City release accounts - Ouch!

[Loosey Boy]

I’m surprised that we’ve announced these now - part of the reason must be to manage supporters expectations re . Jan Transfer Window?!

We have shown our hand now but one thing is for sure, others clubs will now know that we will be desperate to offload some players which won’t help our cause when it comes to negotiating any fees.

Can see one of TK, HNM or Bents being sold on Jan

Edited December 28, 2021 by Loosey Boy

[Mr Hankey]

Struggling to get my head around the comments of “glad we have Lansdown”, “shows how lucky we are to have him”……is that really the takeaway from this, or am i living in a parody world? These losses have come under his watch & long term ownership, regardless of the covid situation, we would still be making monumentous losses

[Mr Popodopolous]

One thing that is worth watching, there are a few clubs who seem to be in a similar or worse position than us as their starting point coming into 2021/22.

I know this is strictly about us, but Middlesbrough and Nottingham Forest within a similar range, Stoke despite Parachute Payments and their Impairment appear to be in a worse position, Blackburn remains to be seen but I wonder about EFL intervention in terms of the first 3 especially.

[Bristol Rob]

Why/how are our operating costs so high?

Is it purely down to player wages, or something else.

Seems like a lot of clubs (Cardiff being one) who have random players on monster monster sums of money, but still seem to have a better grip on things.

[Kodjias Wrist]

Do clubs get an allowance due to COVID? Or do they work out an approximate figure if what are income would have been to offset the losses? 

 

[maxjak]

3 hours ago, steviestevieneville said:

You don’t know where we’d be without them. How do you know we wouldn’t be better off. The tripling of the wage bill is his fault . Lack of a recruitment plan & letting Ashton ride roughshod for years. Obviously covid has had a big impact but if he’d had a sustainable recruitment/football plan in place we’d be in a better place. 

OK.....So withdraw £200 mill from our current position........we are now.playing in a decrepid stadium with no state of the art training ground to attract players and are probably languishing in Division 1....great plan?

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Why/how are our operating costs so high?

Is it purely down to player wages, or something else.

Seems like a lot of clubs (Cardiff being one) who have random players on monster monster sums of money, but still seem to have a better grip on things.

That is something I’ve been bleating on about too. Our “operational costs” are high too, in 19/20 pure football club accounts, they were £11m for a £16m revenue company!!  Way too high, and not very transparent too!

 

[AshtonGreat]

3 minutes ago, maxjak said:

OK.....So withdraw £200 mill from our current position........we are now.playing in a decrepid stadium with no state of the art training ground to attract players and are probably languishing in Division 1....great plan?

State of the art training ground? Fat lot of good that's doing us

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, maxjak said:

OK.....So withdraw £200 mill from our current position........we are now.playing in a decrepid stadium with no state of the art training ground to attract players and are probably languishing in Division 1....great plan?

That’s one view.  Here’s another  

Under different ownership, who knows we might’ve got it right on the pitch first, then worried about the infrastructure with our PL money.

 

[Bristol Rob]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That is something I’ve been bleating on about too. Our “operational costs” are high too, in 19/20 pure football club accounts, they were £11m for a £16m revenue company!!  Way too high, and not very transparent too!

 

Any thought as to were this 200k a week is being spent?

[maxjak]

4 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That’s one view.  Here’s another  

Under different ownership, who knows we might’ve got it right on the pitch first, then worried about the infrastructure with our PL money.

 

i haven't seen a queue to invest so far?  In fact i have never seen a queue to invest?   Only one man has taken the time, trouble and money as far as i can see?  But i guess we could have just waited for someone to eventually come along?

Edited December 28, 2021 by maxjak

[frenchred]

7 minutes ago, maxjak said:

OK.....So withdraw £200 mill from our current position........we are now.playing in a decrepid stadium with no state of the art training ground to attract players and are probably languishing in Division 1....great plan?

With our lavish RENTED stadium and our state of the art RENTED training ground we still can't attract players! Great plan!

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That’s one view.  Here’s another  

Under different ownership, who knows we might’ve got it right on the pitch first, then worried about the infrastructure with our PL money.

 

Who’s knows?  Maybe we would have thrown money after it in an even bigger way and still failed.  Everyone is wise in hindsight. Lansdown has got it right off the field and made one huge recent error in putting so much faith in Ashton. Anyone who wants Lansdown out is assuming that the perfect owner takes over.  That’s unlikely.  Lansdown isn’t perfect but show me someone who is. 

[And Its Smith]

3 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Any thought as to were this 200k a week is being spent?

Can’t see anyone knowing the answer to that. It will be guesswork only. The club don’t have to be transparent on this and I don’t know why they would be 

[maxjak]

1 minute ago, frenchred said:

With our lavish RENTED stadium and our state of the art RENTED training ground we still can't attract players! Great plan!

If you take that stance,  then just about every stadium and ground in the country is rented? Very simplistic IMHO

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

9 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

That is something I’ve been bleating on about too. Our “operational costs” are high too, in 19/20 pure football club accounts, they were £11m for a £16m revenue company!!  Way too high, and not very transparent too!

 

Those operating costs have got to be the rental of the grounds and loan repayments. SL can't write off the loans under FFP like he used to do so I assume they get packaged up under the banner of Operational Costs. 

[steviestevieneville]

12 minutes ago, maxjak said:

OK.....So withdraw £200 mill from our current position........we are now.playing in a decrepid stadium with no state of the art training ground to attract players and are probably languishing in Division 1....great plan?

Always the negative outlook . Who’s to say someone with less or similar  money but a actual sound football plan came in instead. You’re obviously just looking at it as if nobody would of took over the club of course they would of. If SL knew the slightest thing about football as a sport he wouldn’t have wasted so much money. 

[sh1t_ref_again]

1 minute ago, Lorenzos Only Goal said:

Those operating costs have got to be the rental of the grounds and loan repayments. SL can't write off the loans under FFP like he used to do so I assume they get packaged up under the banner of Operational Costs. 

Assume = don't know, stab in the dark, could be anything 

[maxjak]

4 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Who’s knows?  Maybe we would have thrown money after it in an even bigger way and still failed.  Everyone is wise in hindsight. Lansdown has got it right off the field and made one huge recent error in putting so much faith in Ashton. Anyone who wants Lansdown out is assuming that the perfect owner takes over.  That’s unlikely.  Lansdown isn’t perfect but show me someone who is. 

Yeah.......ooh! let;s get a nice foreign owner...that would cause no problems?  People are completely unrealistic, be very careful what u wish For?  LJ's dismissal has also  worked out so very well?

[maxjak]

1 minute ago, steviestevieneville said:

Always the negative outlook . Who’s to say someone with less or similar  money but a actual sound football plan came in instead. You’re obviously just looking at it as if nobody would of took over the club of course they would of. If SL knew the slightest thing about football as a sport he wouldn’t have wasted so much money. 

So who is this dark stranger riding into town to save the day?   Do tell?

[Numero Uno]

Just now, maxjak said:

Yeah.......ooh! let;s get a nice foreign owner...that would cause no problems?  People are completely unrealistic, be very careful what u wish For?  LJ's dismissal has also  worked out so very well?

To think we wouldn’t have ended up in the same position we are now had we kept LJ would be completely and utterly mental. How can you write such trash on a thread discussing a £38m operating loss?

[maxjak]

Just now, Numero Uno said:

To think we wouldn’t have ended up in the same position we are now had we kept LJ would be completely and utterly mental. How can you write such trash on a thread discussing a £38m operating loss?

Quite easily thanks.........LJ is a far better coach than Nige...........the problem was Mark Ashton not LJ?   But you are far wiser than me ?

[Port Said Red]

3 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Ouch. Otoh broadly in line with my expectations/fears.

Not read anything but the main article yet, certainly not read them in full.

@billywedlock mentioned something about future trading talks with the EFL. That sounds about right, we're in that zone clearly between upper and lower loss limits- future trading talks etc are whereby club and EFL talk, club submit what they forecast to be their Projected Accounts and FFP losses for the following couple of seasons. ie 2021/22 and 2022/23. Quite a few clubs will probably be in such talks with the EFL, the basic objective is that 3 year FFP losses are kept to no more than £39m at any given time.

Covered by Future Financial Information regs that I've mentioned on occasion.

I digress, FFP wise:

1) I think we're fine to 2020/21.

2) To 2021/22 as well.

3) As for the losses in 2019/20 and 2020/21, these are added together and halved.

4) A very quick scan of the press release suggests £14m in losses attributable to Covid? You can knock that off the losses.

5) I believe our typical FFP costs to be £4-5m per season. Obviously subtract those from the headline losses.

As for when we can spend with relative freedom again at this level? Barring big sales or benefitting from major sell on clauses, it would be IMO 2023/24.

Your mates at WRDC think this is your comeuppance

https://dcfcfans.uk/topic/38870-bristol-city-next-to-fail-p-and-s/

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

4 minutes ago, sh1t_ref_again said:

Assume = don't know, stab in the dark, could be anything 

Thanks for the definition, always thought assumptions were things you knew. 

[Numero Uno]

Just now, maxjak said:

Quite easily thanks.........LJ is a far better coach than Nige...........the problem was Mark Ashton not LJ?   But you are far wiser than me ?

Not far wiser but far less naive.

[maxjak]

Just now, Numero Uno said:

Not far wiser but far less naive.

And misguided?

[steviestevieneville]

3 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Yeah.......ooh! let;s get a nice foreign owner...that would cause no problems?  People are completely unrealistic, be very careful what u wish For?  LJ's dismissal has also  worked out so very well?

Who mentioned a foreign owner ? Too many like you acting like lansdowns shit don’t stink . Take away covid & the losses are still staggering . Who’s fault is that. You keep your head in the sand 

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, maxjak said:

And misguided?

Yeah, you are definitely misguided to think only one person and one person only contributed to the current shit show, as misguided as you can get.

[maxjak]

Just now, steviestevieneville said:

Who mentioned a foreign owner ? Too many like you acting like lansdowns shit don’t stink . Take away covid & the losses are still staggering . Who’s fault is that. You keep your head in the sand 

How many clubs when for sale have been bought by foreign owners..........do your research.  The only owners who will be able to afford City are 99% certain to be foreign,,and then it becomes another completely different  can of worms?

1 minute ago, Numero Uno said:

Yeah, you are definitely misguided to think only one person and one person only contributed to the current shit show, as misguided as you can get.

And that is?

[Fordy62]

6 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Quite easily thanks.........LJ is a far better coach than Nige...........the problem was Mark Ashton not LJ?   But you are far wiser than me ?

Jesus wept. 

6 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Quite easily thanks.........LJ is a far better coach than Nige...........the problem was Mark Ashton not LJ?   But you are far wiser than me ?

Jesus wept.