Esmond Million's Bung Posted December 8, 2015 Report Share Posted December 8, 2015 Anyone see the Newsnight piece about an experiment about to start in Finland, where every person will be given 800 euros per month regardless of whether they are employed or unemployed, they say the 47 billion per year is the same as it's welfare bill already is. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/finland-plans-to-give-every-citizen-800-euros-a-month-and-scrap-benefits-a6762226.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoke_Gifford_Red Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 Didn't see the show but read it elsewhere - it will be interesting to see whether it actually works. The problem is, if it doesn't work I imagine it will be hard to roll back once many have become use to 800 euro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasbuster Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 The biggest problem will be for the disabled community. A significant number will be receiving more than 800 euros now (when everything is taken into account); and could be facing a sizeable cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrs Court Red Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 does this not risk causing inflation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 30 minutes ago, Barrs Court Red said: does this not risk causing inflation? Unlikely, as the government won't be puting any more money into the economy than they are now. And as some of that money is now going to rich people rather than poor people, it's more likely to be saved. I have no idea what the cost of living is in Finland, but if you re-share the welfare budget to include the vast majority of the population who are working it's clear there are to be some major losers. Not sure you'd be able to rent a home and live on 800 euros, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welcome To The Jungle Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 Does this include children? Imagine getting your pocket money of £500 every month Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTFiGO!?! Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 Sounds lovely in theory, the left half of me likes it a lot. I read it would total less than their current benefit system, the other thing of note is that it would apply to Fins only. I always have liked the Fins, ever since a certain encounter with a fine Fin fillie in my younger days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 Don't they already do this in Switzerland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 1 hour ago, Red-Robbo said: Unlikely, as the government won't be puting any more money into the economy than they are now. And as some of that money is now going to rich people rather than poor people, it's more likely to be saved. I have no idea what the cost of living is in Finland, but if you re-share the welfare budget to include the vast majority of the population who are working it's clear there are to be some major losers. Not sure you'd be able to rent a home and live on 800 euros, for example. Had an Estonian colleague over a few weeks ago and we went out for dinner one night and had a conversation about wages, cost of living etc.....if it's anything like Estonia I can imagine 800 euros is a pretty penny every month, especially on top of their wages. Isn't Scandinavia quite an expensive place though? I like the idea, and fair play to them for trying it out, will certainly be keeping an eye on how it goes for them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 1 minute ago, Woodsy said: Had an Estonian colleague over a few weeks ago and we went out for dinner one night and had a conversation about wages, cost of living etc.....if it's anything like Estonia I can imagine 800 euros is a pretty penny every month, especially on top of their wages. Isn't Scandinavia quite an expensive place though? I like the idea, and fair play to them for trying it out, will certainly be keeping an eye on how it goes for them Although they have a similar language, Estonia (and the other Baltic States) are gonna be much cheaper places to live than Finland. Maybe you get a free house in Finland if you're on the sausage roll or disabled? I don't know. Distributing the welfare budget to include the working can only leave some people much worse off though - even allowing for savings made by simplifying the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 3 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said: Although they have a similar language, Estonia (and the other Baltic States) are gonna be much cheaper places to live than Finland. Maybe you get a free house in Finland if you're on the sausage roll or disabled? I don't know. Distributing the welfare budget to include the working can only leave some people much worse off though - even allowing for savings made by simplifying the system. The colleague who came over, her husband works most of the year in Finland as the money is better, so I'm sure you are correct on the first part As for the second part, it's not an easy system to implement. They must have done the maths though..... I've always said that over here you should get your birthday month off from paying tax. Half should go into savings and there should be an approved list of places where you can spend the other half on goods, services, whatever the hell you like. But spend it on British goods, with British companies who pay tax etc etc. Won't ever happen, but I guess this is something along those lines. I like the idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bard Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 It's most certainly not left wing. As someone pointed out it means income redistribution from the poor to the rich. Simple. Big losers are the Disabled as they will be here when Universal Credit is fully introduced. Not wanting to give too many details but I dealt with someone last week who was receiving over £1100 in Welfare benefits per week...An equivalent person in Universal Credit would receive £100s less per week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipdawg Posted December 9, 2015 Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 4 hours ago, Red-Robbo said: Although they have a similar language, Estonia (and the other Baltic States) are gonna be much cheaper places to live than Finland. Maybe you get a free house in Finland if you're on the sausage roll or disabled? I don't know. Distributing the welfare budget to include the working can only leave some people much worse off though - even allowing for savings made by simplifying the system. Unless they withdraw other public sector services and make admin savings, I agree. Interesting concept though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted December 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2015 5 hours ago, The Bard said: It's most certainly not left wing. As someone pointed out it means income redistribution from the poor to the rich. Simple. Big losers are the Disabled as they will be here when Universal Credit is fully introduced. Not wanting to give too many details but I dealt with someone last week who was receiving over £1100 in Welfare benefits per week...An equivalent person in Universal Credit would receive £100s less per week. I agree but I assume the Finns belief is that most disabled people live with family and so you could be multiplying the 800 euros by 2 or more, just a thought. The biggest problem of all is the amount of people who will become reliant on this 800 euro per month experiment (which is human nature) and will be in financial hardship if the experiment fails and the old system is reinstated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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