Nogbad the Bad Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Nogbad, reading your posts I know you and I have been at many many of the same games over the years and I have a great respect for what you say as I feel you (and dare I say it me) have bloody well earned the right to say what we think...However you seem to speak with great authority about our 'poisonous dressing room' etc and I am a little confused! I think a rise of player power was what undid GJ, Carey Basso among others were implicated, however our dressing room now? If I am right you apear to be saying that Carey Skuse Elliott are the main protaganists and have played a part in unseating various managers...Pearson and Stead were mentioned (I find Stead a little difficult to see in this light myself) and I will assume there were others. Woolford has gone and never settled and Mr McInnes stated he wanted to move some out but McManus and Foster Cunningham Anderson Baldock and Davies were McInnes men as well as various CBs. Pitman was shipped out by McInnes long after he was discarded so that leaves me little else to go on! Killkenny Taylor and Bolaise were they a part of this poisonous clique or Joe Edwards Joe Bryan and Christian Ribeiro...AA even? I know speaking to officials of the club at various times we have had what has been described as a poisonous dressing room at different times which led directly to the purchase of one player who was brought in to sort it out (which ultimatelty failed and we were relegated and the player himself vilifiedby the supporters among others) and of course under GJ we had the same problem...Marcus was singled out as was the other forward we brought in (the guy who played for Leeds and had all the bad injuries),,,Others were eventually brought to heel, but when Basso made his stand that seemed to be the catalyst again....Having all that going on you would wonder why Maynard would want to stay...But even then LJ was in the dressing room so you would think players would be careful... If a club feels that a player is not putting it in, it is possible to terminate a contract on those grounds and then face the possible legal consequences...The player and the agent concerned would almost certainly not want that action and the player will be forever marked, so if this is still going on that would be my advice....Bring those players in tell them they are not acting within the spirit of their contract and give them warning if this situation does not change the club will take action!! If Carey was part of this problem then paying up his contract until May would have sent the warning that the club were acting! I think you are right the players played their part in the downfall of McInnes, however he never brought an effective CB and midfielder THAT WE DESPARETLY NEEDED instead he bought strikers and wingers,,,,DM IMO was as a big a part of his downfall as anyone in the dressing room or anywhere else, his selection decisions were bordering on bizaar and his substitutions worse. Playing the kids was his last refuge and myself I would have played them months ago Joe/Joe and the two lads yesterday have deserved there shot since October and yet he chose to do nothing....Yes some of the players should be hanging their head in shame but the problem was just as much as McInnes as anyone! IMO Hi REDOXO. The point I am trying to make is that the players named in my previous post have all outstayed their welcome at the club. All have been involved to a greater or lesser degree in squads which have appeared to stop playing for 1 or more managers. Other players involved in similar in the past have been moved on, some now have greater influence than previously, some less, but there is a continuing thread that when the club is in crisis, the managers job is on the line, and character is needed there are players who can't or won't rise to the challenge. Some incoming players are then blighted by the encumbent mindset in the dressing room and hence it is a continuing vicious circle that only a brutal excision of the old guard can break. You mention surprise at mention of Stead, but I believe Del alluded to bitter disappointment with him both by his substitution and his after match comments. I would in any case see him as one who needs to be moved on due to age, wage, and overall contribution. I may be being hard on some players - Marvin for instance is these days shackled by fitness issues rather than a lack of desire - and there are others unnamed who may share equal culpability for Del's demise. The reason I mentioned a poisonous dressing room inherited from Millen was that it was clear certain players were not performing for KM at the end, and, having got away with it then, history was always likely to repeat itself while they remained at the club. I think Del tried incredibly hard to address the CB issue, but really what can you do when half a dozen players reject the club, possibly because of new financial restrictions which mean much better offers are available elsewhere? Perhaps he had finally identified the answer with McFadzean and it will be interesting to see if the new manager shows his approval and concludes that deal. I agree with you that there appeared to be some bizarre decisions come the end, but of course we'll never know the complete picture of why certain players weren't picked, what personal issues existed in the squad which made their inclusion complicated etc. The inclusion of Reid and Burns may indeed have been well overdue, but very welcome nonetheless and it's to be hoped that the appointment of a new manager will not stifle their progress as Del made it very clear after the match that he intended to persevere with them at the expense of players he had lost trust in. O'Driscoll looks a promising appointment so let's hope for a much brighter future for the club whether we have to take the hit of relegation or not, It's been really hard work attending AG for several years, and it's vital the new manager can reinvigorate the club and the fans, even (or especially) those of us whose long term addiction makes the idea of not attending a non starter! 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Nogbad the Bad Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Double post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballwinningcentrehalf Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Oh yay, this old '110% effort!!!!' clichè. A lack of effort is a smaller reason for where we are right now than people state. Some of the more accurate reasons have been listed already, thankfully. It's no coincidence that successful teams that people perceive as working harder are those playing consistent, cohesive systems with the right blend of player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SecretSam Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Take a good look at yourself, ask yourself "Am I doing all I can for my employer?" If the answer's "no", then either pull your socks up or bu99er off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Hi REDOXO. The point I am trying to make is that the players named in my previous post have all outstayed their welcome at the club. All have been involved to a greater or lesser degree in squads which have appeared to stop playing for 1 or more managers. Other players involved in similar in the past have been moved on, some now have greater influence than previously, some less, but there is a continuing thread that when the club is in crisis, the managers job is on the line, and character is needed there are players who can't or won't rise to the challenge. Some incoming players are then blighted by the encumbent mindset in the dressing room and hence it is a continuing vicious circle that only a brutal excision of the old guard can break. You mention surprise at mention of Stead, but I believe Del alluded to bitter disappointment with him both by his substitution and his after match comments. I would in any case see him as one who needs to be moved on due to age, wage, and overall contribution. I may be being hard on some players - Marvin for instance is these days shackled by fitness issues rather than a lack of desire - and there are others unnamed who may share equal culpability for Del's demise. The reason I mentioned a poisonous dressing room inherited from Millen was that it was clear certain players were not performing for KM at the end, and, having got away with it then, history was always likely to repeat itself while they remained at the club. I think Del tried incredibly hard to address the CB issue, but really what can you do when half a dozen players reject the club, possibly because of new financial restrictions which mean much better offers are available elsewhere? Perhaps he had finally identified the answer with McFadzean and it will be interesting to see if the new manager shows his approval and concludes that deal. I agree with you that there appeared to be some bizarre decisions come the end, but of course we'll never know the complete picture of why certain players weren't picked, what personal issues existed in the squad which made their inclusion complicated etc. The inclusion of Reid and Burns may indeed have been well overdue, but very welcome nonetheless and it's to be hoped that the appointment of a new manager will not stifle their progress as Del made it very clear after the match that he intended to persevere with them at the expense of players he had lost trust in. O'Driscoll looks a promising appointment so let's hope for a much brighter future for the club whether we have to take the hit of relegation or not, It's been really hard work attending AG for several years, and it's vital the new manager can reinvigorate the club and the fans, even (or especially) those of us whose long term addiction makes the idea of not attending a non starter! Fingers crossed fella....20 games to get out of it...And sort out the dressing room! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notsobigfatdave Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Players have no effect on the managers attitude in the dressing room other than their efforts or lack of them on the pitch. All this talk of "poisonous dresssing room" , " lost the dressing room" " Lost respect for the manager" is utter rubbish. When our Players take the feild its always to try and do the best they possibly can, personalities or tactics or what they think should be happening just dont come into the equation. GJ and Millen on many occassions told the City players that they were paid to play football for Bristol city... not to think. Sure you can react to a Manager and some Managers can bring the best out in you as a player but never in a Players mind is ...."old Gary or Del is a crap manager and im not going to put it in for him today" or "I dont like playing this way so im not going to try too hard" Each Player pulls on that Club shirt and does his best... take that as read...If their form dips or they are injurred their own personal pride takes a blow and so eventually will their status, prospects, salary and career. This is the Championship not Seria A. The success of the club is determined by results...Dels efforts and lack of success just illustrates the gulf in class between Scottish and English football and the players he signed ( accept Baldock ) are ultimately no better or sometimes worse than the ones which he released. Tactically Del was inept and was totally the wrong man for the Job. His lack of success had nothing to do with the attitude of the Players moreover that he didnt really know what he was doing. A string of defeat after defeat saps the Players confidence intensely and is extremely dissapointing but it doesnt make a professional try any less. so they are all going through the motions now and looking forward to a 100k a year pay cut next season I suppose?..... I dont think so ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Cloud Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Whoever the new manager is, pull your socks up. If you don't want to work hard for our club then disappear. Some of your performances have been a disgrace, and however correct the decision to sack Del is, a large portion of the blame lies squarely at your door. If you don't feel like defending the basics properly, tracking your man, being committed in the tackle, then please request a transfer so we can replace you with people who have a bit of pride in their own performance, regardless of the manager. Cheers, CTID. doubt any players have the bottle to come on here but what about tweeting a cut-down version maybe, they may take some notice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loderingo Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Each Player pulls on that Club shirt and does his best... take that as read...If their form dips or they are injurred their own personal pride takes a blow and so eventually will their status, prospects, salary and career. This is the Championship not Seria A. Sorry not convinced by this at all. We should remember that footballers are humans too. I'm sure on a conscious level footballers don't set out to play badly but on a subconscious level if you are unhappy or demoralised you are much less likely to put in a good performance. And of course there is always complacency which can set in any walk of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 Sorry not convinced by this at all. We should remember that footballers are humans too. I'm sure on a conscious level footballers don't set out to play badly but on a subconscious level if you are unhappy or demoralised you are much less likely to put in a good performance. And of course there is always complacency which can set in any walk of life. The truth seems to be somewhere in the middle as far as David James is concerned: http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2011/jan/08/football-managers-sacked-david-james Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riley the great 86 Posted January 14, 2013 Report Share Posted January 14, 2013 The situation the club finds it self in is not just down to the players, i agree there is a few of them who need getting rid of but Mcinnes and his coaching staff let the players and fans down by his constant chopping and changing players and formations,.... in the end i dont think the players could give a toss as it didnt matter if they played well or badly they still didnt know if they would be in the team the following game..... i know the players should give a 100% at all times but hey they are only human..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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