First Game Since Sod's Departure...

[spudski]

... last night was my first game back since SoD departed.

 

It happened to be a pure coincidence in the timing as I work abroad during the Winter.

 

Great to see a City win...and so comprehensively.

 

Very entertaining...very open...

 

Impressed with Wade Elliot.

 

Defenders look more assured... we do still look dodgy at crosses though.

 

I really don't know what to make from it all or how our future will pan out.

 

From last nights performance and the quality of players we've now got for this league, regardless of opposition, if we had 15 games left, I would seriously put us down as play off contenders.

I suppose next season will depend on whether we keep the likes of Baldock and JET.

 

I presume the whole 5 pillars thing has now gone out the window?

 

Under 18's playing one way... under 21's playing another...First team playing their way...

I'm not sure how that is going to work to our benefit...

 

As for our manager...most vocal I've ever heard at the Gate.

For those who don't sit in the Williams...you should give it a go.

You get a running commentary from him, for nearly every move, position to make and pass to be made.

I don't think Nosworthy had to use his brain once last night...he was told what to do it seemed every move...astonishing.

 

Already looking forward to next season.

[myol'man]

Welcome back 

[Esmond Million's Bung]

... last night was my first game back since SoD departed.

 

It happened to be a pure coincidence in the timing as I work abroad during the Winter.

 

Great to see a City win...and so comprehensively.

 

Very entertaining...very open...

 

Impressed with Wade Elliot.

 

Defenders look more assured... we do still look dodgy at crosses though.

 

I really don't know what to make from it all or how our future will pan out.

 

From last nights performance and the quality of players we've now got for this league, regardless of opposition, if we had 15 games left, I would seriously put us down as play off contenders.

I suppose next season will depend on whether we keep the likes of Baldock and JET.

 

I presume the whole 5 pillars thing has now gone out the window?

 

Under 18's playing one way... under 21's playing another...First team playing their way...

I'm not sure how that is going to work to our benefit...

 

As for our manager...most vocal I've ever heard at the Gate.

For those who don't sit in the Williams...you should give it a go.

You get a running commentary from him, for nearly every move, position to make and pass to be made.

I don't think Nosworthy had to use his brain once last night...he was told what to do it seemed every move...astonishing.

 

Already looking forward to next season.

 

I don't think the 5 pillars has gone out of the window, that is just the last crumb of comfort to the few who still believe in the emperors new clothes empire that SOD had them believe. SC has pretty much given everybody a chance and has used the 3 'local' academy players wisely and in the main his signings have given us the experience that we needed in the vital areas, Barnett has not been a success but our record with target men has been appalling over the years so welcome to the club, El Abd a player widely welcomed on his signing for us as 'just what we need' and now widely written off, well the jury is out but you don't become a bad player over night and hopefully he will prove to be a good signing.

 

As for the 2nd highlighted portion, turning the club into a stepford wives type club where every player did exactly the same thing at the same time, hopefully was never part of the 5 pillars, it was to promote a passing game throughout the club and not to stifle individuality.

 

SC was not my first choice, but hey he has almost achieved part 1 of his brief to keep us in this crappy league, can he achieve the long term goal?, well he has certainly earned the chance to try and if he fails, well at least the embarrassed posters who predicted the end of the world as we know it at AG can return to OTIB safe in the knowledge that they right all along (well sort of) and who knows SOD might have another job by then at another big club.

 

The most important point is the squad appear to actually like and respect SC and that usually means they will go the extra mile.

[spudski]

I don't think the 5 pillars has gone out of the window, that is just the last crumb of comfort to the few who still believe in the emperors new clothes empire that SOD had them believe. SC has pretty much given everybody a chance and has used the 3 'local' academy players wisely and in the main his signings have given us the experience that we needed in the vital areas, Barnett has not been a success but our record with target men has been appalling over the years so welcome to the club, El Abd a player widely welcomed on his signing for us as 'just what we need' and now widely written off, well the jury is out but you don't become a bad player over night and hopefully he will prove to be a good signing.

 

As for the 2nd highlighted portion, turning the club into a stepford wives type club where every player did exactly the same thing at the same time, hopefully was never part of the 5 pillars, it was to promote a passing game throughout the club and not to stifle individuality.

 

SC was not my first choice, but hey he has almost achieved part 1 of his brief to keep us in this crappy league, can he achieve the long term goal?, well he has certainly earned the chance to try and if he fails, well at least the embarrassed posters who predicted the end of the world as we know it at AG can return to OTIB safe in the knowledge that they right all along (well sort of) and who knows SOD might have another job by then at another big club.

 

The most important point is the squad appear to actually like and respect SC and that usually means they will go the extra mile.

There is no point going over old ground re the benefits of SoD and what SC has brought to the Club.

We will never know how it would have panned out under SoD.

What interests me is what is going on behind the scenes so to speak.

Will their still be a long term plan.

Or will we still, as we have done before, keep changing players from season to season, using 'Journeymen' pros.

The team I watched last night, was full of players 'good enough' for this league.

What is in the back of my mind...is the future.

With the financial restraints it will be interesting to see which direction we go.

I would hate for us to go back to the same position as before...where by we eventually achieve promotion, then go... errrrrr... where do we go from here???

Finance is the biggest issue...that's why the development and recruitment of youthful, hungry, potential good players is essential for our future.

So when I hear about the 'issues' in our Academy, recruitment and way's of playing from age group to age group...it seems we still haven't learned from our mistakes in the past.

It's great results are going in our favour now, and the first team are doing better...but it still just paints over the cracks of what is going on at the rest of the club.

Either way...I'm going to enjoy today, after witnessing some good football last night and a cracking set piece by JET.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

There is no point going over old ground re the benefits of SoD and what SC has brought to the Club.

We will never know how it would have panned out under SoD.

What interests me is what is going on behind the scenes so to speak.

Will their still be a long term plan.

Or will we still, as we have done before, keep changing players from season to season, using 'Journeymen' pros.

The team I watched last night, was full of players 'good enough' for this league.

What is in the back of my mind...is the future.

With the financial restraints it will be interesting to see which direction we go.

I would hate for us to go back to the same position as before...where by we eventually achieve promotion, then go... errrrrr... where do we go from here???

Finance is the biggest issue...that's why the development and recruitment of youthful, hungry, potential good players is essential for our future.

So when I hear about the 'issues' in our Academy, recruitment and way's of playing from age group to age group...it seems we still haven't learned from our mistakes in the past.

It's great results are going in our favour now, and the first team are doing better...but it still just paints over the cracks of what is going on at the rest of the club.

Either way...I'm going to enjoy today, after witnessing some good football last night and a cracking set piece by JET.

 

i'm sorry but it has to be said we still used journeymen pro's under SOD, last night our latest journeymen pro's have been widely praised since their arrival, so I suspect it depends on the motivation of said journeymen pro's.

 

The future?, well the future that is believed to be good enough at this moment in time are being given their chance, Bryan is injured, Reid appears to be being rested (but i'm sure well within future plans) but both have featured heavily, Burn's who was going nowhere under SOD has featured a lot and has so far proved he can be a game changer and I suspect before the end of the season will feature even more, Williams (a SOD signing) has been pretty much a permanent feature, so the future seems ok to me.

 

I think some fans literally believed we would one day put out a side purely of academy players, when actually anything from 3 upwards will prove 'at the moment' an improvement on our historical use of academy players.

[spudski]

i'm sorry but it has to be said we still used journeymen pro's under SOD, last night our latest journeymen pro's have been widely praised since their arrival, so I suspect it depends on the motivation of said journeymen pro's.

 

The future?, well the future that is believed to be good enough at this moment in time are being given their chance, Bryan is injured, Reid appears to be being rested (but i'm sure well within future plans) but both have featured heavily, Burn's who was going nowhere under SOD has featured a lot and has so far proved he can be a game changer and I suspect before the end of the season will feature even more, Williams (a SOD signing) has been pretty much a permanent feature, so the future seems ok to me.

 

I think some fans literally believed we would one day put out a side purely of academy players, when actually anything from 3 upwards will prove 'at the moment' an improvement on our historical use of academy players.

I'm not on about youngsters being blooded in the first team right now...although I think Reid, Bryan and Burns all have futures in the first team if they keep improving. One of those has to stop thinking he's already made it and stop resting on his laurel...otherwise he'll end up the same way as Aaron Brown.

I'm more concerned with what is going on outside of the first team.

Not as intended or good by all reports...

[ten minutes of rough]

... last night was my first game back since SoD departed.

 

It happened to be a pure coincidence in the timing as I work abroad during the Winter.

 

Great to see a City win...and so comprehensively.

 

Very entertaining...very open...

 

Impressed with Wade Elliot.

 

Defenders look more assured... we do still look dodgy at crosses though.

 

I really don't know what to make from it all or how our future will pan out.

 

From last nights performance and the quality of players we've now got for this league, regardless of opposition, if we had 15 games left, I would seriously put us down as play off contenders.

I suppose next season will depend on whether we keep the likes of Baldock and JET.

 

I presume the whole 5 pillars thing has now gone out the window?

 

Under 18's playing one way... under 21's playing another...First team playing their way...

I'm not sure how that is going to work to our benefit...

 

As for our manager...most vocal I've ever heard at the Gate.

For those who don't sit in the Williams...you should give it a go.

You get a running commentary from him, for nearly every move, position to make and pass to be made.

I don't think Nosworthy had to use his brain once last night...he was told what to do it seemed every move...astonishing.

 

Already looking forward to next season.

That is fantastic, at last we have a manager that has passion and it seems a whole lot of understanding.

[spudski]

That is fantastic, at last we have a manager that has passion and it seems a whole lot of understanding.

I'm not sure it's such a good thing.

I've never been a fan of managers shouting instruction all the time.

Wouldn't you prefer your player to think for himself and make the right decisions.

All very well playing at AG when it's dead quiet...how do you do that in a Stadium full of noise?

Some of the directions given to Nosworthy were very basic...something I would expect a pro to know.

 

Don't get me wrong...it worked last night...and SC's calls WERE the right calls being made...

 

I've also not understood this whole 'passion' thing...

 

Passion isn't just about shouting orders from the touchline.

 

You can be as quiet as a mouse and still have passion, in the work you do, hours put in, coaching etc.

 

If you prefer a manager that shouts a lot...then fine...but it doesn't mean he has anymore or less 'passion' than previous managers.

 

Either way...it was a great result and a fine performance.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I'm not sure it's such a good thing.

I've never been a fan of managers shouting instruction all the time.

Wouldn't you prefer your player to think for himself and make the right decisions.

All very well playing at AG when it's dead quiet...how do you do that in a Stadium full of noise?

Some of the directions given to Nosworthy were very basic...something I would expect a pro to know.

 

Don't get me wrong...it worked last night...and SC's calls WERE the right calls being made...

 

I've also not understood this whole 'passion' thing...

 

Passion isn't just about shouting orders from the touchline.

 

You can be as quiet as a mouse and still have passion, in the work you do, hours put in, coaching etc.

 

If you prefer a manager that shouts a lot...then fine...but it doesn't mean he has anymore or less 'passion' than previous managers.

 

Either way...it was a great result and a fine performance.

 

Come on Sean, that's pretty much what you said and it failed miserably, just apply for the gas job and prove your disbeliebers wrong.

[spudski]

Come on Sean, that's pretty much what you said and it failed miserably, just apply for the gas job and prove your disbeliebers wrong.

   

 

On a more serious note... if we had got the results under SoD...would fans be feeling more positive about our future, rather than just the present.

Forget how well SC has done...and forget it was SoD in charge...

Whoever is/was in charge...if we were sticking to the five pillars ethos and having our teams outside of the first team playing and being coached the same way and getting results... I'd feel much more comfortable.

 

It's great we are getting results and staving off relegation. There are a lot of positives 'in the now'.

 

I just can't help thinking, we are back to square one, similar to when GJ took over and we relied on 'those types of players'.

 

Is there still a plan in place for the future...or is it back to quick fix's?

 

I'm not being negative... I just don't want us to go back to how we were before.

[screech]

   

 

On a more serious note... if we had got the results under SoD...would fans be feeling more positive about our future, rather than just the present.

Forget how well SC has done...and forget it was SoD in charge...

Whoever is/was in charge...if we were sticking to the five pillars ethos and having our teams outside of the first team playing and being coached the same way and getting results... I'd feel much more comfortable.

 

It's great we are getting results and staving off relegation. There are a lot of positives 'in the now'.

 

I just can't help thinking, we are back to square one, similar to when GJ took over and we relied on 'those types of players'.

 

Is there still a plan in place for the future...or is it back to quick fix's?

 

I'm not being negative... I just don't want us to go back to how we were before.

 

Like how we have been for the majority of our existence you mean?

[spudski]

Like how we have been for the majority of our existence you mean?

Exactly...

 

The board decided enough was enough...and brought about the 'five pillars'... most now think bollox to that...

 

However... I thought it was a good idea...because like you say...the majority of our existence has been mediocre.

So we needed a change.

 

It didn't work under SoD results wise...plus our owner Couldn't get on with him.

 

So... SC has come in on a three year contract and turned things around in the first team, with loan signings and older signings...plus keeping Bryan, Reid and Burns in the loop.

 

But by all reports...things are not so good outside of the first team... shame if so...

 

It's great we are on the up...but I can't help thinking it's papering over the cracks...

[BCFC_Dan]

I think we had to stop the rot, and halt the slide. A few months ago we were bottom and destined for L2. I also agree he has kept the development going of 4 young players, and considering the circumstances that is impressive. He has done what GJ did, used players he has previously worked with to halt that slide. Going forward, I expect him to build on the positives, whilst looking to sort out our still fragile defence or defending. I do know he fully buys into the way forward, and will look to connect up the non first team aspects. It was too much to expect all to be done when we were in fire fighting mode. I have no knowledge of the issues you intimate are of concern at the reserve and youth levels. Maybe you can add more detail. I have seen or heard nothing to suggest though, that the club and SC intend to change medium term direction. we had to paper over the cracks, or we would now be a few games away from L2, and that had to be avoided. I think we have to look at SC next season, when we will lose the loan players and probably 7 of the current squad with contract expiry. Then we can start to see what his ideas are. I do expect him to try and sign Wade E though. 

 

This is pretty much spot on in my opinion. As I've said before, the time to implement a long term strategy was around 2008/09 when the team was on an upward tangent and there was a good spine of senior professionals at the club. Unfortunately short term thinking took over and by the time anyone realised what was happening they were faced with trying to implement a long term strategy on a club that was declining rapidly.

 

Everything since Cotterill took over has closely mirrored the situation in 2006 when Johnson took over. We cannot necessarily expect promotion next season but the current form and trend are encouraging.

 

The trick will be in ensuring that this time the long-term strategy is implemented properly alongside an achieving team. When the older players in the squad reach their limits of ability or age we must be able to bring in young players to replace them in a sensible manner, a couple at a time, over a long period.

[WolfOfWestStreet]

I'm quite pleased to hear that SC is constantly in the players earholes barking orders. I don't blame him for not trusting them to think for themselves.

Our defensive players have let the club down this year (with a couple of exceptions) and goals conceded is the only reason this club had not been in contention this season.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

   

 

On a more serious note... if we had got the results under SoD...would fans be feeling more positive about our future, rather than just the present.

Forget how well SC has done...and forget it was SoD in charge...

Whoever is/was in charge...if we were sticking to the five pillars ethos and having our teams outside of the first team playing and being coached the same way and getting results... I'd feel much more comfortable.

 

It's great we are getting results and staving off relegation. There are a lot of positives 'in the now'.

 

I just can't help thinking, we are back to square one, similar to when GJ took over and we relied on 'those types of players'.

 

Is there still a plan in place for the future...or is it back to quick fix's?

 

I'm not being negative... I just don't want us to go back to how we were before.

 

On a serious note SOD didn't so it is irrelevant, as is your view from your crystal ball, instead of whining about woulda, shoulda, coulda, just give the guy a chance, he has actually earned that unlike SOD.

 

The bottom line is SOD believers were left with thoughts, feelings and even in fundaMENTALISTS minds another relegation would be worth it as long as SOD was still in charge.

 

You are being negative, but please explain when is this 'before' of which you speak?, because I am confused about that statement and this as well please 'But by all reports...things are not so good outside of the first team... shame if so.."

 

PS:- only the manager has changed as far as I can see.

[spudski]

On a serious note SOD didn't so it is irrelevant, as is your view from your crystal ball, instead of whining about woulda, shoulda, coulda, just give the guy a chance, he has actually earned that unlike SOD.

 

The bottom line is SOD believers were left with thoughts, feelings and even in fundaMENTALISTS minds another relegation would be worth it as long as SOD was still in charge.

 

You are being negative, but please explain when is this 'before' of which you speak?, because I am confused about that statement and this as well please 'But by all reports...things are not so good outside of the first team... shame if so.."

 

PS:- only the manager has changed as far as I can see.

Kinnel mate...you really don't understand do you?

 

As I've said...forget SoD... this is not about what he did or didn't do...it's like you want to play a game of one up manship.

 

He's gone...we'll never know how he would have done...leave it will you.

 

And who is having a go at SC...not me... so why are you saying I'm moaning and being negative?

 

It's all about what is going on outside of the first team.

 

The 'before' refers to how we have run our Club up until us implementing the '5 pillars ethos'.

 

If you actually knew who was training with who...what coach's are implementing certain tactics or not...playing differently...some having to train on their own, others maybe being released because SC hasn't even watched them play...maybe not his fault...very little or no budget for anything outside of the first team etc,etc.

 

Read the last paragraph of BCFC Dans' post...he understood what I meant. Exactly that.

 

It's all well and good having a team like we have...but if the rest of the club is not developing as was intended, then we are going to be in the same position as last time. i.e bringing in journeymen pros who gave very little...that's why we find ourselves in L1.

 

As BCFC Dan said... as soon as the older more experienced pros are done... think Carey...they need to be shipped out and replaced by players developing outside of the first team but at the club...not by old journeymen pros from other clubs like we have in the past.

 

It's that side of the Club I'm worried about...that's all...so not being negative.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Kinnel mate...you really don't understand do you?

 

As I've said...forget SoD... this is not about what he did or didn't do...it's like you want to play a game of one up manship.

 

He's gone...we'll never know how he would have done...leave it will you.

 

And who is having a go at SC...not me... so why are you saying I'm moaning and being negative?

 

It's all about what is going on outside of the first team.

 

The 'before' refers to how we have run our Club up until us implementing the '5 pillars ethos'.

 

If you actually knew who was training with who...what coach's are implementing certain tactics or not...playing differently...some having to train on their own, others maybe being released because SC hasn't even watched them play...maybe not his fault...very little or no budget for anything outside of the first team etc,etc.

 

Read the last paragraph of BCFC Dans' post...he understood what I meant. Exactly that.

 

It's all well and good having a team like we have...but if the rest of the club is not developing as was intended, then we are going to be in the same position as last time. i.e bringing in journeymen pros who gave very little...that's why we find ourselves in L1.

 

As BCFC Dan said... as soon as the older more experienced pros are done... think Carey...they need to be shipped out and replaced by players developing outside of the first team but at the club...not by old journeymen pros from other clubs like we have in the past.

 

It's that side of the Club I'm worried about...that's all...so not being negative.

 

Firstly let's clear up one point, you have just said 'forget SOD', the post I was replying to said 'if we had got the results under SoD...would fans be feeling more positive about our future, rather than just the present'.

 

The bit I have highlighted describes virtually every pro football club in the world and I suspect if SC is going to let certain players go he is actually listening to his coaching staff.

 

Has the 5 pillars ethos changed the club?, has the club abandoned the 5 pillars?, of course not, so there is nothing to revert back to, as far as i'm aware it's ongoing.

 

As for Carey I would have let him go 2 years ago, the two 1 year contracts were just publicity stunts IMO, we have no journeymen currently contracted to the club, the loanees have actually helped to solidify hopefully our safety, so I don't see what the problem is, whereas you seem to looking into the future and inventing a scenario that as yet does not exist, let's wait and see if it does come to pass and if it does, blame the board if SC is intent on just concentrating on the 'now' next season and they allow that to happen, they have not for the first been economical with the truth, I for one don't believe that will happen, but hey I could be wrong, let us just see.