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Their third goal


Charlie BCFC

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12 minutes ago, Chappers said:

One of the joys of Championship football, occasional questionable decisions, and some inconsistency. Look on the bright side, way better than the sterile World of VAR

I'd say it's questionable and more recurring for us unfortunately. No fan of the current implementation of VAR though.

Yesterday in which officials helped to cost us.

Backend of last season- Aston Villa away. Weimann goal disallowed for offside, 0-0. Very tight and especially in real time..however the penalty they gained in 2nd half which broke open the game had a handball by Hourihane IIRC. We have a strong record on the road and specific tactics last season helped this.

Even if you accept the Weimann goal was tough in real time, the penalty as well is just a nonsense! You might accept one of them going against you but both??

Semenyo straight red v Derby. Took no allowance of the conditions either but even if you accept it, wasn't Huddlestone also guilty of similar?

I don't recall the last 'Homer'of a ref we had at AG! Rotherham just after Christmas? Two reds but IIRC one was a bit harsh.

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11 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

But wouldn't it then be a new phase when the PNE goalkeeper touches it?

I think the main distinction is Moore’s was considered a pass (initiating a new phase) where as the goalkeepers would be considered a deflection, so Weimann’s offside position was still included in the phase of play from Semenyos shot.

I don’t really agree with the rule but there you go... 

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31 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

Can anyone explain to me why Weimann's "goal" was disallowed for offside? When we played Boro at home they passed forward to a player in an offside position but he was deemed not offside because the ball was diverted by Taylor Moore, the Boro player then went on to score. Yesterday when Semenyo shot Weimann was in an offside position but he received the ball from the Preston keeper when he made the save, however the goal was disallowed. I can't see the difference between those two incidents yet the decisions were given different ways.

That's a really good point.

The keeper shouldn't be treated any differently to any other player as far as the offside rule goes.

IMHO both should be offside.

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27 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I agree, feels like a top 6 place should be within reach.

Regardless, the relative lack of possession in games is a new development- when we get a midfield 3 (hopefully!) of Brownhill, Nagy and Massengo that'll change, the control will increase etc.

When Nagy has been on the pitch we’ve dominated the possession battle. We had more possession against Birmingham the only game we’ve won the possession battle all season Nagy played 60 minutes. First half against QPR we had more possession, Nagy subbed off at half time and they ended up having more of the ball. Would love to see a diamond of Nagy, Massengo, Brownhill and Palmer. 

 

26 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said:

Def a foul for their third. Think both pens you have seen given but still feel the first is harsh. Maybe our first is disallowed on another day. So guess a point is fair. 

What I want to ask about Fam’s goal is, if it was the other way around and the defender pushed Fam similarly and he went down that theatrically, would we have gotten the penalty? I don’t think so. Fam did give a slight push but I don’t think enough to push over a 15 stone 6’4 bloke onto his back. 

Looking at one of the views from Quest I think the ref got Diedhious one right and credit where it’s due for that one. However if that’s a foul then the one on Baker is most certainly a foul.

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11 hours ago, Flint says No said:

This is probably a harsher decision than Famaras disallowed goal. Would never have got to that if he didn’t climb on Bakers shoulders. https://twitter.com/jbcfc_/status/1177985525824798720?s=21

The Preston player jumps initially with his arms up as you are coached to, and early as you are coached to do. He would be less able to head ball if Bakers position was better. Preston win a ball inside the six yard box where Citys CB's and Keeper should be controlling the space aggressively. Its poor defending.

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2 minutes ago, Flint says No said:

When Nagy has been on the pitch we’ve dominated the possession battle. We had more possession against Birmingham the only game we’ve won the possession battle all season Nagy played 60 minutes. First half against QPR we had more possession, Nagy subbed off at half time and they ended up having more of the ball. Would love to see a diamond of Nagy, Massengo, Brownhill and Palmer. 

 

Looking at one of the views from Quest I think the ref got Diedhious one right and credit where it’s due for that one. However if that’s a foul then the one on Baker is most certainly a foul.

This is true. When he returns we will get more control and stability- diamond or 4-3-1-2 the way forward IMO.

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Hopefully championship brings in VAR. But I am hoping VAR improves a lot by next season. Not hard to sort out the problems I have seen so far.

Problems are VAR not giving blatant fouls. Taking too long on easy decisions. And the offsides that are so close, it's so hard to tell even when freezing. Not hard to just give attacking team advantage.

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29 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

So the offside rule is different depending on which direction the ball's travelling?

An extract from Law 11:

[a player is offside if he is]

gaining an advantage by playing the ball or interfering with an opponent when it has:

rebounded or been deflected off the goalpost, crossbar or an opponent

been deliberately saved by any opponent

A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an opponent who deliberately plays the ball (except from a deliberate save by any opponent) is not considered to have gained an advantage.

A ‘save’ is when a player stops, or attempts to stop, a ball which is going into or very close to the goal with any part of the body except the hands/arms (unless the goalkeeper within the penalty area).

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/lawsandrules/laws/football-11-11/law-11---offside

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1 hour ago, ashton_fan said:

Can anyone explain to me why Weimann's "goal" was disallowed for offside? When we played Boro at home they passed forward to a player in an offside position but he was deemed not offside because the ball was diverted by Taylor Moore, the Boro player then went on to score. Yesterday when Semenyo shot Weimann was in an offside position but he received the ball from the Preston keeper when he made the save, however the goal was disallowed. I can't see the difference between those two incidents yet the decisions were given different ways.

I personally don't really think the officials understand the offside rule themselves either, so confusing, one referee gives an offside another doesn't, 

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1 hour ago, reddogkev said:

The player held down Baker's shoulders and forced him to the ground, the goal should've been disallowed.

But I also feel Taylor Moore fouled their keeper for our first goal, so I guess it's all fair in the end.

Draw was a fair result, and what a cracking game for those who travelled.

I remember Flint scoring our first goal in the 2015 JPT Final by climbing on a Walsall defender. It happens.

As for Diedhiou, the TV replays showed that he pushed the chest of the Preston defender. Sad, but true.

Glad to say that I was there to experience the rollercoaster of emotions.

And the bloody rain.

 

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16 minutes ago, Redmycolour said:

I personally don't really think the officials understand the offside rule themselves either, so confusing, one referee gives an offside another doesn't, 

If officials don't then fans certainly don't. So many firm claims and opinions are expressed without bothering to read Law 11, despite the laws being freely available on the FA website.

Much the same is true of players, managers and pundits mind you.

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After giving the Ref abuse at the time, and on Twitter after watching the early clips, I do have to reign in the vitriol ..... a little.
My take from clips.

First goal: Moore may have had another bit of luck with the Refs eyeline/view (seeing s clip from the Swansea end last week his tackle could have been costly) Although I think it would have been harsh to disallow it, I have seen that given as a foul. The keeper does have his hands on TM though.

Second goal: Keeper is taken out by his own man.

First Pen: Still struggling to see much contact, but again Refs angle may have come into play.

Second Pen: Nailed on , very poor for an experienced player.

Their Third goal: The Pic that @RedDave posted speaks volumes, how the game was going I couldn't see the Ref disallowing it , sadly.

Offside disallowed goal: Weimann is offside when Semenyo shoots, and becomes active when he plays the ball. He is offside from the shot but not interfering (active) with play until he scores. This said I would like a better angle as it looks tight, but as I said yesterday, at least it the Lino's decision and he had a good view. What usually happens is he sees the nearest shirt (Weimann in this case) and judges from there.

Foul disallowed goal: Harsh for me, but TBF if it was reversed I would appeal for it. 

I just think it feels worse and I felt hard done by due to the way the game went. We said we would have taken a draw in the pub before.

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Same ref as the carabao cup tie vs qpr in August. Joke late pen for qpr. I was in the players guests section yesterday  by the corner flag and to hear both sets of fans singing you don't know what you're doing would have been funny if it wasn't so sad. The efl elite group 2batch of referees really are desperate, Scott Duncan, Keith stroud etc etc. 

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4 hours ago, RedDave said:

I would say a draw wasn’t a fair result as we were much the better side 

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I know xG isn’t the be-all and end-all, but look how we created consistently throughout the game (a bit less in final 30).  Preston dominated possession for 15 minutes just before we went one-up, but they created one solitary chance, the Maguire shot into side netting.  The next two chances were penalties!!  We cope well without the ball this season.  
 

So, I totally agree RD.

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