Rich i e Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Struggles to get around the pitch, can't play 3 games in a week, liability in a midfield which has two wingers, too old for the championship, been there done it, does he really care....... Or, excellent passer, experienced head, good organiser etc etc Has our midfield gone backwards since his arrival........you decide........everyone should be under scrutiny in times like these Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Struggles to get around the pitch, can't play 3 games in a week, liability in a midfield which has two wingers, too old for the championship, been there done it, does he really care....... Or, excellent passer, experienced head, good organiser etc etc Has our midfield gone backwards since his arrival........you decide........everyone should be under scrutiny in times like these but probably dont like being told what to do etc. we did have a great spine Carey, Hartley, Maynard now they seem to have lost faith in well everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich i e Posted February 14, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 but probably dont like being told what to do etc. we did have a great spine Carey, Hartley, Maynard now they seem to have lost faith in well everything. Would agree, and adding Basso to the list, a good spine indeed, on paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordie Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Struggles to get around the pitch, can't play 3 games in a week, liability in a midfield which has two wingers, too old for the championship, been there done it, does he really care....... Or, excellent passer, experienced head, good organiser etc etc Has our midfield gone backwards since his arrival........you decide........everyone should be under scrutiny in times like these Quality passer of a ball but needs help in there cant do everything on his own but saying that its the same as everywhere else on the pitch , getting changed around week after week never playing a settled side so there is no time for them to gel, i suggest if Gary stays (which at the moment but only just i hope he does) then pick what you think is your best side and stick with it barring injuries , they may be able to change players left right and centre in the Premier League but we aint in it and our players aint good enough to rotate all the time like them, play a settled side in a settled formation and give them a chance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WellRedPhil Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 His passing and awareness are first class and although his stamina is not excellent he is hardly a liability. With wingers I believe he would be an even better player as he could sit back and feed them. I don't believe our form/loss of confidece etc. has anything to do with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliftonCliff Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 I think it's got well beyond the point where you can identify specific failings in individual players as a source of difficulty, or even a particular area of the team. I don't think there's a single player at the moment who could be said to be performing to full potential. They all look devoid of self belief and motivation, as well as terminally confused by constant tinkering with selection and tactics. The whole thing is unravelling before your eyes and, having seen us get relegated over the years more times than I care to remember, I would say this is pretty typical of what happens. Hartley's a decent player, but you'd have to be George bloody Best to turn this shambles around on your own. You can no longer say it's the defence, it's the midfield, it's the strikers, whatever. The whole thing is falling apart, which is why the manager doesn't know where to turn to try to put things right. Where do you start? With another manager, some would say... I have said elsewhere that I hate managerial change because of the discontinuity it creates. I am no great admirer of GJ, never have been, though I have always given him full credit for his considerable achievements, but I won't be jumping for joy if he's sacked. In fact, in some ways I'll be just as worried as I will be if he stays, which sums up the chairman's dilemma. I'm pretty sure that SL, who believes firmly in long-termism, will want to keep GJ in post until at least the end of the season, so he can take stock and decide how to go forward from the sanctity of the close season, but he may not have that luxury. I would say it's on a knife-edge, and Tuesday's game could be make-or-break. A win, and he buys himself a bit more time. A so-so draw, and he's just about hanging on by his finger nails. A really bad defeat, either Tuesday or against West Brom on Sunday, and I think it might be time for your man to start clearing his desk. In the mean time, I defy anyone to make a reliable judgement about Hartley or any other player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 I think it's got well beyond the point where you can identify specific failings in individual players as a source of difficulty, or even a particular area of the team. I don't think there's a single player at the moment who could be said to be performing to full potential. They all look devoid of self belief and motivation, as well as terminally confused by constant tinkering with selection and tactics. The whole thing is unravelling before your eyes and, having seen us get relegated over the years more times than I care to remember, I would say this is pretty typical of what happens. Hartley's a decent player, but you'd have to be George bloody Best to turn this shambles around on your own. You can no longer say it's the defence, it's the midfield, it's the strikers, whatever. The whole thing is falling apart, which is why the manager doesn't know where to turn to try to put things right. Where do you start? With another manager, some would say... I have said elsewhere that I hate managerial change because of the discontinuity it creates. I am no great admirer of GJ, never have been, though I have always given him full credit for his considerable achievements, but I won't be jumping for joy if he's sacked. In fact, in some ways I'll be just as worried as I will be if he stays, which sums up the chairman's dilemma. I'm pretty sure that SL, who believes firmly in long-termism, will want to keep GJ in post until at least the end of the season, so he can take stock and decide how to go forward from the sanctity of the close season, but he may not have that luxury. I would say it's on a knife-edge, and Tuesday's game could be make-or-break. A win, and he buys himself a bit more time. A so-so draw, and he's just about hanging on by his finger nails. A really bad defeat, either Tuesday or against West Brom on Sunday, and I think it might be time for your man to start clearing his desk. In the mean time, I defy anyone to make a reliable judgement about Hartley or any other player. Absolutely spot on. Its totally pointless to try and make a reasonable assessment of any of the players in the current shambles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Struggles to get around the pitch, can't play 3 games in a week, liability in a midfield which has two wingers, too old for the championship, been there done it, does he really care....... Or, excellent passer, experienced head, good organiser etc etc Has our midfield gone backwards since his arrival........you decide........everyone should be under scrutiny in times like these You are slating who in IMO is are player of the season so far. He can't play two games in a week, Giggs Etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 You are slating who in IMO is are player of the season so far. He can't play two games in a week, Giggs Etc. Hes not slating anyone, hes asked for opinions on what people think of Hartley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityhead Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Sorry if this offends anyone but I have not seen anything in hartley that LJ cant do. Hartley cant keep up with the pace of the CCC, legs gone, cant close down opposition midfielders, cant remember the last tackle he made. One pass to maynard against middlesborough is sole contribution. I was expecting a midfield general but we've got a weak link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WellRedPhil Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Sorry if this offends anyone but I have not seen anything in hartley that LJ cant do. Hartley cant keep up with the pace of the CCC, legs gone, cant close down opposition midfielders, cant remember the last tackle he made. One pass to maynard against middlesborough is sole contribution. I was expecting a midfield general but we've got a weak link. Rubbish, he very rarely gives the ball again and his vision and execution of his passes are usually of a very high standard. I think you'll find he put Maynard through twice in the Borough game, both of which lead to goals. I also can't remember the last time LJ scored a free kick, or even whipped in a great cross! Hartley is vastly superior to LJ imo and I can't see how anyone could think differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night84 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Sorry if this offends anyone but I have not seen anything in hartley that LJ cant do. Hartley cant keep up with the pace of the CCC, legs gone, cant close down opposition midfielders, cant remember the last tackle he made. One pass to maynard against middlesborough is sole contribution. I was expecting a midfield general but we've got a weak link. Speechless, absolutely speechless. Have you not been watching? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Agreed, the person above said PH hasn't done anything that LJ done, maybe he sits in a obscured seat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Agreed, the person above said PH hasn't done anything that LJ done, maybe he sits in a obscured seat? Hartley is as poor as Johnson in defending but his offensive play, passing and shooting, are way ahead of Johnsons. To compare the two is an insult to Paul Hartley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WellRedPhil Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Hartley is as poor as Johnson in defending but his offensive play, passing and shooting, are way ahead of Johnsons. To compare the two is an insult to Paul Hartley. Hes a much better tackler! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindjuicer Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 I think it's got well beyond the point where you can identify specific failings in individual players as a source of difficulty, or even a particular area of the team. I don't think there's a single player at the moment who could be said to be performing to full potential. They all look devoid of self belief and motivation, as well as terminally confused by constant tinkering with selection and tactics. The whole thing is unravelling before your eyes and, having seen us get relegated over the years more times than I care to remember, I would say this is pretty typical of what happens. Hartley's a decent player, but you'd have to be George bloody Best to turn this shambles around on your own. You can no longer say it's the defence, it's the midfield, it's the strikers, whatever. The whole thing is falling apart, which is why the manager doesn't know where to turn to try to put things right. Where do you start? With another manager, some would say... I have said elsewhere that I hate managerial change because of the discontinuity it creates. I am no great admirer of GJ, never have been, though I have always given him full credit for his considerable achievements, but I won't be jumping for joy if he's sacked. In fact, in some ways I'll be just as worried as I will be if he stays, which sums up the chairman's dilemma. I'm pretty sure that SL, who believes firmly in long-termism, will want to keep GJ in post until at least the end of the season, so he can take stock and decide how to go forward from the sanctity of the close season, but he may not have that luxury. I would say it's on a knife-edge, and Tuesday's game could be make-or-break. A win, and he buys himself a bit more time. A so-so draw, and he's just about hanging on by his finger nails. A really bad defeat, either Tuesday or against West Brom on Sunday, and I think it might be time for your man to start clearing his desk. In the mean time, I defy anyone to make a reliable judgement about Hartley or any other player. Best summary of our predicament so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Hartley is as poor as Johnson in defending but his offensive play, passing and shooting, are way ahead of Johnsons. To compare the two is an insult to Paul Hartley. Read again what i said i am insulting Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 Read again what i said i am insulting Johnson. I have NINE pints of natch so maybe its not coming over has preserved. Stay of the Natch i think can't even spell Good times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolcitysweden Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 I have NINE pints of natch so maybe its not coming over has preserved. Haven't had a single pint. Still I can't get it Sorry missunderstood. Cheers Tommy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcliffe 78 Posted February 14, 2010 Report Share Posted February 14, 2010 RESPECT. Onwards & upwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Risk Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 sorry but hartley has been our best player this season closely followed by Danny Haynes, always assured on the ball, quality passing, very clever in the way he loses people. I just think he is being asked to do too much. we desperately need quality around him but unfortunately we are totally bereft of anything at the mo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityhead Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Granted Hartley and Sno very comfortable on the ball, but contribution to whole game is very poor. Some people have questioned whether I have watched the games they play and not from an obscured seat! Some people have very biased opinions. basing their argument on reputations rather than actual performances. IMO even off-form eliott and on form skuse will enable us to compete in midfield which has been very defficient this season. Another thread hashighlighted the players most involved in our wins this season and none of the new signings/loan players feature very highly - says alot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfcas1 Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 IMO opinion Hartley is one of our most influential players, and is certainly the most experienced at the highest level. When I have seen him he gives 110% and has effected games more than the majority of our other midfielders. I think at times we haven't seen the best out of him as he hasn't played regularly and each time he does it is a different midfield set up around him. Why hasn't he been playing regularly? Johnson - Hartley power struggle, with Johnson stamping his authority on him by dropping him. My suspicion. We have seen similar situations with the way other players have been treated, some who have left recently. 'My way or the high way' - Fine when all is well on the pitch, desperation when all is not.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spud55 Posted February 15, 2010 Report Share Posted February 15, 2010 Granted Hartley and Sno very comfortable on the ball, but contribution to whole game is very poor. Some people have questioned whether I have watched the games they play and not from an obscured seat! Some people have very biased opinions. basing their argument on reputations rather than actual performances. IMO even off-form eliott and on form skuse will enable us to compete in midfield which has been very defficient this season. Another thread hashighlighted the players most involved in our wins this season and none of the new signings/loan players feature very highly - says alot. Mabye i've been on the crack again but i'm sure Hartley is our top scoring midfielder and the midfielder with the most assists, which with largely absolutely no outlet on the left or right is pretty bloody good to be honest. So i'm not sure how you can say he doesn't impact games, i suppose if you ignore scoring and creating goals then you may have a point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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