Why I have hope

[RedTop]

Last night was indisputably turgid, passionless, unimaginitive bilge all round. Personally, I'm grateful that the cameras weren't there as I'd hate think the rest of the country would see that as what Bristol has to offer the footballing world. It was without doubt the worst standard of derby I can recall in my 25-plus years as a City fan. Not the worst result (I recall being on the wrong end of some stinkers in my time!) just the worst fare all round. The word 'flat' doesn't do it justice.

However, my confidence in progressing to the Mill Stad grew when I got back to the car and listened to the Gasheads calling Radio Bristol. For some inexplicable reason, they seemed proud of their performance and to think that they had played very well.

Trying to look at the game objectively, I thought both teams played poorly, and that really is not a case of sour grapes. The Gas are right to be happier with the result, as the away team and the team from a lower division. Their defending was certainly for the most effective, though little was offered to test it. But if what we witnessed last night was indeed a great Rovers performance by their current standards then that really is good news. Because it was easily matched by a very poor, unimagitive City performance hampered further by a rare dodgy tactical set-up by GJ. It's hard to believe that we will play that ineptly again next week. So if that's all the Gas have to offer then I'm feeling much better already.

Rovers proved they can shut up shop but offered very little else. At their place, they will have to be more positive and as those who have watched City away this season will know, that opens up far more possibilities for our passing game.

So thanks to the Rovers fans who phoned up Twentyman enthusing at the end of the game. If you really found that Gas performance inspiring then the lads have nothing to fear when they go to the Mammary Ground. Bring it on.

[Bristol Boy]

Whilst I agree with the thrust of your post, the more worrying thing for me is the backside dropping out of our home form and if you were an occassional fan who'd attended our last three home games, you'd never return.

We are not just dropping points, we are not scoring, not creating chances and our performances lack zest, energy & purpose.

[RedTop]

Whilst I agree with the thrust of your post, the more worrying thing for me is the backside dropping out of our home form and if you were an occassional fan who'd attended our last three home games, you'd never return.

We are not just dropping points, we are not scoring, not creating chances and our performances lack zest, energy & purpose.

Yes, but I also recall debating with you just a few weeks ago BB when you were bemoaning the way we played away and insisting it was impossible to see any glimmer of hope that might suggest where our next away point was coming from. Since then, we've smashed Oldham 3-0 at Boundary Park, eased past Coventry at the Ricoh without breaking sweat, beaten in-form rivals Blackpool 1-0 on a beach and matched Premiership Middlesboro on their own pitch. Things change very quickly.

I think the home blip is just that, borne out of our mental and physical cup exertions. We have a strong enough squad to recover our home form, and once the players can settle down again and concentrate on the one thing that matters to us all and on which judgement of their success or failure this season depends - promotion - then I think we will see us forge ahead once more.

I am in no doubt that being in three competitions with the attention and lack of focus that inevitably brings has had an effect on the players. Frankly, I wonder whether it would have been better to fade out of the JHT in the early rounds or for GJ to make it clear he would be playing the youth team throughout the competition. I'm sure most people would disagree with that (not least the chairman, who can look forward to a better bottom line in the club's accounts). But it has made me reassess my outlook up until now, which has been that success breeds success and, therefore, that winning every game in every competition made it more likely that you'd win the next one. In the future I think we have to think more carefully about our priorities for the club rather than placingthe same emphasis on every game.

While I think we have tremendous strength in depth compared to our rivals, all the switching around, rotating and coping with the extra injuries and suspensions that come with playing more games has disrupted our momentum. Going out of the FA Cup is a relief for me. The last thing I want is for us to get to the Mill Stad by beating the Gas and find that the players minds are not focused on the league during the period leading up to the final. Yes, it's a nice day out and lucrative for the club, but it cannot be allowed to interfere with our promotion drive.

Either way, the number of games interfering with the league will now reduce and with a bit of luck (and good management from GJ) the players should be able to recover their momentum in the league. Provided that happens, I'm confident we can finish in the top two. If that happens, I won't care one jot whether we lose to the Gas in the game next week, or indeed to Doncaster at the Mill Stad.

[Bristol Boy]

Yes, but I also recall debating with you just a few weeks ago BB when you were bemoaning the way we played away and insisting it was impossible to see any glimmer of hope that might suggest where our next away point was coming from. Since then, we've smashed Oldham 3-0 at Boundary Park, eased past Coventry at the Ricoh without breaking sweat, beaten in-form rivals Blackpool 1-0 on a beach and matched Premiership Middlesboro on their own pitch. Things change very

quickly.

We also lost to S****horpe on another beach and it's not the results it our approach and performance level that has me concerned.I can't remember "insisting it was impossible," either.Asfor the Coventry game I think Louis Carey & Co would argue with your "not breaking sweat" analogy

I think the home blip is just that, borne out of our mental and physical cup exertions. We have a strong enough squad to recover our home form, and once the players can settle down again and concentrate on the one thing that matters to us all and on which judgement of their success or failure this season depends - promotion - then I think we will see us forge ahead once more.

I hope you're right although, in terms of our squad, I still say were a tall striker short and our lack of a polific goal scorer is the reason why we're 5th and not top already.ES's injury seems to be our next major problem.

I am in no doubt that being in three competitions with the attention and lack of focus that inevitably brings has had an effect on the players. Frankly, I wonder whether it would have been better to fade out of the JHT in the early rounds or for GJ to make it clear he would be playing the youth team throughout the competition.

SL wanted the £500k that can be made plus Rovers at home as an 19,000 bonus.Whilst that theory is popular, we did nothing in all the cup competitions las season and finsihed 9th so it doesn't always follow.

I'm sure most people would disagree with that (not least the chairman, who can look forward to a better bottom line in the club's accounts). But it has made me reassess my outlook up until now, which has been that success breeds success and, therefore, that winning every game in every competition made it more likely that you'd win the next one. In the future I think we have to think more carefully about our priorities for the club rather than placingthe same emphasis on every game.

I think that problems only arise when you start losing or players start saving themselves for the big day.The same might be said if we look like being in the play offs.

While I think we have tremendous strength in depth compared to our rivals, all the switching around, rotating and coping with the extra injuries and suspensions that come with playing more games has disrupted our momentum. Going out of the FA Cup is a relief for me. The last thing I want is for us to get to the Mill Stad by beating the Gas and find that the players minds are not focused on the league during the period leading up to the final. Yes, it's a nice day out and lucrative for the club, but it cannot be allowed to interfere with our promotion drive.

I think that we'll need good luck with injuries and suspensions from here on in and we need to get ES fit for a start.

Either way, the number of games interfering with the league will now reduce and with a bit of luck (and good management from GJ) the players should be able to recover their momentum in the league. Provided that happens, I'm confident we can finish in the top two. If that happens, I won't care one jot whether we lose to the Gas in the game next week, or indeed to Doncaster at the Mill Stad.

I think getting to the final will give us lift and whilst winning it would be great, I'd rather lose to Donnie than the Gas if I had to choose and we won't have that choice unless GJ decides to play a weakened team against the Gas.

[GrahamC]

Obviously we still have a chance, Rovers didn't look like scoring yesterday and I can't believe they are going to go all guns blazing at BS7, either, so one goal for either side will probably win it.

Having McAllister, McCombe, Russell and hopefully Enoch back certainly won't do us any harm, though we didn't miss the Pontefract colossus so much last night because Richard Keogh was immense yet again.

Be in no doubt though, next week's game on a rugby pitch will, if anything, be even scrappier than last night's and our team selection will need to reflect this if we are to get through (there's a hint there, no LJ!).

[Bristol Boy]

Be in no doubt though, next week's game on a rugby pitch will, if anything, be even scrappier than last night's and our team selection will need to reflect this if we are to get through (there's a hint there, no LJ!).

As much chance of that as getting struck by lightning.

[RedTop]

We also lost to S****horpe on another beach and it's not the results it our approach and performance level that has me concerned.I can't remember "insisting it was impossible," either.Asfor the Coventry game I think Louis Carey & Co would argue with your "not breaking sweat" analogy

I've double checked on this. On Jan 15 we were arguing about our away form. I wrote: "I agree we have to start winning a few away but unlike you, I do think we look like doing it." You replied: "Why do you think that? I've been to every away game in the League apart from Bmth and I don't think so."

Our complete list of away results since your post have been: 2-0 win at Coventry, 3-0 win at Oldham, 1-0 defeat at S****horpe and 1-0 win at Blackpool. On balance, I'd say that vindicates my interpretation of our away prospects rather than yours on this occasion.

I take your point on Louis Carey and Co. It's unfair to suggest they didn't break a sweat, though it was meant as a compliment. What I meant was that I felt they could have moved up a gear or two had they been pushed. That they didn't need to is credit to them.

In terms of our squad, I still say were a tall striker short and our lack of a polific goal scorer is the reason why we're 5th and not top already.ES's injury seems to be our next major problem.

I think the reason we appear to lack a prolific striker is more due to injuries and the fact none of the strikers has been ever-present up front. Brooker, Showunmi, Jevons, Murray, Jennison and now Andrews have had to share the burden and the goals have therefore tended to be spread around rather than having one prolific hitman. Personally, I think we've been unlucky with injuries to our frontmen and in fact what it has shown is that we've had strength in depth with the players we have. How many other teams could have coped with having their 'star' striker out for most of the season to date, had two and sometimes three of their strikers out at times, and still found themselves two points off the top? Another striker would be great, but I consider it a luxury rather than a necessity. I agree it's frustrating if the Showman is out for a while though. He's been proof to all doubters that you don't need to pay through the nose to bring in quality, and that the transfer fee does not necessarily reflect the quality of the player you are buying.

SL wanted the £500k that can be made plus Rovers at home as an 19,000 bonus.Whilst that theory is popular, we did nothing in all the cup competitions las season and finsihed 9th so it doesn't always follow.

True on all counts. But do you not feel that mentally having to switch between three competitions has had an effect on the focus of the players at times, and that the chopping and changing necessary because of cup tied players etc has also had an effect? I can't help wondering, although I was relieved that we seemed to gain something positive to Blackpool from the Middlesboro game rather than feeling demoralised by the nature of the defeat.

I think that we'll need good luck with injuries and suspensions from here on in and we need to get ES fit for a start.

Not so much good luck as a lack of bad luck, which is slightly different. If our luck is par for the course, I'm confident we have what it takes to finish in the top two. However, if luck evens itself out over the season then surely we've had more than our fair share and are due a run without more injuries!

I think getting to the final will give us lift and whilst winning it would be great, I'd rather lose to Donnie than the Gas if I had to choose and we won't have that choice unless GJ decides to play a weakened team against the Gas.

I hope you are right but it could go two ways. There is always the danger, as you say, of players consciously or subconsciously deciding to 'save' themselves for the big day. There is the danger of players thinking about the game in the period before it is played, when their mind needs to be on the next league game. And there is the danger that players might somehow feel winning the trophy at the Millennium Stadium would be enough to make the season a success. It is down to the manager to make sure none of these things happen. This is where he really earns his crust.

[Big Nose]

Bloomin heck, a proper debate about football.

Well done boys,

my faith in this forum may be returning............

[samo]

I think the reason we appear to lack a prolific striker is more due to injuries and the fact none of the strikers has been ever-present up front. Brooker, Showunmi, Jevons, Murray, Jennison and now Andrews have had to share the burden and the goals have therefore tended to be spread around rather than having one prolific hitman. Personally, I think we've been unlucky with injuries to our frontmen and in fact what it has shown is that we've had strength in depth with the players we have. How many other teams could have coped with having their 'star' striker out for most of the season to date, had two and sometimes three of their strikers out at times, and still found themselves two points off the top? Another striker would be great, but I consider it a luxury rather than a necessity. I agree it's frustrating if the Showman is out for a while though. He's been proof to all doubters that you don't need to pay through the nose to bring in quality, and that the transfer fee does not necessarily reflect the quality of the player you are buying.

I disagree with parts of this.

We have clearly lacked a line-leading forward in the Bill Sharp, Chris Porter or Will Hoskins mould. Yes, Enoch has obvious quality, but whatever form he has shown has been cancelled out by the all too frequent injuries. And Brooker has unfortunately played such a small role I this season I don't believe he can be seen as our 'top' forward by a long stretch.

Now, getting someone like the aforementioned three is not easy or cheap, as Hoskins' Watford transfer this year showed, but I think to suggest having at least one player like this is not necessary to mount a promotion challenge, especially in this last important third of the season is very wrong.

If you look at the last two teams to escape this division in the promotion positions (Colchester and Southend) each had at least one goal-hungry frontman. Eastwood for Southend, and Iwelumo and (on loan) Cureton at Colchester. This is as well as other regular contributors from around the team.

We have done well ourselves in this respect, with the players you mentioned contributing important goals, but we have suffered from a lack of a out-and-out goal getter on numerous occasions, and could possibly have won many games just because of the threat of such a striker.

With only one win in the last seven our form is far from promotion worthy, and it's not like we're losing by scores of goals. With another fit potential goal scorer available (rather than playing Betsy or Murray up top) we may have taken more points from these games. I really hope Bristol Boy's suggestion on another thread that we are looking at Leon Best or Lloyd Sam is true, as another attacking option who carries a genuine goal threat and takes the game to the opposion defence could make or break our season for this point on.

[RedTop]

Samo, in a sense Brooker is our Sharp, Porter or Hoskin. The injury sustained at Port Vale was nasty and kept him out for a long time, and there have been other unfortunate reasons why he's not been available every week. He is our 'top' player but you can't always control whether they are available - just ask Newcastle after signing Owen! I do think that the rest have done fine in his absence and the fact that we are two points off the top given that our squad has been stretched to its limits shows not so much how much we need more players, but what a fantastic squad we DO have already. There are not many teams in this division that could have coped with the injuries we have had to key players, let alone challenge in three cups.

If we're going to get Best then great. But I don't believe we need him to sustain a successful promotion challenge. It'd be a nice luxury, but we've already been tested to the limit and I think that we'll go from strength to strength in the remainder of the season as the injuries clear up.

Don't forget that suspensions and injuries are likely to bite on thinner squads far more in the final few months.

[Bristol Boy]

I've double checked on this. On Jan 15 we were arguing about our away form. I wrote: "I agree we have to start winning a few away but unlike you, I do think we look like doing it." You replied: "Why do you think that? I've been to every away game in the League apart from Bmth and I don't think so."

Our complete list of away results since your post have been: 2-0 win at Coventry, 3-0 win at Oldham, 1-0 defeat at S****horpe and 1-0 win at Blackpool. On balance, I'd say that vindicates my interpretation of our away prospects rather than yours on this occasion.

I don't disagree.My point was that I couldn't remember saying it was impossible.

I take your point on Louis Carey and Co. It's unfair to suggest they didn't break a sweat, though it was meant as a compliment. What I meant was that I felt they could have moved up a gear or two had they been pushed. That they didn't need to is credit to them.

Thank you.I don't think that Coventry were all that bad that night just lacking a cutting edge

I think the reason we appear to lack a prolific striker is more due to injuries and the fact none of the strikers has been ever-present up front. Brooker, Showunmi, Jevons, Murray, Jennison and now Andrews have had to share the burden and the goals have therefore tended to be spread around rather than having one prolific hitman. Personally, I think we've been unlucky with injuries to our frontmen and in fact what it has shown is that we've had strength in depth with the players we have. How many other teams could have coped with having their 'star' striker out for most of the season to date, had two and sometimes three of their strikers out at times, and still found themselves two points off the top? Another striker would be great, but I consider it a luxury rather than a necessity. I agree it's frustrating if the Showman is out for a while though. He's been proof to all doubters that you don't need to pay through the nose to bring in quality, and that the transfer fee does not necessarily reflect the quality of the player you are buying.

I think Sharp & Keogh prove that as they cost Scunny nothing.ES & SB have been available simultaneously on 13 of our 43 games.Massive issue and it's not just another striker it's a guy that the others can play off and that currently is SB & ES only.It's a type, as opposed to quantity or even quality issue as our success with Bas in the team proved last season.

True on all counts. But do you not feel that mentally having to switch between three competitions has had an effect on the focus of the players at times, and that the chopping and changing necessary because of cup tied players etc has also had an effect? I can't help wondering, although I was relieved that we seemed to gain something positive to Blackpool from the Middlesboro game rather than feeling demoralised by the nature of the defeat.

That's the bit that baffles me and that's why I've continually made the point that winning the JPT would have a positive effect on our League Campaign and playing in the JPT has meant that we didn't have to play a League Game this week.It also meant that McCombe & McAllister didn't have to miss a vital League Game, so it cuts both ways.

Not so much good luck as a lack of bad luck, which is slightly different. If our luck is par for the course, I'm confident we have what it takes to finish in the top two. However, if luck evens itself out over the season then surely we've had more than our fair share and are due a run without more injuries!

I hope you are right but it could go two ways. There is always the danger, as you say, of players consciously or subconsciously deciding to 'save' themselves for the big day. There is the danger of players thinking about the game in the period before it is played, when their mind needs to be on the next league game. And there is the danger that players might somehow feel winning the trophy at the Millennium Stadium would be enough to make the season a success. It is down to the manager to make sure none of these things happen. This is where he really earns his crust.

My concern, based on recent home displays is that we, or rather the manager & players, have the stomach, tactical nouse and the bottle for the big games we have to play, at home against Yeo, Swans & Forest, another night game if we win next Tuesday.I honestly can't say at the moment.We have strength in depth in defence.In some areas, notably target men and the wide left spot, I'm not convinced.

[samo]

ES & SB have been available simultaneously on 13 of our 43 games.Massive issue and it's not just another striker it's a guy that the others can play off and that currently is SB & ES only.It's a type, as opposed to quantity or even quality issue as our success with Bas in the team proved last season.

This is what I as trying to put across in my post too. It's about having a 'spearhead' striker available, not just being able to put out two attacking players. The mix needs to be right otherwise we can play as well as w like but we'll lack a cutting edge.

[RedTop]

My concern, based on recent home displays is that we, or rather the manager & players, have the stomach, tactical nouse and the bottle for the big games we have to play, at home against Yeo, Swans & Forest, another night game if we win next Tuesday.I honestly can't say at the moment.We have strength in depth in defence.In some areas, notably target men and the wide left spot, I'm not convinced.

This is what baffles me, really. I thought it strange when I heard GJ after the match talking about his worry that some of the players froze in front of a big crowd. Surely the Boro and Coventry matches - both home and away - and the wins over Oldham and Blackpool and the point at Swansea, among others, show that the players have what it takes to win big matches and aren't fazed by such attention. Yes, I agree we don't always win the big games (e.g. Forest and Scunny this season) but it didn't strike me that those defeats were down to bottling it or lacking stomach or tactical nouse.

I really am not too worried about players having the heart or workrate because I have seen enough this season to be convinced hwe have both. I'm not too worried about strength in depth, either. It's hard to believe we will be stretched beyond what what we already have been this season, and the squad coped admirably. Where injuries do worry me, though, is because I think what the players are lacking is routine and a consistent starting XI. Injuries, cup-tied players and suspensions mean there have been too many changes recently, and there have also been too many mental changes required for the different games that have come thick and fast in different competitions. Teams thrive on familiarity as a unit and rhythm. What they need is to start playing league matches regularly one after the other, with the same line-up game after game to build up some consistency and routine. To a degree this is out of our hands because we do seem to have one or two players susceptible to injury, but I hope GJ doesn't add to it by chopping and changing unnecessarily too often and lets things settle down.

[Guest east_dundry_red]

Just like BS3 RED was saying in tye car last night, It's not about rovers, all this tie is down to is witch bristol city turn up, if the crap bristol city turn up like last night it will go to the wire if the city that played agaist boro turn up the tie is ours.