Rich Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Is anyone else concerned about the spine of the team? We have an unknown quantity to us of a goalkeeper that was recently relegated from this division. An ageing captain at centre half with a few injury problems. No target man / centre forward to speak of. Your thoughts please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Alternatively: We have a goalkeeper who is proven at this level, with 2 seasons of experience. We have a young and improving pair of centre backs, both of whom have several seasons under their belts at this level. We have potentially two of the best midfielders in the division in Elliot and Hartley. We have three exciting, young forwards who can attack with guile and pace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westonred Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Alternatively: We have a goalkeeper who is proven at this level, with 2 seasons of experience. We have a young and improving pair of centre backs, both of whom have several seasons under their belts at this level. We have potentially two of the best midfielders in the division in Elliot and Hartley. We have three exciting, young forwards who can attack with guile and pace. I'm with you on this one Dan i feel we are stonger than last season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Alternatively: We have a goalkeeper who is proven at this level, with 2 seasons of experience. We have a young and improving pair of centre backs, both of whom have several seasons under their belts at this level. We have potentially two of the best midfielders in the division in Elliot and Hartley. We have three exciting, young forwards who can attack with guile and pace. Dan the keeper suffered relegation in his second year and is not really proven other than getting relegated. I grant you Fontaine is good but the Derby lad is unknown and unwanted by them at this level. Midfield I don't have much concern about. We could do with a bit of strength up front in my opinion. I like your positive outlook though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssexRobin Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 I'm with you on this one Dan i feel we are stonger than last season At running the risk of being caned down for my "happy clappy" optimism, I too think the squad is in a better place now than last season. We needed some new blood and to shed some dead wood - Onwards and upwards. C'mon you reds!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Dan the keeper suffered relegation in his second year and is not really proven other than getting relegated. I grant you Fontaine is good but the Derby lad is unknown and unwanted by them at this level. Midfield I don't have much concern about. We could do with a bit of strength up front in my opinion. I like your positive outlook though. Colchester were relegated because they were forced to sell their best outfield players. If we'd sold the likes of Elliot, McIndoe, Fontaine etc. after our first season rather than investing further we might well have suffered the same and it would be no reflection on Basso. Nyatanga is a full Welsh international with Championship and Premier League experience. If Nigel Clough preferred to accept City's money than keep him then that's his lookout but it doesn't mean he was "unwanted" or isn't good enough. I'd like a Brooker-style centre forward who is strong and can hold the ball up, so I do agree with you there. I can still see this season going all kinds of wrong. I'm not some kind of mad optimist expecting promotion now, but I do think the squad looks stronger on paper and that the signings have been good ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiderHider Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Maybe a left winger as competition for McIndoe and another striker. Dont mind about a left winger really, its not essential. Need another striker though, unless Akindie, Plumber and Jackson are ready. Spine is good, we have made some quality signings so far, i'm very happy how we are progressing, but lets not get too carried away, this season is gonna be tough and we're gonna have to fight like dogs for top 6 or auto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garlicbread Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Maybe a left winger as competition for McIndoe and another striker. Dont mind about a left winger really, its not essential. Need another striker though, unless Akindie, Plumber and Jackson are ready. Spine is good, we have made some quality signings so far, i'm very happy how we are progressing, but lets not get too carried away, this season is gonna be tough and we're gonna have to fight like dogs for top 6 or auto. That wont happen, johnson said he has cover on the left...i wouldnt be suprised to see blackman push for left wing place. Agree that we need a big ballholderupper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Casual Connoisseur Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Colchester were relegated because they were forced to sell their best outfield players. If we'd sold the likes of Elliot, McIndoe, Fontaine etc. after our first season rather than investing further we might well have suffered the same and it would be no reflection on Basso. Nyatanga is a full Welsh international with Championship and Premier League experience. If Nigel Clough preferred to accept City's money than keep him then that's his lookout but it doesn't mean he was "unwanted" or isn't good enough. I'd like a Brooker-style centre forward who is strong and can hold the ball up, so I do agree with you there. I can still see this season going all kinds of wrong. I'm not some kind of mad optimist expecting promotion now, but I do think the squad looks stronger on paper and that the signings have been good ones. Rhys Weston, is a full welsh international, ever seen him play, shocking. Have seen Nyantanga play twice for Wales at the Millenium and he has been shocking, doesn't mean he wont get better however, I don't think he is that great and is prone to lapses of concentation, at this level that means goals. I wish the lad all the best and hope he succeeds in a City shirt, playing in and around a player like Louis will do him no harm, I think at the moment he is nothing more than decent back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Colchester were relegated because they were forced to sell their best outfield players. If we'd sold the likes of Elliot, McIndoe, Fontaine etc. after our first season rather than investing further we might well have suffered the same and it would be no reflection on Basso. Nyatanga is a full Welsh international with Championship and Premier League experience. If Nigel Clough preferred to accept City's money than keep him then that's his lookout but it doesn't mean he was "unwanted" or isn't good enough. I'd like a Brooker-style centre forward who is strong and can hold the ball up, so I do agree with you there. I can still see this season going all kinds of wrong. I'm not some kind of mad optimist expecting promotion now, but I do think the squad looks stronger on paper and that the signings have been good ones. The way I see it is we're still a bit short up front and GJ seems to be building for next season with louis tiding us over untill Fontaine can impose himself and take responsibility, which is my only concern about him. I don't know too much about the keeper but I know it's better to have members of your team that have been succesful. You get to this point with the season about to start and these thoughts and fears appear, in my case I haven't seen them play yet and I'll miss the first two home games so I'm gutted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 I too agree with Dan that we are shaping up for this season as good and if not better than last. When you look at the likes of Blackman, Gerken and Nyatayanga I personally believe that they all have the potential to improve even further at this level with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
internetjef Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Goalie - light concerns but we still have decent options Defence - no concerns, fontaine and carey are class, mcombe does a job in certain situations and Nyatanga is also decent enough with more to come. If we sign another experienced CB the likes of nyatanga and j.wilson will never get a chance. Midfield - central midfield is awesome Striker - would liek to have a brooker-esque target man, but after seeing what we produced against wolves the other day without one i wouldnt mind watching that style of footie all season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Dan the keeper suffered relegation in his second year and is not really proven other than getting relegated. Are you for real? Just because he was at a team who got relegated? so ******* what Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliftonCliff Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Some interesting comments here. It's always difficult to foresee how a season will turn out. Arguably this year it's harder than usual, given the number of young players likely to be involved. Here, for what it's worth, is a different perspective for anyone who may be interested to consider. The references to "potential" tend to trouble me slightly. Some people are setting a lot of store by this and have based a lot of their optimism on it. As a fan, I am also excited by young talent and have high hopes, but I have also learned to be cautious about getting carried away. This comes not only from many years of watching football but also from experience in other areas of human performance. Prior to my retirement, as part of my professional duties I was often asked by my medical colleagues to assess a patient's potential. (This was usually in the course of discussing future intellectual development, but the argument applies equally in other fields, I believe). I used to find myself having to explain politely to people who should have been bright enough to work it out for themselves that the word "potential", when used in this context, by definition referred to something that had not yet come into existence. You can see where this is heading. If it hasn't yet come into being, how the bloody hell do you expect me to measure it? (I didn't put it like that at the time). I can only measure somebody's current level of functioning, because we can observe that directly. (This goes a long way to telling you why a high proportion of youngsters thought to be very promising don't subsequently make it and why even very experienced coaches and managers can't always tell who will and who won't. In my former line of work we also had a sort of mantra that we used to trot out fairly regularly, which was that "the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour". This may sound blindingly obvious, but you would be surprised how often it's overlooked, often in the name of 'positive thinking'. The implication for football is the same as for anything else (say, criminality for instance). If there is only a limited amount of past 'form' to go on, the accuracy of your prediction is similarly limited. The more conservative forum members have pointed out that some of our new signings still have quite a lot to prove at this level. They have a point and are not necessarily being negative. With players who have been there and done it, you have a better idea of what you are likely to be getting. This is absolutely not an argument against youth, or a criticism of the club's current transfer policy. (In fact, I have argued elsewhere for our academy graduates to be given more chances at first team level: there is room for both young and experienced players and some sort of balance is desirable). However, I would caution against expecting too much of the likes of Haynes, Blackman and even Nyatanga. This is why I think the most crucial signing is that of Hartley. Tinnion was perhaps the last wise old head who could stand in the middle of a group of younger lads and pull the strings. If Hartley can do this, and provide some leadership and authority, the results could be very interesting to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 I agree with you, but that's exactly why I did use the word "potential". If I thought all would automatically be great and there was no chance of failure I would have no cause to use it. It was precisely for the reasons you outline that I did choose to use it. Nothing has been proven yet, but the direction in which the team has developed over the off-season is a promising one. I think it's interesting, though, that you caution against expecting too much from Haynes and Nyatanga when both have at least as much Championship experience as most of the rest of the squad do. If anything Hartley and Clarkson are more of a risk having not played in the Championship before (though I suspect as an international with Champions League experience Hartley won't find it too taxing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliftonCliff Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 I agree with you, but that's exactly why I did use the word "potential". If I thought all would automatically be great and there was no chance of failure I would have no cause to use it. It was precisely for the reasons you outline that I did choose to use it. Nothing has been proven yet, but the direction in which the team has developed over the off-season is a promising one. I think it's interesting, though, that you caution against expecting too much from Haynes and Nyatanga when both have at least as much Championship experience as most of the rest of the squad do. If anything Hartley and Clarkson are more of a risk having not played in the Championship before (though I suspect as an international with Champions League experience Hartley won't find it too taxing). I think we're singing from the same hymn sheet here, Dan. As it happens, you weren't one of the people I was thinking of when I hinted that perhaps some were getting a little over-excited: everything I've read from you seems very balanced to me. And I take the point about Clarkson, whose name I didn't mention specifically but to whom my arguments could equally well apply, and about the number of games the other two have played. I suppose I was thinking more in terms of age. Let's hope we're both right about Hartley. I'm looking forward to seeing all the new guys when the real thing starts, but perhaps him more than any other. From other posts of yours, I get the impression we're of a similar mind regarding the season ahead: hopeful, but not taking anything for granted. (Which is also why I would tend to side with you over the debate about the benefits or otherwise of having the option of a 'physical presence' up front). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Percy Parrot Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 I think the spine of the team is its strength. Ok so we're not too sure what is going on with goalkeepers but Carey has been our most consistent player over the last few years, Fontaine could easily have been player of the season last time round. Marv is our star player and Hartley looks very good - as said elsewhere I think we probably have one of the best central midfield partnerships in the division. Up front I think Maynard did exceptionally well in the second half of last season and I think is one of our best players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Up front I think Maynard did exceptionally well in the second half of last season and I think is one of our best players. I wouldn't go that far YET, but he scores some superb goals. If he can now find the confidence (which hopefully will come with experience) to stick away a better percentage of his 'ordinary' chances then we will have one of the Championship's highest scorers in BCFC colours. I think there's every reason to believe he's capable of this improvement, and in a year or two we'll be fielding offers that will dwarf our outlay into the bargain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted July 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 ] Dan the keeper suffered relegation in his second year and is not really proven other than getting relegated. Are you for real? Just because he was at a team who got relegated? so ******* what Yes I ******* am, fill the team with people with a winning mentality that are used to winning. He may be avery competant keeper, I hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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