14 Years of Lansdown

[Kid in the Riot]

Over £100m spent in those 14 years allegedly, although I suspect that is a conservative estimate.

Managerial appointments as follows:

Tinnion, Johnson, Coppell, Millen, McInnes, O'Driscoll, Cotterill, Johnson.

Successes in bold, less said about the rest the better. What is noticeable is that Cotterill and Johnson are probably the two managers with the most experience in that list. Coppell too perhaps but chasing someone who doesn't really want the job was never going to work out well in retrospect.

Seasons in League One: SEVEN 03 04 05 06 07 14 15

Seasons in Championship: EIGHT 08 09 10 11 12 13 16 17

Of those eight seasons in the Championship I'd say five have been seasons of real struggle where we've done little more than stay up.

2x Football League Trophy winners in 2003 and 2015. Aside from that an atrocious record in the two major cup competitions with no notable cup runs or even a proper draw against one of the big, big clubs (admittedly not his fault).

Nearly every other club in the Championship has played in the Premier League and, in my humble opinion, us and Brighton are the two largest clubs in the league to have not done so. Brighton will be promoted this season leaving us as the biggest and certainly most heavily invested in!

The vast majority of that £100m investment has gone on players and the stadium, only a tiny fraction has gone on managerial appointments. Only a tiny part of a football club's budget is spent on the manager. So why then has Steve appeared to skinflint on managerial appointments when it is the most important position at the football club, yet been so lucid with his cash on players. It continues to make no sense to me.

The investment in the stadium and training ground is obviously great and it's good that it's finally happened. We are now at a juncture where we do have the resources and infrastructure to compete successfully in this league, we are still 10th I think in terms of average crowds this season. I think Mark Ashton has been a good appointment and even though he accepted himself they didn't get this summer's recruitment absolutely spot on (not enough older heads brought in) he fills a position that we've desperately needed for years and on the whole has brought in good players and quickly.

With all this good work going on behind the scenes please do not let it go to waste Steve, do your due diligence (hopefully it's being done RIGHT NOW) and make sure the next managerial appointment at this club matches the ambitions of everything you are trying to build at City because at the moment the above "achievements" of your 14 years in charge does not look like good value for £100m +.

[Buster Footman's T shirt]

I think half the battle will be finding an experienced manager that will come here.....something intagible around the club.....just seems to be terribly wrong for many years. Hope I am wrong.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Over £100m spent in those 14 years allegedly, although I suspect that is a conservative estimate.

Managerial appointments as follows:

Tinnion, Johnson, Coppell, Millen, McInnes, O'Driscoll, Cotterill, Johnson.

Successes in bold, less said about the rest the better. What is noticeable is that Cotterill and Johnson are probably the two managers with the most experience in that list. Coppell too perhaps but chasing someone who doesn't really want the job was never going to work out well in retrospect.

Seasons in League One: SEVEN 03 04 05 06 07 14 15

Seasons in Championship: EIGHT 08 09 10 11 12 13 16 17

Of those eight seasons in the Championship I'd say five have been seasons of real struggle where we've done little more than stay up.

2x Football League Trophy winners in 2003 and 2015. Aside from that an atrocious record in the two major cup competitions with no notable cup runs or even a proper draw against one of the big, big clubs (admittedly not his fault).

Nearly every other club in the Championship has played in the Premier League and, in my humble opinion, us and Brighton are the two largest clubs in the league to have not done so. Brighton will be promoted this season leaving us as the biggest and certainly most heavily invested in!

The vast majority of that £100m investment has gone on players and the stadium, only a tiny fraction has gone on managerial appointments. Only a tiny part of a football club's budget is spent on the manager. So why then has Steve appeared to skinflint on managerial appointments when it is the most important position at the football club, yet been so lucid with his cash on players. It continues to make no sense to me.

The investment in the stadium and training ground is obviously great and it's good that it's finally happened. We are now at a juncture where we do have the resources and infrastructure to compete successfully in this league, we are still 10th I think in terms of average crowds this season. I think Mark Ashton has been a good appointment and even though he accepted himself they didn't get this summer's recruitment absolutely spot on (not enough older heads brought in) he fills a position that we've desperately needed for years and on the whole has brought in good players and quickly.

With all this good work going on behind the scenes please do not let it go to waste Steve, do your due diligence (hopefully it's being done RIGHT NOW) and make sure the next managerial appointment at this club matches the ambitions of everything you are trying to build at City because at the moment the above "achievements" of your 14 years in charge does not look like good value for £100m +.

Can't argue with any of that, skimped on managers is about right, that is why with the ground redevelopment in full swing I was so underwhelmed with LJ's appointment, to me it showed absolutely no ambition whatsoever, the club was crying out for a biggish name and get LJ.

And meanwhile Nero fiddles whilst AG burns.

 

[BigAl&Toby]

8 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Over £100m spent in those 14 years allegedly, although I suspect that is a conservative estimate.

Managerial appointments as follows:

Tinnion, Johnson, Coppell, Millen, McInnes, O'Driscoll, Cotterill, Johnson.

Successes in bold, less said about the rest the better. What is noticeable is that Cotterill and Johnson are probably the two managers with the most experience in that list. Coppell too perhaps but chasing someone who doesn't really want the job was never going to work out well in retrospect.

Seasons in League One: SEVEN 03 04 05 06 07 14 15

Seasons in Championship: EIGHT 08 09 10 11 12 13 16 17

Of those eight seasons in the Championship I'd say five have been seasons of real struggle where we've done little more than stay up.

2x Football League Trophy winners in 2003 and 2015. Aside from that an atrocious record in the two major cup competitions with no notable cup runs or even a proper draw against one of the big, big clubs (admittedly not his fault).

Nearly every other club in the Championship has played in the Premier League and, in my humble opinion, us and Brighton are the two largest clubs in the league to have not done so. Brighton will be promoted this season leaving us as the biggest and certainly most heavily invested in!

The vast majority of that £100m investment has gone on players and the stadium, only a tiny fraction has gone on managerial appointments. Only a tiny part of a football club's budget is spent on the manager. So why then has Steve appeared to skinflint on managerial appointments when it is the most important position at the football club, yet been so lucid with his cash on players. It continues to make no sense to me.

The investment in the stadium and training ground is obviously great and it's good that it's finally happened. We are now at a juncture where we do have the resources and infrastructure to compete successfully in this league, we are still 10th I think in terms of average crowds this season. I think Mark Ashton has been a good appointment and even though he accepted himself they didn't get this summer's recruitment absolutely spot on (not enough older heads brought in) he fills a position that we've desperately needed for years and on the whole has brought in good players and quickly.

With all this good work going on behind the scenes please do not let it go to waste Steve, do your due diligence (hopefully it's being done RIGHT NOW) and make sure the next managerial appointment at this club matches the ambitions of everything you are trying to build at City because at the moment the above "achievements" of your 14 years in charge does not look like good value for £100m +.

Because he's incompetent. Or out of his depth. Bit like LJ. Or (m)any of the other managerial appointments you mention.

If I were him I'd stick to what I know. Making money.

Hang on. Perhaps he has all along. I'd love to know what the net position is on that £100M. 

I doubt he's lost money.

[Ayteomike2]

I know what you are saying but this bristol sport thing he may get 2 teams relegated in one season  and what is he trying to achieve all these different sports love the bloke but is he begining to over stretch himself where is his one focus 

[WessexPest]

Nice summary, KITR. It doesn't make for a very impressive CV.

The Lansdown cheerleading squad's counter-arguments seem to boil down to "we'd be floundering in League One without his money."

Could well be the case anyway WITH his money. 

[longyears]

Sensible summary I think. I don't support the SL knockers because whichever way you view it his money has kept us largely solvent and brought us a very nice stadium. Sadly as a judge of sport he is a failure. I don't wish to get too profound but this is a frequent danger with successful businessmen. When I was working at quite a high level in IT I ended up by chance having dinner with the CEO of the company. It was summer and we started talking cricket. When we disagreed on a point he tried to pull rank and dismiss my opinion as rubbish. I said to him " look ???? you are the company CEO and you can tell me what to do at work and under some circumstances you can fire me. However when it comes to cricket  I have played at county level and you have not so I may well know more than you do ". Being CEO of ???? does not make your opinion about cricket 100% correct.

In my view that is the problem with SL - because in terms of career and business and finance he has been 100% successful he has got into the habit of thinking he is 100% correct about everything and no one who matters has the balls to tell him otherwise and if they do he falls out with them. As at today it is quite likely that BCFC will get relegated and extremely likely that Bristol Rugby Club will go back down. Not a great record for " your " Bristol Sport is it Steve. Even if BCFC survive what logic is there to say next season will suddenly be any different ?

The guy needs to  wake up but personally I think LJ is here for the long term and SL won't lose face to that degree. Hope to be proved wrong ! 

 

[Ivorguy]

The thread title is brilliant. It explains everything about City and what is wrong. Poor management of the club at the highest level coupled with a failed structure

[Barrs Court Red]

I like the approach the club has taken in the last couple of years off the field, but at the same time some decisions over the years have been catastrophic.  

I would not be surprised if both City and Bristol go down, he thinks about selling up.

[054123]

I've always been a supporter of Lansdown and for 13 years would defend him to the hilt. 

My patience finally gave way this year when it finally dawned that we haven't achieved anything of note.

The realisation that we could be playing rovers again in league division 3 after 16 years apart, with absolutely nothing to show of footballing worth, save 2 shiny new stands, just floored me.

Even more distressing was the level of denial on here when it came to assessing the last 10 years. It seemed the 2 new stands were all that mattered. 

[054123]

7 minutes ago, longyears said:

Sensible summary I think. I don't support the SL knockers because whichever way you view it his money has kept us largely solvent and brought us a very nice stadium. Sadly as a judge of sport he is a failure. I don't wish to get too profound but this is a frequent danger with successful businessmen. When I was working at quite a high level in IT I ended up by chance having dinner with the CEO of the company. It was summer and we started talking cricket. When we disagreed on a point he tried to pull rank and dismiss my opinion as rubbish. I said to him " look ???? you are the company CEO and you can tell me what to do at work and under some circumstances you can fire me. However when it comes to cricket  I have played at county level and you have not so I may well know more than you do ". Being CEO of ???? does not make your opinion about cricket 100% correct.

In my view that is the problem with SL - because in terms of career and business and finance he has been 100% successful he has got into the habit of thinking he is 100% correct about everything and no one who matters has the balls to tell him otherwise and if they do he falls out with them. As at today it is quite likely that BCFC will get relegated and extremely likely that Bristol Rugby Club will go back down. Not a great record for " your " Bristol Sport is it Steve. Even if BCFC survive what logic is there to say next season will suddenly be any different ?

The guy needs to  wake up but personally I think LJ is here for the long term and SL won't lose face to that degree. Hope to be proved wrong ! 

 

But there is legitimate reason to knock him. 

When you say solvent, you mean covering the cost of the footballing avenues he chooses?

[Jacki]

The OP has hit the nail on the head on this thread, I was saying exactly the same the other day. Why spend all that cash on players and then have someone completely unproven as manager? It makes no sense. 

Ferguson always said that the manager should be the highest paid, most important figure at any club. Judging by what's happened to us in the last 10 years you can absolutely say he was right. 

[tinman85]

I have a lot of respect for SL. But his blind faith in LJ is the most ridiculous decision he has made in his time. It is unforgivable and disrespectful to the lifeblood of the club - the fans. 

I personally feel the whole club could do with a change in direction. We have the stadium now, there is the legacy. But can anyone honestly see us getting to the promised land of the Premier League? Sorry but I can't. 

[BCFC Grim]

Mark Ashton getting away with it slightly? While Johnson is clueless I can't help but feel Ashton and the players are getting off lightly. With regards to SL, We haven't progressed on the field but infrastructure wise it's obvious we have. That being said, I don't think it's enough. It seems he's happy for us to get relegated. I'm gobsmacked he's not sacked LJ.

[WessexPest]

2 minutes ago, tinman85 said:

I have a lot of respect for SL. But his blind faith in LJ is the most ridiculous decision he has made in his time. It is unforgivable and disrespectful to the lifeblood of the club - the fans. 

I personally feel the whole club could do with a change in direction. We have the stadium now, there is the legacy. But can anyone honestly see us getting to the promised land of the Premier League? Sorry but I can't. 

Under this regime, definitely not. Should be a realistic aim but it won't happen on Lansdown's watch.

[rogerf]

I have supported Bristol City for more than 50 years, followed them in every division of the football league and no owner/chairman has done more or achieved more than Steve Lansdown.

I totally understand some people's frustrations with the failure on his appointments of managers, but where would we honestly be without him.

I don't want us to return to the awful days of 1982 and without him that could easily happen.

Be careful what you wish for, would you like overseas owners of the type they have at Blackburn for example.

I think Johnson has to go now, and Steve needs to show some ambition to appoint a successful coach with a true record of achievement if we are going to move forward from here.

['Orns]

KITR - absolutely bang on, I got some stick on here a while back for suggesting similar. You backed it up with far better stats than I did

SL has done so much for our club, but he really needs to smash the next appointment out of the park, or it's the Bristol Derby again next season, and I'm really enjoying not having that as the big fixture to look for come June. My eldest is now 14, she's never seen her old man on (league game) derby day. I was hoping we'd be able to string it out a bit longer, it's not a good look

Come on SL, it's time. Just have something amazing in your back pocket 

[DT The Optimist]

43 minutes ago, AzerbaijanApeman said:

Nice summary, KITR. It doesn't make for a very impressive CV.

The Lansdown cheerleading squad's counter-arguments seem to boil down to "we'd be floundering in League One without his money."

Could well be the case anyway WITH his money. 

I would love you to tell me where else we would  find an owner as decent as SL.  Well respected through out the game.  No cheer leaders, just people who realise what he has done for the club over the last few years.  The stadium is main example, and we watch laughing gas trying to get everyone and his son to pay for them to have a new stadium, all this total B*****ks about sack the board.  

Please tell me where else we can find a benefactor on the Forbes rich list. And not Russian or Arab. To fund our club.

Yes it is crap on the field at the moment, truth is he has backed everyone now, and before, and will do so again.

[Merrick's Marvels]

25 minutes ago, rogerf said:

I have supported Bristol City for more than 50 years, followed them in every division of the football league and no owner/chairman has done more or achieved more than Steve Lansdown.

I totally understand some people's frustrations with the failure on his appointments of managers, but where would we honestly be without him.

I don't want us to return to the awful days of 1982 and without him that could easily happen.

Be careful what you wish for, would you like overseas owners of the type they have at Blackburn for example.

I think Johnson has to go now, and Steve needs to show some ambition to appoint a successful coach with a true record of achievement if we are going to move forward from here.

1) No worse off, that's for sure. Why? Because there's always been some local bloke with a few quid and a bit of ego who thinks he can run the club. And the result has always been the same - City yo-yoing between Divs 2&3.

Lansdown has achieved no more on the field - where it really counts - than anyone else in our history.  Fact.

2) He won't sell to overseas owners. The whole point of Bristol Sport is for the component parts to become self-sufficient. He's said this about City time and again.

It's probably a pipe dream but it's his intention to leave the club in Jon Boy's hands without the need for billions of quid to sustain us.

Imo. 

3) Indeed he does. But won't.

It doesn't fit the model he's put in place. Sadly.

So he'll continue to talk the Premiership talk but fail to back it up.

Imo.

[Red-Robbo]

Yep under Lansdown we have yo-yoed between the third and second tier. Like we have with all other owners/chairmen in the post-war era, apart from Harry Dolman.

The difference is the game is much more expensive (for owners as well as fans) than it was in the past. And we are one of those relatively rare clubs outside the really big ones, who do not have constant worries about going into administration.

[Kid in the Riot]

1 hour ago, Buster Footman's T shirt said:

I think half the battle will be finding an experienced manager that will come here.

I think you're right but everyone has their price. We would of course need an experienced man who actually wanted the job, not try and convince someone whose heart ain't in it (Coppell).

1 hour ago, BigAlToby&Liam said:

Because he's incompetent. Or out of his depth. Bit like LJ. Or (m)any of the other managerial appointments you mention.

If I were him I'd stick to what I know. Making money.

Hang on. Perhaps he has all along. I'd love to know what the net position is on that £100M. 

I doubt he's lost money.

You're probably right - the total worth of Bristol Sport plus the redeveloped stadium and all the facilities that it has to offer must be worth a lot as a package. Again, makes it more of a farce that he doesn't appear willing to pay £1m per annum for a top manager instead of £400k or whatever. Pardew was on £1.5m pa at Palace, I'd pay near enough that for him. Would be worth every penny IMO.

56 minutes ago, Barrs Court Red said:

I like the approach the club has taken in the last couple of years off the field, but at the same time some decisions over the years have been catastrophic.  

I would not be surprised if both City and Bristol go down, he thinks about selling up.

I think a large part of it would be down to his son Jon - is the plan he takes all of this over eventually? I don't see sale of Bristol Sport being imminent.

42 minutes ago, tinman85 said:

I have a lot of respect for SL. But his blind faith in LJ is the most ridiculous decision he has made in his time. It is unforgivable and disrespectful to the lifeblood of the club - the fans. 

I personally feel the whole club could do with a change in direction. We have the stadium now, there is the legacy. But can anyone honestly see us getting to the promised land of the Premier League? Sorry but I can't. 

We are so far from the Premier League still, sadly. As I pointed out above - five out of our eight seasons at this level we've really struggled. Prior to the ground and training redevelopments there was an excuse as we weren't generating the same revenue as most clubs in this league and had poor training facilities. Those excuses are no longer applicable and so now is the time to strike, instead we're going backwards again.

[Alessandro]

For people to suggest SL is up on his £100m investment is bonkers.

Have you seen the club's revenue? We are in debt and run at a loss Year on Year. Our last accounts showed a loss of - £14m or so IIRC. Year before - £9.2m. This year will likely be an even greater loss with the increased wage bill.

But who will stump up the shortfall. Yeah the guy some of you still love to bash.

People talking about the overall worth of BCFC and Ashton Gate. Well who is going to pay £100m for it right now? As for Ashton Gate itself, don't forget Sainsbury's were only paying £20m for the land a few years ago. Not really denting that 100 mill.

[Barrs Court Red]

2 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

 

I think a large part of it would be down to his son Jon - is the plan he takes all of this over eventually? I don't see sale of Bristol Sport being imminent.

 

It took 4 years to recover last time he did that!

[WessexPest]

16 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said:

I would love you to tell me where else we would  find an owner as decent as SL.  Well respected through out the game.  No cheer leaders, just people who realise what he has done for the club over the last few years.  The stadium is main example, and we watch laughing gas trying to get everyone and his son to pay for them to have a new stadium, all this total B*****ks about sack the board.  

Please tell me where else we can find a benefactor on the Forbes rich list. And not Russian or Arab. To fund our club.

Yes it is crap on the field at the moment, truth is he has backed everyone now, and before, and will do so again.

The stadium is really all there is to show for it. We'all in all likelihood be playing the Gas next season.

There's no shortage of wealthy folks investing in football clubs nowadays. It's not inconceivable that someone could come along - I don't care what his background is as long as he can competently run a football club. 

[Kid in the Riot]

5 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

For people to suggest SL is up on his £100m investment is bonkers.

Have you seen the club's revenue? We are in debt and run at a loss Year on Year. Our last accounts showed a loss of - £14m or so IIRC. Year before - £9.2m. This year will likely be an even greater loss with the increased wage bill.

But who will stump up the shortfall. Yeah the guy some of you still love to bash.

Revenue will be up this year though. There are corporate events on down at AG every week now and the hospitality at the rugby and football bring in a fair chunk. Wolves were recently bought for £45m and I'm not sure whether that included Molineaux (assume it did). SL won't recoup all of that £100m but Bristol Sport could be worth say £50m ? Who knows. He's not a charity and I'm sure the status and everything else that comes with owning a football club has been hugely beneficial to Steve Lansdown over the years. I remember him saying in an interview that in his travels around the world people ask him more about Bristol City than Hargreaves Lansdown...

[rogerf]

4 minutes ago, AzerbaijanApeman said:

The stadium is really all there is to show for it. We'all in all likelihood be playing the Gas next season.

There's no shortage of wealthy folks investing in football clubs nowadays. It's not inconceivable that someone could come along - I don't care what his background is as long as he can competently run a football club. 

Do you really believe there is no shortage of wealthy folk willing to invest in football clubs?

You have to be a little bit mad or be a billionaire there can't be that many willing to invest in a club like ours that has no real history, we are not Man UTC or Liverpool.

[Alessandro]

13 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Revenue will be up this year though. There are corporate events on down at AG every week now and the hospitality at the rugby and football bring in a fair chunk. Wolves were recently bought for £45m and I'm not sure whether that included Molineaux (assume it did). SL won't recoup all of that £100m but Bristol Sport could be worth say £50m ? Who knows. He's not a charity and I'm sure the status and everything else that comes with owning a football club has been hugely beneficial to Steve Lansdown over the years. I remember him saying in an interview that in his travels around the world people ask him more about Bristol City than Hargreaves Lansdown...

Absolutely, I'm not suggesting he doesn't 'take' anything from owing the club. I agree he absolutely will and it opens doors.

But the idea that he is in this for financial gain, screwing over the little fans, doesn't sit well with me. 

That said, he is up for critisim now, and rightly so. But the critisim should be aimed at the right areas, not the scatter gun "the whole thing's ****** top to bottom" by too many people on here who moan about everything and are thankful for nothing.

 

 

 

[Red Exile]

26 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

1) No worse off, that's for sure. Why? Because there's always been some local bloke with a few quid and a bit of ego who thinks he can run the club. And the result has always been the same - City yo-yoing between Divs 2&3.

Lansdown has achieved no more on the field - where it really counts - than anyone else in our history.  Fact.

2) He won't sell to overseas owners. The whole point of Bristol Sport is for the component parts to become self-sufficient. He's said this about City time and again.

It's probably a pipe dream but it's his intention to leave the club in Jon Boy's hands without the need for billions of quid to sustain us.

Imo. 

3) Indeed he does. But won't.

It doesn't fit the model he's put in place. Sadly.

So he'll continue to talk the Premiership talk but fail to back it up.

Imo.

That would be my assumption too.

Steve's a decent chap, in my limited experience, heart in the right place.

Personally I think challenge is fine, he's a successful man with a dream that he's presumably expecting to be held to. He's made big statements of intent. Not delivered on the pitch as yet. The thing I simply can't understand is his poor choice of managers, the weak link time after time.

Some of the cap-doffing deference from fans is embarrassing, I can't imagine that SL or his family expect it.

 

[screech]

32 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

You're probably right - the total worth of Bristol Sport plus the redeveloped stadium and all the facilities that it has to offer must be worth a lot as a package. Again, makes it more of a farce that he doesn't appear willing to pay £1m per annum for a top manager instead of £400k or whatever. Pardew was on £1.5m pa at Palace, I'd pay near enough that for him. Would be worth every penny IMO.

 

I would at least ask the question with Pardew, if he managed to keep us up I would bet he could attract a better quality of player here in the summer.

[CityCiderEd]

I wish sometimes SL would run the club as he does his business.If he had a fund manager that after an exceptionally bright start was losing money on his investments in a big way do you really think he would not replace him?