Gerken

[vincent_bcfc]

Go on then. I bet I could name far more games where his saves have earned us points. And apart from Lee Camp and Steve Harper, name me all of these Championship keepers who command their area so well - I go to a hell of a lot of games and, coming from the angle of being an ex-Keeper myself, I haven't seen them. I saw Marshall punching balls last night that a "commanding" keeper would have caught and flattened three or four players at the same time. I knew that Gerken would eventually become the fall guy at some point this season and the likes of you and others describing him as a "waste of wages" have proven me correct. It wouldn't surprise me if you were one of the "fans" who thought it a fantastic idea to sarcastically cheer last night - if so, well done.

No. I was one of the fans at the back of the east end singing 'There's only one Gary Johnson' actually. At no point did I sarcastically cheer. David Marshall is not a very good keeper and there are goalkeepers in our squad better than Gerken. Note the use of the plural there as well

[CliftonCliff]

I think we're all still a bit shell-shocked after what happened last night (including the manager and chairman).

I hope when we all calm down that the goalkeeping situation will be seen in some perspective. Gerken had a game he'd rather forget; no denying that. Most posters here have correctly indentified that there is a issue with his decision-making when it comes to leaving his line or staying at home. This hesitancy (which happens some of the time, but not all of the time) creates uncertainty in the minds of the back four, and when they dither, good opportunist forwards pounce. Cardiff were clinical in that respect last night.

Having said all that, the lad is relatively young for a keeper, will improve this aspect of his game (if he gets the right help) and has not become a bad player overnight. I think we need to cut him a bit of slack here because laying into him isn't going to help rebuild his confidence and, more to the point, his performance wasn't the only reason we got stuffed. In fact, I doubt it was even the most important reason. Quite frankly, you could have had a world class keeper last night and a middling Conference side could still have put two or three past us, given the unbelieveably scary way the defence just caved in as soon as the first goal was conceded.

If we want to get at the reasons why this disastrous debacle unfolded from that point on, I'd suggest we need to start with the apparently gutless capitulation of the back four and not with the keeper in isolation. Basso is not coming back, so Gerken will need some support and encouragement to recover from this, not barracking and derision. People who mocked him last night need to ask themselves whether they want to help the team recover from a traumatic drubbing or undermine them. We can all make that choice.

[Tunley Legend]

I think we're all still a bit shell-shocked after what happened last night (including the manager and chairman).

I hope when we all calm down that the goalkeeping situation will be seen in some perspective. Gerken had a game he'd rather forget; no denying that. Most posters here have correctly indentified that there is a issue with his decision-making when it comes to leaving his line or staying at home. This hesitancy (which happens some of the time, but not all of the time) creates uncertainty in the minds of the back four, and when they dither, good opportunist forwards pounce. Cardiff were clinical in that respect last night.

Having said all that, the lad is relatively young for a keeper, will improve this aspect of his game (if he gets the right help) and has not become a bad player overnight. I think we need to cut him a bit of slack here because laying into him isn't going to help rebuild his confidence and, more to the point, his performance wasn't the only reason we got stuffed. In fact, I doubt it was even the most important reason. Quite frankly, you could have had a world class keeper last night and a middling Conference side could still have put two or three past us, given the unbelieveably scary way the defence just caved in as soon as the first goal was conceded.

If we want to get at the reasons why this disastrous debacle unfolded from that point on, I'd suggest we need to start with the apparently gutless capitulation of the back four and not with the keeper in isolation. Basso is not coming back, so Gerken will need some support and encouragement to recover from this, not barracking and derision. People who mocked him last night need to ask themselves whether they want to help the team recover from a traumatic drubbing or undermine them. We can all make that choice.

Agree with everything you say except that Collis should come in on Saturday as Gerken's confidence is shot to pieces (helped immensely by his own supporters!!) and he needs time to work on his game and come back a better keeper. The worrying aspect of this is that we have too many "stupid" fans who will use his lack of form recently to condemn him for life and are not intelligent enough to understand the concept that a 24 year old keeper can work on his game and become a far better keeper by the time he is 25, 26, 27, 28 etc. You only have to look at how "raw" Basso was when he first came here to realise that but as I say people have short memories.

[vincent_bcfc]

Agree with everything you say except that Collis should come in on Saturday as Gerken's confidence is shot to pieces (helped immensely by his own supporters!!) and he needs time to work on his game and come back a better keeper. The worrying aspect of this is that we have too many "stupid" fans who will use his lack of form recently to condemn him for life and are not intelligent enough to understand the concept that a 24 year old keeper can work on his game and become a far better keeper by the time he is 25, 26, 27, 28 etc. You only have to look at how "raw" Basso was when he first came here to realise that but as I say people have short memories.

Surely his confidence will be shot to even more pieces if he is replaced by a goalkeeper who has been at the club less than a week?

[Tunley Legend]

Surely his confidence will be shot to even more pieces if he is replaced by a goalkeeper who has been at the club less than a week?

That is where GJ and Stuart Naylor come in. They have to tell him in a way that suits his personality that he is still a good goalkeeper, still has a big future at the club but in the short term he needs a spell away from the limelight to work hard at eliminating weaknesses in his game so that when he next gets a chance he will be a better keeper and a better "man" for his experience.

Actually that sounds quite good - I should tell him he's dropped myself!!

[Redcliffe 78]

Agree with everything you say except that Collis should come in on Saturday as Gerken's confidence is shot to pieces (helped immensely by his own supporters!!) and he needs time to work on his game and come back a better keeper. The worrying aspect of this is that we have too many "stupid" fans who will use his lack of form recently to condemn him for life and are not intelligent enough to understand the concept that a 24 year old keeper can work on his game and become a far better keeper by the time he is 25, 26, 27, 28 etc. You only have to look at how "raw" Basso was when he first came here to realise that but as I say people have short memories.

Agree on most parts but if a keepers confidence is shot surely he has to come out of the team if a strikers misses a chance he may get another if a keeper makes a mistake 9/10 it leads to a goal. Surely he needs to come out of the team until his confiedence is back.

[Riaz]

Think we are seeing why he was on the bench at a league one club..........

Only 24 though, with lots of time to improve.

Much prefer basso in goal though.

[Tunley Legend]

Agree on most parts but if a keepers confidence is shot surely he has to come out of the team if a strikers misses a chance he may get another if a keeper makes a mistake 9/10 it leads to a goal. Surely he needs to come out of the team until his confiedence is back.

Not having a dig but that is what I said at the start!! So we agree then!!

[Redcliffe 78]

I wonder if Mr Johnson regrets selling Chris Weale?, but in all fairness if he could of forseen the Basso situation Weale surely wouldn't have gone.

[gordie]

When i started this thread i didn't mean it to a hang Geken out to dry thread, yes he has been poor for a few games now and personally i feel it would benifit him to be taken out of the frontline and get his head sorted out, he is still only a young player in goalkeeping terms and he was brought here as cover for Basso and was thrust into the spotlight due to unforeseen circumstances, he excelled himself the 1st 10-15 games but he has gone off the boil at the moment, there are a lot of aspects of his game i feel he has to work on and im sure he will and will improve and become a regular no 1 but for me not at the moment. Who do we put in goal if Gerken is not selected? Collis ? none of us have seen him play yet so its probably a bit unfair to comment on him but being 3rd choice for Crewe doesn't look good, Basso? would you have him back in the side, personally i would, he is being paid by the club and i can't see him not giving anything but 100% if he was selected if not just to put him on show.

[vincent_bcfc]

When i started this thread i didn't mean it to a hang Geken out to dry thread, yes he has been poor for a few games now and personally i feel it would benifit him to be taken out of the frontline and get his head sorted out, he is still only a young player in goalkeeping terms and he was brought here as cover for Basso and was thrust into the spotlight due to unforeseen circumstances, he excelled himself the 1st 10-15 games but he has gone off the boil at the moment, there are a lot of aspects of his game i feel he has to work on and im sure he will and will improve and become a regular no 1 but for me not at the moment. Who do we put in goal if Gerken is not selected? Collis ? none of us have seen him play yet so its probably a bit unfair to comment on him but being 3rd choice for Crewe doesn't look good, Basso? would you have him back in the side, personally i would, he is being paid by the club and i can't see him not giving anything but 100% if he was selected if not just to put him on show.

He won't be selected though will he? Leaving Collis as our only option which for me means that Dean will continue

[Guest clevedonred]

Basso isn't 100% committed to the club

I would say it was GJ he wasn't fully committed to. If we changed managers, i fully believe he would stay

[Lack of Action Man]

Here's my ten pence on the matter chaps.

City for most of the season have flattered to deceive. We aren't as good as we think we are and should expect nothing better this season than a 11/12 th place finish. At the start of the season Gerken's fine form had kept us with a good shout of hitting top form which bread confidence throughout the side and fans - I myself fully accepted him into the side following on from Basso and felt that we hadn't missed him one bit.

Then came the late goals and with them a continual drop in confidence in the defence and goal keeper.

I am a big fan of Gerken but it is without doubt that he has been well below the very high standards that he himself set this season. The three games against Cardiff have been plagued with bad luck at first, but then continual misjudgements and school boy errors. There can be no question he was responsible for the first goal and possibly the second as well. This poor run of form has undoubteldly has shattered his confidence - as was evident after the first goal.

With Gerken it is also important to consider that bar fontaine/Nyatanga he was the youngest member of the defensive unit last night. I'd like to see all of his big critics try and be a commanding and demanding figure between the sticks at 24 years of age with that defence in front of you. Consider also that he could not possibly have thought himself our number one goalkeeper at time of signing. This has probably been the most trying period of his career - consistently playing infront of decent crowds that demand a high standard week in/week out. He has coped admirably so far but it is silly to think that this season he would settle into the first team as easy as pie.

My final view is that we still have a very good championship goalkeeper on our hands but there can be no doubt last night was his worst game so far and that in the three games over Cardiff he has not met his own performance standard.

[LoyalRed]

Anyone with a name like that will always end up unpopular. You've only got to take a trip to your local McDonalds to see all the gerkens on the floor. No-one likes a GERKEN!