You've Picked Your Best Candidate........

[mozo]

10 big questions for Holden:

1. How are the former loanees integrated? Moore, Vyner, Walsh, Morrell, Bakinson, Semenyo - you know the players - what's your plan?

2. Wingers or wing backs? No point having both on the books. If we played wing backs previously, and Eliaason is off, forget wingers for good, no?

3. Luxury lads - Palmer, Szmodics, Paterson - can we harness their talents or cut our losses? Need to be clear and not flip flop.

4. Goalkeeper. Competition for Bentley, or just cover with what we've got?

5. Centre backs. We're at least one short even if we integrate loanees. A transfer or loan needed, left footer preferred.

6. Centre mid. Do we seriously see Weimann and Pato as long term centre mid options? Were Massengo and Nagy on the bench for a reason, and if so what do we do with them now? Do we need an enforcer? Or a playmaker? Or what?!

7. Attack. If Diedhiou is off, are we looking for a foil for Wells? A big man? Loan or permanent? Or do we need 2?

8. Captain? Kalas the default? Bring one in (as debated on Forever Bristol City)

9. Impose or spoil? Holden was asked whether City would stop worrying about opponents threats and focus on our strengths. His answer was diplomatic, almost a bit of both. Well our first difficult away game will tell us a lot.

10. Rotation. Will it be minimal, or will the shiny clubs in the bag be too tempting? Will we trust a team even after a couple of defeats? Will he be loyal to players when fans turn against them? TBC.

[Bazooka Joe]

35 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said:

Who said that he was the best candidate.

Not MA, not JL.

They said that he was the right candidate.

Whatever that means.

As they avoided giving a straight answer to a straight question, I'd take that to mean he wasn't the best candidate.

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, mozo said:

10 big questions for Holden:

I know you’re not asking me, but....

1. How are the former loanees integrated? Moore, Vyner, Walsh, Morrell, Bakinson, Semenyo - you know the players - what's your plan?

first 4 to be heavily involved.  Bakinson I reckon will have a season at Plymouth again this time in Lg1.  Semenyo who knows.

2. Wingers or wing backs? No point having both on the books. If we played wing backs previously, and Eliaason is off, forget wingers for good, no?
yep, move on, Eliasson and O’Dowda.  

3. Luxury lads - Palmer, Szmodics, Paterson - can we harness their talents or cut our losses? Need to be clear and not flip flop.
Pato holds the shirt, think one might move on, even Palmer....still young and saleable 

4. Goalkeeper. Competition for Bentley, or just cover with what we've got?

For me, Max is no2....and needs to be patient.

5. Centre backs. We're at least one short even if we integrate loanees. A transfer or loan needed, left footer preferred.
Matt Clarke or Chalobah or Dunkley type.

6. Centre mid. Do we seriously see Weimann and Pato as long term centre mid options? Were Massengo and Nagy on the bench for a reason, and if so what do we do with them now? Do we need an enforcer? Or a playmaker? Or what?!
yes to Pato in a 3....would like a big, ugly CM too

7. Attack. If Diedhiou is off, are we looking for a foil for Wells? A big man? Loan or permanent? Or do we need 2?

Hugill type on loan 

8. Captain? Kalas the default? Bring one in (as debated on Forever Bristol City)

Kalas if we don’t sign one....Moore as vice.

9. Impose or spoil? Holden was asked whether City would stop worrying about opponents threats and focus on our strengths. His answer was diplomatic, almost a bit of both. Well our first difficult away game will tell us a lot.
impose.

10. Rotation. Will it be minimal, or will the shiny clubs in the bag be too tempting? Will we trust a team even after a couple of defeats? Will he be loyal to players when fans turn against them? TBC.
condensed fixture schedule.  Keep CBs the same, rest WBs when they need it, don’t burn them out.

 

[Bris Red]

Call me negative but im struggling to see any real quality players that will be jumping at the chance to play for Holden. To the outside looking in it screams of a small time appointment - its all well and good the club coming out with the usual soundbites that they WANT promotion (how many times have we heard them say that?!) but agents and players aren’t stupid. They will take one look at this makeshift quite odd rookie management setup and big questions will be asked of do they genuinely have the know how to get a team challenging at this level.

Think we will really struggle getting people through the door TBH. Such a shame as Hughton would have attracted that quality without question.

[mozo]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

Dave, seeing as Holden was unlikely to reply to my questions, your views are much appreciated!

I broadly agree with your comments and the question is will Holden agree?

Regards Paterson, I prefer him as the progressive of the 3 in between the lines, not as the quarterback/Pirlo type.

And in theory like the idea of City imposing our game on teams, with either a high press or front foot attacking possession play. This will only work, however, if players know their roles, are free to make mistakes and are kept motivated and confident. As soon as players become confused or disengaged, the assertive approach crumbles and you're better off playing on the counter (known as the Lee Johnson experience!)

[TonyTonyTony]

3 minutes ago, bris red said:

Call me negative but im struggling to see any real quality players that will be jumping at the chance to play for Holden. To the outside looking in it screams of a small time appointment - its all well and good the club coming out with the usual soundbites that they WANT promotion (how many times have we heard them say that?!) but agents and players aren’t stupid. They will take one look at this makeshift quite odd rookie management setup and big questions will be asked of do they genuinely have the know how to get a team challenging at this level.

Think we will really struggle getting people through the door TBH. Such a shame as Hughton would have attracted that quality without question.

Glass half empty kind of fella aren't you?

Hughton would have attracted bigger names, but at what cost? Round and Round we go

[CyderInACan]

46 minutes ago, mozo said:

8. Captain? Kalas the default? Bring one in (as debated on Forever Bristol City)

Taylor Moore 

[Lrrr]

1 hour ago, Red-Robbo said:

 

We  know they aren't serious about challenging.

"Dean has no specific targets" tells its own story.

To be fair that was with regards to him losing his job though, everyone has again said top 6 is the aim, its just a case of if we don't reach it under Dean other factors will be considered as to why so he wouldn't necessarily lose his job just for not coming top 6.

[Midlands Robin]

The way Holden came across regarding signings when he spoke to Geoff on the radio last night was that he was going to look at the squad first, the returning loan players next and then look at what he can bring in. 

This suggests there won't be any immediate movement in the transfer market. 

Due to the Covid situation a lot of clubs are going to be very cautious when it comes to spending. I don't see anyone coming in for a few weeks yet. 

[Numero Uno]

7 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Don't need to spend loads anyway imo.

CB, ST (if we sell Fam)

Ideally RWB, LWB and CM if we can maybe move on Hunt, Rowe and Nagy.

I think we have good players.

I agree that we do not need loads of players but we do need to add some quality to the mix to at least be sitting comfortably in the right end of the table.

[bengalcub]

8 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Don't need to spend loads anyway imo.

CB, ST (if we sell Fam)

Ideally RWB, LWB and CM if we can maybe move on Hunt, Rowe and Nagy.

I think we have good players.

How many young midfielders will be in the matchday squad ? 1 of massengo , morrell and walsh maybe .....in my opinion nagy hasnt worked out and we need better so i reckon we need at least two quality cm signings elliasson will be offski so we need to replace however i feel with holden at the healm weimann will be used out wide all season long 

[LondonBristolian]

Similar to @Davefevs, I fancied jumping in what my answers would be:

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

10 big questions for Holden:

1. How are the former loanees integrated? Moore, Vyner, Walsh, Morrell, Bakinson, Semenyo - you know the players - what's your plan?Le

I hope Moore, Walsh and Morrell are and feel Vyner showed enough at the end of the season to at least be a squad player. Semenyo has a lot to prove. not sure Bakinson is ready yet but could be a loan.

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

2. Wingers or wing backs? No point having both on the books. If we played wing backs previously, and Eliaason is off, forget wingers for good, no?

I think Kalas, Moore, Vyner, Hunt, Rowe and Dasilva are all suited to a back 3 and wing-backs so it feels like a no-brainer. O'Dowda is maybe an area where we can bring someone in.

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

3. Luxury lads - Palmer, Szmodics, Paterson - can we harness their talents or cut our losses? Need to be clear and not flip flop.

I'd like Szmodics and Palmer to get a chance to show what they can do but it is hard with such a limited pre-season. I don't see that we need all three and Paterson was in form at the end of the season.

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

4. Goalkeeper. Competition for Bentley, or just cover with what we've got?

I hope O'Leary can be competition. 

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

5. Centre backs. We're at least one short even if we integrate loanees. A transfer or loan needed, left footer preferred.

Definitely one short. Agree a left-footer would make sense. 

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

6. Centre mid. Do we seriously see Weimann and Pato as long term centre mid options? Were Massengo and Nagy on the bench for a reason, and if so what do we do with them now? Do we need an enforcer? Or a playmaker? Or what?!

Pato, yes. Weimann, no. I think we need an enforcer. I think Massengo or Nagy could work if we had a defensive midfielder who could hold a position and free them up to cover the pitch. 

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

7. Attack. If Diedhiou is off, are we looking for a foil for Wells? A big man? Loan or permanent? Or do we need 2?

I think next season will be Wells, Weimann, Semenyo and one other. I think we need a deep lying forward to play alongside Wells. Don't think that has to be a target man but is an option. 

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

8. Captain? Kalas the default? Bring one in (as debated on Forever Bristol City)

I don't see Kalas as a captain. I think Moore and Baker are the two strongest options but don't think either a strong option so we may need to bring someone in.

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

9. Impose or spoil? Holden was asked whether City would stop worrying about opponents threats and focus on our strengths. His answer was diplomatic, almost a bit of both. Well our first difficult away game will tell us a lot.

I think we need to soak up pressure and hit directly. 

43 minutes ago, mozo said:

10. Rotation. Will it be minimal, or will the shiny clubs in the bag be too tempting? Will we trust a team even after a couple of defeats? Will he be loyal to players when fans turn against them? TBC.

As much consistency as possible without knackering players. I think we need wing-backs and midfielers who can provide some rotation due to the volume of fixtures. 

[SBB]

5 minutes ago, bengalcub said:

How many young midfielders will be in the matchday squad ? 1 of massengo , morrell and walsh maybe .....in my opinion nagy hasnt worked out and we need better so i reckon we need at least two quality cm signings elliasson will be offski so we need to replace however i feel with holden at the healm weimann will be used out wide all season long 

I wouldn’t be surprised to see all 3 in the match day squads next season but definitely 2 out of the 3. 
For all the hype and expectation around HNM and Walsh, my money would be on Morrell to be the success story of the coming season. I have high hopes for all 3.

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

If Dean is expected to be challenging for promotion, but without a gun being held to his head, which to me seems fair enough then he has to be backed adequately. Anyone who thinks our current squad will challenge for promotion without being reinforced is quite simply deluded. It would send a very mixed message IF Dean does not receive adequate backing, whether that is through selling players and being given the money to spend or through a degree of additional funding.

As for the previous mixed messages given out by the Board, one on national radio, no need to revisit that................

If nothing changes and we do challenge for promotion, then that reflects more on LJ than the board.

It is apparent that there are weaknesses in the team but ask anyone on OTIB and you'll get a varied answer. Let's hope that we are all pleasantly surprised by DH and he storms it (that's the optimist in me speaking).

[Steve Watts]

1 hour ago, mozo said:

10 big questions for Holden:

9. Impose or spoil? Holden was asked whether City would stop worrying about opponents threats and focus on our strengths. His answer was diplomatic, almost a bit of both. Well our first difficult away game will tell us a lot.

I'm not sure it will.  Whilst we do want to impose our own game on teams, that doesn't mean that there aren't games where you are better trying to counter the opposition.  Our first tricky home game will be far more telling, for me.

[Red-Robbo]

35 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

To be fair that was with regards to him losing his job though, everyone has again said top 6 is the aim, its just a case of if we don't reach it under Dean other factors will be considered as to why so he wouldn't necessarily lose his job just for not coming top 6.

What would those factors be?

Reaching the top 6 should be no harder than in any other season. Covid didn't exclusively affect Bristol. In fact, you could well say that the league could be easier than last season with two big clubs gone , smaller clubs incoming and one team already on a points deduction with more likely to follow.

20/21 could've represented our best chance for ages to get promoted. Instead we have a "steady as she goes" mentality, if the novice turns out OK we might just do something but... no pressure...

Opportunity wasted.

[Lrrr]

Just now, Red-Robbo said:

What would those factors be?

Quite simple things, say we finished 8th/9th but it was tight to top 6 and missed out by a few points but we'd had a lot of glaringly bad penalty/red card decisions against us which ended up costing us several points then its stuff like that. If hypothetically we had several bad injuries but missed out by a few points.

Its not just so simple to say top 6 or sacked as there will always be footballing reasons that will need to be considered.

[Red-Robbo]

Just now, Lrrr said:

Quite simple things, say we finished 8th/9th but it was tight to top 6 and missed out by a few points but we'd had a lot of glaringly bad penalty/red card decisions against us which ended up costing us several points then its stuff like that. If hypothetically we had several bad injuries but missed out by a few points.

Its not just so simple to say top 6 or sacked as there will always be footballing reasons that will need to be considered.

 

So why did we sack Johnson?  A: We sacked him because he'd assembled a talented (and expensive) squad, but failed.

TBH I think we'll finish lower down this coming season than last. That should be the point you don't "roll" Holden's rolling contract any further, but reconsider your original foolhardy decision to appoint him.

Any management consultant will tell you, you must set clear targets.

An improved position must be a target.

If he does that, Top 6 in year 2 is the target.

Don't fancy it? Don't take the job.

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, JonDolman said:

I think if we base our team around let's say that Derby away line up then we don't really lack quality. Get our players playing to their best and we should hopefully see a quality team of players. 

I don't see why we can't play 2 of them. Walsh is nearly 23. Morrell is 23. And hoping we can start seeing the best version of Massengo. That system he seemed to play better in before LJ changed it.

Nagy I still don't really know about whether he is the answer. He might be if he can play to his best.

I would ideally let Nagy go permanently or even on loan. And would love Joe Williams here.

Williams, Walsh, Morrell and Massengo I would be very comfortable with.

It is well known that we can play on the break away from home. Don Goodman spelt it out in plain terms at a recent Sky match and also pointed out that when teams let us have the ball we are effin useless (he didn't quite put it like that but you get it). That is why quality is needed in central areas and why we are so poor at home in comparison to away matches where we can play on the counter all afternoon/evening.

[Davefevs]

One final thing, we have a plethora of club developed players available.  Last year was farcical.  Bad planning.

Massengo counts as club developed this season.  That’s bonkers!

[Phileas Fogg]

They have to back him. They’ve already needlessly made things tricky for him by making such a mess of the process. As a result, through no fault of his own, Holden won’t have much patience from the supporters.

To make up for this, the club needs to allow him to recruit a couple of key players.

[Phileas Fogg]

2 hours ago, bris red said:

Call me negative but im struggling to see any real quality players that will be jumping at the chance to play for Holden. To the outside looking in it screams of a small time appointment - its all well and good the club coming out with the usual soundbites that they WANT promotion (how many times have we heard them say that?!) but agents and players aren’t stupid. They will take one look at this makeshift quite odd rookie management setup and big questions will be asked of do they genuinely have the know how to get a team challenging at this level.

Think we will really struggle getting people through the door TBH. Such a shame as Hughton would have attracted that quality without question.

I am hoping that the assistants bring a bit of a network with them.

I’ve heard Herbie Kane might be leaving Liverpool. He’s at the age where he’d want to be getting games and genuinely is a huge City fan. I hope the club are taking a look.

[mozo]

41 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

I think if we base our team around let's say that Derby away line up then we don't really lack quality. Get our players playing to their best and we should hopefully see a quality team of players. 

I don't see why we can't play 2 of them. Walsh is nearly 23. Morrell is 23. And hoping we can start seeing the best version of Massengo. That system he seemed to play better in before LJ changed it.

Nagy I still don't really know about whether he is the answer. He might be if he can play to his best.

I would ideally let Nagy go permanently or even on loan. And would love Joe Williams here.

Williams, Walsh, Morrell and Massengo I would be very comfortable with.

Mate I'm with you nearly all the way there with the exception that I'd keep Nagy as well. I actually really like our midfield options and just want 1 of that Williams type added.

Playing with wing backs gives us the opportunity to play either three of that group with 1 Palmer type playing off a front man, or two of those with a playmaker and 2 up top.

[Davefevs]

10 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said:

I am hoping that the assistants bring a bit of a network with them.

I’ve heard Herbie Kane might be leaving Liverpool. He’s at the age where he’d want to be getting games and genuinely is a huge City fan. I hope the club are taking a look.

Some info in transfer forum:

 

[mozo]

17 minutes ago, JonDolman said:

Yeah I'm certainly not saying Nagy is not good enough ability wise. 

Just need to see him do what he did against Huddersfield more often.

I think the team shape could be key to getting the best out of him.

If we do add a Joe Williams type to Nagy, Massengo, Walsh and Morrell. I am not sure we'd keep all of Szmodics, Paterson and Palmer.

Unless we go with one of those 3 just behind Wells like you say.

Having Weimann as an option up top or one of those in behind. I said last week Paterson's best form for us came as a central striker with Bobby. Though obviously floating around all over the place.

Agreed agreed agreed. On Paterson, if I was Holden I'd be saying to him that this could very well be his last season at the club and that he needs to prove that he's irreplaceable. He needs a real sense of urgency to ensure he doesn't get complacent and let the performances levels drop.

Pato turns 29 midway through the season and really needs his career best form to earn what will be a critical contract for the back end of his career.

As I write this I wonder if we'd be better off turning to the younger model (Palmer/Szmodics) now... undecided on that, but definitely no point in having a 30 year old Pato on our books if he's still a player that loses focus for spells.

 

[supercidered]

3 hours ago, bcfcfinker said:

If nothing changes and we do challenge for promotion, then that reflects more on LJ than the board.

It is apparent that there are weaknesses in the team but ask anyone on OTIB and you'll get a varied answer. Let's hope that we are all pleasantly surprised by DH and he storms it (that's the optimist in me speaking).

When you say ‘the optimist in me’ are you in a relationship with Bat Fastard?

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, JonDolman said:

Yeah I'm certainly not saying Nagy is not good enough ability wise. 

Just need to see him do what he did against Huddersfield more often.

I think the team shape could be key to getting the best out of him.

If we do add a Joe Williams type to Nagy, Massengo, Walsh and Morrell. I am not sure we'd keep all of Szmodics, Paterson and Palmer.

Unless we go with one of those 3 just behind Wells like you say.

Having Weimann as an option up top or one of those in behind. I said last week Paterson's best form for us came as a central striker with Bobby. Though obviously floating around all over the place.

The other option(s) are indeed the 5311, or even a 5221 “box”....if we might switch to a 1 man striker system.  But I’m not looking at that until I see whether Diedhiou leaves, and whether we replace him (and who with).

1 hour ago, mozo said:

Agreed agreed agreed. On Paterson, if I was Holden I'd be saying to him that this could very well be his last season at the club and that he needs to prove that he's irreplaceable. He needs a real sense of urgency to ensure he doesn't get complacent and let the performances levels drop.

Pato turns 29 midway through the season and really needs his career best form to earn what will be a critical contract for the back end of his career.

As I write this I wonder if we'd be better off turning to the younger model (Palmer/Szmodics) now... undecided on that, but definitely no point in having a 30 year old Pato on our books if he's still a player that loses focus for spells.

 

Pato looks like the kind of player who still looks 24/25, so I’d have no worries about him being here at 30. The thing with Pato is to keep dangling a carrot.  I’d never him offer him a long deal.

[man in the middle]

Can only see us dipping into the loan market this season. 

[Robin Wood]

5 hours ago, Midlands Robin said:

The way Holden came across regarding signings when he spoke to Geoff on the radio last night was that he was going to look at the squad first, the returning loan players next and then look at what he can bring in. 

This suggests there won't be any immediate movement in the transfer market. 

Due to the Covid situation a lot of clubs are going to be very cautious when it comes to spending. I don't see anyone coming in for a few weeks yet. 

City's problem will be getting players out with a squad of 30 plus don't think lower league clubs will be able to loan players so a large unhappy squad I think we've been there before

[mozo]

13 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

The other option(s) are indeed the 5311, or even a 5221 “box”....if we might switch to a 1 man striker system.  But I’m not looking at that until I see whether Diedhiou leaves, and whether we replace him (and who with).

Pato looks like the kind of player who still looks 24/25, so I’d have no worries about him being here at 30. The thing with Pato is to keep dangling a carrot.  I’d never him offer him a long deal.

Yeah I thought that after I posted. He could pass for a younger player and doesn't seem to get injured, but really does need to be kept on his toes.