Craig Thomson

[nebristolred]

Because he's messed up in the head. He simply fancies children. He's a peado.

Luckily he's not abused any children (that we know of) - but what I dont understand is the protection of these peado's??

Giving them human rights for example? why?

I think peadophiles should be put down like dogs.... I know many will disagree with me, but why run the risk of them abusing more children by allowing them to live?? because at the end of the day, they will never lose that sexual urge.

Or less extreme.... castrate them?

God, everyone here is really sticking to the average public opinion, which I guess is fair enough, but no one considers this approach.

He clearly has been born with a mental problem, that means he goes for this kind of behaviour. Now, I don't condone what he did for one second, and he deserves punishment, but do you think he chose to be born like this, with this deficiency? Don't you think if he could change his preferences he could? What if you were born with the same problem that means he's like this?

This is why people convicted of things like this do need to be protected, and definitely REHABILITATED as well as punished.

[Nibor]

I don't think they've found a paedo gene yet.

Given the frequency with which sex offenders particularly paedos are found to have themselves been the victims of abuse at an earlier stage of their lives it seems likely to be upbringing not hereditary.

How can society fix this vicious circle? I don't see many options, rehabilitation rate is very low, re-offending rate is very high.

Despite the tabloid readers best wishes, hanging all the abusers won't work either because you don't catch anything like all of them.

If we knew the answer I suspect we'd be doing it.

[Riaz]

God, everyone here is really sticking to the average public opinion, which I guess is fair enough, but no one considers this approach.

He clearly has been born with a mental problem, that means he goes for this kind of behaviour. Now, I don't condone what he did for one second, and he deserves punishment, but do you think he chose to be born like this, with this deficiency? Don't you think if he could change his preferences he could? What if you were born with the same problem that means he's like this?

This is why people convicted of things like this do need to be protected, and definitely REHABILITATED as well as punished.

If they can be rehabilitated then fine - but as I understand it (and I'm no expect) there is no "cure" for these paedo's.

The suggestion of ending someone's life is harsh and extreme - but its better than an innocent child being abused.

Now I'm not, for one minute suggesting this player being put down like a dog - cos he aint actually abused any children - but those that do, should be punished in a way that they are never able to do it again....

[Greedo]

I don't think they've found a paedo gene yet.

Given the frequency with which sex offenders particularly paedos are found to have themselves been the victims of abuse at an earlier stage of their lives it seems likely to be upbringing not hereditary.

How can society fix this vicious circle? I don't see many options, rehabilitation rate is very low, re-offending rate is very high.

Despite the tabloid readers best wishes, hanging all the abusers won't work either because you don't catch anything like all of them.

If we knew the answer I suspect we'd be doing it.

Agree.

We can light the torches and gather the pitchforks if we like, but I think the only way of 'solving' the problem is to look deeper and try to find the root of it.

These people would not choose to be this way if they possibly could.

Is it down to chemical imbalances in the brain, childhood experiences or society? I don't know, but wanting blood is not going to break the cycle.

[dezgimed]

They found a cure for gays so maybe they are working on one for these??

[Esmond Million's Bung]

There is no cure, there is no rehabilitation and just like the Ashton Vale nimby's noboby wants them in their neighbourhood and of course paying out shed loads of money to these sick ***** when their human rights are abused makes matters worse, they buy more sweeties, video games and puppies. The most serious offenders should be locked up for life, many others tagged for life and people like Thompson assessed at the end of his 5 year period on the sex offenders register.

Because at the end of the day, we should try to protect every child and make everybody concerned in releasing these ***** back into the community more accountable, perhaps some of the more forgiving members of this forum should have one stay with them upon their release.

[Nibor]

There is no cure, there is no rehabilitation and just like the Ashton Vale nimby's noboby wants them in their neighbourhood and of course paying out shed loads of money to these sick ***** when their human rights are abused makes matters worse, they buy more sweeties, video games and puppies. The most serious offenders should be locked up for life, many others tagged for life and people like Thompson assessed at the end of his 5 year period on the sex offenders register.

Because at the end of the day, we should try to protect every child and make everybody concerned in releasing these ***** back into the community more accountable, perhaps some of the more forgiving members of this forum should have one stay with them upon their release.

It's got nowt to do with forgiving for me it's about practicality.

What do you propose we do about the 95+% of child abusers and sex offenders whose crimes are never reported?

People will not find a solution to this problem whilst they're busy pretending that stringing 'em up or locking 'em up works. It doesn't.

Mandatory life sentences or death penalties are just as likely to turn child abusers into murderers, after all they face the same penalty so why not lessen the chances of being caught?

What's needed here is less bullshit rhetoric, less press hype, less politics, and a clear thought out strategy led by professionals who've spent their careers studying and treating sex offenders.

Without that, we will continue to have this problem and it will actually get worse and worse.

[Brislingwood Red]

Just shows how much money rather than morals dictate football these days. The fact that Hearts have only suspended him since sponsors have pulled out and supporters have threatened to boycott is shocking. Once found guilty he should've been given the boot.

I wonder how his teammates feel about his behaviour, surely there's gotta be some disharmony in the dressing room??

[Greedo]

Agree 100% Riaz. Sick bastards like him should be put down. It's in their dna no body can change them or rehabilitate them.

If it is "in their DNA", then surely that implies it is something beyond their control?

These people are sick but killing them is not the answer.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

It's got nowt to do with forgiving for me it's about practicality.

What do you propose we do about the 95+% of child abusers and sex offenders whose crimes are never reported?

People will not find a solution to this problem whilst they're busy pretending that stringing 'em up or locking 'em up works. It doesn't.

Mandatory life sentences or death penalties are just as likely to turn child abusers into murderers, after all they face the same penalty so why not lessen the chances of being caught?

What's needed here is less bullshit rhetoric, less press hype, less politics, and a clear thought out strategy led by professionals who've spent their careers studying and treating sex offenders.

Without that, we will continue to have this problem and it will actually get worse and worse.

I bet you ain't got no kids or grand children.

The real problem is until the mythical solutions are found children are still being harmed and I suspect 100 years from now we will be in the same vicious circle.

As a child of the 50's nothing makes me laugh more when at election time I have to listen to politicians trotting out "locking them up is'nt the answer, we need to find out why they re-offend". 50 years later millions wasted on research and reports and we are no further forward, but bet your arse at the next election the same rhetoric will be uttered. i've heard it for 50 years and nothing has changed.

[Greedo]

I bet you ain't got no kids or grand children.

The real problem is until the mythical solutions are found children are still being harmed and I suspect 100 years from now we will be in the same vicious circle.

As a child of the 50's nothing makes me laugh more when at election time I have to listen to politicians trotting out "locking them up is'nt the answer, we need to find out why they re-offend". 50 years later millions wasted on research and reports and we are no further forward, but bet your arse at the next election the same rhetoric will be uttered. i've heard it for 50 years and nothing has changed.

So you'd rather them say "hey, we've spent millions on research in the past but now we're going to let all of that go to waste despite any scientific advances and just resort to banging them up forever and not look into the root of the problem."

[Esmond Million's Bung]

So you'd rather them say "hey, we've spent millions on research in the past but now we're going to let all of that go to waste despite any scientific advances and just resort to banging them up forever and not look into the root of the problem."

it's already been wasted and please what scientific advances has there been?. 50 years of the same rhetoric and no answers, but hey what does it matter a few abused kids v human rights?.

[sglosbcfc]

When i first heard about this case I was expecting it to be a young footballer who had mistaken young teenage girls for much older girls. However, the fact that he knew their ages makes it much worse. I can't believe he seems to have escaped with next to nothing. This is probably a sign that the courts can't keep up with the amount of this type of behaviour that is occuring and that the prisons just couldn't cope with the numbers.

It still seems to be game over for Thomson, how can he run out at Hibs, Rangers, Celtic etc without expecting to be lynched. He would get more abuse than Robbie Savage, Jamie Cureton and Ian Hollowhead rolled into one.

[Nibor]

I bet you ain't got no kids or grand children.

The real problem is until the mythical solutions are found children are still being harmed and I suspect 100 years from now we will be in the same vicious circle.

As a child of the 50's nothing makes me laugh more when at election time I have to listen to politicians trotting out "locking them up is'nt the answer, we need to find out why they re-offend". 50 years later millions wasted on research and reports and we are no further forward, but bet your arse at the next election the same rhetoric will be uttered. i've heard it for 50 years and nothing has changed.

So you've been hearing this same shit for 50 years, during which time the problem has worsened, and your solution is to carry on doing the same thing we know doesn't work?

You're saying we should just give up and continue to fail. I'm not sure how that is going to improve the situation any?

I can guarantee we will still be in the same vicious circle if we follow your approach.

For a start the 95+% of abusers whose crimes aren't even reported will still be walking the streets....

[Riaz]

So you'd rather them say "hey, we've spent millions on research in the past but now we're going to let all of that go to waste despite any scientific advances and just resort to banging them up forever and not look into the root of the problem."

Until there is a proper solution - bang em up, castrate or kill em. Keep them out the way of innocent kids.

Forget human rights - I'm more concerned with the rights of a child to not be abused.

Anyone who thinks paedo's should have rights are just as sick in my mind...

[Mr Popodopolous]

With many crimes, perpetrators so deserve a second chance. With sex crimes however, I tend to think not. Once a paedophile always a paedophile. As a society we do have to learn what to do with these people. In the dark days of the Argentinian dictatorship, anyone who had long hair or was in someway suspect was rounded up and dropped into the South Atlantic from a helicopter.

While debating rights and wrongs of that- probably not for a civilised society though some may go for it I suppose, then again what is a civilised society? Don't understand one bit in particular though- long hair=dropped into South Atlantic? Nice...

[Nibor]

Until there is a proper solution - bang em up, castrate or kill em. Keep them out the way of innocent kids.

Forget human rights - I'm more concerned with the rights of a child to not be abused.

Anyone who thinks paedo's should have rights are just as sick in my mind...

Who mentioned paedos having human rights? Your view expressed here is exactly the sort of bollocks that will ensure that children continue to be abused. You've ignored the vast majority of the offenders for a start - the ones not caught.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

So you've been hearing this same shit for 50 years, during which time the problem has worsened, and your solution is to carry on doing the same thing we know doesn't work?

You're saying we should just give up and continue to fail. I'm not sure how that is going to improve the situation any?

I can guarantee we will still be in the same vicious circle if we follow your approach.

For a start the 95+% of abusers whose crimes aren't even reported will still be walking the streets....

Methinks not for the first time you are twisting what I am saying. I am saying for 50 years this country has tried different approaches, approaches emerging from the various reports from various agencies and so called experts who have told us we must do this, we must do that, we have listened and implemented many of the ideas and still 50 years later we are probably in a worse position and until we do come up with the final solution, the main priority must be protect the kids at all costs.

i'm sorry I can't answer the 95% point, if the crimes are not reported I am at a loss to know what can be done even with research.

[Nibor]

Methinks not for the first time you are twisting what I am saying. I am saying for 50 years this country has tried different approaches, approaches emerging from the various reports from various agencies and so called experts who have told us we must do this, we must do that, we have listened and implemented many of the ideas and still 50 years later we are probably in a worse position and until we do come up with the final solution, the main priority must be protect the kids at all costs.

That's just the thing - we haven't.

This country has banged up sex offenders for 50 years and the re-offending rates for those released are high.

There has been some very limited treatment of sex offenders (there's some published analysis of this from broadmoor available). It has been successful in reducing re-offend rates significantly however not perfectly, and it is only given to a small proportion of offenders.

The analysis would suggest that more work could further reduce re-offense rates and so could wider availability of this sort of treatment.

Your approach of continuing to bang people up and do nothing else is what has failed for 50 years. That is why we need less rhetoric and politics and more expert led policy because only in that case has progress been shown.

i'm sorry I can't answer the 95% point, if the crimes are not reported I am at a loss to know what can be done even with research.

First of all you have to actually show that these people can be treated. A lot of this abuse is within a family, the prospect of someone being hung or locked up for life will not help it get reported, but a chance at treatment might even make perpetrators come forward, as well as family victims report more. (Of course we are talking about treatment whilst in custody, not letting people roam free).

There isn't any magical solution here. But while people refuse to actually think about this as a problem that needs solving in favour of the sort of pointless macho crap we've seen in this thread we will get no closer to one. All I'm advocating is actually trying to let the experts find that solution, rather than pretending the Daily Mail outrage is one.

[Greedo]

That's just the thing - we haven't.

This country has banged up sex offenders for 50 years and the re-offending rates for those released are high.

There has been some very limited treatment of sex offenders (there's some published analysis of this from broadmoor available). It has been successful in reducing re-offend rates significantly however not perfectly, and it is only given to a small proportion of offenders.

The analysis would suggest that more work could further reduce re-offense rates and so could wider availability of this sort of treatment.

Your approach of continuing to bang people up and do nothing else is what has failed for 50 years. That is why we need less rhetoric and politics and more expert led policy because only in that case has progress been shown.

First of all you have to actually show that these people can be treated. A lot of this abuse is within a family, the prospect of someone being hung or locked up for life will not help it get reported, but a chance at treatment might even make perpetrators come forward, as well as family victims report more. (Of course we are talking about treatment whilst in custody, not letting people roam free).

There isn't any magical solution here. But while people refuse to actually think about this as a problem that needs solving in favour of the sort of pointless macho crap we've seen in this thread we will get no closer to one. All I'm advocating is actually trying to let the experts find that solution, rather than pretending the Daily Mail outrage is one.

If there was an Internet version of the phrase 'You took the words out of my mouth', then it applies here.

Couldn't have put it better.

[nebristolred]

There is no cure, there is no rehabilitation and just like the Ashton Vale nimby's noboby wants them in their neighbourhood and of course paying out shed loads of money to these sick ***** when their human rights are abused makes matters worse, they buy more sweeties, video games and puppies. The most serious offenders should be locked up for life, many others tagged for life and people like Thompson assessed at the end of his 5 year period on the sex offenders register.

Because at the end of the day, we should try to protect every child and make everybody concerned in releasing these ***** back into the community more accountable, perhaps some of the more forgiving members of this forum should have one stay with them upon their release.

Are you qualified to say this or are you just spouting rubbish?

I'm 100% sure they can be rehabilitated like this.

Please, don't get me wrong, I'm not sticking up for him. I'm just pointing out why the general public opinion of "he's scum and should be hung" is so wrong.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

That's just the thing - we haven't.

This country has banged up sex offenders for 50 years and the re-offending rates for those released are high.

There has been some very limited treatment of sex offenders (there's some published analysis of this from broadmoor available). It has been successful in reducing re-offend rates significantly however not perfectly, and it is only given to a small proportion of offenders.

The analysis would suggest that more work could further reduce re-offense rates and so could wider availability of this sort of treatment.

Your approach of continuing to bang people up and do nothing else is what has failed for 50 years. That is why we need less rhetoric and politics and more expert led policy because only in that case has progress been shown.

First of all you have to actually show that these people can be treated. A lot of this abuse is within a family, the prospect of someone being hung or locked up for life will not help it get reported, but a chance at treatment might even make perpetrators come forward, as well as family victims report more. (Of course we are talking about treatment whilst in custody, not letting people roam free).

There isn't any magical solution here. But while people refuse to actually think about this as a problem that needs solving in favour of the sort of pointless macho crap we've seen in this thread we will get no closer to one. All I'm advocating is actually trying to let the experts find that solution, rather than pretending the Daily Mail outrage is one.

it has only failed because they have been let out to re-offend and not properly monitored and as for expert led policy, bring it on because so far it has failed as much over the past 50 years as banging them up.

Again back to the unreported 95% we don't hang or lock up for life and still 95% is still unreported. What do you suggest within the family?, the Middlesborough 1980's approach?, where there is intervention on the flimsiest of evidence?.

and for the record it's far from pointless macho crap, that is just insulting you might learn that one day when you have kids of your own, instead of playing Russian roulette with their young lives. Let's wait until the 'experts' find that solution, until then let's try to protect the children and stop protecting the abusers.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Are you qualified to say this or are you just spouting rubbish?

I'm 100% sure they can be rehabilitated like this.

Please, don't get me wrong, I'm not sticking up for him. I'm just pointing out why the general public opinion of "he's scum and should be hung" is so wrong.

of course until it happens to one of yours.

[Nibor]

it has only failed because they have been let out to re-offend and not properly monitored and as for expert led policy, bring it on because so far it has failed as much over the past 50 years as banging them up.

What do you think proper monitoring is? Are you seriously suggesting banging sex offenders up for life? Don't you realise that will lead to increased murder rates?

We haven't had any expert led policy. We've had grudging funding of very limited programmes of research and treatment which have shown some success and then been shitcanned by politicians needing your daily mail reading vote.

Again back to the unreported 95% we don't hang or lock up for life and still 95% is still unreported. What do you suggest within the family?, the Middlesborough 1980's approach?, where there is intervention on the flimsiest of evidence?.

Like I said, you have to create circumstances under which people are more inclined to report the crime. You have to try and take the stigma away from the victim. Demonization of sex offenders is fairly strongly linked to the stigma victims feel.

But mainly, you have to actually think about the problem and try solutions based on evidence not ignore it.

and for the record it's far from pointless macho crap, that is just insulting you might learn that one day when you have kids of your own, instead of playing Russian roulette with their young lives. Let's wait until the 'experts' find that solution, until then let's try to protect the children and stop protecting the abusers.

If you find the phrase pointless macho crap insulting perhaps you should think about solving the problem instead of punishing the offender. Let's be clear: Your way has already failed, more kids get abused. You've already lost at roulette, the odds are stacked against you. Worth trying something else? Particularly when it can be guaranteed to not make things worse, since there is no need to reduce custodial time to achieve it?

[Esmond Million's Bung]

What do you think proper monitoring is? Are you seriously suggesting banging sex offenders up for life? Don't you realise that will lead to increased murder rates?

Well proper monitoring is certainly not the way Jon Venables was allowed to make a mockery of the system, firstly for such a notorious killer his monitoring was a disgrace, being allowed to own a computer, drug use, ignoring his life licence and returning to Merseyside, what ever were his social workers actually doing, it is beyond belief. I am suggesting life for the most serious offenders and certainly for child murderers.

We haven't had any expert led policy. We've had grudging funding of very limited programmes of research and treatment which have shown some success and then been shitcanned by politicians needing your daily mail reading vote.

Sometimes your arrogance knows no bounds, you have no idea what I read or why I have my beliefs on this subject.

Like I said, you have to create circumstances under which people are more inclined to report the crime. You have to try and take the stigma away from the victim. Demonization of sex offenders is fairly strongly linked to the stigma victims feel.

That can only happen at school with trustworthy and skilled professionals, but please how do you target, by social groupings, he lives in a council house ergo?????.

But mainly, you have to actually think about the problem and try solutions based on evidence not ignore it.

of course, but as I have said protect our children first and foremost and when we have solutions implement them.

If you find the phrase pointless macho crap insulting perhaps you should think about solving the problem instead of punishing the offender. Let's be clear: Your way has already failed, more kids get abused. You've already lost at roulette, the odds are stacked against you. Worth trying something else? Particularly when it can be guaranteed to not make things worse, since there is no need to reduce custodial time to achieve it?

Heaven help us for even thinking of punishing an offender, no let's just make it easier for him, firstly give him a computer, that'll help, I mean what harm cannot it do, it's not as if he has access to befriending and grooming kids on a computer.

[Nibor]

That was actually a royal "your" in the daily mail reading vote bit, but I guess I can see how that might upset you

As for your last line, that's the sort of rhetoric that politicians use as they shitcan treatment projects. It's the worst kind of bullshit, I didn't suggest not punishing people or handing out computers. It reads exactly like a Daily Mail editorial, and it's juvenile.

If you can't be arsed to actually argue the points made, but instead want to fabricate some stuff to argue about, please don't bother.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

That was actually a royal "your" in the daily mail reading vote bit, but I guess I can see how that might upset you

As for your last line, that's the sort of rhetoric that politicians use as they shitcan treatment projects. It's the worst kind of bullshit, I didn't suggest not punishing people or handing out computers. It reads exactly like a Daily Mail editorial, and it's juvenile.

If you can't be arsed to actually argue the points made, but instead want to fabricate some stuff to argue about, please don't bother.

Fabricated? Venables recall and subsequent 2nd conviction was because of the downloading of images of child pornography. A computer his social worker did'nt even know that he owned. Computers are more of a reason than the failure of the present system to the increase of child abuse.

I can argue your points, but as somebody pointed out earlier this week, the problem is in your world anyone who disagrees with your view can only ever be wrong.

[boadle]

Because he's messed up in the head. He simply fancies children. He's a peado.

Luckily he's not abused any children (that we know of) - but what I dont understand is the protection of these peado's??

Giving them human rights for example? why?

I think peadophiles should be put down like dogs.... I know many will disagree with me, but why run the risk of them abusing more children by allowing them to live?? because at the end of the day, they will never lose that sexual urge.

Or less extreme.... castrate them?

You should watch 'The Woodsman'. It might change your views somewhat.

[Nibor]

Fabricated? Venables recall and subsequent 2nd conviction was because of the downloading of images of child pornography. A computer his social worker did'nt even know that he owned. Computers are more of a reason than the failure of the present system to the increase of child abuse.

I'm pretty sure the government didn't give him a computer and I'm pretty sure I didn't recommend doing so. In fact it was you who insisted that he be properly monitored but haven't been able to describe what that is or how it could prevent him from acquiring a computer. My point would be that simply locking him up didn't work did it? Perhaps we need to actually try and treat these people as well?

I can argue your points, but as somebody pointed out earlier this week, the problem is in your world anyone who disagrees with your view can only ever be wrong.

If you could limit yourself to arguing the points I actually make, rather than the ones you think I did, it would be more interesting. As for the rest, I think anybody who reads the forum can draw their own conclusions really.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I'm pretty sure the government didn't give him a computer and I'm pretty sure I didn't recommend doing so. In fact it was you who insisted that he be properly monitored but haven't been able to describe what that is or how it could prevent him from acquiring a computer. My point would be that simply locking him up didn't work did it? Perhaps we need to actually try and treat these people as well?

I don't think I suggested the government gave HIM a computer. My point is with proper monitoring the social worker SHOULD have known he had a computer and perhaps have taken appropriate steps to ensure either that it be confiscated or doctored to limit it's use or even checked on a monthly basis by an expert to check for illegal use. I think that would constitute proper monitoring, monthly drug tests and tagging that way his movements can be checked at all times and when he illegally went back to Merseyside (which incidentally was for his own protection) it could be dealt with at the time and not come out during a subsequent investigation. i'm sure SOME would call that an invasion of his human rights, parents of children would probably call it protecting their children. Would this be for life?, it would be for long enough to know that he had'nt re-offended and was no longer a threat, however long that takes.

If you could limit yourself to arguing the points I actually make, rather than the ones you think I did, it would be more interesting. As for the rest, I think anybody who reads the forum can draw their own conclusions really.

And by the way, to get back to the OP, I think that court sentencing of Thomson was entirely appropriate and hopefully will work, the next 5 years on the sex offenders register will hopefully prove that one way or another.