Who Shot JR? Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Watching the game today, for me, there was only one person out on the pitch inspiring his team mates, battling for every ball, scolding players for making mistakes - and that was Hartley. He was doing the captain's job. Whilst Hartley played/worked his proverbial sweaty socks off, Carey looked lacklustre and bewildered by the mistakes his fellow defenders were making (McAllister - what a shocker today!). Hartley, you are class - Carey, get your act together and steady the ship ie. do YOUR job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardy Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Absoluely - Hartley should be the skipper without doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Co sign. Hartley should be captain tomorrow. Carey needs to get back to what he's good at, leading central defence, at the moment he's not doing his job let alone leading the team. Give him a chance to re-focus and hand the role to Hartley who is leading the side in all other ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I BELIEVE Posted December 28, 2009 Report Share Posted December 28, 2009 Watching the game today, for me, there was only one person out on the pitch inspiring his team mates, battling for every ball, scolding players for making mistakes - and that was Hartley. He was doing the captain's job. Whilst Hartley played/worked his proverbial sweaty socks off, Carey looked lacklustre and bewildered by the mistakes his fellow defenders were making (McAllister - what a shocker today!). Hartley, you are class - Carey, get your act together and steady the ship ie. do YOUR job. Great post, I have been saying this for weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westred1 Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 I mentioned this today. Seemed to be the only player trying to inspire the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Hartley without a shadow of a doubt. Ive said it for a while but Carey is starting to look past it. As much as i think he has been a great servent to the club i think his time is coming to an end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I BELIEVE Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 The thing is that i think Johnson is not scared, but is worried about changes,,,,,,,, look at his team selecton he is sticking with the players who have served him well in the past,, i,e McAllister, Elliot, (formally McCombe), LJ etc...... it's time for a change, I'm not saying that we get rid of these players, no way, but it is time to mix it up a bit and that includes the captaincy,,,,, NOT THE MANAGER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim S Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Ive seen a few people saying Hartley could be manager material too. While I agree I think he could be a great manager (he reminds me very much of Keane) I think its way to early to be thinking about that. But if he is still here next season then I think he should be a great shout to be captain. You cant really change it halfway through the season, although if Carey is injured anytime soon then Id like to see Hartley deputise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmeronecow Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 i have to agree 100 per cent, i was at the game today too and i thought Hartley was magnificent, we would be in big trouble if it weren't for that guy, think he's real captain material... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Shot JR? Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Hartley without a shadow of a doubt. Ive said it for a while but Carey is starting to look past it. As much as i think he has been a great servent to the club i think his time is coming to an end. I think Carey still has a great deal to offer us. Perhaps he's content with sitting back and letting Hartley run the show. Maybe Hartley's arrival has upset the dynamics of the team and Carey is now feeling the pinch. Who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordie Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Going slightly off the captaincy subject but sticking up for Carey, to be fair to him ourcentral defenders have been getting changed week in week out so its hard to forge a decent partnership when you dont know who you are going to be playing with next game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I BELIEVE Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Going slightly off the captaincy subject but sticking up for Carey, to be fair to him ourcentral defenders have been getting changed week in week out so its hard to forge a decent partnership when you dont know who you are going to be playing with next game Yes your right it might affect form, but it shouldn't affect leadership,, you could say the same about Hartley and the midfield though and Hartley shows this incredible passoin, and regularly is in contact with the coaching staff during the game unlike Carey. Don't get me wrong Carey has been a brilliant servant to this club and I think he will sit at the heart of our defence for a few more seasons, but it's time to change for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordie Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Yes your right it might affect form, but it shouldn't affect leadership,, you could say the same about Hartley and the midfield though and Hartley shows this incredible passoin, and regularly is in contact with the coaching staff during the game unlike Carey. Don't get me wrong Carey has been a brilliant servant to this club and I think he will sit at the heart of our defence for a few more seasons, but it's time to change for me. yes not disagreeing with you just making a point about the form of Carey and i would make Hartley captain anyway as i think he has all the qualities a leader needs and he is the best player at the club, pity he wasn't 10 years younger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Humble Realist Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Carey should be captian. Bristol born and bred, epitomises (when on his game which i admit last couple of games he hasnt been) epitomises when on his game all that the team should be about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Shot JR? Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Going slightly off the captaincy subject but sticking up for Carey, to be fair to him ourcentral defenders have been getting changed week in week out so its hard to forge a decent partnership when you dont know who you are going to be playing with next game Apart from Nyatanga, Carey has been playing with the other defenders week in, week out (bar injury) for many a season now though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindjuicer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 I said it about 2 months ago. :tongue: He's well-respected by the players and either our 2nd or 3rd best player (behind Maynard and maybe Sno). He also gets forward quite a lot these days. One mediocre performance by Carey doesn't mean he shouldn't be captain. Not sure there's much point having McCoombe as deputy so that's what Hartley should be. Just formalising what is already happening on the field anyway. Mind you, I made Hartley my deputy on FM and the back-room staff haven't stopped whining since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carey 6 Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 First johnson gets the blame, then Millen now Carey ? Its the team as a whole not just individuals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindjuicer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 First johnson gets the blame, then Millen now Carey ? Yeah the whole scapegoating system falls apart without LJ & McCoombe I think it would be quicker to count the player you cannot point the finger at: Hartley. It's not his fault. Everyone else has been lacking in some greater or lesser way. But when you have failure spreading across the team, indeed, players taking turns at throwing the game, I have a lot of sympathy for GJ. It points at a self-fulfilling attitude of defeatism which has spread within the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Shot JR? Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 First johnson gets the blame, then Millen now Carey ? Its the team as a whole not just individuals? Not slating Carey - I'm just wondering why Hartley seems to be pulling the strings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Shot JR? Posted December 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Yeah the whole scapegoating system falls apart without LJ & McCoombe I think it would be quicker to count the player you cannot point the finger at: Hartley. It's not his fault. Everyone else has been lacking in some greater or lesser way. But when you have failure spreading across the team, indeed, players taking turns at throwing the game, I have a lot of sympathy for GJ. It points at a self-fulfilling attitude of defeatism which has spread within the team. Defeatism is acceptance of defeat without struggle. I'm sorry - I see mistakes being made on the pitch by individuals. These mistakes are not the result of a pessimistic/defeatist attitude eminating throughout the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Horsman Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Succesful teams are all about leaders, look at Manchester Utd. Giggs is captain,yet Van Der Saar, Ferdinand, Rooney ,Neville etc all chip in.It's not either/all. Carey,Hartley, even McAllister as senior pros can all have a role to play. I personally don't see any value in taking Louis' job away from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindjuicer Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Defeatism is acceptance of defeat without struggle. I'm sorry - I see mistakes being made on the pitch by individuals. These mistakes are not the result of a pessimistic/defeatist attitude eminating throughout the team. I'm in a crap team therefore I'm probably a crap player. Plus most players rise/fall to the level of the team. Also pressure and lack of communication among the back 5 are major. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted December 29, 2009 Report Share Posted December 29, 2009 Succesful teams are all about leaders, look at Manchester Utd. Giggs is captain,yet Van Der Saar, Ferdinand, Rooney ,Neville etc all chip in.It's not either/all. Carey,Hartley, even McAllister as senior pros can all have a role to play. I personally don't see any value in taking Louis' job away from him. He's injury prone, suspension prone and he's had a number of poor games recently. An idea might be to make him club captain with Hartley taking over on the pitch. I'd also like to see City either sign, or actively nurture, Carey's long term replacement. He'll be 33 next month and there are very few defenders approaching their mid thirties in the Championship, even fewer with repetitive injuries. Last season Carey missed 18 league games and in each of the previous 2 seasons was absent for 10. There's a pattern there which unfortunately adds up to too many non appearances for a player captaining the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiderHider Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 can never have too many leaders. As captain, Carey has inspired Hartley to play well. Vice captain for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who Shot JR? Posted December 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 Succesful teams are all about leaders, look at Manchester Utd. Giggs is captain,yet Van Der Saar, Ferdinand, Rooney ,Neville etc all chip in.It's not either/all. Carey,Hartley, even McAllister as senior pros can all have a role to play. I personally don't see any value in taking Louis' job away from him. I don't disagree with this, I'm just wondering why he doesn't seem to be fulfilling his duties as well as we know he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Humble Realist Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 He's injury prone, suspension prone and he's had a number of poor games recently. An idea might be to make him club captain with Hartley taking over on the pitch. I'd also like to see City either sign, or actively nurture, Carey's long term replacement. He'll be 33 next month and there are very few defenders approaching their mid thirties in the Championship, even fewer with repetitive injuries. Last season Carey missed 18 league games and in each of the previous 2 seasons was absent for 10. There's a pattern there which unfortunately adds up to too many non appearances for a player captaining the team. Ridiculous suggestion. Im sure Careys confidance would be sky high after losing the on field captaincy after guiding us through promotion, the play offs and last season. Hartley could be vice captain i can kind of understand that argument but Carey has to be captian at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityfan Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 I believe Carey would expect to lose the captaincy soon at his age and given that he is now injury prone. Whether he would take exceptiojn to losing it to someone else of the same age, who knows. That said, it might be worth awarding the captaincy to Hartley. Carey loses no face and still is a great servant and player. He can continue in that vain. However, in Harley Johnson has found a true leader and an outstanding player. I imagine the players genuinely look up to him. Without exception, HE IS the best player in the club by far and a far superior footballer to Nicky Maynard and Evander Sno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Humble Realist Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 being honest why not Lee J? Regular in the first team, has been playing for the club for a good few years now, never hides and leads by example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex_BCFC Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 being honest why not Lee J? Regular in the first team, has been playing for the club for a good few years now, never hides and leads by example What by giving the ball away in front of his own goal alot? At the moment Carey or Hartley are the obvious choices. I've seen McCallister/McCombe been given it a few times which was worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityfan Posted December 30, 2009 Report Share Posted December 30, 2009 being honest why not Lee J? Regular in the first team, has been playing for the club for a good few years now, never hides and leads by example Because your captain has to be a first choice. You cannot have a captain that could be spending half his time on the bench. Hartley and Skuse are nailed on for central midfield now and I see nothing changing that all season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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