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Holden - sack or keep?


Major Isewater

Holden - sack or keep?   

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I still think if we want to continue with this framework after Holden, Howe is the ideal candidate.

 

Impressive coach, less impressive on the transfer front. Let him focus on the pitch and somebody else on the recruitment and I think there is a recipe for success there.

 

Also, his ex-assistant is now the Bournemouth manager, so he might not desire to bring in his own backroom staff.

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1 hour ago, Major Isewater said:

If Tisdale does well at the Gas I have a feeling  that Uncle Steve will make moves to bring him into City.

In-exp and cheap will fit in well and continue the never ending circle we are on.

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It's actually mental that Bristol f*****g rovers have a better manager than us. Would happily swap with them right now. Still backing Holden but I pray to god the 12 month contract is it, didn't deserve the job to begin with and from the performances we've seen, doesn't deserve to keep it. Needs to step up over the next 6 weeks and prove he's the man for the job, otherwise we should let him see out the contract and begin the recruitment search ready for someone to take over at the end of the season. Howe or Bilic being the ideal replacement. Might sound harsh and sudden but if we want to make it to the prem we have to do it ASAP before we turn stale and have a bad season. Have a feeling next seasons championship will be even more wide open than this one, should we lose Norwich, Bournemouth and Watford, which seems likely, and gain Sheffield United, West Brom and Fulham, again likely, then id fancy our chances more for next season than this, should we have a proper manager in place that is.. 

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7 minutes ago, Negan said:

It's actually mental that Bristol f*****g rovers have a better manager than us. Would happily swap with them right now. Still backing Holden but I pray to god the 12 month contract is it, didn't deserve the job to begin with and from the performances we've seen, doesn't deserve to keep it. Needs to step up over the next 6 weeks and prove he's the man for the job, otherwise we should let him see out the contract and begin the recruitment search ready for someone to take over at the end of the season. Howe or Bilic being the ideal replacement. Might sound harsh and sudden but if we want to make it to the prem we have to do it ASAP before we turn stale and have a bad season. Have a feeling next seasons championship will be even more wide open than this one, should we lose Norwich, Bournemouth and Watford, which seems likely, and gain Sheffield United, West Brom and Fulham, again likely, then id fancy our chances more for next season than this, should we have a proper manager in place that is.. 

The questions that need asking ;

Why not now ?

Why not us ?

It seems like we are always just hoping  rather than grabbing the bull by the horns and insisting that this season is our season and fighting to achieve our goal , whatever it costs .

Is Uncle Steve that  hard nosed owner demanding nothing less than a promotion ?

 

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2 minutes ago, Major Isewater said:

The questions that need asking ;

Why not now ?

Why not us ?

It seems like we are always just hoping  rather than grabbing the bull by the horns and insisting that this season is our season and fighting to achieve our goal , whatever it costs .

Is Uncle Steve that  hard nosed owner demanding nothing less than a promotion ?

 

We've been told that promotion is the objective for the season from the powers that be, so they can't be annoyed when fans expect it and when we've been watching performances like we have been for the past 18 months we're right to question the decisions they've made. Holden has to be the most bizarre appointment we've ever made and had a very small chance of working, we're starting to see it isn't. So if they are really serious about promotion then there has to be a certain standard needed from the people in charge of the team. Let's be honest, every win we've picked up this season has been a total "shithouse" result, the other team walk off the pitch thinking "how the hell have we just lost" I genuinely can't think of a single game this season where I've felt we were the better team and deserved the 3 points. That sort of luck runs out. I said I think we'll finish between 12th - 18th this season, which going by the comments made by the lancdowns, Ashton and holden, will be total failure. We've invested a lot of money in to the players so we really do need to be serious contenders for top 6. I'm aware you can't just spend money to get out the league, but when you do the pressure is massively on to at least be in the mix. The most important part of a successful team is the manager, I just don't think we have the right one in charge to get us a top 6. 

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2 minutes ago, Negan said:

We've been told that promotion is the objective for the season from the powers that be, so they can't be annoyed when fans expect it and when we've been watching performances like we have been for the past 18 months we're right to question the decisions they've made. Holden has to be the most bizarre appointment we've ever made and had a very small chance of working, we're starting to see it isn't. So if they are really serious about promotion then there has to be a certain standard needed from the people in charge of the team. Let's be honest, every win we've picked up this season has been a total "shithouse" result, the other team walk off the pitch thinking "how the hell have we just lost" I genuinely can't think of a single game this season where I've felt we were the better team and deserved the 3 points. That sort of luck runs out. I said I think we'll finish between 12th - 18th this season, which going by the comments made by the lancdowns, Ashton and holden, will be total failure. We've invested a lot of money in to the players so we really do need to be serious contenders for top 6. I'm aware you can't just spend money to get out the league, but when you do the pressure is massively on to at least be in the mix. The most important part of a successful team is the manager, I just don't think we have the right one in charge to get us a top 6. 

I have to disagree in that the players are more important than the manager/coach, if the players aren't good enough then they won't get promoted regardless of who's coaching them. The problem is we can't afford the players we need and keep within FFP to compete with the big teams on parachute money.

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3 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

I have to disagree in that the players are more important than the manager/coach, if the players aren't good enough then they won't get promoted regardless of who's coaching them. The problem is we can't afford the players we need and keep within FFP to compete with the big teams on parachute money.

Tisdale at Exeter worked wonders year after year with a very average squad including several ex-City players.

He got the best out of them as a team which is what a good coach is there for.

In these days of FFP turning average players into a good team is the way to achieve promotion; not by having Harry Redknapp-alikes come in and start leaf-blowing money around on new signings.

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1 minute ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Tisdale at Exeter worked wonders year after year with a very average squad including several ex-City players.

He got the best out of them as a team which is what a good coach is there for.

In these days of FFP turning average players into a good team is the way to achieve promotion; not by having Harry Redknapp-alikes come in and start leaf-blowing money around on new signings.

It's easier to achieve in the lower leagues where there's not such a big difference in squad quality between the top and bottom clubs but in the Championship there's a massive gulf between clubs just promoted out of L1 and those just relegated from the Prem, with clubs like ours somewhere in the middle.

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1 hour ago, Negan said:

It's actually mental that Bristol f*****g rovers have a better manager than us. Would happily swap with them right now. Still backing Holden but I pray to god the 12 month contract is it, didn't deserve the job to begin with and from the performances we've seen, doesn't deserve to keep it. Needs to step up over the next 6 weeks and prove he's the man for the job, otherwise we should let him see out the contract and begin the recruitment search ready for someone to take over at the end of the season. Howe or Bilic being the ideal replacement. Might sound harsh and sudden but if we want to make it to the prem we have to do it ASAP before we turn stale and have a bad season. Have a feeling next seasons championship will be even more wide open than this one, should we lose Norwich, Bournemouth and Watford, which seems likely, and gain Sheffield United, West Brom and Fulham, again likely, then id fancy our chances more for next season than this, should we have a proper manager in place that is.. 

interesting way of ‘still backing Holden’.

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45 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Tisdale at Exeter worked wonders year after year with a very average squad including several ex-City players.

He got the best out of them as a team which is what a good coach is there for.

In these days of FFP turning average players into a good team is the way to achieve promotion; not by having Harry Redknapp-alikes come in and start leaf-blowing money around on new signings.

Totally different managerial requirements , different level entirely 

Not selling Holden as the answer but Tisdale certainly  isn’t

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42 minutes ago, ashton_fan said:

It's easier to achieve in the lower leagues where there's not such a big difference in squad quality between the top and bottom clubs but in the Championship there's a massive gulf between clubs just promoted out of L1 and those just relegated from the Prem, with clubs like ours somewhere in the middle.

That's true but he was able to take the step up from Team Bath to Exeter in Div 4 and Div 3.  It's a leap but he has done it before.

MK Dons was a fail but that was down to a small squad and key player injuries; whenever he has been given time he has succeeded.

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1 hour ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Hooray! Someone else recognising that we should have appointed Tisdale first instead of LJ and then ahead of DH and I posted just this each time.

Maybe third time lucky.

 

I thought he would’ve been a good candidate 4 years ago.  But the guy has been at Rovers a few weeks, but this is typical OTIB, so I’m not sure why I’m surprised.

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1 hour ago, Negan said:

It's actually mental that Bristol f*****g rovers have a better manager than us. Would happily swap with them right now. Still backing Holden but I pray to god the 12 month contract is it, didn't deserve the job to begin with and from the performances we've seen, doesn't deserve to keep it. Needs to step up over the next 6 weeks and prove he's the man for the job, otherwise we should let him see out the contract and begin the recruitment search ready for someone to take over at the end of the season. Howe or Bilic being the ideal replacement. Might sound harsh and sudden but if we want to make it to the prem we have to do it ASAP before we turn stale and have a bad season. Have a feeling next seasons championship will be even more wide open than this one, should we lose Norwich, Bournemouth and Watford, which seems likely, and gain Sheffield United, West Brom and Fulham, again likely, then id fancy our chances more for next season than this, should we have a proper manager in place that is.. 

You cant possibly see out a one year rolling contract. 

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IMHO We have to go left field and appoint a foreign, preferably German coach.            Also an experienced   British manager  could   be an option.  German coaches have a great record in the UK, and that's a route I would suggest we should certainly  look at, but nationality is mostly secondary to the obvious need to research and investigate a replacement for Holden.                        .

Everyone and his Auntie can see that Holden is a nice bloke and a relatively competent manager, but we don't want  competent, we need and require  inspirational, tactically astute and  experienced?    We have been unlucky with injuries, but so have plenty of other sides, and it's the tactics and approach rather than personnel that concerns me most.  We will NOT get into the top 6 with Holden, and surely that is ultimately the aim, or else why even bother?

Lansdown has to admit his error, and look into lining up a new manager for the summer?  We have the time and resources, we just need a competent recruitment team to seek out an experienced Coach/manager to take over the reins, we have  4 - 5 months to find one, rather than ending up performing the kneejerk sacking of DH, and then rooting around at the last minute to find a replacement?  

How about something groundbreaking?  It's called forward planning, where you identify 2 or 3 realistic targets, do your research, fact finding  and analysis , and make sure your target is viable, then you employ him.  There are managers out there who could do a great job here, Lansdown stated we needed "A breath of fresh air".......... and we have ended up with a "stale gust".  Think ahead and plan for Christake's .....Surely City supporters deserve so much more than what is being served up at present?

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35 minutes ago, handsofclay said:

Tbf that's one point from 27 more than I can see Holden getting for us at present. 

Holden has already got us 30 points. Don't get me wrong I don't think he's the right man to move us forward, and I've found the football dire, but also lets not be OTT.

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