JoeAman08 Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 1 hour ago, Robin1988 said: He's not there to score and assist, especially in a three. It's easy to overlook what he does, which is exactly what I think you're doing. I get that but they both should still pop up with a goal or assist over a 46 game season. Pack and Korey compliment each other well. Just think GON is more alike to Korey than Marlon. So IMO we will see more of Marlon than both of the others as he will likely play 90 minutes most matches. The others will spell each other from time to time or come on as a sub yo sure up the midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 4 minutes ago, JoeAman08 said: I get that but they both should still pop up with a goal or assist over a 46 game season. Pack and Korey compliment each other well. Just think GON is more alike to Korey than Marlon. So IMO we will see more of Marlon than both of the others as he will likely play 90 minutes most matches. The others will spell each other from time to time or come on as a sub yo sure up the midfield. Pack has almost exclusively played in a more attacking role than Korey and has four goals from 101 starts in the league, I know Smith has none but neither are exactly prolific. Korey could probably do more if he were further forward, and LJ said as much last season. As it is, he's there to protect the defence, win the ball and start our attacking transition with it, and he does that very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted July 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 7 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: Pack has almost exclusively played in a more attacking role than Korey and has four goals from 101 starts in the league, I know Smith has none but neither are exactly prolific. Korey could probably do more if he were further forward, and LJ said as much last season. As it is, he's there to protect the defence, win the ball and start our attacking transition with it, and he does that very well. Both stats are embarrassing, desperately need to add goals to the midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeAman08 Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 8 minutes ago, Robin1988 said: Pack has almost exclusively played in a more attacking role than Korey and has four goals from 101 starts in the league, I know Smith has none but neither are exactly prolific. Korey could probably do more if he were further forward, and LJ said as much last season. As it is, he's there to protect the defence, win the ball and start our attacking transition with it, and he does that very well. I've always seen them in the same positions. To me they're both holding midfielders. Marlon may go for their forward but I don't think he's played further by design. Korey I'd like to see in and around the box more. He's composed and and his control in tight spots I think is made for it. Anyway, like I said, they're the same position to me. Two holding midfielders protecting the defence. Countless times have I seen Marlon slot in for a fullback that's getting forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 4 hours ago, Robin1988 said: He's not there to score and assist, especially in a three. It's easy to overlook what he does, which is exactly what I think you're doing. Definitely the other way around on your second sentence. Pack and his contribution is overlooked a lot. While Korey gets a thread of praise every other week. I took my Dad to the MK Dons home game last season, he isn't a regular anymore and halfway through the first half he pointed at one of the players and asked who was it, because the he'd been counting the interceptions made by said player and was up to about 12-13 already. That player was Marlon Pack. In the second half everybody in the team had a shocker, no exceptions at all, but there was only one player that had a thread complaining about him. That was also Marlon Pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman Mao Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 3 hours ago, Super said: Both stats are embarrassing, desperately need to add goals to the midfield. Bobby Reid and Lee Tomlin do this with ease tbf, hope the latter is in the starting XI next season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 4 hours ago, SecretSam said: they kind of complement each other (no, not in a "nice hairdo" "thanks, love your shoes, BTW"...kind of way) That is compliment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Army 87 Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 Wouldn't be surprised to see a midfield 3 of GON holding and Smith / pack just in front. Tomlin left, right wing TBC (Freeman, odowda, can't call that position atm) and that would be a decent starting line up. Smith and pack pass very well between themselves and their understanding got stronger as the season went on imo, so would think that LJ would want to keep that going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin1988 Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 1 hour ago, City169 said: Definitely the other way around on your second sentence. Pack and his contribution is overlooked a lot. While Korey gets a thread of praise every other week. I took my Dad to the MK Dons home game last season, he isn't a regular anymore and halfway through the first half he pointed at one of the players and asked who was it, because the he'd been counting the interceptions made by said player and was up to about 12-13 already. That player was Marlon Pack. In the second half everybody in the team had a shocker, no exceptions at all, but there was only one player that had a thread complaining about him. That was also Marlon Pack. Pack is the go-to boo boy, undeservedly. I think a some people really recognise Korey's contribution but in comparison to other players (Kodjia for example) he's still overlooked. Pack's faults are more obvious, if his passing range is off it can get really frustrating. But on his day he's great at this level. I just think Korey is more consistent and valuable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 I like Marlon Pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 5 hours ago, Super said: Both stats are embarrassing, desperately need to add goals to the midfield. That's why I loved Gerry Gow and Gary Shelton so much - hard as nails, creative, never went missing and notched around 75 goals (combined) for us from the engine room... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted July 19, 2016 Report Share Posted July 19, 2016 10 hours ago, NeilS said: Pack brings something different, to say another team (mates) are 'way'ahead of him is just plain daft. Why is it some always diss our own? Not dissed anyone. Flint is better than Williams, does that mean I'm dissing Williams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted July 20, 2016 Report Share Posted July 20, 2016 22 hours ago, SecretSam said: Smith and Pack are two different types of player; they kind of complement each other (no, not in a "nice hairdo" "thanks, love your shoes, BTW"...kind of way) It's called Team Spirit. I am sure both Smith and Pack compliment each other when they make a good pass or score a (rare) goal, as I am sure they do when both play well in the same team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted July 20, 2016 Report Share Posted July 20, 2016 7 hours ago, NeilS said: Well yea... Either an unfunny joke or you are a fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NVMal Posted July 20, 2016 Report Share Posted July 20, 2016 If Pack left the club he wouldn't be missed, if Smith left he would be missed. There's no debating it for me, Pack is a league 1 player who had a few good games last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 34 minutes ago, NeilS said: Look just because someone challenges your precious views, there is no need to resort to insults is there? To say Flint is better than Williams, or any other squad player is childish in the extreme, all players have certain qualities or weaknesses, a bit like Top Trumps I guess, but you really shouldn't base your views on players on such, it's a team game, not a collection of individuals, or at least that's how it should be...II give you Leicester City, and of of course Iceland. So will you retract the fool comment, or will you just keep on being in the dark about such matters? No retraction. Messi is better than Freeman. Doesn't mean I'm disrespecting Freeman. Everyone judges players all the time and compares them with other players. To call that extreme childish is again foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 I'm not one to wade into other people's arguments, but you're struggling here @NeilS. To say that Flint is better than Williams is objective. If you can find anyone who disagrees, then I'll be impressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 11 hours ago, NVMal said: If Pack left the club he wouldn't be missed, if Smith left he would be missed. There's no debating it for me, Pack is a league 1 player who had a few good games last season. I think he had a few outstanding games, several good ones and overall was one of our most consistent performers. He certainly seemed to improve and adapt to the Championship during the course of the season. Having played most of his football in L2 then a couple of seasons in L1, and only just 25 yrs old, I think Pack has proved he can continue to develop as a player. Interesting that you comment that his level is L1 because a couple of seasons ago the conversation on here that his level was L2. We need a bigger squad and more options and I think he would most definitely be missed if he wasn't one of them. Edit: It is unfortunate that Pack seems to attract his unfair share of criticism. During a game he can be a very effective player both on and off the ball but one wayward pass and its 'Pack is crap' all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 2 hours ago, Fordy62 said: I'm not one to wade into other people's arguments, but you're struggling here @NeilS. To say that Flint is better than Williams is objective. If you can find anyone who disagrees, then I'll be impressed. Thing is both are at different points in their career. I could quite easily see Williams going on to be a better overall player than Flint, but certain aspects of his game will never get to the levels of Flints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 11 minutes ago, City169 said: Thing is both are at different points in their career. I could quite easily see Williams going on to be a better overall player than Flint, but certain aspects of his game will never get to the levels of Flints. Really? I get your point, but absolutely don't agree... but the argument was neilS taking issue with RedDave suggesting that saying Flint was the better player was being harsh on Williams. It's clearly not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 7 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: Really? I get your point, but absolutely don't agree... but the argument was neilS taking issue with RedDave suggesting that saying Flint was the better player was being harsh on Williams. It's clearly not. I agree with that, but also think a lot of people are extremely harsh on Williams, writing him off as a player already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unan Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 Well now we know what user is Williams dad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazred Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 3 hours ago, NeilS said: Look just because someone challenges your precious views, there is no need to resort to insults is there? To say Flint is better than Williams, or any other squad player is childish in the extreme, all players have certain qualities or weaknesses, a bit like Top Trumps I guess, but you really shouldn't base your views on players on such, it's a team game, not a collection of individuals, or at least that's how it should be...II give you Leicester City, and of of course Iceland. So will you retract the fool comment, or will you just keep on being in the dark about such matters? What? Utter nonsense. Flint is our best CB, to be classed as our best CB, he has to be better than the other CBs we have. How could that not be any clearer? Unless of course you don't agree that he is our outstanding CB? Why would one player from a team be sold for millions yet his team mate who plays in the same position doesn't generate any transfer interest? Perhaps it's because the former is a better player. Top Trumps - you mean the game where the cards have different attributes but one or more of them is clearly better than the other cards when compared directly and is more value to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, NeilS said: You again, are missing the point. I'm not missing the point at all though. I get what you're saying, I really do. And I completely agree with your challenge of the chap above who suggested Pack wouldn't be missed - he's a good player and he clearly would be... But... I only took issue with the quote near to the top of the page. It's there for all to see in black and white... On 19 July 2016 at 23:49, RedDave said: Not dissed anyone. Flint is better than Williams, does that mean I'm dissing Williams? 23 hours ago, NeilS said: Well yea... To say he's dissing Williams is nonsense. It's nigh on a fact that Flint is better than Williams and it's one that's agreed with by the management of our club. The general gist of your postings are correct. Pack is indeed a valued member of the first team, but you invalidate your argument to a degree by spouting such a ridiculous statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Dawe Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 Pack wouldn't be missed, if we replaced him with a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, NeilS said: Well it's a forum when I last looked, and I didn't imagine that we would all have to agree, but certainly to dismiss another posters comments as foolish or ridiculous, nonsense shows a real lack of understanding I am afraid of the points I was making, you keep reverting back to 'better' than another 'team mate' which is what I disagree with, certainly is you are a first team player you have different attributes, skills, and not to be confused with 'better'. Yes but all attributes when taken together allow us to form a hierarchy of players' importance to the team (read scale of ability of you please). 'Better' is a word to succinctly sum up this hierarchy. It is a forum, you're right. And yes it'd be boring if we all had the same opinion, you're right. But is it unfair on Dereck Williams to say that Flint is the better player... No. It isn't. You say it is. That's the crux of our disagreement. It's tantamount to me arguing that the capital of France is Paris and you disagreeing, having the view that the capital of France is Rome. So, I suppose the only question that remains is... Do you still maintain that it's dissing Williams to say that Flint is the better player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 3 hours ago, NeilS said: Look just because someone challenges your precious views, there is no need to resort to insults is there? To say Flint is better than Williams, or any other squad player is childish in the extreme, all players have certain qualities or weaknesses, a bit like Top Trumps I guess, but you really shouldn't base your views on players on such, it's a team game, not a collection of individuals, or at least that's how it should be...II give you Leicester City, and of of course Iceland. So will you retract the fool comment, or will you just keep on being in the dark about such matters? Who did you vote for in the Supporters Player of the Year Awards last year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 4 minutes ago, NeilS said: More , we especially City, are so quick to promote players to a status that doesn't fit with their abilities. And it is not always based on football ability either, take the Flint Swindon No thing, that was assured to mask over some of his footballing shortfalls wasn't it? But 'hey is one of our own, and untouchable, he is error prone though, as all players are. Again. I completely agree. We are fickle like that. We love a hero. Flint does indeed have defensive shortcomings and ice often said that I doubt his ability to be a top flight defender - but only time will tell on that. That being said, he's clearly better than Williams. I think Richard O'Donnell perhaps has a slightly elevated standing due to his much admired celebrations in his first game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheddarReds Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 3 hours ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: I think he had a few outstanding games, several good ones and overall was one of our most consistent performers. He certainly seemed to improve and adapt to the Championship during the course of the season. Having played most of his football in L2 then a couple of seasons in L1, and only just 25 yrs old, I think Pack has proved he can continue to develop as a player. Interesting that you comment that his level is L1 because a couple of seasons ago the conversation on here that his level was L2. We need a bigger squad and more options and I think he would most definitely be missed if he wasn't one of them. Edit: It is unfortunate that Pack seems to attract his unfair share of criticism. During a game he can be a very effective player both on and off the ball but one wayward pass and its 'Pack is crap' all over again. Perhaps it could be we jump on his back more when things don't come off because we rely on him? Not saying we do or do not, just a thought as he's regularly the player to move the ball from out our half into there's. I'm not sure just a thought Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted July 21, 2016 Report Share Posted July 21, 2016 The way pack ended last season he's got to be a starter for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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