Lack of Action Man Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Recently, I've noticed that the topic of refereeing and the standard thereof in English football has once again become a topic that has featured heavily on TV and radio. A series of baffling decisions and generally poor refereeing performances has once again opened this can of worms, though what has been refreshing is the response of football fans who've have come out in support of referees in light of the difficulty of getting every decision 100% right - it's just not humanly possible, especially when certain laws of football are open to interpretation, such as ball to hand vs hand ball.The reemergence of the topic of refereeing got me thinking about the general standard of refereeing in this country, what we do well and what could be improved upon. Firstly, I was listening to a radio interview with Graham Poll (he of the three card trick fame) recently where he questioned the athletic desire of some current referees, using Mark Clattenburg as a positive example. I thought this was an excellent point well made - though Clattenburg isn't perhaps in the same league as Collina, he does make good efforts to keep himself in a good athletic condition and enthusiastically looks to keep up with play and make sure his eyeline is in a prime position relative to the area of interest. Before him, Howard Webb did the same - what we don't ask as fans is for a referee to be able to do 50 to 60 yard sprints every 10 seconds, but rather 15 - 30 yard sprints as and when they are needed and maintain a steady pace relative to the game when the ball is in play. However, if I was to contrast this with say Phil Dowd or the majority of the referees at League 1 level, can I say that they are A) Athletic or B) Enthusiastic about getting into key areas for line of sight? No, I cannot - and herein lies an inherent problem with referees in this country because for all the professional training they receive about decision making and recognising situations that may arise, if they aren't able to get themselves into a position where they have good line of sight to the action then they've already lost half the battle. Graham Poll also touched upon how referees are trained to have the mentality whereby it's acceptable (not encouraged) to not see a decision that could have been given, but it is not acceptable to give a decision that wasn't seen - i.e. handball actually hitting the face - something which was seen by a whole stadium but not one man. Surely, this mentality encourages an apathy in referees towards improving their physical condition and mentality towards their on the field positioning and athleticism. Secondly, I feel that somewhere along the line officiating in football has become too reliant on the usage of the modern headset equipment. In footage I've seen from games 30 - 40 years ago, because there wasn't the communication technology like there is today available to referees, there were instances where the linesmen were able to stop the game themselves if they felt a serious enough offence had occured. I can't think of the last time I saw a linesman make a 'in the game' decision like awarding a free kick that wasn't for offside - in my opinion the linesmen of today communicate using their headsets for decisions which are blatently obvious but don't want to signal for anything else because they feel that the referee is in control or should've picked it up - this opinion coming from my experiences of playing football up to County level. Regarding how linesmen of the past took the authority to stop the game for infringements, for me this is a positive thing for a couple of reasons, firstly: it sends a message out to the 22 players that it's not just one person officiating the match its a team of four and that if you are up to anything naughty, it isn't just one person that may or may not have even seen the incident that has to make the decision. Secondly, it demonstrates togetherness and presence of the match officials to the fans in the stand - all to often have I heard at AG phrases along the lines of "What's the point in having you there if you're not going to make a decision lino?", with certain expletives deleted of course. Now for all we know, the linesman may have signalled using his headset that an infringement was made but the referee decided to play on. In my opinion, all three on field officials need to have equal authority to award infringement foul decisions, or at the very least the two that are present in the active half of the pitch. Furthermore, when fans and also players can visibly see the officals discussing a decision, they know that it isn't just going to be the opinion of one man against say 25,000 it's a team decision - I think that this sits a lot better with fans than the former. I think perhaps that too much emphasis has been placed on training modern linesmen to pick up on the offside rule (because of its convuluted nature regarding interference with play vs non interference) and that this also contributes towards the linesmen taking a less active role in the officiating of the match. If this is the case then this is where the fourth official can be involved - in this day and age it is not paticularly challenging economically or logistically for the big clubs to install a touchline monitor for the fourth official - he then can watch a live feed of the match and has the benefit of replays so he can further assist the on field officials in case they have missed something. I've discussed a number of suggestions with players and fans over how officiating in football could be improved. One such suggestion was that we look towards Futsal and Hockey by introducing a referee for each half of the pitch. However, instantly this suggestion was shot down by a friend saying that at amateur level, where there is already a drastic shortage of referees, it would put too much strain on league organisers and in games where independent officials were not present it could lead to fights between teams since one referee from each team would never be to agree on decisions, which I will concede is a fair point. For every comment though, someone had something to detract from it - again I feel that this is another problem. We're very quick to criticise or find holes in suggestions to improve match officiating. So now I'd like to open it up to the OTIB faithful - what do we do well officiating in this country and what can we do to improve the standard of referees and furthermore entice more people into becoming referees to end the current shortfall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkeh Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 No worse the. It's always been Those picking it a part are taking apart calls after super slow motion and from various angles The ref gets to see it on at speed and has to make a snap judgement If you want to improve refs then give them acess to the tech that exists in other sports Also ban Jose from this country Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gillies Downs Leeds Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Players stop "cheating", refereeing becomes a lot easier. Simples!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aizoon Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Players stop "cheating", refereeing becomes a lot easier. Simples!! Referees (and possibly after-the-event cameras) stop letting cheats get away with it, cheating becomes a lot more difficult. Simples!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 I do think part of the problem is the emphasis refs are obviously told to give towards stopping fouls committed with the feet, which could possible injure a players' legs. The result is blind eyes are turned to all-in wrestling, players put in headlocks at dead ball situations and rampant shirt-pulling, whereas a minor tap on the heel of a boot often gets a card if the player goes down for it. There really ought to be some sort of FA panel examining real time footage of games and studying how the laws are being interpreted and issuing fresh guidelines for officials. That, and the sparing use of technology and retrospective punishment for cheats of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 If the threats and abuse doesn't stop at grassroots football,then in 20 years time we won't have any Referees coming through to Referee at the top level. Young Refs are quitting all the time because of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markyou Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Cracking read OBJ, looking forward to your next article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtonboy Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Retrospective punishment for cheating is a must. Retro yellow cards or even red would soon get clubs who currently encourage it, to stamp it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Cyril Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 Didn't lino's become assistant referees for a while. Did this concept get reversed? And not sure what the name is for the 4th and 5th jokers who stand behind the goal line in euro games. They seriously offer nothing except to block the view of paying fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlBCFC Posted January 7, 2015 Report Share Posted January 7, 2015 A Level 6 referee myself, officiating on the Toolstation Western League, I agree with some of your points OBJ. I can't speak for anything above level 3/2, but we are taught to work as a team and that credibility is key. The ref is in the middle and will make the majority of decisions, the assistants are there to do exactly that - assist him. Different refs will tell you different things, but in my experience the message is the same - as an assistant, within your area of the pitch the decisions are yours to be made, as long as you have credibility to make that decision. Perhaps the assistants feel they dont have the credibility to make those decisions? Lack of support is a massive issue with the shortage of refs, if you have a bad game early in your career and don't recieve support from the County FA, it could quite easily put you off refereeing. The quality of coaching and teaching is fantastic, but it's taken me a promotion and moving up the ranks to get access to any of it. In my opinion there needs to be more support and coaching for level 10-6 referees, because they are the ones that need it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballwinningcentrehalf Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 I actually feel generally they do a good job. The pace and pressure of the game has increased almost exponentially in recent generations and referees are not afforded much help from the authorities in comparison. Feel the extra officials behind the goal should become a standard. More sets of eyes on the game from an officiating standpoint the better. Goal line technology is also a good improvement and was long overdue. Was recently speaking to a friend of a friend, he has in fact performed in the PL as an assistant referee within the last 3 or so years. Apparently assistants do still make a large number of decisions, it is in-fact just that many officiating teams now favour the verbal communication over the frantic waving of their flags. I can understand supporters and pundits that incorrectly bemoan why a referee has given a decision when his assistant is so close and hasn't flagged would be appeased somewhat by a flag being held aloft, but I'd much rather officiating teams worked out a system they are comfortable with instead. Also feel the game has changed so much in terms of contact in recent times that officials are left needing to make a decision almost every time there is any physical confrontation. I am not keen on a return to the 'hatchet' era of previous decades, but each year the amount of force allowed is decreased further. It's a clever move by the authorities to protect its most skilful and marketable assets (nimble attacking players), but it's dumps so much pressure on a referee every time an opponent goes within a foot of a player. In 50 years the game will be unrecognisable. Will probably be manager challenges using TV, sin bins, zero contact allowed during play, everyone will play on 7G artificial pitches and the attacking stars of the day will be allowed to roll on and off whenever they feel like playing during a game. But for today.. I'd be happy with extra officials behind each goal and less resistance to introducing technology that helps officials make the correct calls if they feel they require it. Oh, and added time multi-ball, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 The point made about verbal communication between lino and ref is very interesting. Surely the point of having a flag is that it is a direct means of communicating with everyone in the stadium and should be used more. It's a simple but effective system and should be encouraged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 A Level 6 referee myself, officiating on the Toolstation Western League, I agree with some of your points OBJ. I can't speak for anything above level 3/2, but we are taught to work as a team and that credibility is key. The ref is in the middle and will make the majority of decisions, the assistants are there to do exactly that - assist him. Different refs will tell you different things, but in my experience the message is the same - as an assistant, within your area of the pitch the decisions are yours to be made, as long as you have credibility to make that decision. Perhaps the assistants feel they dont have the credibility to make those decisions? Lack of support is a massive issue with the shortage of refs, if you have a bad game early in your career and don't recieve support from the County FA, it could quite easily put you off refereeing. The quality of coaching and teaching is fantastic, but it's taken me a promotion and moving up the ranks to get access to any of it. In my opinion there needs to be more support and coaching for level 10-6 referees, because they are the ones that need it. When I've been an assistant (not that often I should say) I'm often told by the match referee what he wants me to do. One referee told me my job is offside and throw ins and to give absolutely nothing else. Others tell me different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted January 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 When I've been an assistant (not that often I should say) I'm often told by the match referee what he wants me to do. One referee told me my job is offside and throw ins and to give absolutely nothing else. Others tell me different things. Cracking point and something that happens a lot at amateur level. However I feel that kind of approach is wrong - how can a referee give a foul close to the byline when the linesman would obviously be the closer official? For me, that's the linesman's call to make. He is, after all, part of the match officiating team and would have the closest view. The officials need to work as a team and visually demonstrate that to the players and crowd at professional level. The headsets have stifled this imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballwinningcentrehalf Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Need to be careful you don't confuse points between amateur and professional football, although sometimes they do overlap. At an amateur level I agree with an 'assistant', usually a sub or someone connected with one of the sides, being told not to raise the flag for decisions aside from offsides. I've seen referees get to know certain people and hold that trust in allowing them to officiate more, but you turn up to take a league game with a sub running the line for you and no way should you be telling them to go around waving for decisions on the field. Generally you are lucky if you can just find someone to keep up with play and call offsides correctly. Conversely, I don't think any referee with a legitimate assistant should be telling him not to call decisions, as has been said they will often have the best viewpoint of certain events. And lastly, I can't say I'm fussed by an assistant at the top level raising his flag more. It's nothing more than pandering to fans and pundits who don't understand the officials are in constant communication using a system they probably prefer. It's like the ignorant people that believe the extra officials behind the goal do nothing but stand there silently not seeing anything. There are some excellent referee documentaries out there, and was a very good programme with Colina on Sky a few months back that covered a lot of this. What I'd love most is a stream of the referees communications during a match available to listen to. Would be fantastic to 'see' a top level game from their points of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted January 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Need to be careful you don't confuse points between amateur and professional football, although sometimes they do overlap. At an amateur level I agree with an 'assistant', usually a sub or someone connected with one of the sides, being told not to raise the flag for decisions aside from offsides. I've seen referees get to know certain people and hold that trust in allowing them to officiate more, but you turn up to take a league game with a sub running the line for you and no way should you be telling them to go around waving for decisions on the field. Generally you are lucky if you can just find someone to keep up with play and call offsides correctly. Conversely, I don't think any referee with a legitimate assistant should be telling him not to call decisions, as has been said they will often have the best viewpoint of certain events. And lastly, I can't say I'm fussed by an assistant at the top level raising his flag more. It's nothing more than pandering to fans and pundits who don't understand the officials are in constant communication using a system they probably prefer. It's like the ignorant people that believe the extra officials behind the goal do nothing but stand there silently not seeing anything. There are some excellent referee documentaries out there, and was a very good programme with Colina on Sky a few months back that covered a lot of this. What I'd love most is a stream of the referees communications during a match available to listen to. Would be fantastic to 'see' a top level game from their points of view. What a contradictory post. You don't mind not seeing visual evidence of communication between officials through the use of flags and on field discussion... Yet you would like a stream of their headset communications? So in effect you do want to know what they have and haven't each seen.. Which could be achieved through the linesmen and goal line officials taking a more active approach in officiating the game. Regardless of the ignorance of people, visually seeing that the officials are communicating sends out a message and leaves no one in doubt that they are working together. That can't be a bad thing imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballwinningcentrehalf Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 I don't see my post at contradictory, but I see your point. I'm saying I don't need the symbolism of a raised flag to know the referees are part of a team making decisions.. Everyone should know that. For my own selfish interest I'd love to hear the communication between them during a game, however. I'm just at odds with the opinion added communication has stifled officiating. For me it has enhanced it. For instance, a potential foul occurs near the touchline, from the assistant's view it's a clear foul. In days gone by he would flag immediately. Often referees would give this decision immediately to 'save face' for their team. How often before the extended communication did you see an official flag for an infringement and the referee disregard it and play on? Very, very rarely. It would give off an impression of distrust in a fellow official they would be desperate to avoid. Nowadays an official will communicate that they believe they've seen a foul and if the referee has not seen a contradictory angle he will often give it. Assistants still raise their flag to signal in some cases, you'll just notice it's often later than in the past and in-fact often after they've already agreed over the mic an infringement is about to be awarded. Ultimately, as I said originally, I'd prefer the officials played to a system they think succeeds for their team the most, rather than a system that makes fans and pundits happiest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 I'd much rather have a visual aid that didn't interfere with the game then some verbal commentary. It is a simple and effective way to inform everyone what is going on. I have a right as a fan to know what is going on in the game - I don't see that as a problem. I don't need lots of detail however just the basic information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 I'd much rather have a visual aid that didn't interfere with the game then some verbal commentary. It is a simple and effective way to inform everyone what is going on. I have a right as a fan to know what is going on in the game - I don't see that as a problem. I don't need lots of detail however just the basic information Surly the referee blowing his whistle and indicating a free kick is just as clear. Do you need to know which official awarded it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 Surly the referee blowing his whistle and indicating a free kick is just as clear. Do you need to know which official awarded it? no but I like to see why, if it's not clear from where I am Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarlBCFC Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 When I've been an assistant (not that often I should say) I'm often told by the match referee what he wants me to do. One referee told me my job is offside and throw ins and to give absolutely nothing else. Others tell me different things. At amateur level refs are told that they cover all fouls, assistants can come in for offsides and ball in and out of play. As you go higher up and the game has 2 neutral linos, thats when they can make the decisions for themselves without the direction of the referee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted January 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 no but I like to see why, if it's not clear from where I am This is along the lines of what I was alluding to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRoss Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 My two pence. Any factual based decisions the referees need to be supported with technology. For any opinion based decisions everyone has to account for and accept human error. No referee will always make the right decision and that will not change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted January 8, 2015 Report Share Posted January 8, 2015 At amateur level refs are told that they cover all fouls, assistants can come in for offsides and ball in and out of play. As you go higher up and the game has 2 neutral linos, thats when they can make the decisions for themselves without the direction of the referee Never been in a team and was neutral on every occasion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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