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42nite

Bristol Rovers Dustbin Thread

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2 hours ago, Spoons said:

My kids match of the day magazine misprint ?

Mind the gap rovers! 

image.jpg

So the Blue Fews defeat on Friday night was just a dream! Turns out it was US that lost 4-2 after all! They must be pissing themselves laughing at us, I feel awful! How did it happen? Suppose we can concentrate on the league now - it's a Mickey Mouse cup anyway.

So who did they get in the next round...?

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Am I correct in thinking that Dwayne Sports is an offshore company holds a charge on the mem for around £10m then charges BRFC £600k pa interest on that loan? 

What was that £10m loan actually spent on and are any tax dodges or complex tax avoidance schemes involved?

The Panama papers and Paradise papers are causing quite a stir in respect of these kinds of things.

Are any other companies involved?

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53 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

"....to the side is a very tall but short stand..." - how can that even make sense?!

In other words it’s shite.

 

23 minutes ago, slartibartfast said:

Talk about selective .............! Why didn't they print what Millwall and Oxford fans said about it........ a SHITHOLE !             What a brown nose hack the "editor" must be !

The Bolton fans if I remember rightly named it Chernobyl.

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3 hours ago, BCFC11 said:

"The away end is covered, but by a plastic tent thing which seemed quite temporary"....wrong Mr Port Vale fan, it's permanent. In fact, I'm sure they were playing Port Vale when a wayward shot nearly knocked the whole thing down.

Why isn't that Sag journalist trying to find out what's going on at the club instead of trawling the Internet for the handful of comments out there about the Mem that are'nt taking the piss?

No mention of the comparison to Chernobyl :yawn:

Millwall fans loved the place...

D54CD9E7-453D-46C5-95D2-B068CF2C7DB7.png

Edited by Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan
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9 hours ago, Red34 said:

I can't actually decide which has brightened my days more!

Santa's grotto.

UWE cancellation.

Sainsburys watertight contract. 

Championship ready sprinklers that break. 

Nope can't decide!

 

Celebrating staying up one week, then being relegated to Non-League the next, by a team wearing their own kit does take some beating for me.

Then the picture of that bloke being chased by a horse......

 

Along with pinching their top player for peanuts............and I'm sure there's still plenty more to come...............:yawn:

 

 

 

Edited by 42nite
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6 hours ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

"The away end is covered, but by a plastic tent thing which seemed quite temporary"....wrong Mr Port Vale fan, it's permanent. In fact, I'm sure they were playing Port Vale when a wayward shot nearly knocked the whole thing down.

Why isn't that Sag journalist trying to find out what's going on at the club instead of trawling the Internet for the handful of comments out there about the Mem that are'nt taking the piss?

No mention of the comparison to Chernobyl :yawn:

Millwall fans loved the place...

D54CD9E7-453D-46C5-95D2-B068CF2C7DB7.png

The Millwall fan said the only thing missing was the "fackin coconut shy"!

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20 hours ago, Red34 said:

Firstly - in the constraints tab it seems to mention a lot about flooding.  Anyone who understands the planning stuff know if that means it's likely to flood often?!

My boy used to play there for Coalpit Heath and it was a nightmare for flooding. As soon as there was any sort of rain at least two of the pitches would be unplayable

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8 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Am I correct in thinking that Dwayne Sports is an offshore company holds a charge on the mem for around £10m then charges BRFC £600k pa interest on that loan? 

What was that £10m loan actually spent on and are any tax dodges or complex tax avoidance schemes involved?

The Panama papers and Paradise papers are causing quite a stir in respect of these kinds of things.

Are any other companies involved?

If you have legitimate and perfectly legal ways to avoid paying tax why wouldn't you use them?  Though those IoM aircraft VAT deals do not look legal, but I digress.

I don't actually think that there's anything dodgy or shady about the dealings and ownership of the club.

That £10m facility, secured by a charge on the ground, is close (by my calculations) to being fully used with the drawings from it being used to fund clearing the past debts, the failed stadium costs, the annual operating losses of ?£1.2m and the interest of c. £0.6m payable on the loan.

I don't think there's anything particularly to see here other than the obvious: loss-making club exhausts its line of secured credit sometime this season ? March.

At that point either there is an immediate sale of a loss-making club with no net assets, or Dwane Sports puts more money in to either continue funding the losses or tide it over until sale, or DS can just call in the security on the ground and sell it, then wind up the club (to avoid being prosecuted for trading when insolvent) and walk away only having lost their initial purchase cost.

With the obvious exception of that arch-belter Henbury there is a widespread realisation amongst Rovers' fans that they are very much drinking in the last chance saloon.

I am very surprised that the BEP has not done a financial analysis of their position and started asking some questions. A good journalist should be spotting a crisis before it happens not waiting until it happens and claiming "Nobody saw this coming".

Here's a simple question for them to put to the Rovers' Chairman:

"When do you expect the £10m secured loan facility upon the Memorial Ground to be fully drawn and how will you fund the club's operating loss and the payment of interest upon that drawn loan thereafter?".

It's a simple question.

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27 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

I am very surprised that the BEP has not done a financial analysis of their position and started asking some questions. A good journalist should be spotting a crisis before it happens not waiting until it happens and claiming "Nobody saw this coming".

This is where the BEP/gAss love in does them no favours at all.  The way they fawned over Wael when he first came in , Billionaire/saviour/15k watch , was pathetic . Now  a real local paper would be asking questions not trawling through 3 years of away fans comments to find the five good ones. 
Evolution , not revolution, is fine . But eventually even evolution needs investment , but in the meantime lets carry the bloke down Gloucester road on OUR shoulders 

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44 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

That £10m facility, secured by a charge on the ground, is close (by my calculations) to being fully used with the drawings from it being used to fund clearing the past debts, the failed stadium costs, the annual operating losses of ?£1.2m and the interest of c. £0.6m payable on the loan.

I don't think there's anything particularly to see here other than the obvious: loss-making club exhausts its line of secured credit sometime this season ? March.

At that point either there is an immediate sale of a loss-making club with no net assets, or Dwane Sports puts more money in to either continue funding the losses or tide it over until sale, or DS can just call in the security on the ground and sell it, then wind up the club (to avoid being prosecuted for trading when insolvent) and walk away only having lost their initial purchase cost.

I'm not even sure there was much of an initial purchase cost. 

From what I've heard of Higgs and the debts, it sounds like the purchase may have been for a token amount (£1 say), with the agreement to take on the debts including those to the old directors.

As Higgs etc would be getting their loans back I imagine they were just happy with not having lost it all to administration when the Wonga loan was called in.

And as all debts are being paid by the club according to the accounts, as you suggest Dwane Sports can walk away with their interest payments and maybe the Colony, take the Mem due to the charge and just fold Rovers... 

Good profit already, and if they then sat on the Mem site for a few years until it's worth even more than the valuation for the charge at call in time, it could be a great profit... 

Edited by Red34
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2 hours ago, Cheesleysmate said:

The Millwall fan said the only thing missing was the "fackin coconut shy"!

This made me laugh! Surprisingly shrewd comment from a bunch commonly referred to as "wenkas"... :)

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35 minutes ago, Red34 said:

, and if they then sat on the Mem site for a few years

One things for sure, it wouldn’t look more derelict and full of tumbleweed, than it does now........

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32 minutes ago, Red34 said:

I'm not even sure there was much of an initial purchase cost. 

From what I've heard of Higgs and the debts, it sounds like the purchase may have been for a token amount (£1 say), with the agreement to take on the debts including those to the old directors.

As Higgs etc would be getting their loans back I imagine they were just happy with not having lost it all to administration when the Wonga loan was called in.

And as all debts are being paid by the club according to the accounts, as you suggest Dwane Sports can walk away with their interest payments and maybe the Colony, take the Mem due to the charge and just fold Rovers... 

Good profit already, and if they then sat on the Mem site for a few years until it's worth even more than the valuation for the charge at call in time, it could be a great profit... 

Or I suppose they could take the ground for the debt and then sell the club without either it or the debt; and then rent the ground to the club until they want to sell it to developers.

I would guess they'd want something like £600k a year rent to match the interest lost; and we can dust off the "rent boys" monciker for them again.

You couldn't see an outside investor wanting to buy the club on these terms so it would probably be a fans' consortium.  The one at Exeter has run that club decently but they have the huge advantage of owning their own ground and have recently pulled down a stand to redevelop it. 

There probably are enough wealthy Rovers' fans to pull this off short term but they would need to build a new ground or arrnage a groundshare pretty soon as £1.2m of losses plus £0.6m of rent will empty a lot of pockets in short order.

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20 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Or I suppose they could take the ground for the debt and then sell the club without either it or the debt; and then rent the ground to the club until they want to sell it to developers.

I would guess they'd want something like £600k a year rent to match the interest lost; and we can dust off the "rent boys" monciker for them again.

You couldn't see an outside investor wanting to buy the club on these terms so it would probably be a fans' consortium.  The one at Exeter has run that club decently but they have the huge advantage of owning their own ground and have recently pulled down a stand to redevelop it. 

There probably are enough wealthy Rovers' fans to pull this off short term but they would need to build a new ground or arrnage a groundshare pretty soon as £1.2m of losses plus £0.6m of rent will empty a lot of pockets in short order.

They have got a VERY wealthy supporter. A true gashead, loyal and proud, apparently. 

It’s “definitely” true because someone once took a picture of him stood with a bloke wearing a Rovers shirt. That makes him a gashead, you know..!

I can’t think what his name is at the moment, but he was a co-founder if some financial services firm and has recently started taking quite a supportive interest in developing local sport, within Bristol. 

Oh.... what is his name....?!

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I’m not psychic but I predict the following 

Wally will sell up

some other dubious muppet will buy them for a pound

promuse them the earth, give it the I’ve always loved the gas blah blah blah

gas chat will lap it up, wally will still be the saviour who handed over the baton

mr tan or whoever will be dragged around as the new messiah while they play at Weston and mutter were coming for you

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3 hours ago, Eddie Hitler said:

 

Here's a simple question for them to put to the Rovers' Chairman:

"When do you expect the £10m secured loan facility upon the Memorial Ground to be fully drawn and how will you fund the club's operating loss and the payment of interest upon that drawn loan thereafter?".

It's a simple question.

Very concisely put, and possibly one for Twentyman to broach next time he invites Hamer or Wally onto his show (not that I expect either to answer with any honesty or clarity).

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I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

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2 minutes ago, I'm Sparti-Bob said:

Very concisely put, and possibly one for Twentyman to broach next time he invites Hamer or Wally onto his show (not that I expect either to answer with any honesty or clarity).

I can practically hear Hamer's answer now: a twenty minute ramble bringing in some dated cultural references talking about football finance in general terms, parachute payments, how small clubs can't compete, problems at other clubs, how he found his lost sock under the bed that morning.  Everything but answer the question. 

And to give him his credit he is a decent and avuncular speaker who has over many years mastered the art of saying nothing at great length but in an entertaining way.

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6 minutes ago, red'tili'mdead said:

 

I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

Don’t worry,a nasty taste in the mouth can be easily remedied by a glug of mouthwash .

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20 minutes ago, red'tili'mdead said:

 

I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

 

Yeah right.

Good luck with that then!

 

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23 minutes ago, red'tili'mdead said:

 

I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

Probably the best thing for them, Bath are going renovate the ground and they can assume the title of their alter ego Bath Rovers or of course Bath might take them over and become Bath City league 2 team?.

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12 hours ago, wendyredredrobin said:

Am I correct in thinking that Dwayne Sports is an offshore company holds a charge on the mem for around £10m then charges BRFC £600k pa interest on that loan? 

What was that £10m loan actually spent on and are any tax dodges or complex tax avoidance schemes involved?

The Panama papers and Paradise papers are causing quite a stir in respect of these kinds of things.

Are any other companies involved?

If it is listed debt on the Jersey exchange then it may have corp tax benefits in respect of loan interest and witholding taxes. But that's been around and known of for years - have a look at some of the companies you see with listed debts. Even as a City fan I wouldn't raise an eyebrow at that or wrap my chips in what it says in the newspaper.

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56 minutes ago, red'tili'mdead said:

.Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

I don’t think for one second that they will go under, however if the shit was to hit the fan big time I’d have much more sympathy for them if they hadn’t constantly thrown 1982 in our face for the last 30 odd years.

 

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3 hours ago, BS3City said:

This made me laugh! Surprisingly shrewd comment from a bunch commonly referred to as "wenkas"... :)

Don't they own Blackburn?!

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2 hours ago, B block said:

I’m not psychic but I predict the following 

Wally will sell up

some other dubious muppet will buy them for a pound

promuse them the earth, give it the I’ve always loved the gas blah blah blah

gas chat will lap it up, wally will still be the saviour who handed over the baton

mr tan or whoever will be dragged around as the new messiah while they play at Weston and mutter were coming for you

They have approached another Sheikh........

Image result for shakin stevens

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23 minutes ago, Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan said:

I don’t think for one second that they will go under, however if the shit was to hit the fan big time I’d have much more sympathy for them if they hadn’t constantly thrown 1982 in our face for the last 30 odd years.

 

The thing is nobody ever goes under as in disappeared and gone.  Accrington Stanley, Bradford Park Avenue, Aldershot all still going.

So even if they imploded financially with a massive "whump": ground seized, players released from contracts, Santa's Grotto auctioned off to the highest bidder, Sinclair reclaiming his begging patch etc. then with their crowds they would get a berth in something like the Southern League Premier Division or only two leagues below where they were a couple of years' ago.  All they need to do is rally behind a reformed club founded by the Supporters Club; put some financial guarnatees in place, recruit some semi-pro players and they're off again.

There is no "end" for clubs as long as they have supporters.

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5 hours ago, citysimmo said:

My boy used to play there for Coalpit Heath and it was a nightmare for flooding. As soon as there was any sort of rain at least two of the pitches would be unplayable

So the sags will be right at home there then. They're used to kick and rush on a bog.

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1 hour ago, red'tili'mdead said:

 

I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

er - yes!

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29 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

This 'ole Mem

Coming to a record shop near you.

Saw an eyeball peep in through a smoky cloud behind the green door (Green door)
When I said Joe sent me some one laughed out loud behind the green door (Ooh, green door)
All I want to do is join the happy crowd behind the green door (Green door)

 

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13 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

This shake works

 

ah, Shakin' (Archie) Stevens

just a selection (in Meat Loaf fashion) of his hits

This Ole (Mad) House

Wally, Wally

Green Door (Knocked On By The Bailiff)

Its Late (Another Overdue Payment Demand)

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1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said:

The thing is nobody ever goes under as in disappeared and gone.  Accrington Stanley, Bradford Park Avenue, Aldershot all still going.

So even if they imploded financially with a massive "whump": ground seized, players released from contracts, Santa's Grotto auctioned off to the highest bidder, Sinclair reclaiming his begging patch etc. then with their crowds they would get a berth in something like the Southern League Premier Division or only two leagues below where they were a couple of years' ago.  All they need to do is rally behind a reformed club founded by the Supporters Club; put some financial guarnatees in place, recruit some semi-pro players and they're off again.

There is no "end" for clubs as long as they have supporters.

The precedents are that new clubs now tend to start no higher than the equivalent of Western League Premier. Recently, that’s where reformed Aldershot, Hereford and Salisbury restarted (probably a few more but that’ll do for an example). It causes problems with away attendances but usually only for one season, if you are the best funded by miles you tend to get promoted. 

In one respect I like the way it spreads the money around, every other team in that league gets a bumper home gate. I know in Hereford’s season in the Midland League the attendance for their game at a club was invariably more than the rest of the season’s home gates combined. In other respects it’s daft, clubs with home gates of 100 usually can’t cope with (say) 500 visiting supporters (and since most games are local that can easily happen). Throw in a bit of bad behaviour from the visitors and it’s a bad recipe.

Should the implosion happen I think relocation to Twerton is very likely, followed by rapid amalgamation of the clubs should the EFL be content for Bath City to take over the sags’s EFL persona.

Edited by Bianconeri
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5 minutes ago, Bianconeri said:

The precedents are that new clubs now tend to start no higher than the equivalent of Western League Premier. Recently, that’s where reformed Aldershot, Hereford and Salisbury restarted (probably a few more but that’ll do for an example). It causes problems with away attendances but usually only for one season, if you are the best funded by miles you tend to get promoted. 

In one respect I like the way it spreads the money around, every other team in that league gets a bumper home gate. I know in Hereford’s season in the Midland League the attendance for their game at a club was invariably more than the rest of the season’s home gates combined. In other respects it’s daft, clubs with home gates of 100 usually can’t cope with (say) 500 visiting supporters (and since most games are local that can easily happen). Throw in a bit of bad behaviour from the visitors and it’s a bad recipe.

Should the implosion happen I think relocation to Twerton is very likely, followed by rapid amalgamation of the clubs should the EFL be content for Bath City to take over the sags’s EFL persona.

Oh no does that mean those pikeys might be coming to Wellington next season? :shutup: :gasmask: @Andy Horsman

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27 minutes ago, Cheesleysmate said:

Being in Gloucestershire they may have to apply for the Hellenic League 

Hellenic Premier fits the bill, level 9, but as a Bath-based team I suppose it would be Western Premier. We can hope they end up ground squatting in somewhere like Aberdeen I suppose.

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19 minutes ago, Bianconeri said:

Hellenic Premier fits the bill, level 9, but as a Bath-based team I suppose it would be Western Premier. We can hope they end up ground squatting in somewhere like Aberdeen I suppose.

Hah! In the Highland League with Brora Rangers, Fort WIlliam and WIck Academy, see how many they take away then :) . 

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24 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

Hah! In the Highland League with Brora Rangers, Fort WIlliam and WIck Academy, see how many they take away then :) . 

4000 obviously.

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7 minutes ago, ZiderEyed said:

4000 obviously.

I remember reading an interview with someone associated with the Wick Academy where they said that they were struggling with attendances due to the travelling distances involved, especially as they had lost their only local derby with the rise of Inverness Caledonian Thistle. It's 110 miles and 2 1/4hr drive to Inverness...... that's some "local" derby. :) 

Edited by Port Said Red
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2 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

I remember reading an interview with someone associated with the Wick Academy where they said that they were struggling with attendances due to the travelling distances involved, especially as they had lost their only local derby with the rise of Inverness Caledonian Thistle. It's 110 miles and 2 1/4hr drive to Inverness...... that's some "local" derby. :) 

Truro must be in that world of pain too. I think their ‘derby’ this season is with WSM, must be a 300 mile round trip.

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5 hours ago, red'tili'mdead said:

 

I'm fairly certain they have had it chaps.

From the latest noises emanating from Chernobyl,  it appears to be a fire sale and if a buyer cannot be found very quickly then all subsequent options will v bad news for the Blue Few.

I genuinely believe that within 12-24 months they will end up 'back where they belong' - ground sharing with Bath City in L2.

Obv we are going to laugh long and hard in the short term, but celebrating the financial demise of any football club (even them!) leaves a bit of a nasty taste. 

For the avoidance of doubt, I'm not suggesting we give them any 'help' (we all remember '82 etc) but should we really 'gloat' if / when the brown stuff finally hits the fan.......

 

Yeah ****** right we should. 

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11 minutes ago, Bianconeri said:

Truro must be in that world of pain too. I think their ‘derby’ this season is with WSM, must be a 300 mile round trip.

I know a fan who told me that their combined distance of all away games (and he goes to pretty much all of them) would actually be lower in Conference North than their current in Conference South; with all those trips to Kent, London and East Anglia.

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