Q P R Propose Move To New Ground...

[Maesknoll Red]

What's the betting they don't get problems from judicial reviews and out of town NIMBY's.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-25355950

[herman]

in accordance with their player recruitment policy, QPR's stadium will be 5 years past its prime and vastly overpriced

[Maesknoll Red]

in accordance with their player recruitment policy, QPR's stadium will be 5 years past its prime and vastly overpriced

But I bet they are playing in it years before we play at AV.

[phantom]

Finally hopefully moving away from Loftus Road.

Yeah it was a nice old school ground, but the top tier has to be one of the most uncomfortable stands with poor views too.

With all the redevelopment around White City etc, I'm surprised it has taken them this long

[beaverface]

What's the betting they don't get problems from judicial reviews and out of town NIMBY's.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-25355950

Did I read something in the Evening Post the other day, when Nick Clegg was at the m-shed, that the government were going to make an announcement yesterday (thurs) concerning the mis-use of JR's?

[Monkeh]

they won't get any problems at old oak, there is massive devlopment going on there,

Loftus road much like Ashton Gate isn't fit to host league football now a days not with their ambitions,

[phantom]

they won't get any problems at old oak, there is massive devlopment going on there,

Loftus road much like Ashton Gate isn't fit to host league football now a days not with their ambitions,

 

Is that on the site of where the railway yard was?

[Maesknoll Red]

There are still two depots at Old Oak Common, FGW and HEX. The old EWS depot is now where they are making the concrete liners for the crossrail tunnels and crossrail/ HS2 are going to have stations there.

Massive development, that would take about a 1000 years to get approved in our hick town.

[Keepers Ball]

Sickening isn't it?

In the meantime we get stopped by a bunch of selfish bastards, wasted money and gutless owner and council and having to make do with a second rate plan f stadium

[Bat Fastard]

40000 capacity sounds like they mean Premiership business. 26500 sounds like our ambition is to be a reasonable Championship team.

[Aizoon]

They won't have any problems with NIMBYs and Greens because they've all moved to Bristol (sorry, Lymeswold-on-Avon)

[Cider red]

40000 capacity sounds like they mean Premier League business. 26500 sounds like our ambition is to be a reasonable Championship team.

 

27k sounds like realism to me. 29k with safe standing bairing in mind. When was the last time we averaged over 27k a season? If we ever have!? 40 thousand for qpr a team who average about 15k at the top of the championship sounds optimistic, they will play in a stadium that is 10k short of capacity even in the premier league imo.

[Nogbad the Bad]

27k sounds like realism to me. 29k with safe standing bairing in mind. When was the last time we averaged over 27k a season? If we ever have!? 40 thousand for qpr a team who average about 15k at the top of the championship sounds optimistic, they will play in a stadium that is 10k short of capacity even in the premier league imo.

 

We never have averaged over 27k..

 

26,575 was our highest ever average in 1956.

 

Apart from that 23,000, twice in the 70's.

[WhistleHappy]

..some of their fans are getting a little too excited about it most are happy but some are apparently co ck a hoop! 

[EstoniaTallinnRed]

We never have averaged over 27k..

 

26,575 was our highest ever average in 1956.

 

Apart from that 23,000, twice in the 70's.

 

But I bet they are playing in it years before we play at AV.

I was watching the London news on ITV player as I have now installed Hola unblocker and I am sure they said that QPR wont be moving there until 2043.  Please correct me if I'am wrong.

[Cider red]

We never have averaged over 27k..

 

26,575 was our highest ever average in 1956.

 

Apart from that 23,000, twice in the 70's.

 

Cheers nogbad. Realistic capacity it is then! (If not slightly optimistic)

[Jordan Tansley]

Cheers nogbad. Realistic capacity it is then! (If not slightly optimistic)

 

The past is irrelevant I would say. Should we get to Premiership there would be no ceiling on our potential attendances, they'd all be plastics but they'd all be desperate to watch their first team live at AG.

 

26k does smack of settling, especially with no scope for continued growth.

 

AV is still the best option.

[RedM]

I was watching the London news on ITV player as I have now installed Hola unblocker and I am sure they said that QPR wont be moving there until 2043.  Please correct me if I'am wrong.

Planning permission hoped in 2015, move to new ground in time for 2018/19 season

[Cider red]

The past is irrelevant I would say. Should we get to Premier League there would be no ceiling on our potential attendances, they'd all be plastics but they'd all be desperate to watch their first team live at AG.

 

26k does smack of settling, especially with no scope for continued growth.

 

AV is still the best option.

 

Clubs like Norwich and west brom seem to be doing okay, Charlton were up there for the best part of a decade (and really competing) on a 26k capacity. Id say its more of a quick fix rather than setting Jordan, all the non match day facilities are badly needed as im sure your already more than aware. Personally I think AV will happen 10 years down the line even though we will redevelop the gate first.

[Eco]

We never have averaged over 27k..

 

26,575 was our highest ever average in 1956.

 

Apart from that 23,000, twice in the 70's.

Ddidn't we average more than 23000 in 76/77 ?  Remember more than 30,000 on a few occasions plus plenty of 25000 +

[Nogbad the Bad]

Ddidn't we average more than 23000 in 76/77 ?  Remember more than 30,000 on a few occasions plus plenty of 25000 +

 

No we didn't, it was 23,522.

 

Your overestimating the number of high attendances and also forgetting the 17/18K crowds against the likes of Coventry, Ipswich, Leicester and Sunderland etc.

[Nogbad the Bad]

The past is irrelevant I would say. Should we get to Premier League there would be no ceiling on our potential attendances, they'd all be plastics but they'd all be desperate to watch their first team live at AG.

 

26k does smack of settling, especially with no scope for continued growth.

 

AV is still the best option.

 AV may be ther best option to you but your argument is cobblers.

 

Why would we want to build a bigger stadium 'for all the plastics to watch their first team.' What you actually mean is providing a bigger stadium for opposition fans then.

 

It makes me feel sick that younger fans like you feel so little for BCFC and it's history that you are happy to destroy AG, and move to a new stadium where the only way it could be more successful would be if half those in the ground were opposition supporters, or at best neutrals.

 

Bugger that, give me 14k fanatical Bristol City supporters in the Championship at Ashton Gate, or even 10k in div.1 come to that..

 

In fact if it means moving grounds to accommodate plastic opposition fans bugger the PL altogether - it's complete s**t anyway.

[Jordan Tansley]

 AV may be ther best option to you but your argument is cobblers.

 

Why would we want to build a bigger stadium 'for all the plastics to watch their first team.' What you actually mean is providing a bigger stadium for opposition fans then.

 

It makes me feel sick that younger fans like you feel so little for BCFC and it's history that you are happy to destroy AG, and move to a new stadium where the only way it could be more successful would be if half those in the ground were opposition supporters, or at best neutrals.

 

Bugger that, give me 14k fanatical Bristol City supporters in the Championship at Ashton Gate, or even 10k in div.1 come to that..

 

In fact if it means moving grounds to accommodate plastic opposition fans bugger the PL altogether - it's complete s**t anyway.

 

How dare you? What on earth gives you the right to question how much I care about this football club. You utterly contemptible man.

That you're stuck in the dark ages (A case proven over years of inane, backward postings) does not make you any more caring about this football club. In fact, it makes me feel sick that old men like yourself not only want to hold this club back and sit idly in the status quo, but also this entire nation. Held back by conservative thinking and conservative voting.

BCFC will be here a hell of long time after your death, and mine. How dare you put your moronic, anti-progressive agenda ahead of the continued survival of this football club.

Clearly you have no foresight whatsoever, that's been made abundantly clear. The whole point in getting people through the doors is to eventually convert them to the cause. How the hell do you think fans watching their first game of football are converted? It's not all following dad, especially in a city over-run with 'outsiders' who have moved here and have no allegiance to this city or this club.

 

No wonder the city is such a horrible laughing stock, I bet you voted for Red Trousers too.

[Rich]

No we didn't, it was 23,522.

 

Your overestimating the number of high attendances and also forgetting the 17/18K crowds against the likes of Coventry, Ipswich, Leicester and Sunderland etc.

Just like to point out that. without those higher than proposed capacity attendances, our average would have been much lower, and subsequently much lower revenue. If you don't have the capacity for larger games then you lose money and the possibility of increasing your fan base. As we have never had sustained success for whatever reason, you can only estimate what is achievable on a regular basis and plan for as much success as possible. Or you can settle for mediocrity in an untapped market.

If we had experienced sustained success and never reached capacity, then I'd agree with the argument to restrict capacity and remain unadveturous. 

[Fiale]

How dare you? What on earth gives you the right to question how much I care about this football club. You utterly contemptible man.

That you're stuck in the dark ages (A case proven over years of inane, backward postings) does not make you any more caring about this football club. In fact, it makes me feel sick that old men like yourself not only want to hold this club back and sit idly in the status quo, but also this entire nation. Held back by conservative thinking and conservative voting.

BCFC will be here a hell of long time after your death, and mine. How dare you put your moronic, anti-progressive agenda ahead of the continued survival of this football club.

Clearly you have no foresight whatsoever, that's been made abundantly clear. The whole point in getting people through the doors is to eventually convert them to the cause. How the hell do you think fans watching their first game of football are converted? It's not all following dad, especially in a city over-run with 'outsiders' who have moved here and have no allegiance to this city or this club.

No wonder the city is such a horrible laughing stock, I bet you voted for Red Trousers too.

You can't really attack someone for being a conservative and then insinuate they voted for a left wing liberal because of it.. Makes no sense..

But yes, a hell of a lot of people seem to want a bygone age brought back by doing the club progressing. The club needs to keep creating it's history, whatever it does will be part of that.. Hopefully one moving forward and giving fans something to be proud of.

[Nogbad the Bad]

Just like to point out that. without those higher than proposed capacity attendances, our average would have been much lower, and subsequently much lower revenue. If you don't have the capacity for larger games then you lose money and the possibility of increasing your fan base. As we have never had sustained success for whatever reason, you can only estimate what is achievable on a regular basis and plan for as much success as possible. Or you can settle for mediocrity in an untapped market.

If we had experienced sustained success and never reached capacity, then I'd agree with the argument to restrict capacity and remain unadveturous. 

Thank you for your measured reply Rich, I know you've always felt strongly about AV, and have spent alot of time and effort arguing it's case on many fronts.

 

Yes, we would have got lower gates for a few games in the old First Division with a 27,5k capacity - Liverpool, Leeds, Man. Utd, Forest from memory - but really not many. I don't expect BCFC to have sustained (top 8?) sucess at the top level at any time in the future, too many traditionally successful clubs have stolen a march on us for that to happen. I don't particularly want to be in a two thirds empty stadium if we never get there either.

 

I don't think 27K (30K+ with the possibility of Safe Standing areas, and these then being increased further over time) is really either restricting capacity, or being unadventurous when our history shows we would probably rarely need to exceed that in the event of City reaching the top league. Why stop at 40k at AV if we're really feeling ambitious and the potential crowds are out there - should we not be looking to equal Man.Utd.'s capacity if we really think one day we might compete with the likes of them?.

 

Anyway my point is I'm not comfortable if the majority of extra fans were not Bristol City fans, and there's no reason for me to think that thousands of Bristol based people would suddenly convert to City after being fans of PL teams for many years. I don't want to be surrounded by neutrals or one match a season Bristol football fans who want the visiting team to win.

 

I'm content that with a 27-30k stadium at AG City could one day be a competitive Championship club with genuine thoughts of promotion and even the occasional lower to mid table season in the PL (as much as I don't particularly desire to see City in the modern top division) and personally, bearing in mind the general apathy amongst Bristolians, I can't see us building up a massive new fanbase. I'd rather witness any City success at a ground and location that I love rather than at a slightly bigger new ground, having walked past a supermarket where AG used to be, just to get there. And I want to be surrounded by genuine BCFC fans wherever we end up. 

 

If we stay at a redeveloped Ashton Gate and occasionally a few thousand plastic PL supporting Bristol based fans couldn't get a ticket to watch their team when the big teams came down, well, I wouldn't lose any sleep over that.

[Rich]

Thank you for your measured reply Rich, I know you've always felt strongly about AV, and have spent alot of time and effort arguing it's case on many fronts.

 

Yes, we would have got lower gates for a few games in the old First Division with a 27,5k capacity - Liverpool, Leeds, Man. Utd, Forest from memory - but really not many. I don't expect BCFC to have sustained (top 8?) sucess at the top level at any time in the future, too many traditionally successful clubs have stolen a march on us for that to happen. I don't particularly want to be in a two thirds empty stadium if we never get there either.

 

I don't think 27K (30K+ with the possibility of Safe Standing areas, and these then being increased further over time) is really either restricting capacity, or being unadventurous when our history shows we would probably rarely need to exceed that in the event of City reaching the top league. Why stop at 40k at AV if we're really feeling ambitious and the potential crowds are out there - should we not be looking to equal Man.Utd.'s capacity if we really think one day we might compete with the likes of them?.

 

Anyway my point is I'm not comfortable if the majority of extra fans were not Bristol City fans, and there's no reason for me to think that thousands of Bristol based people would suddenly convert to City after being fans of PL teams for many years. I don't want to be surrounded by neutrals or one match a season Bristol football fans who want the visiting team to win.

 

I'm content that with a 27-30k stadium at AG City could one day be a competitive Championship club with genuine thoughts of promotion and even the occasional lower to mid table season in the PL (as much as I don't particularly desire to see City in the modern top division) and personally, bearing in mind the general apathy amongst Bristolians, I can't see us building up a massive new fanbase. I'd rather witness any City success at a ground and location that I love rather than at a slightly bigger new ground, having walked past a supermarket where AG used to be, just to get there. And I want to be surrounded by genuine BCFC fans wherever we end up. 

 

If we stay at a redeveloped Ashton Gate and occasionally a few thousand plastic PL supporting Bristol based fans couldn't get a ticket to watch their team when the big teams came down, well, I wouldn't lose any sleep over that.

Just listened to Cotterill on the league radio show and the presenter stated that we have a massive city with untapped potential and a large caption area.

 

As you well know, an average crowd of say 10,000 is made up of people who attend to varying degrees, say 6k every match, 2k twenty games 1k fifteen games  1k every six or so games. I don't know the exact scientific figures but it covers about 20,000 regular attendees. If you are successful those figure increase.

That I believe is what should be aiming for, a steady increase in regular watchers.  I don't want to see our stadium filled with people who are not there supporting the team but, you have to get then there first and then win them over. If we attract people who go because of the opposition then some might return to watch more and hopefully become regular supporters, as many have done over the years. I'm sure you and all of us know people who are lapsed supporters, or people who would attend matches if there were attractive games and opposition and more importantly, a chance of success. This area has been so starved of anything that resembles success that it meekly accepts that, and can't be bothered to strive for anything that might be a little risky and upset the applecart of mediocrity.

I understand your feelings regarding regular attendees at the gate and the comeradery amongst those. Ask yourself this, how many fans standing/sitting near you have been there as long as you and how many no longer go, over say a twenty year period.

I'll bet it's changed a great deal, with others taking their place, Our crowds were comparable to the old second div over recent seasons, so it's concieveable that we could once more achieve those higher attendances, however infrequently, if we did ever reach the promised land. The challenge is to stay there and sustain success, a task never before achieved, why restrict your chances financially with restricted capacity? After all, when the capacity was 42,000, you probably didn't complain about playing in a stadium a quater to half full.

[Barrs Court Red]

AV may be ther best option to you but your argument is cobblers.

Why would we want to build a bigger stadium 'for all the plastics to watch their first team.' What you actually mean is providing a bigger stadium for opposition fans then.

It makes me feel sick that younger fans like you feel so little for BCFC and it's history that you are happy to destroy AG, and move to a new stadium where the only way it could be more successful would be if half those in the ground were opposition supporters, or at best neutrals.

Bugger that, give me 14k fanatical Bristol City supporters in the Championship at Ashton Gate, or even 10k in div.1 come to that..

In fact if it means moving grounds to accommodate plastic opposition fans bugger the PL altogether - it's complete s**t anyway.

I feel sorry for you. Your small time thinking is typical of so many Bristolians.

Have you even ever left Bristol?

[Lew-T]

AV may be ther best option to you but your argument is cobblers.

Why would we want to build a bigger stadium 'for all the plastics to watch their first team.' What you actually mean is providing a bigger stadium for opposition fans then.

It makes me feel sick that younger fans like you feel so little for BCFC and it's history that you are happy to destroy AG, and move to a new stadium where the only way it could be more successful would be if half those in the ground were opposition supporters, or at best neutrals.

Bugger that, give me 14k fanatical Bristol City supporters in the Championship at Ashton Gate, or even 10k in div.1 come to that..

In fact if it means moving grounds to accommodate plastic opposition fans bugger the PL altogether - it's complete s**t anyway.

That's quite narrow minded of you Nogbad. These 'plastic' fans will get the bug, just like me and you. Some won't ovcourse but surely there's a chance to extend our fanbase and become a 'bigger' club in AV. Past supporters haven't just gone to a City game being a supporter even before stepping inside the Gate!

Everybody was a neutral. But it's just getting them to come again. Being in the PL will do that IMO

[Nogbad the Bad]

That's quite narrow minded of you Nogbad. These 'plastic' fans will get the bug, just like me and you. Some won't ovcourse but surely there's a chance to extend our fanbase and become a 'bigger' club in AV. Past supporters haven't just gone to a City game being a supporter even before stepping inside the Gate!

Everybody was a neutral. But it's just getting them to come again. Being in the PL will do that IMO

 

Narrow minded for giving my opinion? Cheers Lew.

 

I'll just add I know of whole families, Bristolians, where the father started actively supporting Liverpool/ Chelsea/ Man.Utd in the 70's/early80's, his grown up son supports them, and the grandchildren are being brought up to do the same.They regularly travel from Bristol to matches as a family and have no interest in Bristol City/Rovers, and never will do.I'm not just talking about one or two either, we have had numerous builders working on the house over the years where this has been the case, all local Bristolians, and I can't remember one who I could talk to as a fellow City fan.

 

In their own minds they are as ingrained in their support for their teams as we are for City.

 

They, and the thousands of other Bristolians who support PL teams from their armchairs, or in the pub, will never get the bug for BCFC like we did, their affection is already rooted elsewhere and they don't even like Bristol City.

 

They will support their team against us at AG, and the bigger the Stadium we provide, the more of them there will be.

 

I want to see the majority of fans in Bristol City's stadium supporting Bristol City and a redeveloped AG can amply provide for our needs, and increasing our fanbase, with 10,000+ increased capacity.

 

I don't think that's narrow minded, it's simply a reality others haven't come to terms with, or don't care about, in their determination to see the biggest stadium possible, whatever the make up of the crowd inside.

 

I don't, and won't ever agree with that being the way forward for BCFC.