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Southampton manager....


BS4 on Tour...

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12 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

....sacked.

8th place finish in Premier League and League Cup Final runners up.

What exactly does the Southampton FC board expect? That sounds like a fantastic season to me.....do they really demand more than that?!

Expect goals is what a Saints fan told me. Only scored in 1 of last 7 matches at home. 

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47 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said:

....sacked.

8th place finish in Premier League and League Cup Final runners up.

What exactly does the Southampton FC board expect? That sounds like a fantastic season to me.....do they really demand more than that?!

Personally I'm with you - unbelievable really. However playing devils advocate, didn't they sack Nigel Adkins and bring in Pochettino straight after Adkins got them promotion? Sometimes it takes bottle to push on, and not stick with managers for sentimental reasons.

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6 minutes ago, beaverface said:

Personally I'm with you - unbelievable really. However playing devils advocate, didn't they sack Nigel Adkins and bring in Pochettino straight after Adkins got them promotion? Sometimes it takes bottle to push on, and not stick with managers for sentimental reasons.

No, Adkins wasn't sacked until January 2013 - so not 'straight after Adkins got them promotion' - they gave Nige nearly 6 months to give it a go....

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Sadly it's becoming common place in England now, Watford have done similar & have done it for the last couple of seasons! It's hard to understand exactly what some clubs expect because it wasn't too long ago that both clubs were in The Championship and even lower in Southampton's case.

And the trouble is that clubs & fans then wonder why managers & players don't show any sign of loyalty to their clubs!!

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6 hours ago, RedDave said:

A lot of it is about entertainment for Saints fans.  I agree with them. Why pay hundreds of pounds to watch defensive, dour football?  

Surely the board knew what they were getting with the (now ex) manager by watching him in his previous role @ Nice?

No win in last 8, 1 goal in last 6 or 7 games. Not helped by loss to injury of Charlie Austin, good stadium, good crop of youngsters, good youth setup.....opportunity for someone.

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32 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

Surely the board knew what they were getting with the (now ex) manager by watching him in his previous role @ Nice?

No win in last 8, 1 goal in last 6 or 7 games. Not helped by loss to injury of Charlie Austin, good stadium, good crop of youngsters, good youth setup.....opportunity for someone.

It won't be Lee Johnson, he'll be the next Arsenal manager. 

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48 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

Surely the board knew what they were getting with the (now ex) manager by watching him in his previous role @ Nice?

No win in last 8, 1 goal in last 6 or 7 games. Not helped by loss to injury of Charlie Austin, good stadium, good crop of youngsters, good youth setup.....opportunity for someone.

Only if they can make a mediocre side top six overnight as apparently 8th best in the country isn't good enough. 

Madness. 

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Not overly surprised with this. Finished lower than the previous season, won less games, scored 18 goals less and finished with 17 less points. Whilst it would have been difficult to improve on the season under Koeman, I'm sure their board didn't expect that level of regression.

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1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Only if they can make a mediocre side top six overnight as apparently 8th best in the country isn't good enough. 

Madness. 

They finished 6th the season before under Koeman.

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2 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Only if they can make a mediocre side top six overnight as apparently 8th best in the country isn't good enough. 

Madness. 

Exactly. Not sure what their expectations are but when they look at the teams above them, maybe with the exception of Everton (possibly), what do they expect? Delusional.

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Lots of neutrals are focusing on the position in the league. Note that they only finished 6 points ahead of 17th. 

If you compare with previous few seasons it is a step in the wrong direction. 

Combine that with, so I hear from a few Saints mates, really dull football (no goal at home in 540 mins) then this decision doesn't come as a surprise to me. 

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7 minutes ago, Reading Red UTC said:

Lots of neutrals are focusing on the position in the league. Note that they only finished 6 points ahead of 17th. 

If you compare with previous few seasons it is a step in the wrong direction. 

Combine that with, so I hear from a few Saints mates, really dull football (no goal at home in 540 mins) then this decision doesn't come as a surprise to me. 

Is this also not an indication of the Premier League being a mini league of 3? The top 6 or 7, then the 'middle' league, then the relegation fodder bottom 3 or 4. Saints finished top of that 'middle' league.

Conversely, any manager between 8th and 17th should be fearing for their job. Pulis be warned for a negative boring style....

Like i said, it's about expectations. And what do Saints fans really expect?

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3 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

Is this also not an indication of the Premier League being a mini league of 3? The top 6 or 7, then the 'middle' league, then the relegation fodder bottom 3 or 4. Saints finished top of that 'middle' league.

Conversely, any manager between 8th and 17th should be fearing for their job. Pulis be warned for a negative boring style....

Like i said, it's about expectations. And what do Saints fans really expect?

You raise very good points.

Saints are one of those teams in the "middle league" as you mentioned! These teams are quite aware that's it's unlikely that they'll win any silverware and, especially with saints, not be involved in a relegation battle. So entertainment factor becomes more important. The lack of that and as previously mentioned the decline in points tally have ultimately resulted in him losing his job! 

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Good decision by the sound of it.

No club or set of fans should be content with negative, boring, low scoring football.

The people's game is about entertainment - or at least the endeavour of it - whichever division you're in.

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2 hours ago, Super said:

Go get him Steve.

Interesting to hear on talksport this morning they said that Southampton are looking for a new manager who will "buy in" to their long term project.

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3 hours ago, BanburyRed said:

Exactly. Not sure what their expectations are but when they look at the teams above them, maybe with the exception of Everton (possibly), what do they expect? Delusional.

Again, read a bit and you will find out what their expectations are.  The fans wanted him out and I would too.  Boring, dour football.  

I might be in the minority here but football isn't all about the result.

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4 hours ago, myol'man said:

They'll be playing Pompey in the Championship within the next 5 years. Saints are a club with a very over inflated opinion of themselves 

I would say this is exactly why they have succeeded in recent years and developed so many top players. They set high standards and demand the best. So far it has worked for them and I would not be at all shocked if they made an appointment that pushes them on again. 

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5 hours ago, myol'man said:

They'll be playing Pompey in the Championship within the next 5 years. Saints are a club with a very over inflated opinion of themselves 

Very strange post.  They couldn't be more different to Pompey.  They don't overspend on players, they do bring their own through and they aren't scared to sell and replace if they get inflated offers for their players.

 

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7 hours ago, RedDave said:

Are you willfully misreading explanations? It wasn't about finishing 8th, it was about style of football. 

Not at all. Delusions of grandeur if Soton fans genuinely feel their footballing 'identity' is more important than results and league placing.

We played really attractive football on several occasions last season and nearly got relegated. 

Amazing what a tiny little bit of success does to expectations.

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4 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Good decision by the sound of it.

No club or set of fans should be content with negative, boring, low scoring football.

The people's game is about entertainment - or at least the endeavour of it - whichever division you're in.

Best tell Baggies

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1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Not at all. Delusions of grandeur if Soton fans genuinely feel their footballing 'identity' is more important than results and league placing.

We played really attractive football on several occasions last season and nearly got relegated. 

Amazing what a tiny little bit of success does to expectations.

Their expectations have remained the same: to play attractive football.  

What has changed?  

Style of play for me is more important than results and league placings, as long as we remain in this league.  I'd rather finish 18th playing football seen under Wilson than 8th with football seen under Pulis.

A lot of people on this forum remember the Wilson years fondly.  I didn't used to as he didn't get us promoted but, I've changed my mind about that period now and realise that it was special to watch regardless of end results.

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1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Not at all. Delusions of grandeur if Soton fans genuinely feel their footballing 'identity' is more important than results and league placing.

We played really attractive football on several occasions last season and nearly got relegated. 

Amazing what a tiny little bit of success does to expectations.

Russell Osman once thought that the result was more important than entertainment/identity and gates at home dropped by 40%, and away support fell below 500 for away games.   

I expect their identity of scoring a goal a game not less than a goal a game at home is important to supporters. Southampton produce great, truly great attacking players, they have a academy on par with the very best in Europe,  the philosophy of the club creates great attacking players ... If this Manager decided dour and defensive is his way to go, out he should and has gone.

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1 hour ago, RedDave said:

Their expectations have remained the same: to play attractive football.  

What has changed?  

Style of play for me is more important than results and league placings, as long as we remain in this league.  I'd rather finish 18th playing football seen under Wilson than 8th with football seen under Pulis.

A lot of people on this forum remember the Wilson years fondly.  I didn't used to as he didn't get us promoted but, I've changed my mind about that period now and realise that it was special to watch regardless of end results.

Fair enough. I would much rather we get promoted playing ugly than struggle to avoid relegation whilst playing the beautiful game but each to their own! 

Leicester didn't play nice football, their fans weren't moaning that they won the premier league. 

Southampton simply don't have the quality to play like Brazil and be a top six club in that league. 

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34 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Russell Osman once thought that the result was more important than entertainment/identity and gates at home dropped by 40%, and away support fell below 500 for away games.   

I expect their identity of scoring a goal a game not less than a goal a game at home is important to supporters. Southampton produce great, truly great attacking players, they have a academy on par with the very best in Europe,  the philosophy of the club creates great attacking players ... If this Manager decided dour and defensive is his way to go, out he should and has gone.

Not sure it's a case of deciding that 'dour is the way to go' - more a case of doing the best with what you have in order to achieve the maximum outcome in terms of league placing. 

I'd rather have a 0-0 and a 1-0 than a 4-5 and a 3-3 but maybe I'm old fashioned!

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29 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Fair enough. I would much rather we get promoted playing ugly than struggle to avoid relegation whilst playing the beautiful game but each to their own! 

Leicester didn't play nice football, their fans weren't moaning that they won the premier league. 

Southampton simply don't have the quality to play like Brazil and be a top six club in that league. 

Maybe it's an age thing ( not supposed to sound as patronising as it probably does )  but I no longer have a burning desire to reach the Premier League.  I know WBA fans who are bored out of their brains now and a couple wouldn't mind getting relegated so they can witness something different.  

I have no desire for us to become WBA. 

Realistically, teams won't scrape relegation and play beautiful football as teams down the bottom generally dig in, play percentage football and try to survive.  

I would argue that many times Leicester's style of play was exciting.  Very fast counter attacks are attractive to watch.

Hey, each to their own.  Plenty of people like an ugly 1-0

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44 minutes ago, RedDave said:

Maybe it's an age thing ( not supposed to sound as patronising as it probably does )  but I no longer have a burning desire to reach the Premier League.  I know WBA fans who are bored out of their brains now and a couple wouldn't mind getting relegated so they can witness something different.  

I have no desire for us to become WBA. 

Realistically, teams won't scrape relegation and play beautiful football as teams down the bottom generally dig in, play percentage football and try to survive.  

I would argue that many times Leicester's style of play was exciting.  Very fast counter attacks are attractive to watch.

Hey, each to their own.  Plenty of people like an ugly 1-0

I'd be happy with one season in the Prem at this stage. I just want to see us get there. I'd take a season of ugly 1-0s in all honesty. Especially after two seasons fighting relegation whilst at times playing very attractive football!

Dont get me wrong I like the fact that Soton aren't happy being a WBA and want to reach the next level but you have to be realistic about what you are and are not.

Not a chance in hell are Soton going to push higher than that and play scintillating football with the squad and transfer policy they have. They're still a selling club for one. If they're serious about kicking into top six and doing it by playing incredible football week in week out they'll need significant investment in the squad. 

Fair play to them if they can achieve that but expectations seem a little detached from reality. 

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26 minutes ago, David Brent said:

I'd pay hundreds of pounds to watch my team finish 8th in the premier league

I'd pay a bit to see them finish 8th in the championship!

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3 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Not sure it's a case of deciding that 'dour is the way to go' - more a case of doing the best with what you have in order to achieve the maximum outcome in terms of league placing. 

I'd rather have a 0-0 and a 1-0 than a 4-5 and a 3-3 but maybe I'm old fashioned!

And many would not which Is why I used a parallel of Russell Osman's at BCFC. 

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14 hours ago, myol'man said:

They'll be playing Pompey in the Championship within the next 5 years. Saints are a club with a very over inflated opinion of themselves 

Don't think so, they're a strong club with a great infrastructure. Ruthless with managers and why not? They've been vindicated with it in the past. 

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The style vs results/league position debate is an interesting one.

I just missed out on the Div 1 days of the 1970s.  I've often wondered - what was City's football like during that time? I'm aware we had some excellent players,  but overall were we a team that played with flair or a gritty side that managed to grind out results? 

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7 hours ago, Offside said:

The style vs results/league position debate is an interesting one.

I just missed out on the Div 1 days of the 1970s.  I've often wondered - what was City's football like during that time? I'm aware we had some excellent players,  but overall were we a team that played with flair or a gritty side that managed to grind out results? 

We were that team . Gritty , hard to beat , most of our wins were 2-1 or 1-0 . 

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On 2017-6-14 at 22:58, beaverface said:

Personally I'm with you - unbelievable really. However playing devils advocate, didn't they sack Nigel Adkins and bring in Pochettino straight after Adkins got them promotion? Sometimes it takes bottle to push on, and not stick with managers for sentimental reasons.

Can't disagree with that-the revolving door at Watford as an example-

It's a gamble though,spinning the chamber in such fashon.

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8 hours ago, Cowshed said:

And many would not which Is why I used a parallel of Russell Osman's at BCFC. 

So you'd honestly rather see us get one point from six playing 'beautiful football' than four from six playing 'dour and defensive' ?

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On 2017-6-14 at 22:07, BS4 on Tour... said:

....sacked.

8th place finish in Premier League and League Cup Final runners up.

What exactly does the Southampton FC board expect? That sounds like a fantastic season to me.....do they really demand more than that?!

They had 17 fewer points than last season tbh Matt Le Tissier thought it was the right call aswell.

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8 hours ago, BRISTOL86 said:

So you'd honestly rather see us get one point from six playing 'beautiful football' than four from six playing 'dour and defensive' ?

Did you watch Russell Osman's team in the league? Thousands of fans, and it was thousands ceased watching BCFC because it was boring.

I don't understand why anybody would go to football to be bored. Its meant to be entertainment. 

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42 minutes ago, Cowshed said:

Did you watch Russell Osman's team in the league? Thousands of fans, and it was thousands ceased watching BCFC because it was boring.

I don't understand why anybody would go to football to be bored. Its meant to be entertainment. 

It certainly wasn't the greatest watch ever, but considering the resources at his disposal, I thought Osman worked a miracle.

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59 minutes ago, Sweeneys Penalties said:

It certainly wasn't the greatest watch ever, but considering the resources at his disposal, I thought Osman worked a miracle.

Yes he managed to vanish 6000 fans off the gate and inspired a fans walk out at half time at Pompey with the score being  0-0. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Cowshed said:

Yes he managed to vanish 6000 fans off the gate and inspired a fans walk out at half time at Pompey with the score being  0-0. 

 

 

You're only as good as the cards you are dealt. He had a budget of about £2.50 and it took the best part of 20 years for City to get back to where he left us. If you want a scapegoat look no further than David Russe and his ilk 

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Just now, Sweeneys Penalties said:

You're only as good as the cards you are dealt. He had a budget of about £2.50 and it took the best part of 20 years for City to get back to where he left us. If you want a scapegoat look no further than David Russe and his ilk 

Football is entertainment. Fans (most) do not want to be bored. Those are the cards. 

His tactics were funny with hindsight, but also damaging to the club. Miserable off (Kew) and on the pitch.

Osman would have told Pele and Ardiles to sit deep in Escape to Victory ...  That bad.

 

 

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