PHILINFRANCE Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 2 hours ago, CotswoldRed said: No chance they will go out of business. The administrator looks for a buyer - there will be plenty of willing buyers for a basement price club with no debt. But that is their main problem. Their current owner is prepared to write off Bolton's debt to him, but they owe millions to HMRC and others - £20M if I understand correctly. Thus, any potential buyer, even somebody who just takes over the club for free, has to first pay off the £20M and then finance their monthly £1M losses - a difficult task with administration and in Division 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daored Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 I think this is unfortunately perfectly sums up modern football and in my opinion will only get worse. The money to the premiership clubs for next season is just ridiculous and as we're seeing this year a number of championship clubs are gambling on getting into the premiership next season to have a slice of the pie. For those clubs that fail to make it , will be interesting to see how they cope, one club that springs to mind being QPR. Plus for clubs in the premiership , relegation is unthinkable, a club like villa going down. For me, I'm enjoying this season, decent grounds, crowds and some really good footballers. Would take a stable Bristol city in the championship , rather than chase that dream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotswoldRed Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 9 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said: But that is their main problem. Their current owner is prepared to write off Bolton's debt to him, but they owe millions to HMRC and others - £20M if I understand correctly. Thus, any potential buyer, even somebody who just takes over the club for free, has to first pay off the £20M and then finance their monthly £1M losses - a difficult task with administration and in Division 1. No they don't. A sale of assets will raise cash to pay off creditors (a percentage only of course) with the HMRC first in line. A sale is not dependent on taking on debts. That would be a takeover. We are talking about administration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 23 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said: No they don't. A sale of assets will raise cash to pay off creditors (a percentage only of course) with the HMRC first in line. A sale is not dependent on taking on debts. That would be a takeover. We are talking about administration. My apologies. I was referring to a sale and not administration, but their problem still exists. A sale would require a huge investment (outstanding debts included) whilst administration, in addition to the 12 point reduction, suggests Division 1 and little chance of financial security in the short/medium term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 39 minutes ago, CotswoldRed said: No they don't. A sale of assets will raise cash to pay off creditors (a percentage only of course) with the HMRC first in line. A sale is not dependent on taking on debts. That would be a takeover. We are talking about administration. Explain assets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 2 minutes ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: Explain assets. Players, ground? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malago Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 I hope Bolton survive and spend many a happy season bouncing between the lower leagues. It's not supriding really. Nearly all the clubs which Pre 1992 were solid level 2/3 clubs that subsequently had a run in the premier league are back down where they should be,; Charlton. Oldham, Bolton, Pompey, Blackburn, ( certs for relegation to league 1 within 3 years) Sheffield Utd etc, have had their day in the sun, but what goes up must come down. It's not difficult to forsee that Swansea, Stoke and Hull will be playing league 1 football in the not too distant future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 6 minutes ago, Malago said: I hope Bolton survive and spend many a happy season bouncing between the lower leagues. It's not supriding really. Nearly all the clubs which Pre 1992 were solid level 2/3 clubs that subsequently had a run in the premier league are back down where they should be,; Charlton. Oldham, Bolton, Pompey, Blackburn, ( certs for relegation to league 1 within 3 years) Sheffield Utd etc, have had their day in the sun, but what goes up must come down. It's not difficult to forsee that Swansea, Stoke and Hull will be playing league 1 football in the not too distant future. And Bristol City? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malago Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 1 minute ago, PHILINFRANCE said: And Bristol City? If we ever make it to the "promise land" I'm sure we could expect the same fate, hopefully without the going into admin part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTFiGO!?! Posted December 10, 2015 Report Share Posted December 10, 2015 4 hours ago, Cider red said: id take jay spearing off their hands I'd take the 12 points off their hands. Gotta feel for the supporters, a brave new world for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 9 hours ago, Malago said: I hope Bolton survive and spend many a happy season bouncing between the lower leagues. It's not supriding really. Nearly all the clubs which Pre 1992 were solid level 2/3 clubs that subsequently had a run in the premier league are back down where they should be,; Charlton. Oldham, Bolton, Pompey, Blackburn, ( certs for relegation to league 1 within 3 years) Sheffield Utd etc, have had their day in the sun, but what goes up must come down. It's not difficult to forsee that Swansea, Stoke and Hull will be playing league 1 football in the not too distant future. Why would Stoke be heading to league 1 ???! A well run club with a great premier league manager signing players from Barcelona etc. Currently doing very well indeed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HLR Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 10 hours ago, CotswoldRed said: No they don't. A sale of assets will raise cash to pay off creditors (a percentage only of course) with the HMRC first in line. A sale is not dependent on taking on debts. That would be a takeover. We are talking about administration. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HLR Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 They would still at this stage most likely be looking at entering into a CVA (Company Voluntary Arrangement) - whereby they agree a payment plan to pay off their debt's/part of their debts, whilst taking pressure off themselves from creditors . For this to work however they would need those that are owed 75% value of their whole debt to agree to this scheme - otherwise it won't be approved & if they can't agree that, or find x amount between now and the court hearing in January, then the likelihood is they will enter administration. Even if the owner who is owed the most part of the debt chooses not to claim that, HMRC are unlikely to drop their winding up petition unless the Company Voluntary Arrangement looks like offering a better financial return than administration. It isn't even like Bolton can now offer Bolton a hush hush cut price amount now, as now it has been reported to media, any other creditors owed money will now jump on bandwagon and potential seek legal action/will submit formal action like HMRC have done against the club. Whatever the outcome, it looks relatively bleak for BWFC at this point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 14 hours ago, SecretSam said: I remember many entertaining games against them down the years, especially back in the '80s. Plus they were our opposition in the first FRT final. Wish them well. If we finish ahead of them I hope it's not just due to a points deduction. I thought of our first Wembley final too. What a contrast in fortunes since then for both clubs. They've had cup finals, the premiership, European football, relocated, dealt in millions instead of thousands. Must have been some good times and memories for their fans. Ok yes they are now having a downturn in fortunes, and not looking good but I suppose the higher you rise the further you can fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 14 minutes ago, RedM said: I thought of our first Wembley final too. What a contrast in fortunes since then for both clubs. They've had cup finals, the premiership, European football, relocated, dealt in millions instead of thousands. Must have been some good times and memories for their fans. Ok yes they are now having a downturn in fortunes, and not looking good but I suppose the higher you rise the further you can fall. And don't we know all about that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasbuster Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 15 hours ago, SecretSam said: I remember many entertaining games against them down the years, especially back in the '80s. Plus they were our opposition in the first FRT final. Wish them well. If we finish ahead of them I hope it's not just due to a points deduction. Didn't we hold some sort of "Indian Sign" over them for decades, i.e we were their bogey team ? IIRC, when they won at AG in the early 2000's, it was their first win at our place for something like 80 odd years ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 It makes you think where would we be if we weren't backed a very wealthy chairman. I always wonder what the contingency plan is after Landsdown ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 59 minutes ago, shelts said: It makes you think where would we be if we weren't backed a very wealthy chairman. I always wonder what the contingency plan is after Landsdown ? ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly The Kid Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 1 hour ago, shelts said: It makes you think where would we be if we weren't backed a very wealthy chairman. I always wonder what the contingency plan is after Landsdown ? I don't suppose there is one... That said, even with him, regarding player recruitment this season, there appears to be no plan, either master or contingency.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddoh Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 14 hours ago, nickolas said: Perhaps they could go bust and the Gash could steal their ground off them for £1 just like the minimal with bristol rugby then they can f00k off up there out of the way!! there is only one team in bolton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbored Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 1 hour ago, shelts said: It makes you think where would we be if we weren't backed a very wealthy chairman. I always wonder what the contingency plan is after Landsdown ? Not bashing Lansdown so dont take my comments the wrong way ...but Probably more or less the same place as we have been ever since i have followed city circa late 80`s onwards even possibly without so much debt and also owning our own stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 What seems odd to me is that in this thread, our fans have highlighted 5 Bolton players they want, even though Bolton are 4 points worse off than we are currently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 14 minutes ago, City169 said: What seems odd to me is that in this thread, our fans have highlighted 5 Bolton players they want, even though Bolton are 4 points worse off than we are currently. It's not what you've got but how you use it that's important . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 5 hours ago, Major Isewater said: It's not what you've got but how you use it that's important . Let's give a top manager the Basingstoke squad and see them in Europe next season then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedorDead BCFC Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 I was told by a Bolton fan there are three possible buyers for the club, but they know if the club go into administration then they can buy the club at a lot cheaper price. Also the chairman said if someone gives him £50 million for the club he will personally write off the debt as the debt is to him and the tax office. Dont know how much of it was true mind, so don't go shooting me down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 11, 2015 Report Share Posted December 11, 2015 2 hours ago, City169 said: Let's give a top manager the Basingstoke squad and see them in Europe next season then? Cotts has got quite enough on his plate with us thank you . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malago Posted December 12, 2015 Report Share Posted December 12, 2015 16 hours ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Why would Stoke be heading to league 1 ???! A well run club with a great premier league manager signing players from Barcelona etc. Currently doing very well indeed Because their historic cycle of success and failure shows that that they peak at lower to middle of level one and bottom out at top half level 3. Coventry were well run for many years but eventually bottomed out to their former level 3 status. Only the very top clubs like Man U, Arsenal , Everton Spurs and Liverpool avoid level 3 football. The likes of Aston Villa, WBA, Soton, Wolves , Stoke , Leicester, Norwich, will inevitably drop diwn to level 3 at some stage. It's the nature of English football that they do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pezo Posted December 12, 2015 Report Share Posted December 12, 2015 7 hours ago, Malago said: Because their historic cycle of success and failure shows that that they peak at lower to middle of level one and bottom out at top half level 3. Coventry were well run for many years but eventually bottomed out to their former level 3 status. Only the very top clubs like Man U, Arsenal , Everton Spurs and Liverpool avoid level 3 football. The likes of Aston Villa, WBA, Soton, Wolves , Stoke , Leicester, Norwich, will inevitably drop diwn to level 3 at some stage. It's the nature of English football that they do so. Not sure i would include villa in that but otherwise id agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfieldred Posted December 12, 2015 Report Share Posted December 12, 2015 23 hours ago, City169 said: What seems odd to me is that in this thread, our fans have highlighted 5 Bolton players they want, even though Bolton are 4 points worse off than we are currently. I'd only take Pratley. A good player in a poor team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedorDead BCFC Posted December 12, 2015 Report Share Posted December 12, 2015 12 hours ago, Malago said: Because their historic cycle of success and failure shows that that they peak at lower to middle of level one and bottom out at top half level 3. Coventry were well run for many years but eventually bottomed out to their former level 3 status. Only the very top clubs like Man U, Arsenal , Everton Spurs and Liverpool avoid level 3 football. The likes of Aston Villa, WBA, Soton, Wolves , Stoke , Leicester, Norwich, will inevitably drop diwn to level 3 at some stage. It's the nature of English football that they do so. Where does Chelsea fit into this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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