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Is The "not Allowed To Wear A England Shirt/flag In Pubs/cars/houses Etc Ban" For World Cup True?

BristolCityFC1

By BristolCityFC1
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BristolCityFC1

BristolCityFC1

Posted
Posted

There have been many stories and rumours going around that you are not permitted to put an England flag up in your house/car or even wear a football shirt in public/pubs because it is seen as being "racist!"?"?"?"? wht the hell???

is this true? have others also heard about this? why cant we do anything in OUR country? seems as though we are being dictated by foreigners?

Link: http://www.footballshirtculture.com/fans/england-shirts-could-be-banned-at-pubs.html

if you have seen any other links, please show!

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The Batman

The Batman

Posted
Posted

There have been many stories and rumours going around that you are not permitted to put an England flag up in your house/car or even wear a football shirt in public/pubs because it is seen as being "racist!"?"?"?"? wht the hell???

is this true? have others also heard about this? why cant we do anything in OUR country? seems as though we are being dictated by foreigners?

Link: http://www.footballs...ed-at-pubs.html

if you have seen any other links, please show!

originally i thought it was the tabloids talking nonsense and shit stirring.

but my housemate who works for police said some council is trying to implement it.

so the papers have jumped on it.

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Guest AJ Sylvester

Guest AJ Sylvester

Posted
Posted

There have been many stories and rumours going around that you are not permitted to put an England flag up in your house/car or even wear a football shirt in public/pubs because it is seen as being "racist!"?"?"?"? wht the hell???

is this true? have others also heard about this? why cant we do anything in OUR country? seems as though we are being dictated by foreigners?

Link: http://www.footballs...ed-at-pubs.html

if you have seen any other links, please show!

The story is a pile of rubbish. It's nothing to do with being racist and no-one banning it.

ONE police force has told pubs they can take measures to cut the risk of football related trouble and once of many measures open to them is not to allow shirts. No different to what many pubs, bars and clubs already do...in fact I think some of the bars at most football stadiums, including our own, ban football shirts in certain areas.

So it's nothing to do with racism, it's nothing to do with being 'dictated to by foreigners' - it's just that people as per usual jump to conclusions about these things. Every time a flag pole is taken down it's blamed on 'bloody foreigners' even though it's usually to do with planning restrictions.

Hardly anyone in the country has ever been told not to wave a flag or wear a shirt because of racism - the only people that bring the race card into it are those who then cry foul.

Roughly translated:

England fan waves flag

Copper: "Hello"

England fan: "stop telling me I can't wave my flag"

Copper: "err...I'm not, I was just saying hello"

England fan: "don't accuse me of being racist"

Copper: "I'm not"

England fan: "it's MY country, I can wave my flag if I like"

Copper: "yes, please go ahead"

England fan: "this is political correctness gone mad"

Basically: you CAN wear your England kit, you CAN wave your flags, you CAN celebrate St. Georges Day and hardly anyone will tell you you can't. Get on with it, stop moaning and enjoy yourself

Edit: If people did just get on with it and made less of a fuss about clearly exaggerated stories such as this one then you'd find far more people do show their national pride. It's precisely the people who flag up these stories who are to blame for more people not celebrating Englishness. It's not an issue do don't make it one.

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Guest AJ Sylvester

Guest AJ Sylvester

Posted
Posted

I was wondering about the flags out of car windows, didn't the OB get funny about this last time?

I think one police force asked people to be careful with them (make sure they were fastened properly) and make sure they're aware they make extra noise when going past horses (as not to startle them).

The police were trying to stop accidents: nothing to do with being PC.

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Northern Red

Northern Red

Posted
Posted

I'm sure there have been lots of moronic Facebook groups set up in tribute to this made up scare-mongering tabloid story

Funny you should say that, the following is the status of choice for a couple of people on my friends list:

Police are going around pubs and clubs saying that we cant wear our nations tops for the football & we have to take the flags down as its upsetting immigrants that dont come from here! Now Im not racist, but this is going too far!!! THIS IS OUR COUNTRY & WE NEED TO MAKE A STAND, IF THEY DONT LIKE IT THEN THEY SHOULD GO HOME! Would they remove their turban or burkha if it upset us!!! post this status if you agree

It does of course contain the timeless phrase "I'm not racist but..."

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Guest AJ Sylvester

Guest AJ Sylvester

Posted
Posted

Funny you should say that, the following is the status of choice for a couple of people on my friends list:

It does of course contain the timeless phrase "I'm not racist but..."

Ah yes. We could play the 'what they actually mean' game.

"I'm not a racist but...." = "I'm going to say something that marks people out by race/I am racist"

"this is OUR country" = "it's not theirs...bloody foreigners"

"no-one's gonna tell me what to do" = "I haven't thought for two seconds but assume someone is trying to tell me what to do"

"if they don't like it they should go home" = "even though they have no issue with it I would rather they 'went home'"

"would they remove their turban or burka" = "they should be forced to move their silly little hats"

Or we can play the 'make that Facebook status look stupid' game:

Police are going around pubs and clubs saying that we cant wear our nations tops for the football [No they're not. They (one police force) haven't told anyone they can't wear a football top] & we have to take the flags down [No mention of flags anywhere] as its upsetting immigrants that dont come from here! [Not about immigrants in any shape, form or way...but congratulations on making it an issue] Now Im not racist, but this is going too far!!! [What? Giving advice on various measures that pubs COULD consider taking if they want to avoid violence?] THIS IS OUR COUNTRY [Yep, nothing to do with that though] & WE NEED TO MAKE A STAND, IF THEY DONT LIKE IT THEN THEY SHOULD GO HOME! [Who? The police? Or the landlords who voluntarily ban football shirts just as many of them already do every weekend] Would they remove their turban or burkha if it upset us!!! [still nothing to do with it...] post this status if you agree [...funnily enough most people who do post this status would want 'them' to remove their turbans and burkas. Irony]

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Spud55

Spud55

Posted
Posted

i love that line.

It is a beauty, usually because it seems to have to be followed by an overtly rascist statement.

I could at least understand it if people used it and then put forward a mildly controversial view, but it's almost always followed by why don't they all go home or just plain old i f'ing hate (whichever ethnic group has got their goat)

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Fiale

Fiale

Posted
Posted

It was a guidelines notice sent by some Police forces to landlords on how to curtail trouble at World Cup matches viewed on their premises. One of the suggestions was to have a 'dress code' that does not include football shirts. That in-itself is rather benign, however the end of the guidelines suggest that if there is any violence or problems at the landlords premises and they had not followed the 'suggested' guidelines to prevent any possible trouble that it 'could' harm future licensing of the premises.

A you don't have to do this 'BUT'.....

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madmax

madmax

Posted
Posted

Cornwall are to ban the St George's Flag on cars, houses, tents etc... being displayed anywhere. I haven't seen any news reports on it, but a friend whos been on holiday there said that the locals are backing the ban.

So, we feed their pockets every year with tourism, but they don't want our flag...so I put forward a boycott! I won't be going there for our short break like every year, I'm going to Devon!

MM

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94th Minute

94th Minute

Posted
Posted

Ah yes. We could play the 'what they actually mean' game.

"I'm not a racist but...." = "I'm going to say something that marks people out by race/I am racist"

"this is OUR country" = "it's not theirs...bloody foreigners"

"no-one's gonna tell me what to do" = "I haven't thought for two seconds but assume someone is trying to tell me what to do"

"if they don't like it they should go home" = "even though they have no issue with it I would rather they 'went home'"

"would they remove their turban or burka" = "they should be forced to move their silly little hats"

That's one of the most ridiculous posts ever, people get scared when they think that they are having their civil liberties taken away from them, but to brandish them all racists for it is nothing short of outrageous

1. British is not a race, the Polish immigrants may have a problem with it... as far as I'm aware polish is not a race, therefore anything between these two groups could not be construed as racism. This could very well be the point they were making.

2. Yes, this is England, we should have the right to support England

3. That's not for a second what that sentence was implying, again I refer to the first point of people fearing that their civil liberties are being removed, they act like sheep

4. Given the evidence that they have been provided, they believe that there are people who don't like it, therefore they have the right to hold the opinion that they should either like it or leave it

5. In France they have banned the Burka, it has nothing to do with it being a 'silly little hat' (which most ironically it isn't even a hat), it has everything to do with it upsetting the status quo of the country

My side isn't with those who have made these rash assumptions on Facebook, do some sodding research in future, and stop getting so scared so easily. Its with 'I'm in the right-ers' who believe anyone expressing an opinion not akin to their own must be a racist. It just forms a 'us and them' mentality, where people start thinking they're better than those with national identity.

The fact is at the end of the day it comes down to something very simple, you either believe in national identity or not. I, for what its worth, do, I think its important that there are differences between the countries of the world... but that means that anyone entering the UK has to play by its rules, if we become a melting pot of hundreds of different cultures, we give up our identity as England. That's all France have done with the Burka, France's identity is, and always has been as a Christian country, they are just protecting that.

Science has taught us that if you put 8 different substances in a beaker, before too long all the substances are equally dispersed. That's fine if you think its the ideal way to live, but that sort of makes everything based around a country pointless. Emmergration, why go somewhere thats exactly like where you came from (the 'I left because of the weather' thing is pathetic), the World Cup, why compete against a nation the exact same as your own?

National Identity is important, please don't mock people who feel the need to stand up for it

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eskay

eskay

Posted
Posted

Cornwall are to ban the St George's Flag on cars, houses, tents etc... being displayed anywhere. I haven't seen any news reports on it, but a friend whos been on holiday there said that the locals are backing the ban.

So, we feed their pockets every year with tourism, but they don't want our flag...so I put forward a boycott! I won't be going there for our short break like every year, I'm going to Devon!

MM

I always thought Cornwall is in England. So they are banning people flying their own countries flag? Get out the Semtex and let them float off into the Atlantic!

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Red_Mat

Red_Mat

Posted
Posted

The story is a pile of rubbish. It's nothing to do with being racist and no-one banning it.

ONE police force has told pubs they can take measures to cut the risk of football related trouble and once of many measures open to them is not to allow shirts. No different to what many pubs, bars and clubs already do...in fact I think some of the bars at most football stadiums, including our own, ban football shirts in certain areas.

So it's nothing to do with racism, it's nothing to do with being 'dictated to by foreigners' - it's just that people as per usual jump to conclusions about these things. Every time a flag pole is taken down it's blamed on 'bloody foreigners' even though it's usually to do with planning restrictions.

Hardly anyone in the country has ever been told not to wave a flag or wear a shirt because of racism - the only people that bring the race card into it are those who then cry foul.

Roughly translated:

England fan waves flag

Copper: "Hello"

England fan: "stop telling me I can't wave my flag"

Copper: "err...I'm not, I was just saying hello"

England fan: "don't accuse me of being racist"

Copper: "I'm not"

England fan: "it's MY country, I can wave my flag if I like"

Copper: "yes, please go ahead"

England fan: "this is political correctness gone mad"

Basically: you CAN wear your England kit, you CAN wave your flags, you CAN celebrate St. Georges Day and hardly anyone will tell you you can't. Get on with it, stop moaning and enjoy yourself

Edit: If people did just get on with it and made less of a fuss about clearly exaggerated stories such as this one then you'd find far more people do show their national pride. It's precisely the people who flag up these stories who are to blame for more people not celebrating Englishness. It's not an issue do don't make it one.

Ah yes. We could play the 'what they actually mean' game.

"I'm not a racist but...." = "I'm going to say something that marks people out by race/I am racist"

"this is OUR country" = "it's not theirs...bloody foreigners"

"no-one's gonna tell me what to do" = "I haven't thought for two seconds but assume someone is trying to tell me what to do"

"if they don't like it they should go home" = "even though they have no issue with it I would rather they 'went home'"

"would they remove their turban or burka" = "they should be forced to move their silly little hats"

Or we can play the 'make that Facebook status look stupid' game:

Police are going around pubs and clubs saying that we cant wear our nations tops for the football [No they're not. They (one police force) haven't told anyone they can't wear a football top] & we have to take the flags down [No mention of flags anywhere] as its upsetting immigrants that dont come from here! [Not about immigrants in any shape, form or way...but congratulations on making it an issue] Now Im not racist, but this is going too far!!! [What? Giving advice on various measures that pubs COULD consider taking if they want to avoid violence?] THIS IS OUR COUNTRY [Yep, nothing to do with that though] & WE NEED TO MAKE A STAND, IF THEY DONT LIKE IT THEN THEY SHOULD GO HOME! [Who? The police? Or the landlords who voluntarily ban football shirts just as many of them already do every weekend] Would they remove their turban or burkha if it upset us!!! [still nothing to do with it...] post this status if you agree [...funnily enough most people who do post this status would want 'them' to remove their turbans and burkas. Irony]

Very well said, completely agree. Thank you for putting it so succinctly.

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Guest AJ Sylvester

Guest AJ Sylvester

Posted
Posted

1. British is not a race, the Polish immigrants may have a problem with it... as far as I'm aware polish is not a race, therefore anything between these two groups could not be construed as racism. This could very well be the point they were making.

I don't think so. The only people to have jumped in with the word 'racist' are those moaning about the shirt-ban. As I said, race has nothing to do with it

2. Yes, this is England, we should have the right to support England

Of course. I agree. In actual fact I think anyone should be able to support their country anywhere. The point is no-one's trying to stop us from doing that and I for one will have England kit and England flags out this summer.

3. That's not for a second what that sentence was implying, again I refer to the first point of people fearing that their civil liberties are being removed, they act like sheep

I don't like dress codes but they exist. They exist at work, schools, clubs and bars all over the place. If any pub bans England shirts I just won't go in there. Again, it's nothing to do with 'upsetting immigrants'

4. Given the evidence that they have been provided, they believe that there are people who don't like it, therefore they have the right to hold the opinion that they should either like it or leave it

But yet again no-one is moaning about it! There are around 52 million people in England. The only people that think race/immigration/political correctness have anything to do with bans on shirts/flags are those people who react in such a daft assuming way to the story. There probably are a tiny tiny tiny handful of people who don't like England flags and you can bet your bottom dollar those people will be reported in the press. But their views no more news worthy than lunatics or nutters. Once again a story that has nothing to do with these people or these issues has been totally misread so that thousands of people now feel as though their civil liberties and 'Englishness' is being threatened. It's not!

5. In France they have banned the Burka, it has nothing to do with it being a 'silly little hat' (which most ironically it isn't even a hat), it has everything to do with it upsetting the status quo of the country

My side isn't with those who have made these rash assumptions on Facebook, do some sodding research in future, and stop getting so scared so easily. Its with 'I'm in the right-ers' who believe anyone expressing an opinion not akin to their own must be a racist. It just forms a 'us and them' mentality, where people start thinking they're better than those with national identity.

In this area I probably agree to some extent but I don't think that everyone who expresses an opinion different to me is a racist. I do, however, feel that a lot of muppets out there have totally misread this article and either accidentally stirred 'them vs us' mentality or even worse they have deliberately done so. I too have seen Facebook status' and message boards talking about the stories and saying things like "illegal immigants" and "they can go home" etc etc. It's a terrible shame because I love being English and I will wave flags like many of you do...but every now and then a daft story like this crops up and again implies that perhaps flag wavers are 'racist'.

The fact is at the end of the day it comes down to something very simple, you either believe in national identity or not. I, for what its worth, do, I think its important that there are differences between the countries of the world... but that means that anyone entering the UK has to play by its rules, if we become a melting pot of hundreds of different cultures, we give up our identity as England.

I don't agree with that. People have moved around since time began. There have been huge movements of people, tribes and races throughout history. Over the last 2000 years we have been a melting pot of different cultures - Celts, Romans, Vikings, Saxons, Normans etc etc. Those groups have all totally shaped what we are today and many of them spread across other European countries too but we still have an 'English identity'. I do believe in national identity but it's fluid and it changes.

That's all France have done with the Burka, France's identity is, and always has been as a Christian country, they are just protecting that.

Don't think so. The headscarf ban was because France is a secular country, not Christian. The burka is to do with issues over oppression.

Science has taught us that if you put 8 different substances in a beaker, before too long all the substances are equally dispersed. That's fine if you think its the ideal way to live, but that sort of makes everything based around a country pointless. Emmergration, why go somewhere thats exactly like where you came from (the 'I left because of the weather' thing is pathetic), the World Cup, why compete against a nation the exact same as your own?

See above - we have way more than 8 substances in the beaker and they've been in the beaker for a long long time...yet the beaker still has it's own identity. It did during the war, it does now, it will in the future. And, back to the original post, no-one's telling it not to.

National Identity is important, please don't mock people who feel the need to stand up for it

I'm not. As stated I have a strong sense of national identity and will be wearing my England kit and waving my flags over the summer. I'm mocking those muppets who make it harder for people like me to show my national identity by linking immigrants and burkas to stories that have nothing to do with them.

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted

Has anyone ever met a person who is offended by our flag??

I get the feeling its just the latest crazy politically correct thing......

Problem is in this country is that we are too worried about offending people all the time.... **** it! let them be offended and LETS BE PATRIOTIC :englandsmile4wf:

I will be carrying a flag round - it would be a bit stupid for someone to accuse me of being racist!

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ciderup

ciderup

Posted
Posted

Has anyone ever met a person who is offended by our flag??

I get the feeling its just the latest crazy politically correct thing......

Problem is in this country is that we are too worried about offending people all the time.... **** it! let them be offended and LETS BE PATRIOTIC englandsmile4wf.gif

I will be carrying a flag round - it would be a bit stupid for someone to accuse me of being racist!

Riaz,

I have been in the situation where our countrys flag upset someone and it was at a City match coincidentally. Years ago I went to watch the City at Walsall and went for a pint before the game. On entering the pub, I was asked to cover my England rugby shirt for fear of upsetting the locals.

A sad but true story.

I am all for patriotism and will be flying the St George cross in support of OUR team. I really enjoy the surge of patriotic pride that sweeps the nation whenever England are playing in a big tournament. So long as it doesn't turn into volence and bigotted behaviour if / when we get beaten then I am all for it!

COME ON ENGLAND

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The Batman

The Batman

Posted
Posted

Has anyone ever met a person who is offended by our flag??

I get the feeling its just the latest crazy politically correct thing......

Problem is in this country is that we are too worried about offending people all the time.... **** it! let them be offended and LETS BE PATRIOTIC englandsmile4wf.gif

I will be carrying a flag round - it would be a bit stupid for someone to accuse me of being racist!

when working for my uni, i was asked to remove my bristol city england flag from my office in case someone found it offensive.

i was also advised against celebrating st george's day at our uni bar. we held it anyway, and there were no problems.

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Riaz

Riaz

Posted
Posted

Riaz,

I have been in the situation where our countrys flag upset someone and it was at a City match coincidentally. Years ago I went to watch the City at Walsall and went for a pint before the game. On entering the pub, I was asked to cover my England rugby shirt for fear of upsetting the locals.

A sad but true story.

I am all for patriotism and will be flying the St George cross in support of OUR team. I really enjoy the surge of patriotic pride that sweeps the nation whenever England are playing in a big tournament. So long as it doesn't turn into volence and bigotted behaviour if / when we get beaten then I am all for it!

COME ON ENGLAND

when working for my uni, i was asked to remove my bristol city england flag from my office in case someone found it offensive.

i was also advised against celebrating st george's day at our uni bar. we held it anyway, and there were no problems.

Shocking - its no wonder some people decide to support the BNP :disapointed2se:

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bs4_bcfc

bs4_bcfc

Posted
Posted

Has anyone ever met a person who is offended by our flag??

I get the feeling its just the latest crazy politically correct thing......

Problem is in this country is that we are too worried about offending people all the time.... **** it! let them be offended and LETS BE PATRIOTIC englandsmile4wf.gif

Well siad Riaz. totally agree. C'MON ENGLAND!!

I will be carrying a flag round - it would be bit stupid for someone to accuse me of being racist!

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Red_Mat

Red_Mat

Posted
Posted

Dear Lord, does nobody read previous posts in a thread?! Do people just read the first one, and think: "I agree passionately! / I disagree vehemently! (delete as appropriate), so I'll post and tell the world just that!"

Noone has ever said you can't wave an England flag and support England.

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Economou

Economou

Posted
Posted

1. British is not a race, the Polish immigrants may have a problem with it... as far as I'm aware polish is not a race, therefore anything between these two groups could not be construed as racism. This could very well be the point they were making.

2. Yes, this is England, we should have the right to support England

3. That's not for a second what that sentence was implying, again I refer to the first point of people fearing that their civil liberties are being removed, they act like sheep

4. Given the evidence that they have been provided, they believe that there are people who don't like it, therefore they have the right to hold the opinion that they should either like it or leave it

5. In France they have banned the Burka, it has nothing to do with it being a 'silly little hat' (which most ironically it isn't even a hat), it has everything to do with it upsetting the status quo of the country

My side isn't with those who have made these rash assumptions on Facebook, do some sodding research in future, and stop getting so scared so easily. Its with 'I'm in the right-ers' who believe anyone expressing an opinion not akin to their own must be a racist. It just forms a 'us and them' mentality, where people start thinking they're better than those with national identity.

The fact is at the end of the day it comes down to something very simple, you either believe in national identity or not. I, for what its worth, do, I think its important that there are differences between the countries of the world... but that means that anyone entering the UK has to play by its rules, if we become a melting pot of hundreds of different cultures, we give up our identity as England. That's all France have done with the Burka, France's identity is, and always has been as a Christian country, they are just protecting that.

Science has taught us that if you put 8 different substances in a beaker, before too long all the substances are equally dispersed. That's fine if you think its the ideal way to live, but that sort of makes everything based around a country pointless. Emmergration, why go somewhere thats exactly like where you came from (the 'I left because of the weather' thing is pathetic), the World Cup, why compete against a nation the exact same as your own?

National Identity is important, please don't mock people who feel the need to stand up for it

I prefer the way we do national identity here ie. not ramming it down your throat every day which is what they do in the country where you're currntly located.

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Fat Cigar

Fat Cigar

Posted
Posted

The story is a pile of rubbish. It's nothing to do with being racist and no-one banning it.

ONE police force has told pubs they can take measures to cut the risk of football related trouble and once of many measures open to them is not to allow shirts. No different to what many pubs, bars and clubs already do...in fact I think some of the bars at most football stadiums, including our own, ban football shirts in certain areas.

So it's nothing to do with racism, it's nothing to do with being 'dictated to by foreigners' - it's just that people as per usual jump to conclusions about these things. Every time a flag pole is taken down it's blamed on 'bloody foreigners' even though it's usually to do with planning restrictions.

Hardly anyone in the country has ever been told not to wave a flag or wear a shirt because of racism - the only people that bring the race card into it are those who then cry foul.

Roughly translated:

England fan waves flag

Copper: "Hello"

England fan: "stop telling me I can't wave my flag"

Copper: "err...I'm not, I was just saying hello"

England fan: "don't accuse me of being racist"

Copper: "I'm not"

England fan: "it's MY country, I can wave my flag if I like"

Copper: "yes, please go ahead"

England fan: "this is political correctness gone mad"

Basically: you CAN wear your England kit, you CAN wave your flags, you CAN celebrate St. Georges Day and hardly anyone will tell you you can't. Get on with it, stop moaning and enjoy yourself

Edit: If people did just get on with it and made less of a fuss about clearly exaggerated stories such as this one then you'd find far more people do show their national pride. It's precisely the people who flag up these stories who are to blame for more people not celebrating Englishness. It's not an issue do don't make it one.

AJ Sylvester: A man (or woman!) after my own heart. Well said. The waving of St George's flags became acceptable during Euro '96 I'd say. There are of course a few over zealous, badly misguided councils or local bureaucrats who like to behave like jobsworths and spoil peoples' fun, but they are a minority, and are usually shouted down by the fair minded, decent majority.

The things is, we're just not really a patriotic country. It's only when the World Cup/European Championships begin that we start to get a little patriotic. It's not in our national character to be obsessive flag-waivers like our American cousins.

And, who the hell actually celebrates St George's Day anyway?? Does anyone even know what it's about?

Right, mini rant over. En-ger-land, En-ger-land, En-ger-land, En-ger-land, En-ger-land, En-ger-land, .........

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