Money In Football

[Devereux]

Following on from some of the topics about the "Dragons", its got me thinking to a subject that I have thought alot about in recent years. I have gradually felt my love of premiership football erode slightly. I still have it, its just not as strong and binding as it once was. This is all down to the change in dynamic of clubs due to the money flying round.

Now heres a very hard thing to imagine non-emotionally. Would I want Bristol City to take on a Russian billionaire backer who is as unpredictable, ruthless and megalomaniac as Abramovic?

I understand the yes camp....suddenly the club will have no money worries, we can compete for top european players, we will be competing at the top of the prem and possibly the CL most seasons, we will be massively high profile and the fan base will explode. That sharp rise in stature is sure to excite all City fans right?

Now the "no" camp....I actually know a Man City fan who does not enjoy City matches anymore. Yes he loved winning the league last season and part of him loves seeing his club successful (finally), but part of him feels more detached from Man City. He said he hates the fact that City pay HUGE wages to squad players who do not even get a game. He doesnt think the players relate to the fans at all. He hates the fact that none of the players have local links (even the English players). He hates the fact he cannot afford to go to as many games as he could, that the stadium is full of tourists and that the noise levels have noticeably reduced. He hates the fact that players like Tevez and Balotelli can get paid millions and still show public attitude and disrespect to Man City. He hates the fact his foreign players dive too.

Now don't get me wrong, I'd be excited for a while (if we won something that would be amazing)....but then you are left with a club whos support would be predominately from non-Bristolians, whos players would be non-Bristolian, whos owner would be non-Bristolian, whos tickets would increase beyond affordability for most and who would be in the press for spats and large wages and manager sackings constantly.

It makes me appreciate having a rich Bristolian owning our club who is trying to build it slowly and surely.

I think I can honestly say I prefer a slow steady build with Lansdown, than a sharp rise to the top destroying all our culture and principles on the way with a foreign backer

I would imagine alot of the older generation would be in the "no" camp....and alot of the younger in the "yes" camp having been brought up to expect instant success.

an interesting discussion point for fans anyway.

p.s. and should factor in the terrible state of Blackburn, Portsmouth and Forest into that discussion!

[054123]

I have never loved the premier league.

Its a con, a myth perpetuated by the Murdoch Media and the big 4 and sadly the majority have been suckered in.

All that's important is that you enjoy supporting your local football club. What division they play in, or whatever its called, isn't really relevent.

As long as your club is healthy and and vibrant in the community, thats all that matters.

The state of football in this country, the greed that has corrupted the power brokers and it's sad, sad conscious move away from a local, communal focal point to a 'leisure activity', is nothing short of shameful.

It's only City that keeps me going and ironically my passion for them is born out of a football that doesn't exist anymore.

[fka dagest]

I have never loved the premier league.

Its a con, a myth perpetuated by the Murdoch Media and the big 4 and sadly the majority have been suckered in.

All that's important is that you enjoy supporting your local football club. What division they play in, or whatever its called, isn't really relevent.

As long as your club is healthy and and vibrant in the community, thats all that matters.

The state of football in this country, the greed that has corrupted the power brokers and it's sad, sad conscious move away from a local, communal focal point to a 'leisure activity', is nothing short of shameful.

It's only City that keeps me going and ironically my passion for them is born out of a football that doesn't exist anymore.

I can't agree more. I don't follow the Premier League at all. People think it's odd, but I've just got no interest in what is effectively a closed shop competition.

Communities and football in the PL are becoming increasingly estranged. More and more clubs will go the way of Cardiff and just become marketable commodities.

[Eco]

I shouldn't worry, somehow I can't see a Russian billionaire being excited by the prospect of buying Bristol City !

Totally agree with your general point, although I've never been 'in love' with the Premier league but did enjoy top flight footy when there was more competition for the title.

[herman]

I shouldn't worry, somehow I can't see a Russian billionaire being excited by the prospect of buying Bristol City !

Totally agree with your general point, although I've never been 'in love' with the Premier league but did enjoy top flight footy when there was more competition for the title.

can't you? the biggest team in a large catchment area in a fairly affluent region? a city of roughly 1m people, above average earnings, no PL team in reasonable distance...?

[downendcity]

When I was young, football was a working man's game, played by predominantly working men who were paid pretty much a working man's wage. Nowadays, when a pretty ordinary player can earn more in a week than a brain surgeon earns in a year then you know the world has gone mad. When a foreign owner can, at a stroke, eradicate a club's heritage, history and everything the fans hold dear then you realise that money will eventually kill the gose that laid fotball's golden egg.

For most of my life us fans suported our club, increasingly those clubs are less and less football clubs and moreand more becoming global brands used to generate even more money. The fans and supporters who used to be a club's lifeblood are now increasingly a customer base to whom a club can market it's increasinge range of products. Top clubs' financial managers are worried less and less about the fans who live within 50 miles of the ground and more and more about the fans on the other side of the world.

Is the premier league a good thing?

If you are Richard Scudamore - definitely yes!

If you are a top player - definitely yes!

If you are a supporter of a prem team - yes

If your club is on the verge of promotion to the prem - yes, but probably only if you din't think about the possible financial consequences fo failure.

For me, I only think it will be a good thing if we can get there after financial fair play is fully in place and has been proven to be working. I watch the prem on MOTD but find very little to excite me. I live away so don't get to as many games as would like, but I was just as excited to watch us on a dodgy live stream last Saturday as I always was.

Truth is that I'm more worried that we will be playing in league 1 next season than I am about us playing in the prem in the next 5, but I no longer feel passion for promotion to the top flight as I did back in the mid 70's.

[Spike]

can't you? the biggest team in a large catchment area in a fairly affluent region? a city of roughly 1m people, above average earnings, no PL team in reasonable distance...?

This is what I always think, surely it can't be long before some rich guy looking to get a club at cheaper cost but with a lot of potential sees us as a target. That said in our current state we're fine, no-one would want a team likely to be in League One, the gap between us and the Prem would be too large. I do think with the academy being improved and the club starting to thrive if we remain in the Championship or come back up in a few seasons and are looking a lot stronger we could be an investment that a foreigner with a lot of money could see as a good move.

I'd like to think Lansdown would never sell and that we'll never go down that road but football is a very weird sport these days and the business side is almost as big as the football side of it, if not bigger.

[054123]

Is the premier league a good thing?

If you are Richard Scudamore - definitely yes!

If you are a top player - definitely yes!

Only these two I'm afraid.

I don't think the Premier League is that great if your Stoke etc.

Again, it's the allure of getting their, created by those it benefits, that seems the attraction. In terms of supporting a team, i don't really see whats great about the Premiership.

[Monkeh]

I didn't know Richard Scudimore is a quilified lvl 5 ref

[Aizoon]

This is what I always think, surely it can't be long before some rich guy looking to get a club at cheaper cost but with a lot of potential sees us as a target. That said in our current state we're fine, no-one would want a team likely to be in League One, the gap between us and the Prem would be too large. I do think with the academy being improved and the club starting to thrive if we remain in the Championship or come back up in a few seasons and are looking a lot stronger we could be an investment that a foreigner with a lot of money could see as a good move.

I'd like to think Lansdown would never sell and that we'll never go down that road but football is a very weird sport these days and the business side is almost as big as the football side of it, if not bigger.

You know this sounds daft, even to me, but maybe a spell with our heads down in the Third Division while the sh1t-storm blows over might not be a bad idea...

[Mickey Bells left foot]

for me the sooner one of the top clubs goes into administration like Rangers the better. Just don't understand how clubs can be £millions+ in debt and not be in admin and you get teams like Chester City who i believed were in debt by a 100k or 2 and they went bust. I know there's major differences as the top teams are worldwide brands and are raking it in but they are also losing money hand over fist at the same time.

[redcityman]

I have never loved the premier league.

Its a con, a myth perpetuated by the Murdoch Media and the big 4 and sadly the majority have been suckered in.

All that's important is that you enjoy supporting your local football club. What division they play in, or whatever its called, isn't really relevent.

As long as your club is healthy and and vibrant in the community, thats all that matters.

The state of football in this country, the greed that has corrupted the power brokers and it's sad, sad conscious move away from a local, communal focal point to a 'leisure activity', is nothing short of shameful.

It's only City that keeps me going and ironically my passion for them is born out of a football that doesn't exist anymore.

I can't agree more. I don't follow the Premier League at all. People think it's odd, but I've just got no interest in what is effectively a closed shop competition.

Communities and football in the PL are becoming increasingly estranged. More and more clubs will go the way of Cardiff and just become marketable commodities.

When I was young, football was a working man's game, played by predominantly working men who were paid pretty much a working man's wage. Nowadays, when a pretty ordinary player can earn more in a week than a brain surgeon earns in a year then you know the world has gone mad. When a foreign owner can, at a stroke, eradicate a club's heritage, history and everything the fans hold dear then you realise that money will eventually kill the gose that laid fotball's golden egg.

For most of my life us fans suported our club, increasingly those clubs are less and less football clubs and moreand more becoming global brands used to generate even more money. The fans and supporters who used to be a club's lifeblood are now increasingly a customer base to whom a club can market it's increasinge range of products. Top clubs' financial managers are worried less and less about the fans who live within 50 miles of the ground and more and more about the fans on the other side of the world.

Is the premier league a good thing?

If you are Richard Scudamore - definitely yes!

If you are a top player - definitely yes!

If you are a supporter of a prem team - yes

If your club is on the verge of promotion to the prem - yes, but probably only if you din't think about the possible financial consequences fo failure.

For me, I only think it will be a good thing if we can get there after financial fair play is fully in place and has been proven to be working. I watch the prem on MOTD but find very little to excite me. I live away so don't get to as many games as would like, but I was just as excited to watch us on a dodgy live stream last Saturday as I always was.

Truth is that I'm more worried that we will be playing in league 1 next season than I am about us playing in the prem in the next 5, but I no longer feel passion for promotion to the top flight as I did back in the mid 70's.

These sum it up for me.

I don't watch Sky and Match of the Day no longer catches my interest, it's not like I couldn't afford Sky if I wanted to, it's more the fact that I don't want to be feathering the nest of certain clubs who appear intent on stopping competition for their favoured European places.

FFP although in the long run could be a good thing but it wasn't brought in just to ensure clubs ran their finances correctly, but IMO bought in to ensure we never get another Blackburn or Wigan, the chance of another Wimbledon having fairy tale rise to top is also more or less wiped out, basically a closed shop.

If they really wanted a fair play system let's have a wage cap, unfortunately it won't happen, not while top seven teams are eating 99% of the cake and armchair fans are willing to feed it to them.

[Monkeh]

These sum it up for me.

I don't watch Sky and Match of the Day no longer catches my interest, it's not like I couldn't afford Sky if I wanted to, it's more the fact that I don't want to be feathering the nest of certain clubs who appear intent on stopping competition for their favoured European places.

FFP although in the long run could be a good thing wasn't brought in to ensure clubs ran their finances correctly, but IMO bought in to ensure we never get another Blackburn or Wigan, the chance of another Wimbledon having fairy tale rise to top is also more or less wiped out, basically a closed shop.

If they really wanted a fair play system let's have a wage cap, unfortunately it won't happen, not while top seven teams are eating 99% of the cake and armchair fans are willing to feed it to them.

I only really watch championship and league one games now on sky don't watch much of the prem and nothing on ITV because andy townsend is a crap commintaitor,

The prem mid table battle is more intresting to me the top for can **** off and form their own league now

[Aizoon]

These sum it up for me.

I don't watch Sky and Match of the Day no longer catches my interest, it's not like I couldn't afford Sky if I wanted to, it's more the fact that I don't want to be feathering the nest of certain clubs who appear intent on stopping competition for their favoured European places.

FFP although in the long run could be a good thing but it wasn't brought in just to ensure clubs ran their finances correctly, but IMO bought in to ensure we never get another Blackburn or Wigan, the chance of another Wimbledon having fairy tale rise to top is also more or less wiped out, basically a closed shop.

If they really wanted a fair play system let's have a wage cap, unfortunately it won't happen, not while top seven teams are eating 99% of the cake and armchair fans are willing to feed it to them.

I'd go further than that. I do have Sky for the cricket, but I rarely watch the Prem because I find it hideously boring and the commentaries are beyond belief. That's another thing that Cloughie took a pot at. Every game is "scintillating" and "magic". You never hear the commentators admit that it was a pile of dingo's droppings.

I watched Saturday's game on t'Internet, and it was infinitely more exciting than any of the Prem games that have been on in the pub when I wanted a quiet drink.

[054123]

These sum it up for me.

I don't watch Sky and Match of the Day no longer catches my interest, it's not like I couldn't afford Sky if I wanted to, it's more the fact that I don't want to be feathering the nest of certain clubs who appear intent on stopping competition for their favoured European places.

FFP although in the long run could be a good thing but it wasn't brought in just to ensure clubs ran their finances correctly, but IMO bought in to ensure we never get another Blackburn or Wigan, the chance of another Wimbledon having fairy tale rise to top is also more or less wiped out, basically a closed shop.

If they really wanted a fair play system let's have a wage cap, unfortunately it won't happen, not while top seven teams are eating 99% of the cake and armchair fans are willing to feed it to them.

This is exactley right, The last couple of amendments, put forward by Arsenal, serve to only stop clubs obtaining money. I could understand stopping loans, leveraged buyouts etc, huge debt, but if Jack Walker wants to spend £200m on Blackburn, then let him. If i want to spend £1bn on City, thats fine, if i give it openly to the club.

[054123]

I only really watch championship and league one games now on sky don't watch much of the prem and nothing on ITV because andy townsend is a crap commintaitor,

The prem mid table battle is more intresting to me the top for can **** off and form their own league now

I said this to a mate a couple of weeks ago.

The top four need to fork off, form their own Super league and sell whatever they to whoever they want. We can then get back to restructuring the football league, under the guise of a single body, ran for the benefit of all.

[cider-manc]

These sum it up for me.

I don't watch Sky and Match of the Day no longer catches my interest, it's not like I couldn't afford Sky if I wanted to, it's more the fact that I don't want to be feathering the nest of certain clubs who appear intent on stopping competition for their favoured European places.

FFP although in the long run could be a good thing wasn't brought in to ensure clubs ran their finances correctly, but IMO bought in to ensure we never get another Blackburn or Wigan, the chance of another Wimbledon having fairy tale rise to top is also more or less wiped out, basically a closed shop.

If they really wanted a fair play system let's have a wage cap, unfortunately it won't happen, not while top seven teams are eating 99% of the cake and armchair fans are willing to feed it to them.

Exactly my thoughts. The big boys got their 20 year head start and now don't want anyone else spoiling their private party, Manchester City were the last ones in before the door slammed well shut.

Unfortunately I also believe that the FFP will lead to a lot of teams re branding and also increasing ticket prices as clubs try to compete for whatever small gain they possibly can as It can't just be a sugar daddy as they won't be allowed to just throw their money at a club.

We should have taken note of the Germans model years ago.

(I did read an interesting article a few months back suggesting that the more money that comes in the more player power exists and it suggested that players would in the future hire themselves out on shorter and shorter contracts to the highest bidders. So in essence Rooney could play for 3 teams in 3 weeks on 3 1 week contracts- much like a hired gun. Lets hope it never comes to that!)

[Monkeh]

Exactly my thoughts. The big boys got their 20 year head start and now don't want anyone else spoiling their private party, Manchester City were the last ones in before the door slammed well shut.

Unfortunately I also believe that the FFP will lead to a lot of teams re branding and also increasing ticket prices as clubs try to compete for whatever small gain they possibly can as It can't just be a sugar daddy as they won't be allowed to just throw their money at a club.

We should have taken note of the Germans model years ago.

(I did read an interesting article a few months back suggesting that the more money that comes in the more player power exists and it suggested that players would in the future hire themselves out on shorter and shorter contracts to the highest bidders. So in essence Rooney could play for 3 teams in 3 weeks on 3 1 week contracts- much like a hired gun. Lets hope it never comes to that!)

I believe ether fifa or league rules prevent a player from playing for 3 clubs in a season (loans are the exception to this as the parent club still holds the players main registration)

[cider-manc]

I believe ether fifa or league rules prevent a player from playing for 3 clubs in a season (loans are the exception to this as the parent club still holds the players main registration)

They do at the moment. As I said it was simply suggested in the article if the players got to much power.

Clubs buckle to the player power, FIFA or whoever doesn't want to lose the money brought in by the club, all of a sudden the rules change.

[Monkeh]

They do at the moment. As I said it was simply suggested in the article if the players got to much power.

Clubs buckle to the player power, FIFA or whoever doesn't want to lose the money brought in by the club, all of a sudden the rules change.

didn't read it like that but its a good point what with bosmon ruling and players being able to buy up their remaining contract to move etc,

would be intresting if they challenged that too,

Plyers are far too greedy these days, its becoming a very rare to find player loyalty these days

[One Team In Keynsham]

didn't read it like that but its a good point what with bosmon ruling and players being able to buy up their remaining contract to move etc,

would be intresting if they challenged that too,

Plyers are far too greedy these days, its becoming a very rare to find player loyalty these days

The Bosman ruling, in isolation, was a good decision: if you accept that footballers are employees, then the situation that permitted a club to prevent a player leaving at the end of a fixed term contract was unacceptable. How many members of this forum would accept a situation where you wanted to leave Company A for Company B (who had offered you a job, and maybe had offered to double your salary), but Company A refused your move and then reduced your salary?

The problem is the attachment that supporters have for clubs and the misplaced expectation that players will have the same attachment.

That said, I do realise that the fall-out of Bosman is that the balance of power might have shifted too far to the side of players, from clubs. And that clubs may get zero return on the costs spent in player development. But for those that object to players getting paid vast sums of money, stop feeding the system with cash.