Danny Wilson Era

[BCFC_Dan]

Only Freezer out of the first list could've been anything more than L1-standard. Was overlooked quite a lot, and never had an utterly horrible game like some players here have over the last 2 seasons. Aside from the playoff final I went to the Newport County friendly the following August and my welsh mate at the game said something akin to "Who is he, and how dare he skin 4 of our players?".

Most of his games were pretty terrible!

I once saw him pick up the ball on the halfway line and start running with it. He literally ran in a dead straight line until he hit the Atyeo stand. Getting to the byline is normally a good thing in a winger, but running on past it isn't so useful!

Wilson's teams had good and bad points. On good days they could be very entertaining and on bad days they were worse than useless. I think the major difference is that Gary Johnson's teams are a lot better on their bad days. Also Wilson was in his 3rd season before the team even began to look like promotion contenders right to the end of the season. Johnson took us up in his first full season and nearly took us up again.

Basically there's no comparison. Johnson is a far, far better manager and I'm sure he will produce the flowing football we all want to see in time.

[Lack of Action Man]

It was thanks to one player - Brian Tinnion.

To me, that team had its day and were never ever going anywhere - it was a blessing in disguise that we did not go up. My memories include:

Philips - a ####

Coles - Found out

Butler - Older than my great nan

Woodman - enough said

Doherty - Great player, but lasted 10 minutes less than Noble, and thats not a lot

Goodfellow - wow.

Mickey Bell - Left wing? and older than my great great nan

Rougier - right wing and older enough to know better

...And then there was the whole Peacock love in and Miller.

I enjoyed those days, don't get me wrong - the Roberts goal againts H'Pool will live with me forever, but no thanks to the swap...

Tbh the choice of players especially the defence left a lot to be desired but would rather have Goodfellow than Mcindoe based on Mcindoe's current form and would rather have Mickey Bell or Matt Hill than Jaime McAllister tbf. Our midfield desperately needs someone like Tommy but someone who can endure a full game.

Danny Wilson did get us playing the better football but we too often scraped 1-0 victories getting a scrappy goal early on and then defending for 85 minutes having to rely on Phillips flapping away at crosses. At least now we do attack and defend in a sort of balance but have cr*p service from midfield.

[Chappers]

Personally, I enjoyed the Wilson era, it was not successful, but we played some great football, and it was good seeing the Academy players progress. In his penultimate season, we were unlucky having to play Cardiff in the play-offs, who had invested heavily, and in Kavanagh and Thorne had 2 top quality players. The last season was rubbish though, Wilson just kept saying 'The Wigan way', overlooking that we had quality attackers, and could have killed off many games that we eventually drew, and the Brighton game will always be the worst £100 I have ever spent going to football. As for Peacock being undroppable......

The GJ era started poor, improved somewhat, with last year being particularly memorable, and now looks like reality is kicking in, and the side will need to be rebuilt over the next couple of years. OK, we are not too stylish, but lets not get carried away, our first aim should be to survive.

My favourite times were the Cooper years, no big spending, heaps of goals, always entertaining, rubbish defence, and we had Alan Walsh. Worst were undoubtedly the Houghton days, watching paint dry was more fun! The Pulis era was not too far behind, but thankfully Portsmouth rescued us before he wasted any more money on aging crocks!

It's disappointing to see so many people knocking ex-City players, even Phillips (Hardly a favourite these days) who may not have always been sure with crosses, but was an excellent shot stopper, and Burnell, who had his moments (Personally I thought he was a good defender but an ordinary midfielder). Bring back Forbes Phillipson-Masters!

[Nibor]

Wilson did a good job the first two or three seasons, clearing out all of Tiny Penis' injury prone aging crocks and getting us playing decent football. He failed to strike the right balance between defending properly and scoring goals in the final season and really looked to have taken us as far as he could. His team lacked professionalism and couldn't hold their nerve under pressure, every time we got close we'd lose a game we should have won.

[bh_red]

It's pretty unfair using Danny Wilson's best possible 11 (an 11 that rarely played together!) as a comparison. Burnell and Doherty featured heavily in the middle together and Murray only re-signed on deadline day (and was very average for the rest of that season, and not exactly in his prime). Wilkshire was also a regular throughout the season on the right of midfield.

From Gary Johnson's side you've excluded Noble and Skuse, while Keogh (the young player of the year) and others also featured regularly. Personally, I'd prefer a central pairing of any 2 from Johnson/Russell/Skuse/Noble to Burnell and Doherty.

I don't know, I thought using (what I felt) was our 2 strongest 11's was fair? Burnell was a bit part player, much like Keogh and Noble in that they only started around 20 games, so I thought it was fair to leave them out, though your right it was possibly fairer that Wilkshire should have been in over Murray and Skuse over Russell.

Doesn't that show exactly why GJ is the better manager. Getting the best out of worse players?

I think personally though, only the strikers and right winger were better under Wilson. Aaron Brown...pfft only if it was the 1 in 20 games he was any good. Would rather have Betsy or Wilson.LJ and Tinnion are similar but IMO LJ is better. Russell was and still is, and always will be better than what Tommy came back as.

Agree, GJ has proved to be probably the better manager for us, in that he actually got us promoted, but at that point of promotion's, I don't think there was much in the way of a difference, apart from the obvious of Gary being stronger in being able to control the dressing room, whereas Wilson seemed to let the players do what they wanted as long as they performed on the pitch. Both methods work in different way for different managers, however Wilson let them have too much of a loose run which got out of control......that was the vital component.

finally you reckon LJ is a better player than Tinnion??? :noexpression: wow.....

[bh_red]

Burnell, who had his moments (Personally I thought he was a good defender but an ordinary midfielder)

TOTALLY AGREE with that, when he first made his debut he was a FANTASTIC RIGHT BACK, why he got moved to midfield and then not moved back I'll never know, I don't understand why he wasn't played in his best position? considering the right back's we have had over recent season, I'd pick him over the majority of them, maybe not Orr. But certainly the likes of Lavin and Jamie Smith

[bh_red]

Some your posts do make me laugh!!!

Where is the fairness in comparing Danny Wilsons side that was in its 4th full season compared to GJ 1st full season??

That team took 4 years to build and still could not get promoted, GJ did it in the first attempt.

What particularly makes me laugh is saying wilsons team would have shaved it? His team would have got torn apart - any team that could'nt get promoted with Tinnion and Murray in their prime, has something wrong with it!!

I can see you point, however my posting wasn't about how long it took the teams to build, it was a counter to someone trying to compare Wilson's best team to our current team now and stating.......Johnson's was much better?.....of course it was.

The fact that Gary did it in one full season is definately too his credit, though although he did have his problems who know's how Gary would have coped with the likes of Mercer, Holland, Beadle and Jones on the books earning big money with long term contracts and very little fitness.

which team would have won, who Wilson's team would have won probably depending on the weather, nice sunny day win 4-0, bit of drizzle lose 3-2, Gary's team wouldn't batter anyone, very much a 1-0 then hang on for dear life.

as for Tinnion and Murray point very fair.....but I suppose with Tony Butler and flapper at the back your always going to have problems.

[samo]

I can see you point, however my posting wasn't about how long it took the teams to build, it was a counter to someone trying to compare Wilson's best team to our current team now and stating.......Johnson's was much better?.....of course it was.

The fact that Gary did it in one full season is definately too his credit, though although he did have his problems who know's how Gary would have coped with the likes of Mercer, Holland, Beadle and Jones on the books earning big money with long term contracts and very little fitness.

which team would have won, who Wilson's team would have won probably depending on the weather, nice sunny day win 4-0, bit of drizzle lose 3-2, Gary's team wouldn't batter anyone, very much a 1-0 then hang on for dear life.

as for Tinnion and Murray point very fair.....but I suppose with Tony Butler and flapper at the back your always going to have problems.

On a bit of a side note bh_red; do you think that if City (fans, board, everyone) gave Wilson money and three years to build a side to try and get us out of division two/league one then considering the fact GJ managed this feat a lot quicker and arguably cheaper, then we should give him similar time in this division to do the same?

I'm not having a pop at yourself or suggesting you are doing anything else other than fairly arguing valid points, but a certain element on here seem to think that after a season and a half at this level we've seen all that Gary Johnson has to offer at Championship-level.

Is it not logical to support the current gaffer for a similar amount of time and hope he can develop the team into stronger promotion contenders, like Wilson was able to do, despite early disappointment and failure?

[Nibor]

On a bit of a side note bh_red; do you think that if City (fans, board, everyone) gave Wilson money and three years to build a side to try and get us out of division two/league one then considering the fact GJ managed this feat a lot quicker and arguably cheaper, then we should give him similar time in this division to do the same?

I'm not having a pop at yourself or suggesting you are doing anything else other than fairly arguing valid points, but a certain element on here seem to think that after a season and a half at this level we've seen all that Gary Johnson has to offer at Championship-level.

Is it not logical to support the current gaffer for a similar amount of time and hope he can develop the team into stronger promotion contenders, like Wilson was able to do, despite early disappointment and failure?

The thing about Wilson was that the team improved every season under his guidance. It just failed at the final hurdle.

GJ's success last season sort of made a rod for his own back because it was always going to be very tough to improve on. I do think however that we seem to have taken too much of a step back this year in the quality of our play as much as the results.

[samo]

[Nibor]

Fair play, although I'd suggest that Wilson's teams didn't so much get better after 2003 (if they had he'd have won promotion that last year) as played at a consistently high level for that division. As they should have; we had one of the best squads and most expensive squads, unlike now in this division.

Personally I think we were lucky and fearless in equal measure at times last year and this year have simply suffered from a bit of stage fright and not been able to recreate than. It’s not worthy of a root-and-branch change at the club, just that old chestnut patience.

Expectation, not just from fans but the players and likely management too, has slowed us down this season and it’s almost a good thing the reality check has hit home already.

Right now, with 21 games gone and more than half the season to go, we sit 9 points off relegation and 7 from the playoffs. That's nothing to be scared of, but also nothing to be proud of, IF promotion is our aim.

I'm getting somewhat sick of the drip, drip, drip that is leading towards an inevitable "GJ OUT" call from someone very soon. We should be careful about what a few on here already are obviously wishing for; i.e. the end of the current management team (I notice another thread has started on Millen...).

All this about the Wilson Years should be accompanied with a bit of "Where is he now...". He got MK Dons relegated (twice technically, as only a points deduction for Wrexham stopped them heading to league two first time round) and then brought Hartlepool back up to league one after one season in league two, where they have remained midtable and stable ever since. I’d not say we’ve missed out on a rising star.

His teams had the potential to be explosive but lacked the bottle to close out games or win the crucial clashes (by which I mean the 'boring' midweek fixtures against unflashy teams, not the big names; his teams loved them) and that is why Wilson failed at any club with real, solid ambition.

I certainly agree with that. I'd add that Wilson's failure to really improve in that final season was what lost him the job, so it was recognised.

I think there's more to our mediocre season this time around though than just luck and confidence though I agree those play a large part.

We've made a change in our regular system, to two strikers, after the purchase of Maynard, yet we've not adjusted the style of play to fit. We're still humping balls at Adebola and hoping for the best and we're changing selections reactively without ever getting our two best ball players in the same starting XI.

I'm not one who started the season expecting promotion (hoping for playoffs perhaps) but I'm still disappointed by how badly our home form has dipped.

[samo]

I certainly agree with that. I'd add that Wilson's failure to really improve in that final season was what lost him the job, so it was recognised.

I think there's more to our mediocre season this time around though than just luck and confidence though I agree those play a large part.

We've made a change in our regular system, to two strikers, after the purchase of Maynard, yet we've not adjusted the style of play to fit. We're still humping balls at Adebola and hoping for the best and we're changing selections reactively without ever getting our two best ball players in the same starting XI.

I'm not one who started the season expecting promotion (hoping for playoffs perhaps) but I'm still disappointed by how badly our home form has dipped.

Yep, again you're not wrong.

We are struggling to adapt, but at least GJ seems to be looking to buy players to work on that and possbily will do so further in january/summer.

Maybe he hoped last year's heroes could do it and gave them the time to prove that, but I'd suggest they've by-and-large failed, and that will mean a wholesale adjustment in personnel.

The style of play relys on those who can play it and I just think that we've not got enough who can.

I don't think Trundle and Noble, for all their skill and invention, have enough dynamisum to make an impact at this level, but then I'm turning to the belief that that can be said about 75% of our squad (including LJ before someone jumps on me).

We do need change, but not in the manager's office.

[bh_red]

To be honest, Nibor has pretty much summed up what I would have said. Wilson got time from the fans because you could see things were gradually improving over the time, especially when alot of the players coming through were young local lads, each year there was progress.

To be honest for me I look back at the Wilson years very fondly as it was some great football, however the turning point losing in the play-off semi to Cardiff, Murray went and we weren't the same and we just couldn't adapt.

As Nibor said, The Last Season were soo good that unfortunately Gary set himself to high a standard, despite the renewed mention post Hull and Pre-Season that we would be pushing for the top 2 again, I think most knew with the teams coming down that it would be a harder season, however most hoped that we would be around the play-offs/top 8 for most of the season.

Unfortunately though that hasn't been the case to date, all the talk early season was about "no second season sydrome" unfortunately after the first 3 games or so, all the talk was.....there is no second season here, which almost overnight sealed the "second season sydrome" effect kicking in.

I personally don't believe when we had started the season that 12-15th position in december would be too bad, however I just expected it to be down to natural inconsistency. Instead it's been the a case where our away form has carried on in parts from last season and our home form has been to be blunt. Crap.

This is where the issue starts for, Majority only see home games so can only base their view on what we have seen at the gate, whether that be right or wrong,

People asking for Johnson out is just stupid talk and nothing more. However alot of people are growing more and more worried about some of his tactics, selections and comments?

January honestly can't come quick enough for everyone. I just hope he makes the players changes that are so desperately needed.

[William Stand]

Has GJ always been like this though - I seem to remember his Yeovil teams looking quite exciting on local TV.

Lee Johnson, for instance, seemed to play as an attacking midfielder, with a hell of a shot on him as well.

When GJ came I certainly expected the emphasis to be on attacking football and to see plenty of goals at the Gate.

I find this really interesting. Yeovil were widely recognised as one of the best footballing teams in the lower leagues & they seemed to get by on a "we'll score more than you" approach. On his appointment I recall people posting here that Johnson may be tatically niave & we may concede too many goals to get promoted!

Whether it was by luck or design I think we've become a side better defensively than offensive but to suggest that playing attacking football is out of Johnsons comfort zone is wrong I think.