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Why Pearson?


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1 hour ago, Northern Red said:

Regardless of whether Pearson is the right man or not, the last sentence of that is spot on and I'm amazed at the number of people who can't grasp it.

It literally takes no more than a couple of defeats for people to start screaming for the manager to be changed and for various players to never appear again. It's a completely unrealistic way to run a football club yet it happens constantly, not just our fans either.

The *** who should be hung for this mess is Ashton (his team, his side, his ownership), and the scumbag is now bailing out. Says it all.

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Another peak OTIB thread.

We're raising the bar yet again 🙂

My opinion has been written on several threads on this forum. The BLATANT fact is that the players aren't good enough. And that, for most of you is a bitter pill to swallow. Here's a list of their downfalls:

  1. They're not intelligent enough
  2. They're not strong enough (mentally and physically)
  3. They're not team players
  4. They're injury prone
  5. They're not positionally aware
  6. They're not playing for their lives
  7. They're not consistent enough
  8. They're paid way too much money
  9. They're not leaders
  10. They don't play for each other
  11. They believe their own hubris that they're world beaters
  12. Their psychologically weak
  13. They're too nice

What were you all expecting when Pearson took over? 11 wins from 11 and a playoff push?

I think that Ashton's DNA machine was broken - because that list is damning (and probably incomplete)

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1 hour ago, Berkshire Red said:

Radio Bristol summed it up last night, none of that Wycombe squad on paper would get into Citys starting line up. 

Why has Pearson the messiah not managed to get a point against Wycombe placed 24th in the table. Further to that, how has he only managed 1 point against teams positioned 22nd, 20th, 15th, 23rd and 24th at the time of playing them?

He's the manager. He trains them every week. He picks the squad. He motivates them. A good manager takes responsibility for the performance of their team. 

If it was Appleton who was on this form, or a league one manager would you be saying extend their contract and give them 4 transfer windows?

As I said in my post earlier today, there's all kinds of extra variables that you can factor into the statistical comparison I put up. I'll assume that the positions you've quoted are correct.

Honestly, I am trying to take a nuanced view. As I've said, I am not Pearson's biggest fan, I was cold on his appointment, and am far from enamoured at how he conducts himself in interviews, with the football we're watching, or with certain other matters, including some of the signings that you've mentioned in other posts.

However, I temper that negativity by looking at the stats, and the contract situations of the players, and the disturbance that Ashton's departure will be causing, and the ongoing injury issue. The bloke has still only been with us for two months, and inherited a real mess. That is the balance.

My conclusion, perhaps in a futile attempt to balance all of these things, is that his contract should be extended. I say that with caution, and with the fact in mind that I don't think it's good for us to have a fourth manager in a year. It's an opinion, a view, a thought. It's not fact and as with Holden we will only ever know the outcome of one reality.

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34 minutes ago, DaveInSA said:

Another peak OTIB thread.

We're raising the bar yet again 🙂

My opinion has been written on several threads on this forum. The BLATANT fact is that the players aren't good enough. And that, for most of you is a bitter pill to swallow. Here's a list of their downfalls:

  1. They're not intelligent enough
  2. They're not strong enough (mentally and physically)
  3. They're not team players
  4. They're injury prone
  5. They're not positionally aware
  6. They're not playing for their lives
  7. They're not consistent enough
  8. They're paid way too much money
  9. They're not leaders
  10. They don't play for each other
  11. They believe their own hubris that they're world beaters
  12. Their psychologically weak
  13. They're too nice

What were you all expecting when Pearson took over? 11 wins from 11 and a playoff push?

I think that Ashton's DNA machine was broken - because that list is damning (and probably incomplete)

Re. Point 7 they been consistent. Unfortunately consistently crap. 

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9 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

I'm surprised anyone would take an inherent dislike to Pearson - have to say the City fans I know have taken to Nige.

Fair enough, we're all different, but all the same to compare the extent of your negative feelings about him with Pulis seems extraordinary.

Do you consider it to be an important trait in a City manager that you think you'd enjoy drinking with him?

Which City managers of the last 20 years would you have fancied having a pint with?

 

I can’t necessarily explain it, the signing of Danny Simpson certainly didn’t help. But even before that, I simply didn’t think he came across as a particularly likeable bloke. Much in the same way I felt about Pulis when he first arrived. 

I wouldn’t say I consider it important to want to go for a drink with the manager no, as it’s never going to happen. But it would be nice to feel a slight warmth towards whoever is in the throne.

And to answer your last question, all of them, except unsurprisingly Pearson and Pulis. 

 

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Pearson needs a contract and the backroom staff he wants

The club have royally ballsed this up with OOC players, Ashton running his mouth etc etc.

 

It feels like when GJ joined. The club was in a right state and he nearly delivered the promised land 

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21 hours ago, bris red said:

I really like him and his no nonsense attitude, the way he comes across in interviews is a breath of fresh air but tonight’s result i have to be honest is the first one that has got me questioning if he really is the right man to take us forward..

I’m going to stick my neck out on the line and say i would still give him time and at least the summer transfer window to mould his own squad and clear out the deadwood. 

Tonight's result or tonight's performance?

The result is a product of one particularly poor piece of defending where key players switched off, one moment of stupidity from KP and strikers who simply are not performing. 

The performance was on the whole a poor one but if the strikers perform than it would have been out of sight before the defensive lapses. 

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Nigel Pearson is the best bloke out there by a country mile! Polishing the turds left by LJ and Mark Ashton is pretty much all he can do. We and he are lucky that we have just enough points to not be concerned by relegation which gives him a chance to take a look. 

There will be a lot of players available for free come June and who knows what the new owners may want to do, if the rumors are true!

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I said when we was in a bad run, DH was the manager that it doesnt matter If LJ, DH or another manager would lead the team. The players are not good enough. Really hope NP or another manager can have a good team next season. For months we have looked like a leauge one team. Alarm bells are ringin.

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1 hour ago, rednotblue said:

Pearson needs a contract and the backroom staff he wants

The club have royally ballsed this up with OOC players, Ashton running his mouth etc etc.

 

It feels like when GJ joined. The club was in a right state and he nearly delivered the promised land 

Yes & GJ initial results were terrible. Won 1 of his first 9 I think. 

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We have been crying out for an experienced manager for years .
We get one at a time the squad is decimated by injuries, we could only sign players no one else wanted, players know that they will be not getting a new contract even though the lazy disinterested centre forward will and there is barely a chance to work only anything because of the quick game turn around. 
Don't think it's really fair judging him on current results, even though I would have expected more.

I think he needs to be given a window, a pre-season and a chance to reshape a side that has been playing this shite football for so long it's ingrained.
I could understand Steve having doubts and trying someone else, based purely on the football it's hard to argue. The thing is I don't think anyone coming in could sort this quickly. So a new man to me would be a step backwards as he has to learn about the squad all over again.

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Why Pearson?

Because I have every belief that with the right support/back room staff, along with him having the ability to build a team of organised players with a winning mentality, he will improve us massively.

Get him confirmed SL and let’s re-build a team that we can be proud of!!

Edited by Loosey Boy
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from a players point of view, would you want to play for bristol city if one of your team mates was offered a spanking a new deal and the rest of you told 'no dice'. play your socks of all season and we 'might' talk to you.

also,wouldnt you feel a little bit aggrieved having to carry your sicknote team mates through best part of a whole season knowing they are taking home more money than you for doing sod all?? i would be really pissed off at that one.  the sooner NP gets the nod to clear out all the wasters and useless medical team,the better

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Think we should hold our nerve regarding Pearson. I did see some signs first half yesterday of improvement in our attacking principles, but only microscopic.

I don't get this thing with Pearson being an 'old school manager'. Just because he looks hard as nails and would make your average night club bouncer meat head run a mile, doesn't mean to say he goes around the dressing room/training ground ranting and raving.

If you did your research at the start, you'd know he is quite a well read, methodical thinker, who thinks quite deeply about the game. Anyone that goes out of their way to self-educate themselves in modern psychology etc is not someone who has entrenched beliefs with the 'old way' of managing.

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I’ve never been a Pearson fan but I believed he was what we needed.   However, when a new manager comes into a club in our situation the first thing must be to install the basics and I don’t care that it isn’t his players    If you watch the Wycombe equaliser and pause it at the build up stage,  at least 6 or 7 of the players are in pointless positions. That is basics that should be drilled into the players from day 1.  It is very worrying that after 9 or 10 games they are still not doing it.  Hopefully Barnsley will not go up and we can get ismael, he has been a tactical genius with an average team 

I can’t see why SL would take the risk with NP.  If you had a car on demo and it performed badly , you wouldn’t purchase it even if the make had a good reputation 

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On 21/04/2021 at 21:55, Red Alert said:

OOC players should be motivated to earn their next contract even if that is not here.

Transfer market could be brutal for them.

I think many of them may not be the brightest lightbulbs. They also have the other football enigma - an agent. Greedy agents ‘advising’ their clients. 
If nothing else, Covid should drive down wages to help clubs deal with finances. 

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15 hours ago, Berkshire Red said:

 

He's the manager. He trains them every week. He picks the squad. He motivates them. A good manager takes responsibility for the performance of their team. 

If it was Appleton who was on this form, or a league one manager would you be saying extend their contract and give them 4 transfer windows?

I made the exact same point regarding Appleton a few pages back.

It appears that lipstick is being applied to the pig of results and performance. 

Every blinking point I've made has been about being concerned that the new Manager has not prevented the same old same old and it's everyone's else's fault but still "give him the job" - long term contract etc immediately.

The point about the  players being all the things they are accused of is that they may actually want a future career here or elsewhere so might have something to try for? How many times have we been told that a sudden change in a player's form is - playing for a new contract or putting themselves in the shop window.

I most definitely would wait until the final game of the season and then act VERY fast to secure Pearson if he's made the difference or someone else immediately. If all the players are so say going then it hardly matters that there is yet another appointment.

But here in lies the problem. I just wonder if by the last game - Steve says- "no thanks Nige...... now I wonder who I'll appoint now  and lets take the summer to think very carefully...."     Scott Murray eventually being the best candidate.

 

Groundhog day.

 

 

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16 hours ago, Berkshire Red said:

Radio Bristol summed it up last night, none of that Wycombe squad on paper would get into Citys starting line up. 

Why has Pearson the messiah not managed to get a point against Wycombe placed 24th in the table. Further to that, how has he only managed 1 point against teams positioned 22nd, 20th, 15th, 23rd and 24th at the time of playing them?

Because Wycombe have "spirit," and they're still trying. They still feel like they have something to play for. Spirit and effort go a long way in football. Our spirit and effort went before Pearson got here.

Oh, and Wycombe will be relegated, and City won't be, incidentally. Because the Wycombe players aren't good enough, despite their spirit and effort. Ours are good enough to stay up despite downing tools before the clocks went forward.

16 hours ago, Berkshire Red said:

He's the manager. He trains them every week. He picks the squad. He motivates them. A good manager takes responsibility for the performance of their team. 

It’s not his team yet, though, is it? Will it be the same personnel in August, or next February, or August '22 if he’s here that long? No. It's not yet his team. You're going to have to wait for him to put together "his" team. Meantime, the omnishambles that is Bristol City put together "this" team, they're responsible, so blame them.

16 hours ago, Berkshire Red said:

 

If it was Appleton who was on this form, or a league one manager would you be saying extend their contract and give them 4 transfer windows?

No, because he has managed primarily at a lower level and yet to promote a team from this division to the top one, let alone keep a team up in the top division, and let even further alone be involved in putting together a squad capable of doing something extraordinary.

A CV like that tends to lead to people having a bit of faith in you, and take a chance on you, even when things get a bit sticky.

Johnson was only able to enjoy two good seasons because SL stuck by him when he really should've bombed him out as we set a new club record for consecutive league defeats in 16/17.

 

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I’m setting a low bar.

I just want to watch a side that plays as a team.

A group of 11 men who know their positions, the formation, can pass accurately to each other, control a ball, win their physical and mental individual battles and support others in their battles with their opponent, can show intelligent movement, find space to take pressure off colleagues, can tackle, shoot accurately and show some fight, passion and unity.
 

From the most expensively assembled squad in the history of the Club this, surely, is not an unreasonable ask. 
 

If we can’t find 11 men to do this, it speaks volumes of our recruitment, our Academy, the entire backroom set up and the Club’s DNA. Quite astonishing really.

After a couple of months do I expect an experienced and successful manager - even with the apparent absolute shambles of a set-up he’s inherited to show signs of welding a team together to perform these basics - ummmm.

Do I still support Pearson’s appointment? Yes, because what Ashton’s left behind is just so bad it’s going to take more than one man to find a solution. And yes, because I think the guy has football intelligence and a steely determination to produce a successful team in his own image.

 

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Catching up with bits of that thread...

We won't be getting Shakespeare, fairly sure- he's got an Aston Villa (though I question FFP compliance) on the up, read somewhere he's fan of theirs too- non-starter.

Walsh? More realistic- in USA isn't he.

On 22/04/2021 at 00:34, big dosser said:

 

what i cant understand is that squad was quality against boro and swansea and since then have down tools

Agreed-  perhaps "job done" kicked in to some extent (in the players mind), especially post Birmingham when we were approaching 50 pts. When sliding towards midtable with a load out of contract it can happen- it certainly shouldn't though! Yet some of those returned also got injured again which is infuriating- that didn't help. Moves lined up, leaving- out of contract I mean. I'd like to see most of those 13 gone.

See also Blackburn and Stoke...arguably Preston as well to an extent but certainly the first two meandering towards May in recent months.

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1 hour ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Catching up with bits of that thread...

We won't be getting Shakespeare, fairly sure- he's got an Aston Villa (though I question FFP compliance) on the up, read somewhere he's fan of theirs too- non-starter.

Walsh? More realistic- in USA isn't he.

Agreed-  perhaps "job done" kicked in to some extent (in the players mind), especially post Birmingham when we were approaching 50 pts. When sliding towards midtable with a load out of contract it can happen- it certainly shouldn't though! Yet some of those returned also got injured again which is infuriating- that didn't help. Moves lined up, leaving- out of contract I mean. I'd like to see most of those 13 gone.

See also Blackburn and Stoke...arguably Preston as well to an extent but certainly the first two meandering towards May in recent months.

Steve Walsh Still has a home in Lancashire recently had his medals stolen.. Getting Walsh in as a DOF would fit perfectly at city now Ashton is going that just leaves someone to step into Operations etc.https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/leicester-city-favourite-appeals-information-5324675

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On 21/04/2021 at 21:05, Berkshire Red said:

Can someone tell me why the desperation for Pearsons contract to be extended. Its all well and good to blame the players and their lack of effort but he is the manager and it's his responsibility to motivate them. 

I personally think we would be better off had we stuck with Holden and criticising the players is all well and good, but given the current climate he may have to work with a lot next season and seems to have no consideration for this fact?

Should we be extending the contract of a manager who's picked up 9 points in 11 games? Arguably we didn't deserve to pick up points against Swansea and have looked poor the last 5 or 6 games 

I'm guessing a three year contract with the possibility of extending to a fourth, and Lansbury as Team Captain wouldn't float your boat then Berkshire?😬

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We are suffering the consequences of MA's legacy of buying players to generate profit rather than to build a team.  It's a view I have had for quite some time but we won't achieve success on the pitch until we restructure off it. 

We need a long-term DoF with a philosophy that is instilled at all levels.  He needs to be the guardian of this and have the final say on player recruitment and sales. 

NP's difficulties and the poor football we are witnessing merely reflect this so I for one was not expecting miracles (even though I hoped for one).

The real ray of hope is SL sees this as something fundmental and addresses it structurally.  We have the perfect opportunity with MA going.   

Even if this happens it will take 2 or 3 years for us to become really competitive, so I am adjusting my expectations accordingly and just enjoying the glimpses we get of the future in the performances of younger players still developing.  

Edited by Red Skin
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I wonder how it would go down if one or two players were just released. Would that galvanise the rest for the next few games, would they just think "why couldn't that be me, paid to stay home". Would it hurt their career as? Or do clubs not care about such things ?

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Unfortunately, off the top of my head, Walsh (again), Watkins (again), O'Dowda (again), Simpson, Bell and Moore have all been new injuries since Nige took over. Baker, seemingly near full fitness and playing for the u.23's many weeks ago has just disappeared.

Under present circumstances I imagine 5 or 6 of those would be in his team tomorrow, if not necessarily 1st choices with less injuries all told.

So by necessity we're down to bare bones - probably 3rd choices - in many positions and as much as he might like to NP has next to no leeway to 'release players', side line them to the reserves, or even make many changes without risking a real hammering.

Even so, if it was me I'd bung Britton and Scott in tomorrow.

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On 22/04/2021 at 22:34, Whale Eye Beef Hooked said:

I’ve never been a Pearson fan but I believed he was what we needed.   However, when a new manager comes into a club in our situation the first thing must be to install the basics and I don’t care that it isn’t his players    If you watch the Wycombe equaliser and pause it at the build up stage,  at least 6 or 7 of the players are in pointless positions. That is basics that should be drilled into the players from day 1.  It is very worrying that after 9 or 10 games they are still not doing it.  Hopefully Barnsley will not go up and we can get ismael, he has been a tactical genius with an average team 

I can’t see why SL would take the risk with NP.  If you had a car on demo and it performed badly , you wouldn’t purchase it even if the make had a good reputation 

You’d need to stretch this analogy so that taking the car on loan somehow contributed to it not working as well as if you owned it. 

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Just think a lot boils down to the players, they either don’t want to be here, or perhaps don’t like they way Pearson going about doing things, and don’t want him here as manager, hence the half hearted performances.

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