two windows outcomes, I think professionally that seems sensible.

The bottom line about all of this for me is that Liams weaknesses at game 50 plus are the same as game one. I can’t see him developing, I can’t see him learning. I don’t see an improved team either stylistically or in terms of results. I don’t see great transfer dealings, development of players or a pathway. I cannot see a compelling reason not to make the decision from a professional angle. 
 

I’m clear I’d have sacked him last season. Having now had time to see how this has panned out, and mindful of direction of travel, for the first time this season I’m saying “yeah, it’s time to pull the trigger”. And to acknowledge, Christmas is a shitty time whatever the circumstances - but you have to separate personal from professional, and doing it now may even allow Liam to take some real stock, spend much needed time with family, and not totally torpedo any future managerial ambitions.

[IdliketoRogerMoore]

13 hours ago, Dolman1973 said:

That was rubbish!  What a contrast to the Bears yesterday  best team  in the country- top entertainment with a brilliant coach.

Steve must have watched both games - come on don’t let us footie fans suffer any more!  

 

 

You can’t compare the rugby to the football, there’s only 13ish Professional clubs in the country, 10 in the premiership. We got one of the best coaches in the world coaching us rumoured to be on £800k a year for comparison Guardiola is on £19m (rumoured) it’s not even in the same ball park! 
 Also there is a salary cap with rugby £5m a season, so it’s a much more level playing field, where as the ffp allows to you spend  a % of revenue or lose a £13m (I think) a year, 

The rumours that SL wants to sell the City but does he want to sell the Rugby and the Basketball as well and also the hotel, Stadium and arena? The way he’s structured the whole thing is a mess, I can only assume that is part of the reason we haven’t been sold yet and other clubs have!
 
We have decent stadium, decent catchment area, decent academy and training ground and we’re only 1 promotion in theory away from the Prem  so why haven’t we been sold? 

 

[Johnny Musicworks]

When we get that occasional good result people talk about Manningball. I would argue that yesterday was Manningball at its peak. A performance lacking any drive, passion or commitment. A grey team for a grey day. No he hasn’t lost the dressing room because the dressing room is clearly content to churn out pathetic dross like yesterday on multiple occasions. Add in a bit of bad weather like Portsmouth or yesterday and another week of great training ground performances and tactical masterclasses gets literally blown away. 

It was my first away day for a while, freezing cold, soaked along with everyone else down the front and only warmed by the banter of the fans whose effort and commitment could not be questioned. ‘We’ll train hard to put it right on Boxing Day” a typical comfy players comment. Frankly I don’t care as that performance was unacceptable and the responsibility begins with our inept coach but falls on every part of this fraud that we the long suffering fans are victims of.
 

Top 6 ? not a chance. This season is done by Christmas so let’s not be fooled the next time our players can be bothered to turn up. 

[Sleepy1968]

21 minutes ago, IdliketoRogerMoore said:

You can’t compare the rugby to the football, there’s only 13ish Professional clubs in the country, 10 in the premiership. We got one of the best coaches in the world coaching us rumoured to be on £800k a year for comparison Guardiola is on £19m (rumoured) it’s not even in the same ball park! 
 Also there is a salary cap with rugby £5m a season, so it’s a much more level playing field, where as the ffp allows to you spend  a % of revenue or lose a £13m (I think) a year, 

The rumours that SL wants to sell the City but does he want to sell the Rugby and the Basketball as well and also the hotel, Stadium and arena? The way he’s structured the whole thing is a mess, I can only assume that is part of the reason we haven’t been sold yet and other clubs have!
 
We have decent stadium, decent catchment area, decent academy and training ground and we’re only 1 promotion in theory away from the Prem  so why haven’t we been sold? 

 

In the scheme of company structures/ownership it's pretty simple: all owned by about three members of the Lansdown family isn't it?

It's only going to be 'difficult' to sell the football club if SL makes it so. And he might have some very good reasons for doing that, and he might have some terrible ones, like overpricing.

We'll be attractive at the right price.

[MarcusX]

I was happy for him to go after Cardiff. I’ve said it many times but that week was dreadful.

He earned some grace with what happened, and rightly so that was far more important than football. The club showed some unity and we managed some good results and performances.

Unfortunately, we’ve somehow got worse and yesterday was as bad a performance as I’ve seen in years. WBA didn’t get out of second gear and it could easily have been 3 or 4 nil.

No one even seemed to care. There was no anger, no fight just dejection. I wanted to see someone at least give a shit, but a late tackle in, a petulant kick something to make me think “yea he ******* cares” at least. Closest we got was knights pathetic push while they were making a sub.

Sending Mcrorie out for the post match interview was cowardly too. Should have been the captain, or at least someone who’d played the 90. Give us a proper answer, not just the guy who played the least badly.

I know people don’t like the comparison, but at least under Pearson there was a guy with experience, been there and done it, and had contacts. I think his tenure almost ended with a bad display at West Brom at Xmas? But you kinda trusted him to at least have something to draw on to say “I can get out of this”.

What does Manning have?

seems a nice bloke, but he’s never gonna improve us and some of that is beyond his control. The issues go far deeper.

[MarcusX]

I would also add there’s been some good performances and bad luck, but I said a while back I’m not sure which is the outlier and sadly I think it’s bad performances with the odd lucky good one rather than the other way round.

Most decent managers have found us out - I think the only ones who haven’t are the ones who tried to play their own way regardless eg Stoke. Every manager who’s worked us out has tanked us, Derby after 20 mins, Blackburn, Portsmouth and West Brom.

[Oizys]

15 hours ago, PortInTheMorning said:

I think it's time - I made up my mind last week when he called out the players, but refused to take any responsibility for the result. I think he's lost the dressing room too.

Unfortunately, it will take section 82 a few more games to think the same.

He's constantly called out the players.  I've lost count of the number of times I've bemoaned his "players lose matches, coaches win them" rhetoric. 

13 hours ago, EstoniaTallinnRed said:

Perhaps get rid and appoint Hogg, he seemed to do well when LM was on compassionate leave. Couldn't do worse.

Yes... and then Hoggy can appoint his own backroom team.  Welcome to the coaching staff....Hoggys best mate Liam Manning!

12 hours ago, MythikRobins said:

I do wish we’d go for some unproven head-coaches at some point. We’d maybe stumble into a top level head-coach. Instead we go for ones who’ve slightly proven themselves at a level below ours such as LJ and Manning.

Maybe if we’d go for someone who is totally unproven as a head-coach we’d stumble into a Rohl, McKenna, Carrick, Cleverly, Mousinho, Maresca etc etc. It’s a big risk of course, but we are mid-table might aswell take one sometime this decade. Alas, I’ll go early by a year or two, welcome to Bristol City Ryan Lowe! 

We did that when we sacked Nige....

12 hours ago, Tecknical Director said:

God forbid, you wake up tomorrow morning to the death of your child.  Beginning of January you go back to work, you’re still grieving. Your work sack you, because, rightly so you might not be 100%. Your boss says “sorry you lost, your job, but your work hasn’t been 100% and the loss of your child is irrelevant”. 

Really? You’d be fine with that? Really think about it for a second. 

Irrespective of whether he should or shouldn’t be back in work, Liam has made that choice for whatever reason. But to say it’s irrelevant is wild. 
 

 

What was the excuse for being shit prior to his tragedy? Theo's tragic passing hasn't made him perform any worse than he already was. 

And as for giving him the boot on top of christmas? I would say, with the payout he'd receive, that actually Mrs Manning would probably appreciate the emotional support from her husband at this sad time... 

The reality is that it's rinse and repeat under him.  His performance has not decreased since Theo. Long past time to go. 

Edited December 23, 2024 by Oizys

[Son of Fred]

16 hours ago, Robbored said:

2-0 down at the Hawthornes, barely a shot on target - it’s crap and I’m fed up with the uninspiring shite that Manning is serving up game after game.

Nige was sacked so-say because of results - surely the same should apply to Manning? ……..

Eleven points from our last ten games - Current form table we are 17th,,five points in six.

We're on a steady slide - I view the next four games,three at home,all against poorish sides to be crucial for Mainwaring.

It's a real opportunity to pick up points & raise spirits- absolute bare minimum for me from these four games would be seven points.

Anything considerably less than that total should pull even Jon from his slumber!

This little period pre the Wolves cup game could be a key moment & rather telling.

And if Jon were to rub his eyes?? - the most likely outcome would unsurprisingly be the easy option: Hogg until the end of the season.

 

Edited December 23, 2024 by Son of Fred

[Oizys]

4 minutes ago, Son of Fred said:

Eleven points from our last ten games - Current form table we are 17th,,five points in six.

We're on a steady slide - I view the next four games,three at home,all against poorish sides to be crucial for Mainwaring.

It's a real opportunity to pick up points & raise spirits- absolute bare minimum for me from these four games would be seven points.

Anything considerably less than that total should pull even Jon from his slumber!

This little period pre the Wolves cup game could be a key moment & rather telling.

And if Jon were to rub his eyes?? - the most likely outcome would unsurprisingly be the easy option: Hogg until the end of the season.

 

But even if he could manage 7 points... what does that tell us? It's 7 points against teams that any club with declared playoff aspirations should be taking maximum points from.   

The real litmus test is against the likes of Cov, Blackburn etc.  Any sort of decent return from the next 4 is just more papering over the cracks. 

[DaveInSA]

What were we all expecting?

I was expecting a long hard season. With a few good results in the mix. And. That’s what we’ve got. 

I’m not going to go over my previous posts as for the reasons why.

If you don’t have the quality at the top of the organisation the only way is down. And the slide has started. 

The reason we’re easy to play against is that every other coach or manager has read the same books Liam has. They’ve all been to the same school. They all know about behaviours and outcomes based football. And. It’s all shit. It results in boring chess like football.

You need to do the unexpected on a football field. You need to turn defenders around. As Alan Hansen always used to say “defenders hate defending facing their own goal” (or similar)

FWIW I think a couple of our players have the balls for this approach. 

Unfortunately, the head coach does not.

[Natchfever]

44 minutes ago, Oizys said:

He's constantly called out the players.  I've lost count of the number of times I've bemoaned his "players lose matches, coaches win them" rhetoric. 

Yes... and then Hoggy can appoint his own backroom team.  Welcome to the coaching staff....Hoggys best mate Liam Manning!

We did that when we sacked Nige....

What was the excuse for being shit prior to his tragedy? Theo's tragic passing hasn't made him perform any worse than he already was. 

And as for giving him the boot on top of christmas? I would say, with the payout he'd receive, that actually Mrs Manning would probably appreciate the emotional support from her husband at this sad time... 

The reality is that it's rinse and repeat under him.  His performance has not decreased since Theo. Long past time to go. 

Nailed it mate.

[MythikRobins]

1 hour ago, Oizys said:

We did that when we sacked Nige....

We didn’t really though. Manning has had four seasons in the English league prior and a season in the belgian league. Whilst, he’s unproven relative to Nige he wasn’t particularly unproven. His floor had been clearly shown and his ceiling whilst debatable was visible and is now completely apparent. 5 seasons is a significant amount of time as a head-coach as opposed to some other examples such as Hurzeler, Rohl, McKenna Johannes Hoff Thorup, Mousinho and many more who’s experience as head-coaches begins in 2022/2023.

It certainly holds more risk to go for head-coaches like this some who’ve only had one job at one club for a year or two, or in many of these cases have never had a job as a head-coach. But the upside as we see with many of these clubs St. Pauli reaching the bundesliga for the first time in decades, Ipswich achieving double promotions, Sheffield wednesday clawing themselves out of a guaranteed relegation to potentially pushing for upper middtable shows that in my opinion the risk/reward is worth it. It also takes much more research, time and effort to find the right one as opposed to just going off the league 1 or sacked championship manager conveyer belt.

Edited December 23, 2024 by MythikRobins

[BobBobBobbin]

13 hours ago, Spike said:

A few people saying Moyes, I don't see why even as a past player he'd consider us, he gave West Ham their first major silverware in 43 years and is way beyond this club. I can't even imagine the wages he could demand from a club, I couldn't see us even being realistically close and that's before he meets Tinnion who he'd have to work under, he'd probably laugh all the way home at that thought. 

The Moyes suggestion has additional parameters/consequences imo. 

If you go for him it's possible on the proviso that you essentially hand him the keys for a complete structural rebuild.

I've seen him comment on wanting a long term job, like he had at Everton. I can see him being enticed by that prospect here as "manager" with total control.

It would take time to professionalise this football club. It's an absolute shit show currently. But if we brought in him and Biff that would be a start.

The benefits would mainly be off the pitch to start with. And as those things bore fruit, the on pitch stuff would follow. It'd be functional and effective. 

It won't happen because of Lansdowns ego, but if you handed me ownership of the club I'd be on the phone to Moyes within half a minute selling him the vision. 

Add to that a conversation with Scudamore about the chairmanship/CEO position with a remit of making our business model and sponsorships elite. 

There are ample people with an affinity to Bristol City who, with the right offer, would want to be part of a team who returned this club to the top tier. Issue is that Lansdown is a grade A moron. 

[Son of Fred]

50 minutes ago, Oizys said:

But even if he could manage 7 points... what does that tell us? It's 7 points against teams that any club with declared playoff aspirations should be taking maximum points from.   

The real litmus test is against the likes of Cov, Blackburn etc.  Any sort of decent return from the next 4 is just more papering over the cracks. 

I quite agree- I marked the next four as crucial,, because failure to perform will make those cracks impossible to ignore.

I'd very much like to see us win,and win well v Luton(I'll be there with my grandson) - I can't hope for us to lose.

However,the writing to some extent for Mainwaring is already on the wall- there's a terrible inevitability about it - he's not self aware/flexible enough to begin a climb,let alone sustain it - stubbornness shall be his downfall.

 This only leads to destabilisation - we've backed the wrong horse & the fatal dive is sadly inevitable.. it's just a matter of when.

[Spike]

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

The Moyes suggestion has additional parameters/consequences imo. 

If you go for him it's possible on the proviso that you essentially hand him the keys for a complete structural rebuild.

I'd agree if this had happened 5-10 years ago, but it's very clear to see that Tinnion is where he is because he loves that line he has to tow and the people above him see that as his best quality, towing the line. 

We're not getting any kind of restructuring under Tinnion and we're not getting rid of Tinnion because he loves to stroke the egos of those above him. 

Even if we could talk Moyes into taking less money and offering him the opportunity to make changes I think it would only be a matter of time and some home truths and Tinnion and friends would be looking for a reason to get him out as Moyes is a no nonsense man, more so than Pearson. 

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

I've seen him comment on wanting a long term job, like he had at Everton. I can see him being enticed by that prospect here as "manager" with total control.

I still think he knows he has a higher calibre of suitors than us and as above, he wouldn't be a traditional manager because we have a technical director and should Moyes come in Tinnion would find his position pointless, hence we've got rid of a manager such as Pearson and replaced him with a head coach. 

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

It would take time to professionalise this football club. It's an absolute shit show currently. But if we brought in him and Biff that would be a start.

I fully agree, most of our fans will agree and I'd dare to say any interested outside parties would probably agree, the problem is the people at the top of the club won't agree. Currently we have a man who thinks he's a visionary and designer at the top but he has about as much creativity as a bird shitting on a car and calling it art and his vision is about as clear as Stevie Wonder wearing blacked out glasses whist sat in a room with no windows or lights. 

Jon wouldn't know what to do with a man like Moyes telling him what needs to change, it would threaten his position as the main man and that's why he has Tinnion as a Technical director, because he'll agree with Jon and won't make him face reality, that he's not capable of his job. Instead they continue to pat each other on the back and reassure each other they know what they're doing. 

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

The benefits would mainly be off the pitch to start with. And as those things bore fruit, the on pitch stuff would follow. It'd be functional and effective. 

I think given a managerial role and Tinnion being removed I couldn't agree more. 

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

It won't happen because of Lansdowns ego, but if you handed me ownership of the club I'd be on the phone to Moyes within half a minute selling him the vision. 

I think most of us would but even if he was interested I still believe there would be better offers, certainly better paid ones. The chances of everything signing to get him here would be astronomical IMO, so many things would need to fall in line perfectly before there would even be an outside chance. 

15 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

Add to that a conversation with Scudamore about the chairmanship/CEO position with a remit of making our business model and sponsorships elite. 

There are ample people with an affinity to Bristol City who, with the right offer, would want to be part of a team who returned this club to the top tier. Issue is that Lansdown is a grade A moron. 

I don't even see Steve Lansdown as a moron, I think if he could see past the fact he doesn't know football he'd actually be a fantastic owner as the business side of the club he's improved no end, the stadium, the training ground, the financial backing etc The only reason he falls short is because he wanted to be the reason we succeeded so badly that he wouldn't hire people who would stand up to him and his son is the same, it's their need to be right. I feel like because Steve has had so much success in business that he doesn't see the possibility that he may not be able to do some things successfully and that's probably effected his judgement of people he's brought in because he's used to having employees who follow his vision when what he needs here is someone with a footballing vision to take control of the club. Steve just can't accept that he can't make anything he wants work, he's so used to being right in business that it's alien that football may be beyond him. 

[BobBobBobbin]

7 minutes ago, Spike said:

I'd agree if this had happened 5-10 years ago, but it's very clear to see that Tinnion is where he is because he loves that line he has to tow and the people above him see that as his best quality, towing the line. 

We're not getting any kind of restructuring under Tinnion and we're not getting rid of Tinnion because he loves to stroke the egos of those above him. 

Even if we could talk Moyes into taking less money and offering him the opportunity to make changes I think it would only be a matter of time and some home truths and Tinnion and friends would be looking for a reason to get him out as Moyes is a no nonsense man, more so than Pearson. 

I still think he knows he has a higher calibre of suitors than us and as above, he wouldn't be a traditional manager because we have a technical director and should Moyes come in Tinnion would find his position pointless, hence we've got rid of a manager such as Pearson and replaced him with a head coach. 

I fully agree, most of our fans will agree and I'd dare to say any interested outside parties would probably agree, the problem is the people at the top of the club won't agree. Currently we have a man who thinks he's a visionary and designer at the top but he has about as much creativity as a bird shitting on a car and calling it art and his vision is about as clear as Stevie Wonder wearing blacked out glasses whist sat in a room with no windows or lights. 

Jon wouldn't know what to do with a man like Moyes telling him what needs to change, it would threaten his position as the main man and that's why he has Tinnion as a Technical director, because he'll agree with Jon and won't make him face reality, that he's not capable of his job. Instead they continue to pat each other on the back and reassure each other they know what they're doing. 

I think given a managerial role and Tinnion being removed I couldn't agree more. 

I think most of us would but even if he was interested I still believe there would be better offers, certainly better paid ones. The chances of everything signing to get him here would be astronomical IMO, so many things would need to fall in line perfectly before there would even be an outside chance. 

I don't even see Steve Lansdown as a moron, I think if he could see past the fact he doesn't know football he'd actually be a fantastic owner as the business side of the club he's improved no end, the stadium, the training ground, the financial backing etc The only reason he falls short is because he wanted to be the reason we succeeded so badly that he wouldn't hire people who would stand up to him and his son is the same, it's their need to be right. I feel like because Steve has had so much success in business that he doesn't see the possibility that he may not be able to do some things successfully and that's probably effected his judgement of people he's brought in because he's used to having employees who follow his vision when what he needs here is someone with a footballing vision to take control of the club. Steve just can't accept that he can't make anything he wants work, he's so used to being right in business that it's alien that football may be beyond him. 

All fair, except the last bit. 

Lansdown hasnt done well for us from a business or a facilities perspective..

The revamp has been done to a high standard but there's still no room for it to grow and the Dolman is a few years from needing to be replaced. 

He screwed up Ashton Vale. He's built a average training ground and it took him decades to get it done.

We lose millions a year because we don't make any money and spend ridiculous amounts on non-football staff. (syphoning money out of the club for his mates).

He's a terrible owner. He's a worse bloke. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

16 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

All fair, except the last bit. 

Lansdown hasnt done well for us from a business or a facilities perspective..

The revamp has been done to a high standard but there's still no room for it to grow and the Dolman is a few years from needing to be replaced. 

He screwed up Ashton Vale. He's built a average training ground and it took him decades to get it done.

We lose millions a year because we don't make any money and spend ridiculous amounts on non-football staff. (syphoning money out of the club for his mates).

He's a terrible owner. He's a worse bloke. 

Tbh the infrastructure...I dunno seems okay? Seems better than it was- we messed up Ashton Vale yes but there is a useful Plan B at AG.

The Revenue Point I would challenge on as it hit £36mish for Bristol City Holdings in 2022-23. That being the sum total of Club and AGL mainly.

The stuff about hiring mates, can you expand on that. How much do we think it is costing the Club annually?

He could of course convert all his debt to equity which would leave us debt free and leave 3% or so Interest annually on said debt.

I would say what can we do in Summer 2013...how long could or should we have fought in respect of Ashton Vale, how long would a new Stadium Plan have taken with us bouncing along with the non redeveloped AG and relative lack of Income.

Edited December 23, 2024 by Mr Popodopolous

[fisherrich]

9 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Tbh the infrastructure...I dunno seems okay? Seems better than it was- we messed up Ashton Vale yes but there is a useful Plan B at AG.

The Revenue Point I would challenge on as it hit £36mish for Bristol City Holdings in 2022-23. That being the sum total of Club and AGL mainly.

The stuff about hiring mates, can you expand on that. How much do we think it is costing the Club annually?

He could of course convert all his debt to equity which would leave us debt free and leave 3% or so Interest annually on said debt.

I would say what can we do in Summer 2013...how long could or should we have fought in respect of Ashton Vale, how long would a new Stadium Plan have taken with us bouncing along with the non redeveloped AG and relative lack of Income.

IMO it is about the Chairman and the Board being accountable, which currently they are not.

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, fisherrich said:

IMO it is about the Chairman and the Board being accountable, which currently they are not.

I totally agree here. They are hiding.

[Jerseybean]

22 minutes ago, fisherrich said:

IMO it is about the Chairman and the Board being accountable, which currently they are not.

Agree. See separate thread headed ‘accountability’ 

[IAmNick]

It's getting harder to think what I'd need to see to believe he was capable of turning things around on a macro scale. Even a couple of wins and draws in a row, does that really make a marked long term difference?

We know we can win/lose/draw a few under Manning at this point, the issue is whether we're seeing overall progress and that isn't really measured over 1, 2, or even 6 games. It's been over a year now. I was in the "give him until Christmas unless it really goes to shit" group in the summer, and it's now Christmas.

The real question is, given what we now know, would you hire Manning today? The answer is no for me, so he needs to go. Anything else is just falling into the sunk cost, hope above reason trap imo.

[RollsRoyce]

1 hour ago, BobBobBobbin said:

The Moyes suggestion has additional parameters/consequences imo. 

If you go for him it's possible on the proviso that you essentially hand him the keys for a complete structural rebuild.

I've seen him comment on wanting a long term job, like he had at Everton. I can see him being enticed by that prospect here as "manager" with total control.

It would take time to professionalise this football club. It's an absolute shit show currently. But if we brought in him and Biff that would be a start.

The benefits would mainly be off the pitch to start with. And as those things bore fruit, the on pitch stuff would follow. It'd be functional and effective. 

It won't happen because of Lansdowns ego, but if you handed me ownership of the club I'd be on the phone to Moyes within half a minute selling him the vision. 

Add to that a conversation with Scudamore about the chairmanship/CEO position with a remit of making our business model and sponsorships elite. 

There are ample people with an affinity to Bristol City who, with the right offer, would want to be part of a team who returned this club to the top tier. Issue is that Lansdown is a grade A moron. 

Scudamore already did that . The guy lasted a few months . 
 

The owners do not want to be told what they are lacking or what to do . When you have a structure filled with yes people and mates that is no shock. It’s turkeys voting for Christmas . 

[BobBobBobbin]

11 minutes ago, RollsRoyce said:

Scudamore already did that . The guy lasted a few months . 
 

The owners do not want to be told what they are lacking or what to do . When you have a structure filled with yes people and mates that is no shock. It’s turkeys voting for Christmas . 

I know, I agree. 

Lansdown is the cancer. 

Everything else is the symptom of that cancer. 

Nothing will change until he's gone. Unfortunately I can't see the club changing hands through any other means than a last will and testament. 

 

[Red Ferret]

Manningball 

[Cidre Monita]

17 minutes ago, BobBobBobbin said:

I know, I agree. 

Lansdown is the cancer. 

Everything else is the symptom of that cancer. 

Nothing will change until he's gone. Unfortunately I can't see the club changing hands through any other means than a last will and testament. 

 

Regrettably I think we have got at least another decade to suffer under the Lansdown ownership. As you say nothing will change until SL has gone. The fish rots from the head down, as they say. 

Let’s assume that he has the clubs best interests at heart and desperately wants premiership football. If that is the case then he has totally mismanaged the club in his circa 20 years with us. The dreadful recruitment and general decision making by him over the years has been nothing short of self-destructive. 

Alternatively he may not want Premier league football due to the massive costs involved. I remember back in 2015 he expressed his shock and the increased cost of wages/agents fees following our promotion to the Championship. I speak to people who think that SL is ‘comfortable’ with where we are and happy for the status quo to continue. This then leads to some people thinking that he actively jeopardises any opportunity of us making it to the PL. 

[MythikRobins]

1 hour ago, IAmNick said:

It's getting harder to think what I'd need to see to believe he was capable of turning things around on a macro scale. Even a couple of wins and draws in a row, does that really make a marked long term difference?

We know we can win/lose/draw a few under Manning at this point, the issue is whether we're seeing overall progress and that isn't really measured over 1, 2, or even 6 games. It's been over a year now. I was in the "give him until Christmas unless it really goes to shit" group in the summer, and it's now Christmas.

The real question is, given what we now know, would you hire Manning today? The answer is no for me, so he needs to go. Anything else is just falling into the sunk cost, hope above reason trap imo.

This is our prevailing weakness as a club. The club withheld a portion of  funds from Pearson in his last summer. They obviously didn’t see a future with him at the helm beyond his contract so why wait and forge a reason? It’s such a waste of everybody’s time.

The same could be said about LJ, we got close, but as many said at the time it was a missed opportunity and we persisted with LJ as if out of nowhere everything was gonna suddenly click. 

Feel we’ve seen Mannings ceiling or at least close to it with this squad and I see no reason why it’d suddenly click. Once again we are close and competitive but a couple steps short. Either we keep spending and try to improve the squad or we change the manager. At this point I see no reason we can overcome what’s preventing us from taking the next stop.

[IdliketoRogerMoore]

5 hours ago, Sleepy1968 said:

In the scheme of company structures/ownership it's pretty simple: all owned by about three members of the Lansdown family isn't it?

It's only going to be 'difficult' to sell the football club if SL makes it so. And he might have some very good reasons for doing that, and he might have some terrible ones, like overpricing.

We'll be attractive at the right price.

I would suggest seeing that we apparently have been up for sale or open to outside investment for a while now that he has indeed been an obstacle in the sale of the club!

[Davefevs]

6 hours ago, MarcusX said:

Sending Mcrorie out for the post match interview was cowardly too. Should have been the captain, or at least someone who’d played the 90.

Said that on our WhatsApp group.

[Dredd]

We keep hearing about 'taking the emotion out of the game' and not getting too high or low. Sorry but for me football is about the highs and lows, be that on a game by game basis or season by season. If I wanted to watch a load of robots play football I'd stay home and stick the PlayStation on. I want to see a bit of fight, a petulant tackle, a ******* speculative shot from 30 yards, an argument amongst players to show they actually care. Look what happened with Orr and Carey back in the day; kick started one of the great seasons and Orr turned into a hell of a player. 
People say that the football is better with us now playing a more possession based game rather than the counter attacking style NP had us playing. Is it better? Is anyone enjoying it any more? Because results don't suggest it's any better, nor the league table, nor the amount of dissatisfied fans. For me we've just transitioned into a different style of play without progress. 

[Maltshoveller]

1 hour ago, IdliketoRogerMoore said:

I would suggest seeing that we apparently have been up for sale or open to outside investment for a while now that he has indeed been an obstacle in the sale of the club!

OR

No body has come up with any money to buy the club

 

 

[temp]

1 hour ago, IdliketoRogerMoore said:

I would suggest seeing that we apparently have been up for sale or open to outside investment for a while now that he has indeed been an obstacle in the sale of the club!

What is "we" is the question? the club and football ground including Bristol Rugby, just the club who would still have to be paying for use of the ground owned by? what about the new development hotel etc? we are part of something else now Bristol Sport, very messy for anyone to buy into imo.

[temp]

5 minutes ago, Maltshoveller said:

OR

No body has come up with any money to buy the club

 

 

Difficult to cut free from BS imo,  would they be Bristol Part Sport

[Mr Popodopolous]

8 minutes ago, Maltshoveller said:

OR

No body has come up with any money to buy the club

 

 

For me, £40-60m bracket based on other sales. I know the new infrastructure etc etc.

SL already has a £90m as of last Accounts secured debt over AGL, so that alone could be the asking price. Then there is the equity he has converted.

Nobody is buying at that price, no chance.

[Maltshoveller]

2 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

For me, £40-60m bracket based on other sales. I know the new infrastructure etc etc.

SL already has a £90m as of last Accounts secured debt over AGL, so that alone could be the asking price. Then there is the equity he has converted.

Nobody is buying at that price, no chance.

So as i said 

Nobody has come up with the money to buy the club

[Ian M]

On 22/12/2024 at 15:58, Robbored said:

2-0 down at the Hawthornes, barely a shot on target - it’s crap and I’m fed up with the uninspiring shite that Manning is serving up game after game.

Nige was sacked so-say because of results - surely the same should apply to Manning? ……..

To quote a reply in another thread:

"I can’t see the purpose of posts of this nature. Regardless of the results nobody within the hierarchy at AG would take the slightest notice.

To coin a phrase said by Neil Harris ‘ fans are thickoes’ I daresay that our hierarchy think the same - they just haven’t say it."

[Robbored]

14 minutes ago, Ian M said:

To quote a reply in another thread:

"I can’t see the purpose of posts of this nature. Regardless of the results nobody within the hierarchy at AG would take the slightest notice.

To coin a phrase said by Neil Harris ‘ fans are thickoes’ I daresay that our hierarchy think the same - they just haven’t say it."

You’ll have to explain your meaning in simpler terms IanM as I can’t see what your point is……….

[Jerseybean]

If we lose to Luton then Pompey I’d expect that to be a taxi for Manning, however, can’t see the hierarchy doing anything. 

[Ska Junkie]

For those of a similar / older vintage as me (57), remember that night at Coventry in 1977 when, at 2-2, they passed the ball about in their own half, then kicked it to us to do the same? Isn't that very similar to 'Manningball'? 

[SDBS36]

Time for Robbings to be brought in if he’s still available and would want to comes

[Shauntaylor85]

Just read his Cornick interview whereby he thinks best he moves on in Jan yet he’s no worse than the strikers we have! Baffling. What is irritating is the nicknames for players, Corns, Twiney, Sincs….I bet he even calls his boss Tins! Honestly this guy has no leadership! Would you respect him and be driven by him as a player? Absolutely not, he’s another Dean Holden.

Edited December 23, 2024 by Shauntaylor85

[Shauntaylor85]

27 minutes ago, Jerseybean said:

If we lose to Luton then Pompey I’d expect that to be a taxi for Manning, however, can’t see the hierarchy doing anything. 

We may need that to happen to move on this depressing 14 month period of him as Head Coach. Two steps back to move forward. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

10 minutes ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

Just read his Cornick interview whereby he thinks best he moves on in Jan yet he’s no worse than the strikers we have! Baffling. What is irritating is the nicknames for players, Corns, Twiney, Sincs….I bet he even calls his boss Tins! Honestly this guy has no leadership! Would you respect him and be driven by him as a player? Absolutely not, he’s another Dean Holden.

I do wonder what Cornick has done to deserve such treatment. 

Yes he is not the long term answer. But what he does is cause a nuisance of himself up front, presses well and has good long throws. Those abilities should have been used at times. Maybe a long throw yesterday helps us get back into the game for example. 

Cornick is an employee of Bristol City and is well paid, yet here we are not utilising him. 

It's shambolic that LM won't use him. 

 

[Sleepy1968]

2 hours ago, Maltshoveller said:

So as i said 

Nobody has come up with the money to buy the club

I'm sure there would be interested parties if it was competitively priced.

In completely separate news, is anyone interested in a 1985 Vauxhall Nova? £18,350 ono. You would need to arrange shipping from the Channel Islands.I can put you in touch with the owners son on Thursday.

[38MC]

10 hours ago, MarcusX said:

I was happy for him to go after Cardiff. I’ve said it many times but that week was dreadful.

He earned some grace with what happened, and rightly so that was far more important than football. The club showed some unity and we managed some good results and performances.

Unfortunately, we’ve somehow got worse and yesterday was as bad a performance as I’ve seen in years. WBA didn’t get out of second gear and it could easily have been 3 or 4 nil.

No one even seemed to care. There was no anger, no fight just dejection. I wanted to see someone at least give a shit, but a late tackle in, a petulant kick something to make me think “yea he ******* cares” at least. Closest we got was knights pathetic push while they were making a sub.

Sending Mcrorie out for the post match interview was cowardly too. Should have been the captain, or at least someone who’d played the 90. Give us a proper answer, not just the guy who played the least badly.

I know people don’t like the comparison, but at least under Pearson there was a guy with experience, been there and done it, and had contacts. I think his tenure almost ended with a bad display at West Brom at Xmas? But you kinda trusted him to at least have something to draw on to say “I can get out of this”.

What does Manning have?

seems a nice bloke, but he’s never gonna improve us and some of that is beyond his control. The issues go far deeper.

Exactly how I feel. Wanted him gone post Cardiff. Then there was credit in the bank, and even pre-WBA I was defending him, but that performance, the post match interview, the selection and tactics, and now the admission he’d rather shit in his hands and clap than possibly see HC score from the bench, I’m in the out camp. I was before, switched sides, but coming back again. 

Despite being in the overall out camp I still wouldn’t sack him right now. Because I’m not sure we’d bring in someone to propel us. 

Tinnion gone and a proper replacement is a pre-requisite. I’d also like better, realistic candidates than Robins for manager. 

I want a combo we can trust. For that Id want Tinnion gone and replaced first. Let a proper footballing CEO judge Manning.

If he doesn’t like what he sees, by all means sack him; but unless in danger of relegation there’s no need to pull the trigger just to get Robins. I’d be willing to wait. 

Edited December 23, 2024 by 38MC

[maxjak]

Everyone and his Auntie seems to believe he should be sacked?   But  he will get at least until the end of the season, unless we end up in the bottom 3?   So we will all have to put up with him for a while yet ?  Personally i don't rate him.................or Tinnion, but having said that, I am hoping things will improve, as i support the team, who   ever is in charge?     But i am not  holding my breath    

[Ska Junkie]

1 hour ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

I do wonder what Cornick has done to deserve such treatment. 

Yes he is not the long term answer. But what he does is cause a nuisance of himself up front, presses well and has good long throws. Those abilities should have been used at times. Maybe a long throw yesterday helps us get back into the game for example. 

Cornick is an employee of Bristol City and is well paid, yet here we are not utilising him. 

It's shambolic that LM won't use him. 

 

We had better hope Nahki stays fit or we could be in a bit of trouble with the remaining 'strikers' available. 

The fact that most would rather Sham69 (come on, come on, urry up 'Arry, come on) play over the other 2 speaks volumes IMHO.

[TV Tom]

17 minutes ago, 38MC said:

Exactly how I feel. Wanted him gone post Cardiff. Then there was credit in the bank, and even pre-WBA I was defending him, but that performance, the post match interview, the selection and tactics, and now the admission he’d rather shit in his hands and clap than possibly see HC score from the bench, I’m in the out camp. I was before, switched sides, but coming back again. 

Despite being in the overall out camp I still wouldn’t sack him right now. Because I’m not sure we’d bring in someone to propel us. 

Tinnion gone and a proper replacement is a pre-requisite. I’d also like better, realistic candidates than Robins for manager. 

I want a combo we can trust. For that Id want Tinnion gone and replaced first. Let a proper footballing CEO judge Manning.

If he doesn’t like what he sees, by all means sack him; but unless in danger of relegation there’s no need to pull the trigger just to get Robins. I’d be willing to wait. 

I'm still just about onboard with Manning but only just, some big games coming up which even if they are positive might only be delaying the inevitable particularly with the likes of Robins, O'Neil and even Moyes who are all currently out of work (whether any of them would come here is another matter)

[Swede]

Unless the owner finally steps in to radically shake up who controls the day to day running of the club by moving JL onto a new project more attuned to his skill set and employing experienced people such as Scudamore & Newman or we have new owners, nothing will happen.

I think we were better with Hogg in charge & certainly had more purpose & that's taking into account the unfortunate circumstances.

The question is, he's stuck by him up to now but with results and performances on the wain, how long before he twists? 

As far as January is concerned, unfortunately I can only see the experienced Cornick & Naismith gone, whether that means a new forward coming in, who knows but I wager it will be only be a "one for the future" lower league replacement. So, in effect we will be even weaker.

 

[Ska Junkie]

17 minutes ago, Swede said:

As far as January is concerned, unfortunately I can only see the experienced Cornick & Naismith gone, whether that means a new forward coming in, who knows but I wager it will be only be a "one for the future" lower league replacement. So, in effect we will be even weaker.

 

An utterly pointless exercise then Swede. We ve got plenty of 'ones for the future', most out on loan. We need one for the present. 

I appreciate we are making the same point btw. 

Riis or Poku for me, both ooc in the summer although Poku is currently injured.

If we pushed the boat out a bit, go in for Whittaker and play him through the middle. Argyle can say 'no' but at least we would have tried.

[IAmNick]

1 minute ago, Ska Junkie said:

An utterly pointless exercise then Swede. We ve got plenty of 'ones for the future', most out on loan. We need one for the present. 

I appreciate we are making the same point btw. 

Riis or Poku for me, both ooc in the summer although Poku is currently injured.

If we pushed the boat out a bit, go in for Whittaker and play him through the middle. Argyle can say 'no' but at least we would have tried.

Surely this "it's not working, throw more money at him" approach is exactly what we don't want to repeat? 

Manning, and Tinnion had a fair chunk of cash over the summer. Part of me wants to say you had your backing - now it's time to deliver.

Is buying our third multi-million pound striker in a single season really a rational or justifiable response for a club like City?

It's not like we made a big signing who immediately got injured (e.g. Afobe) and we're holding on until January to buy a replacement.

 

[Ska Junkie]

23 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Surely this "it's not working, throw more money at him" approach is exactly what we don't want to repeat? 

Manning, and Tinnion had a fair chunk of cash over the summer. Part of me wants to say you had your backing - now it's time to deliver.

Is buying our third multi-million pound striker in a single season really a rational or justifiable response for a club like City?

It's not like we made a big signing who immediately got injured (e.g. Afobe) and we're holding on until January to buy a replacement.

 

Fair comment IAmNick.

My only reply would be the names I have mentioned have proven scoring records and due to being OOC in the summer would be at a reduced price.

I have no magic wand and fwiw, I agree with your sentiment but would return, with all possible respect, with, what would you do?

EDIT If anyone else wants to answer, feel free as we are gonna be mid table, at best, again, with the status quo.

Edited December 23, 2024 by Ska Junkie

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 22/12/2024 at 16:26, Mendip City said:

Funny how Ashton doesn’t get slagged off here any longer…. 

Let's not go nuts, he given a degree of freedom played a big role still in our near disaster. He also was assisting Ipswich when still on our payroll. Between them him and Johnson, ably assisted by a disastrous lack of oversight by the Lansdowns left us in a huge mess.

Gould and Pearson were the perfect antidote- plus Fleming, Euell and Rennie.

Because of the jokers in the first Paragraph however, we couldn't spend a fee from September 1st 2021 to late January 2023, ie when Semenyo went.

I think we were even so hamstrung that we couldn't get anyone worth adding once Baker had to retire but was still on the payroll for a year e post August 2022. Perhaps I'm overstating the last bit but Ashton played a full role in that near disaster.

[One Team]

Anyone know what the reaction Of our fans was like at FT on Sunday? 

[Jose]

21 minutes ago, One Team said:

Anyone know what the reaction Of our fans was like at FT on Sunday? 

Mainly boos. You still get some who clap absolutely anything. I wouldn’t call it hostile. I mean I gave it both barrels but it doesn’t seem the fans have turned really. Most had left by that point.

[BeggyBlaggers]

I said manning would be gone in his first 12 months, ive seen absolutely nothing that suggests he will take us forward. Hes a classroom coach of the modern FA era - for someone who has history of working with academy players, its baffling that none are getting a breakthrough.

 

And as for the love in for Hogg, im not buying how great it was in his 2 games...we beat middlesboro, decent result, was it a fantastic performance though?. despite having 28 shots against Stoke, we could just as easily lost that game in the few chances stoke had.

 

Get shot of the pair of them asap, but its a short term fix because the biggest issue is off the pitch and until those are binned off, the next 'head coach' will fail.

 

The club has stagnated because lansdown has allowed it, he wants to be promoted 'purely' but his ego wont allow him to employ a decent manager that could actually get us there.

 

The bloke is an absolute cockwomble.