Admin phantom Posted February 27, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 3 hours ago, italian dave said: Watched the Sky Sports highlights from last night and there's clearly something (golf ball?) thrown at the B'ham players from our fans when they get their first goal. Their 7 (I think) also made a point of picking up something thrown at him when he was taking a throw. 2 hours ago, gordie said: There was a plastic bottle and something else thrown but not sure what it was. Seems to be making a big comeback in a lot of grounds at the moment sadly You can see the coke bottle up near the corner flag and the other object flying past their number 7 It looked like a roll from a hot dog on the footage to me, certainly not the shape of a golf ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 hour ago, italian dave said: Because they stop people breathing. I sit in s18. My 4 year old son has breathing difficulties and started coughing so we had to retreat to the concourse for a few minutes until it went away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLionLad Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 19 minutes ago, JulieH said: 2 Bristol city fans identified from cctv and detained by stewards and police last night before the end of the game. Both were captured on club cctv throwing items onto the pitch from the south stand . There was one smoke grenade set off by Birmingham fans but unfortunately at this stage no one identified. When will they ever learn? It's not the 1970's anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted February 27, 2019 Admin Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 The thing that always puzzles me is we always read about people having breathing problems around these incidents, so how do all the people manage abroad? Some grounds are completely filled with smoke etc, or are they different devices? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieH Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 I keep saying, the cctv at the ground is excellent and if people work on the basis that whatever unlawful action they are going to do will be caught on CCTV and recorded I am absolutely certain the incidents will be considerably less . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 19 minutes ago, JulieH said: I keep saying, the cctv at the ground is excellent and if people work on the basis that whatever unlawful action they are going to do will be caught on CCTV and recorded I am absolutely certain the incidents will be considerably less . But amazingly, it was unable to capture the very serious assault on a venerable person that only a computer shop repair man was aware of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 10 hours ago, italian dave said: Because they stop people breathing. A genuine question, how many smoke related deaths/serious harm incidents are there on the continent where flares and smoke bombs are common place i wonder? Genuinely would be interested to know the facts on it as it seems every single country bar the UK seem to be absolutely fine with it.. are lungs in the UK built differently i wonder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLionLad Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 20 minutes ago, bris red said: A genuine question, how many smoke related deaths/serious harm incidents are there on the continent where flares and smoke bombs are common place i wonder? Genuinely would be interested to know the facts on it as it seems every single country bar the UK seem to be absolutely fine with it.. are lungs in the UK built differently i wonder They are banned at football stadiums in the UK. Can you not just accept that fact? Is wetting yourself over a little bit of coloured smoke really worth getting a stadium ban for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Red Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 8 hours ago, RedLionLad said: When will they ever learn? It's not the 1970's anymore... Any statistics on smoke related issues in grounds around Europe pal? Genuinely intrigued to know how the Germans French Italians etc cope?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLionLad Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 1 minute ago, bris red said: Any statistics on smoke related issues in grounds around Europe pal? Genuinely intrigued to know how the Germans French Italians etc cope?! What's Europe pal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieH Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 In reply to this , I am sure there are people on this forum who would be able to get the statistics from Europe about injuries etc .they have provided me in the past with details regarding injuries i was surprised that they are actually banned in Holland, they would appear to have massive issues with them there, including fireworks inside the stadium . I am not sure where we would report the breathing problems that fans suffer but I have personally had fans complaining of breathing issues where these smoke grenades are let off at probably half the games where this happens. Clubs medical teams deal with them very well. I have dealt with 2 people with burns on hands from misuse of them, they were the offenders ! We keep details only of games where they have been let off . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carey 6 Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 If I’m correct, one of the lads who threw the bottle wasn’t old enough to know better. Doesn't deserve a banning order, I’m sure a warning from Police will suffice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 2 hours ago, Carey 6 said: If I’m correct, one of the lads who threw the bottle wasn’t old enough to know better. Doesn't deserve a banning order, I’m sure a warning from Police will suffice. What like an under 5? Even a three year old has some awareness of right and wrong and when told not to do something they generally don’t. Anyway I guess if the offender was a child then they would have had an adult with them, does that adult then assume responsibility for the child’s actions in possible offences like this @JulieH? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 10 hours ago, bris red said: A genuine question, how many smoke related deaths/serious harm incidents are there on the continent where flares and smoke bombs are common place i wonder? Genuinely would be interested to know the facts on it as it seems every single country bar the UK seem to be absolutely fine with it.. are lungs in the UK built differently i wonder I don’t know. Maybe they just have less respect for individuals and/or are thoughtless. I’d like to think we’re better than that. But what I do know is much closer to home, a friend, a City fan, with cystic fibrosis, whose lungs are damaged enough already and don’t need further damage caused by smoke, and who has had several occasions, at home and away games, of real breathing difficulties when someone has set off a canister nearby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 51 minutes ago, RedM said: What like an under 5? Even a three year old has some awareness of right and wrong and when told not to do something they generally don’t. Anyway I guess if the offender was a child then they would have had an adult with them, does that adult then assume responsibility for the child’s actions in possible offences like this @JulieH? Surely can't be that young! Very worrying if it was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 11 minutes ago, Super said: Surely can't be that young! Very worrying if it was. I’ve no idea. Just going on what @Carey 6said, that he wasn’t old enough to know better. As far as I’m concerned anyone over 5 years must realise it’s wrong to throw anything onto the pitch. Granted he/she could be copying people around them but would still look to the parent for the nod I would think, and even then there would have to be a fair few people throwing things for a child to believe it to be ok. So how old do you have to be not to know it’s wrong to chuck things onto the pitch is the question I think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spike Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 22 hours ago, bris red said: Don’t understand for the life of me Why smoke bombs and flares are banned in this country, health amd safety gone mad. Smoke canisters can obscure a paying fans view, if one were to be set off near the front of a stand out could block up to 50-100 peoples view, all of which will have paid money to watch the match. A quote from a health and safety point of view: A worrying 28% thought flares and smoke bombs were less dangerous than fireworks. Flares burn at the melting point of steel and contain toxic chemicals. Designed for marine distress, they are deliberately difficult to extinguish. Smoke bombs also burn at high temperatures and are not designed for use in confined spaces. They can cause panic in a tightly packed crowd and trigger asthma attacks. I can understand how many dismiss them as "health and safety gone mad" but I've also witnessed a few extreme asthma attacks caused by smoke inhalation when I was younger in school. A girl in our class has asthma and when we were doing a science experiment it caused smoke which triggered her asthma and at one point she passed out by the panic out caused her. In a football stadium there are thousands of people and it's not always simple to get up and walk out, especially if you're suffering from shortness of breath. It may sound minor to many people but again, these are paying customers who support the club. I never have and never will understand the whole fascination with pyros, yes they can look intimidating and help build atmosphere but is that more important than fans actually being able to see the game or a few fans ending up in hospital because they have inhaled smoke? Alan Weir, Head of Medical Services at St John Ambulance, said: “We know that St John Ambulance volunteers have treated people for burns and smoke inhalation caused by flares at several football grounds. These cases could have led to disfigurement or other serious injuries.” The argument that these smoke canisters and flares are safe is not true at all. Are you going to have an accident every time one is used, most likely not but is a permanent disfigurement worth a bit of smoke or a floating stick? No. When they did a survey for the Premier League two third of parents said the increased use of pyrotechnics is putting them off bringing their children to matches and 81% wanted more done to tackle the issue. I'm sure they'll be called "snowflakes" or whatever stupid term is used alongside that but I'm sure every single one of the pro-pyrotechnics fans would change their tune of their Mrs got hospitalised by a smoke canister or even permanently disfigured by a flare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midred Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 Players managed to throw themselves around on the pitch on Tuesday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 Smoke canisters are somewhat different to flares- they have different characteristics but are all illegal. Smoke canisters give off a bit of coloured smoke- flares are the ones that you have to watch out for- melting point of steel is a real risk at 1,600C and according to a piece I found in a quick search smoke bombs reach the same level. Smoke bombs are probably pretty dangerous too but not as much as flares- but they are all lumped under pyros. However melting point of steel is a huge risk, say it is launched by a fan panicking they'll be arrested and even if it misses people, it hits a steel beam- would it affect the structural integrity of the stand? To say nothing of breathing risks etc. However in short, flares/pyro as it is commonly known burn at 1,600C, Smoke bombs possibly similar- canisters 88C post functioning, maximum temperature of the device during functioning 40C. They are all commonly called pyros though even though there are subtle differences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carey 6 Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 1 hour ago, RedM said: I’ve no idea. Just going on what @Carey 6said, that he wasn’t old enough to know better. As far as I’m concerned anyone over 5 years must realise it’s wrong to throw anything onto the pitch. Granted he/she could be copying people around them but would still look to the parent for the nod I would think, and even then there would have to be a fair few people throwing things for a child to believe it to be ok. So how old do you have to be not to know it’s wrong to chuck things onto the pitch is the question I think? I didn't see who was taken out at the end, I was told it was a kid who was 'about 10' & his dad/grandad, still young enough to not realise that would result in a ban & could've easily got caught up when everyone around him was telling Mahoney to **** off & spur of the moment decided to chuck what he was holding. He's still in the wrong, but not deserving of a ban at that age, I think a talking to from the club/police would scare him into not doing that again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 2 hours ago, RedM said: I’ve no idea. Just going on what @Carey 6said, that he wasn’t old enough to know better. As far as I’m concerned anyone over 5 years must realise it’s wrong to throw anything onto the pitch. So how old do you have to be not to know it’s wrong to chuck things onto the pitch is the question I think? Unfortunately, it would seem some young children don't know better: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 2 hours ago, RedM said: I’ve no idea. Just going on what @Carey 6said, that he wasn’t old enough to know better. As far as I’m concerned anyone over 5 years must realise it’s wrong to throw anything onto the pitch. So how old do you have to be not to know it’s wrong to chuck things onto the pitch is the question I think? Some, on the other hand. His face says it all. And when the Atyeo corner started singing "there's only one Oskar Pycroft" he looked at his mum and said "Mummy, they're singing my name!" By the way. Does anybody know how young Oskar is doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 I don’t know how he’s doing, @Dollymariewould probably know. Hopefully he’s doing well but it’s gone very quiet since his walk out onto the pitch after the op. I thought about him the other delay and meant to ask on here, so thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Carey 6 said: I didn't see who was taken out at the end, I was told it was a kid who was 'about 10' & his dad/grandad, still young enough to not realise that would result in a ban & could've easily got caught up when everyone around him was telling Mahoney to **** off & spur of the moment decided to chuck what he was holding. He's still in the wrong, but not deserving of a ban at that age, I think a talking to from the club/police would scare him into not doing that again Crikey I have a son that age. Very Worrying behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BessexRED Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 That'd have to be the youngest banning order in the country wouldn't it? If that's right, he's a kid who's probably seen others do it and thought he could get involved, he wouldn't have understood the potential consequences so I'd agree with Carey 6 that a warning might scare him from doing similar in future. When Tomlin took a corner at Forest in front of us last season he was getting all sorts lobbed at him, he collected a coin and tucked it into his sock at one stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollymarie Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 26 minutes ago, RedM said: I don’t know how he’s doing, @Dollymariewould probably know. Hopefully he’s doing well but it’s gone very quiet since his walk out onto the pitch after the op. I thought about him the other delay and meant to ask on here, so thanks. He’s doing fab. Making all sorts of progress. I’ll ask his mum to send me over some pics that I can post on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulieH Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 7 hours ago, RedM said: What like an under 5? Even a three year old has some awareness of right and wrong and when told not to do something they generally don’t. Anyway I guess if the offender was a child then they would have had an adult with them, does that adult then assume responsibility for the child’s actions in possible offences like this @JulieH? I am aware of the incident and will speak to the officer dealing tomorrow and update as soon as I can Unfortunately the only person who can be held responsible is the person who committed the offence and the responsibility cannot shift to the adult in charge if they are too young to be held criminally responsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BessexRED Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 22 minutes ago, JulieH said: I am aware of the incident and will speak to the officer dealing tomorrow and update as soon as I can Unfortunately the only person who can be held responsible is the person who committed the offence and the responsibility cannot shift to the adult in charge if they are too young to be held criminally responsible. Why is that unfortunate? Imagine if you took your young boy/girl out and he naively did something stupid and it was filed against you for the rest of your life. That’s not fair in any sense at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Rob Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 1 hour ago, BessexRED said: Why is that unfortunate? Imagine if you took your young boy/girl out and he naively did something stupid and it was filed against you for the rest of your life. That’s not fair in any sense at all. It would give Channel 5 a whole new world of 'benefit porn' to pedal to the middle class right wing. 'Skint and my kids run riot, while I watch Trisha' But yes, I agree. It isn't the fault of the parents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedM Posted February 28, 2019 Report Share Posted February 28, 2019 I guess I was thinking along the lines of a car driver is responsible to make sure their passengers are wearing seatbelts, and if anyone under 14 (I think it is) doesn’t then they are the one who gets the fine/warning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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