Brentford Football club to become cashless

[Never to the dark side]

in its new ground

Sheffield Wednesday is already cashless

Millwall and Fulham will be cashless next season

The above will not effect us next season as the grounds that will be cashless next season are

Brighton Palace Leicester Sheff Utd Spurs and Wolves

[Bristol Rob]

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

[Bas's perfect hattrick]

Next season, rovers will stop accepting turnips as payment

[Red DNA]

16 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

Not quite right, they plan on remaining clueless 

[CyderInACan]

45 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

And completely clueless 

[CyderInACan]

47 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

And hopeless 

[Eddie Hitler]

1 hour ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

Always ahead of the curve is Rovers.

[054123]

1 hour ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

Ho ho!

[sephjnr]

This isn't a good thing. Besides football being more expensive in general, it's becoming mandatory in more places for one to have a bank account to attend football games which - besides being antithetical to the Working Class Sport notion - will hit the poorest (who may only be coming when tickets are on offer) and also the youngest who may not be able to rely on Mum or Dad buying tickets forever.

[Mike Hunt-Hertz]

2 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

Like their trophy room.

[Carey 6]

Doesn't bother me much, I never carry cash. A lot of the older generation still don't have cards though, there should always be a place within a stadium where they can still use cash. 

Birmingham away I couldn't get a drink in the concourse though because they only take cash. Couldn't believe that in today's society.  

[Galway Red]

I refuse to pay cashless so that will save me a few quid, do kids carry cashless cards? 

[Port Said Red]

3 minutes ago, Carey 6 said:

Doesn't bother me much, I never carry cash. A lot of the older generation still don't have cards though, there should always be a place within a stadium where they can still use cash. 

Birmingham away I couldn't get a drink in the concourse though because they only take cash. Couldn't believe that in today's society.  

I must admit that with contactless payments now, I rarely have cash on me. I think there are some old school guys who might begrudge their partners being able to see just how much they spend when at the ground though.

[KingLear]

To me, it's stranger when an establishment accepts cash only as I never carry cash.

Plenty of bars, especially in London, have resorted to cashless to stop any losses in case they are burgled. Also stops the passing of counterfeit money as well I guess. 

Interesting debate but I think you'll only see more clubs follow suit in the future.

[Bristol Rob]

1 minute ago, KingLear said:

To me, it's stranger when an establishment accepts cash only as I never carry cash.

Plenty of bars, especially in London, have resorted to cashless to stop any losses in case they are burgled. Also stops the passing of counterfeit money as well I guess. 

Interesting debate but I think you'll only see more clubs follow suit in the future.

The prevention of forged cash is interesting, as if you don't realise your card has gone missing, someone can quickly rack up a small fortune in contactless payments on a card that isn't theirs.

Granted, banks are generally quick to refund, but it does put the onus on the customer to take more care than the retailer.

Oddly, I still prefer cash for most things as I know how much on a Sunday morning I have pissed up the wall if I went out with 'x' amount and wake up with 'x - y'.

I just don't really buy in to the idea that I need to piece transactions together using an app.

That said, Ola/Uber have changed my travelling habits for the worse. I am far more likely to jump in a cab now than wait for a bus.

[BTRFTG]

Yeah, I love standing behind the potless numpty in the queue who feigns surprise when their contactless purchase (sic) gets rejected and proceeds to spend 10 minutes obfuscating attempting to cadge something for n'owt. 'Hold on whilst I call my bank...' - that's going to work in the drinks queue on the concourse......

[WolfOfWestStreet]

I'm not a tin foil hat sort of person but I'm a little bit uncomfortable with all my purchases being tracked digitally. 

[candygram for mongo]

Will “cashless” mean that they accept debit/credit cards or will it be like several foreign clubs where you have a dedicated charge card which you continually “top up” on the premises ?

[Up The City!]

I'm still a bit meh about contactless. I use it and it's handy but I feel it makes you feel like you have more money than you have as you don't physically get to handle and count the cash etc. I don't feel like I'm spending money when I use contactless.

On a night out I will set myself a budget and take out cash and leave my card at home because one or two times I've woke up the next day having spent an absolute fortune at the bar using contactless.

At Ashton Gate, one of the outside bars only takes contactless I believe, everytime I've got a beer from there and checked my account a few days later they always charge me the full price rather than the discounted price, there is not much you can do a few days later. That's why I like cash, if I'm over charged then I can instantly get it corrected.

[exAtyeoMax]

2 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

have they turned decimal? 

[Bristol Rob]

6 minutes ago, candygram for mongo said:

Will “cashless” mean that they accept debit/credit cards or will it be like several foreign clubs where you have a dedicated charge card which you continually “top up” on the premises ?

Only a matter of time me thinks, before 'season ticket discount' is replaced with the 'Bristol Sport Charge Card' where you lodge your cash, that will be held to the clubs advantage (probably offshore) earning interest, and you are encouraged to save £££s by using their apps/plastic.

Sterling will be like Itchy and Scratchy money in a few years.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

I'm still a bit meh about contactless. I use it and it's handy but I feel it makes you feel like you have more money than you have as you don't physically get to handle and count the cash etc. I don't feel like I'm spending money when I use contactless.

On a night out I will set myself a budget and take out cash and leave my card at home because one or two times I've woke up the next day having spent an absolute fortune at the bar using contactless.

At Ashton Gate, one of the outside bars only takes contactless I believe, everytime I've got a beer from there and checked my account a few days later they always charge me the full price rather than the discounted price, there is not much you can do a few days later. That's why I like cash, if I'm over charged then I can instantly get it corrected.

It’s important to be in control of your own money and not to embrace cashless which for me is a dangerous road to go down.

there are many websites as to why not to go cashless as well as the support of “bill of exchange act” which they ignore.

it will take too long to explain why you should not go cashless which supports the banks complete control over yours.

[Up The City!]

7 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Only a matter of time me thinks, before 'season ticket discount' is replaced with the 'Bristol Sport Charge Card' where you lodge your cash, that will be held to the clubs advantage (probably offshore) earning interest, and you are encouraged to save £££s by using their apps/plastic.

Sterling will be like Itchy and Scratchy money in a few years.

And if you don't spend it by the end of the season, you lose it.

[Bristol Rob]

2 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

And if you don't spend it by the end of the season, you lose it.

That's a given!

Especially as a lot of people will think... 'pie, 3 pints a game, maybe a few cup games as well', I'll lump a roughly similar amount of cash on at the start of the season, and either have to top it up because they suddenly get all generous with their pals because 'it isn't real money' or are too cautious as they want it to last. 

God knows how much money TFL have made from inactive oyster cards.

[Eddie Hitler]

1 hour ago, sephjnr said:

This isn't a good thing. Besides football being more expensive in general, it's becoming mandatory in more places for one to have a bank account to attend football games which - besides being antithetical to the Working Class Sport notion - will hit the poorest (who may only be coming when tickets are on offer) and also the youngest who may not be able to rely on Mum or Dad buying tickets forever.

 

48 minutes ago, Galway Red said:

I refuse to pay cashless so that will save me a few quid, do kids carry cashless cards? 

 

26 minutes ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

I'm not a tin foil hat sort of person but I'm a little bit uncomfortable with all my purchases being tracked digitally. 

 

This is very much my position and with the people I know (all ages) it very much divides people.  Some embrace every easy payment method going including paying by swiping their phone on a laser whereas others (like me) see cash as having huge advantages so always pay by cash if possible.  Certainly for anything sub £100.

I don't think that anybody is going to change their position because it's down to personal preference but for me the advantages of cash are:

• Automatic budgeting - if you have the cash you can buy it, if you don't then you don't.  Very handy on a drinking night when I have heard of people spending astronomical sums on their cards which they very much regret the next day.
• Not having every one of your purchases tracked (simple example - if you are a smoker and tell your medical insurance company that you don't smoke then they can prove you wrong) (I don't smoke).
• You don't need to keep receipts or remember every small purchase for when you receive your statement because you are effectively doing this each time you make a cash purchase - pass cash over and receive goods or services.
• If you buy with cash then you are not open to possible fraud - card cloning or whatever - at every transaction.
• There is no percentage take by the card provider from the transaction - the retailer sells you something for ten pounds and they receive ten pounds.

There are of course disadvantages but I think that the advantages outweigh them.

 

 

[Up The City!]

Potentially could someone walk around a public place such as Ashton Gate with some sort of reader and just charge numerous cards 30 quid a time? That is what always worries me.

[Sturny]

4 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

Potentially could someone walk around a public place such as Ashton Gate with some sort of reader and just charge numerous cards 30 quid a time? That is what always worries me.

That could happen anywhere, I bought a wallet card blocker to stop this. I've seen some wallets that have that inbuilt 

[Eddie Hitler]

10 minutes ago, Sturny said:

That could happen anywhere, I bought a wallet card blocker to stop this. I've seen some wallets that have that inbuilt 

Plus you can cut the aerial within the card so that it doesn't work as a contactless if you're never going to use it in this way.  I have done this rather than go through the faff of getting my bank to issue me with non-contactless cards.

This tells you how:

https://robinminto.com/blog/post/2014/03/21/Disabling-contactless-payment-cards-or-preventing-card-clash-with-Oyster

[Selred]

42 minutes ago, Up The City! said:

everytime I've got a beer from there and checked my account a few days later they always charge me the full price rather than the discounted price, there is not much you can do a few days later

Check the machine before you tap then, it'll say how much you're about to be charged.

[TBW]

40 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

 

 

 

This is very much my position and with the people I know (all ages) it very much divides people.  Some embrace every easy payment method going including paying by swiping their phone on a laser whereas others (like me) see cash as having huge advantages so always pay by cash if possible.  Certainly for anything sub £100.

I don't think that anybody is going to change their position because it's down to personal preference but for me the advantages of cash are:

• Automatic budgeting - if you have the cash you can buy it, if you don't then you don't.  Very handy on a drinking night when I have heard of people spending astronomical sums on their cards which they very much regret the next day.
• Not having every one of your purchases tracked (simple example - if you are a smoker and tell your medical insurance company that you don't smoke then they can prove you wrong) (I don't smoke).
• You don't need to keep receipts or remember every small purchase for when you receive your statement because you are effectively doing this each time you make a cash purchase - pass cash over and receive goods or services.
• If you buy with cash then you are not open to possible fraud - card cloning or whatever - at every transaction.
• There is no percentage take by the card provider from the transaction - the retailer sells you something for ten pounds and they receive ten pounds.

There are of course disadvantages but I think that the advantages outweigh them.

1. You can get an account like Monzo and use it as a prepaid card. Transfer a value onto it your main account before you go out and then every time there is a spend on it, you get a notification on your phone immediately. 

2. When you go to Tesco and do a shop, it doesn't put on your statement every individual item you purchased.

3. Nobody keeps receipts anyway, but still, use #1 again and it's got every purchase in there. There's even a section where you can take a picture of your receipt and attach it to the purchase, then dispose of the actual receipt. 

4. Apart from it being fake cash.

5. The business have agreed to these terms, it's the price of convenience in not having to handle cash and have people pulling out 5p coins and dropping them on the floor when trying to pay. With ST discount the prices are always annoying. 

 

[Eddie Hitler]

2 minutes ago, TBW said:

1. You can get an account like Monzo and use it as a prepaid card. Transfer a value onto it your main account before you go out and then every time there is a spend on it, you get a notification on your phone. 

2. When you go to Tesco and do a shop, it doesn't put on you're statement every individual item you purchased.

3. Nobody keeps receipts anyway, but still, use #1 again and it's got every purchase in there. There's even a section where you can take a picture of your receipt and attach it to the purchase, then dispose of the actual receipt. 

4. Apart from it being fake cash.

5. The business have agreed to these terms, it's the price of convenience in not having to handle cash and have people pulling out 5p coins and dropping them on the floor when trying to pay. With ST discount the prices are always annoying. 

 

All absolutely fair.  As I said I was listing the advantages of cash but not the downsides or alternatives.

I know somebody who is very careful with her money (meaning monitors it rather than being mean) and she uses all the modern payment methods and checks her bank statement online daily so she is no more going to get done than I am with cash payments.

It comes down to personal preference and what you think is important.

[Sturny]

It's more or less happened in Sweden. When I was there it was just so easy... 

[Red7]

3 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wereas Rovers plan on remaining potless.

They have plenty of tinpots.

[BTRFTG]

1 hour ago, candygram for mongo said:

Will “cashless” mean that they accept debit/credit cards or will it be like several foreign clubs where you have a dedicated charge card which you continually “top up” on the premises ?

Went with the lad to see The Netherlands Vs Spain at the Amsterdam Arena. Inside early, went to buy some beers and....what! Arena Card only and whilst you could 'top up' inside the ground at that time you could only buy cards themselves from the outlet outside. Also,  I recall there was a minimum €20 card or whatever so if you only wanted a pint and weren't a regular it proved a mighty expensive drink.

[TBW]

4 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

All absolutely fair.  As I said I was listing the advantages of cash but not the downsides or alternatives.

I know somebody who is very careful with her money (meaning monitors it rather than being mean) and she uses all the modern payment methods and checks her bank statement online daily so she is no more going to get done than I am with cash payments.

It comes down to personal preference and what you think is important.

I honestly do recommend looking into using something like Monzo though. The immediate notifications are a great option. Basically if you're card does get cloned and used, your phone will tell you it's being used as it happens, and where it's being used. You can then use an option in the application to freeze the card temporarily until you've figured out what to do. 

Fortunately I've never had to do that but it's nice to know it's there and the application sorts all your payments into sections so you can see how much you've spent at a particular vendor between a certain period of you want to budget that badly. 

[BTRFTG]

45 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

God knows how much money TFL have made from inactive oyster cards.

I've got 40 in my drawer. Ever tried to cash them in to get the deposits back, don't bother. There's only 4 places you may do so, they're never open or have endless queues. 

[Up The City!]

2 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

Went with the lad to see The Netherlands Vs Spain at the Amsterdam Arena. Inside early, went to buy some beers and....what! Arena Card only and whilst you could 'top up' inside the ground at that time you could only buy cards themselves from the outlet outside. Also,  I recall there was a minimum €20 card or whatever so if you only wanted a pint and weren't a regular it proved a mighty expensive drink.

But highly lucrative for them as you may only buy one beer and then as you never visit there again you never get to use the rest of the money.

I've been to many festivals that operate token systems for bars, always get proper ripped off with them.

[BTRFTG]

31 minutes ago, Redwhitepurple said:

Government have you right where they want. 6million cctv cameras and soon they will know every single penny you earn and spend. Eric Arthur Blair, aka mr Orwell. What a clever man, has the future predictions spot on

Not quite. I know a thing or two about data and Government knows surprisingly little about you, they certainly aren't spying in your living room or bedroom. Google, Amazon, Samsung and Sony on the other hand.....not to mention Tesco & Sainsbury's for wider profiles.

[SinéadB]

8 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

I've got 40 in my drawer. Ever tried to cash them in to get the deposits back, don't bother. There's only 4 places you may do so, they're never open or have endless queues. 

You can get a refund for your oyster in plenty of ways. Either online, by post, on the phone or at the tube station. It's not that difficult - or you can put it in a charity box at plenty of tube stations so the leftover money and deposit refund goes to charity.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/oyster-card-refunds/

[pillred]

1 hour ago, Up The City! said:

I'm still a bit meh about contactless. I use it and it's handy but I feel it makes you feel like you have more money than you have as you don't physically get to handle and count the cash etc. I don't feel like I'm spending money when I use contactless.

On a night out I will set myself a budget and take out cash and leave my card at home because one or two times I've woke up the next day having spent an absolute fortune at the bar using contactless.

At Ashton Gate, one of the outside bars only takes contactless I believe, everytime I've got a beer from there and checked my account a few days later they always charge me the full price rather than the discounted price, there is not much you can do a few days later. That's why I like cash, if I'm over charged then I can instantly get it corrected.

I think that's part of the reason places want to become cashless, as you said it doesn't feel like your spending REAL money and so probably spend more as a result which is obviously better for them.

[Robin Goch]

1 hour ago, Up The City! said:

I'm still a bit meh about contactless. I use it and it's handy but I feel it makes you feel like you have more money than you have as you don't physically get to handle and count the cash etc. I don't feel like I'm spending money when I use contactless.

On a night out I will set myself a budget and take out cash and leave my card at home because one or two times I've woke up the next day having spent an absolute fortune at the bar using contactless.

At Ashton Gate, one of the outside bars only takes contactless I believe, everytime I've got a beer from there and checked my account a few days later they always charge me the full price rather than the discounted price, there is not much you can do a few days later. That's why I like cash, if I'm over charged then I can instantly get it corrected.

See I’m the complete opposite, if I use cash then I feel that it’s almost ‘throw away money’ as I don’t see it in bank statements etc so in my head it’s never existed.

[Sturny]

8 minutes ago, pillred said:

I think that's part of the reason places want to become cashless, as you said it doesn't feel like your spending REAL money and so probably spend more as a result which is obviously better for them.

I don't think it's that at all. It's much much easier/safer to run a business that doesn't involve a load of cash handling.  

 

[Bristol Oil Services]

Southend United was cashless, years ago, when we went there first game of the season, early 90s. Entry was swift, no problems. Worked beautifully; years ahead of their time, I thought. Next time we went there, they were back to wanting cash - insistent they were, and not very welcoming, either! Funny lot, never quite figured them out....

[Eddie Hitler]

8 minutes ago, Sturny said:

I don't think it's that at all. It's much much easier/safer to run a business that doesn't involve a load of cash handling.  

 

Absolutely; unless it's a very small business for whom hiring the terminal is a material cost.

Though as the saying goes "The customer is always right".  I am the customer, I want to pay cash.

[ZiderEyed]

1 hour ago, Redwhitepurple said:

Government have you right where they want. 6million cctv cameras and soon they will know every single penny you earn and spend. Eric Arthur Blair, aka mr Orwell. What a clever man, has the future predictions spot on

[Sturny]

10 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Absolutely; unless it's a very small business for whom hiring the terminal is a material cost.

Though as the saying goes "The customer is always right".  I am the customer, I want to pay cash.

You'll be surprised it's mostly complete opposite these days. Much cheaper to buy some online transaction machine that probably outweighs the cost of losing the odd customer that only has cash (which i think is rare these days). I've seen loads of those small coffee vans round Bristol using them. 

 

[Reading Red UTC]

I'd probably get used to this.

Cash will be no more by 2030.

[Eddie Hitler]

3 minutes ago, Reading Red UTC said:

I'd probably get used to this.

Cash will be no more by 2030.

Nobody knows the future.

[TBW]

59 minutes ago, BTRFTG said:

I've got 40 in my drawer. Ever tried to cash them in to get the deposits back, don't bother. There's only 4 places you may do so, they're never open or have endless queues. 

I did it online, it was easy enough.

40 in the drawer though? That's £200, not including any remaining value on them. Definitely is worth the hassle.

[Bristol Rob]

9 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said:

Nobody knows the future.

Clearly haven't read the Brexit thread!

Some right Mystic Meg's on that one.

[Eddie Hitler]

3 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Clearly haven't read the Brexit thread!

Some right Mystic Meg's on that one.

All politicians seem to be doing this at the moment.

"I know exactly what will be happening in two years' time if we do x or y".  Of course they don't, nobody ever does. 

They just make it up and hope people believe them as happens at every single General Election.

[cidered abroad]

2 hours ago, Galway Red said:

I refuse to pay cashless so that will save me a few quid, do kids carry cashless cards? 

My 13 years granddaughter has her own card to use on buses, shopping and food outlets and so on. Very sensible isn't it.

[bcfcredandwhite]

I personally like contactless as a concept and use it almost all the time. No hassle with pockets full of change to drop all over the floor, or needing an ATM that's miles away - and for the retailers no need to keep loads of change on premis. It's particularly useful in London when using the underground as it works the same as Oysters and better than buying a zoned ticket because you only pay for what you use. 

I don't care if the bank (or the wife) knows when I've popped down the local for a couple of pints, or put £30 worth of fuel in my car. It also makes tax avoidance difficult so I'm surprised that the government isn't coming up with incentives to encourage more retailers to adopt it (they may have to be fair - I'm not a retailer so I don't know). I'm a bit suspicious of outlets that only deal in cash - but that's me!

Anyway, it works for me - until there's a power cut of course - but the electronic cash registers would also fail so no difference - we'd all go without!!!!!

I can see cash being phased out within the next 20 years - maybe sooner. 

[BTRFTG]

1 hour ago, S.B. said:

You can get a refund for your oyster in plenty of ways. Either online, by post, on the phone or at the tube station. It's not that difficult - or you can put it in a charity box at plenty of tube stations so the leftover money and deposit refund goes to charity.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/oyster-card-refunds/

No you can't. Their desired system only works if each card has been used in the previous account period, has been pre-registered and without seeing them they also did not know which generation they were or what deposit was charged? By used,  that means taking a journey, not touching in at a nachine. I've only ever managed to have 3 refunded via the in station process. It's deliberately made difficult to prevent people from claiming refunds. The only way to do it is to go not to a station but a customer service centre and queue up. Present a pile of cards and they claim that they're unable to process given they've other customers to serve.

[Bristol Rob]

The flip side to the joy of cashless, was a fairly substantial power cut that impacted Gloucester Road the other month.

Wasn't me waiting for bar service that night! Those cashless customers had a dreadful time however! Gotta have some cash on you. 

[Sturny]

5 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

The flip side to the joy of cashless, was a fairly substantial power cut that impacted Gloucester Road the other month.

Wasn't me waiting for bar service that night! Those cashless customers had a dreadful time however! Gotta have some cash on you. 

The bars were open after a powercut?

[Nongazeuse]

Cashless is fine when it works.  I buy lunch from a couple of different mobile food outlets but on about 1 in 10 days the point of sale device doesn't work so they ask for cash - many people don't have it on them so they don't get lunch although one vendor trusts you to pay next time.

On the first day of the season before last (Wigan?)  the bars in the Lansdown wouldn't take card payments due to a network failure I believe - had to share a cup of tea with my daughter as not much shrapnel in our pockets.

I think cash should always be an option if you are running a retail outlet.

 

 

  

[Bristol Rob]

20 minutes ago, Sturny said:

The bars were open after a powercut?

The pub was.

The only issue was that they had to keep one of the tills open (they were electric) and some beers were off, aside from that, it was good times! I tend to drink bottles anyway, so impact to me was pretty much nil.

[italian dave]

I thought most clubs were cashless? Pretty short, at least. 

[Fiale]

Whilst I have no problems with this we need to make sure cash is not phased out as we all know what will happen. Every transaction will start incurring transaction/processing fees that will be like another tax on all your money. 

[CotswoldRed]

Yippee. Yet another company who wants to know and record information on every item you buy from them. You can't even buy a beer anonymously any more. 

Hope their data security is up to scratch. 

[RedRock]

2 hours ago, ZiderEyed said:

Never understood this issue with CCTV. Wasn’t it actually the Tories who wanted to scrap it a few years back due to the infringement on ‘civil liberties’.

Bonkers.

While waiting for my car to be serviced in Exeter recently, thought I’d pop into the Crown Court. It was a rape and battery charge, the whole Police case rested on CCTV evidence of the day of the attack and the months previous demonstrating the accused had regularly toured the area waiting for a single victim. 

I'll do a deal with ‘civil liberty’ advocates. You rid the Country of terrorists and criminals, then we can get rid of CCTV.

Until then, I’m quite happy with the cost of my ‘civil liberty’ being infringed in the knowledge of the benefit that loads of ****holes being locked up and the place being a safer place because of that. 

 

 

[Guest]

Was in a German stadium the other day and they only accepted the club card or a contactless card, lucky my UK card worked there 

[pillred]

3 hours ago, bcfcredandwhite said:

I personally like contactless as a concept and use it almost all the time. No hassle with pockets full of change to drop all over the floor, or needing an ATM that's miles away - and for the retailers no need to keep loads of change on premis. It's particularly useful in London when using the underground as it works the same as Oysters and better than buying a zoned ticket because you only pay for what you use. 

I don't care if the bank (or the wife) knows when I've popped down the local for a couple of pints, or put £30 worth of fuel in my car. It also makes tax avoidance difficult so I'm surprised that the government isn't coming up with incentives to encourage more retailers to adopt it (they may have to be fair - I'm not a retailer so I don't know). I'm a bit suspicious of outlets that only deal in cash - but that's me!

Anyway, it works for me - until there's a power cut of course - but the electronic cash registers would also fail so no difference - we'd all go without!!!!!

I can see cash being phased out within the next 20 years - maybe sooner. 

But I still say it's a very easy way to spend money when your not actually handing over cash, just think myself budgeting is easier when you takeout a certain amount though I realise some purchases would need too much cash to be safe that's when cards come into their own.

[bcfcredandwhite]

6 hours ago, pillred said:

But I still say it's a very easy way to spend money when your not actually handing over cash, just think myself budgeting is easier when you takeout a certain amount though I realise some purchases would need too much cash to be safe that's when cards come into their own.

Fair enough mate 

[Brentford Fan]

16 hours ago, Bas's perfect hattrick said:

Next season, rovers will stop accepting turnips as payment

Just put them out on the pitch instead.

[Olé]

On 01/10/2019 at 10:22, Eddie Hitler said:

There is no percentage take by the card provider from the transaction - the retailer sells you something for ten pounds and they receive ten pounds

Full disclosure: payments and in particular cashless payments has been my job and my professional passion for almost all of my working life. I deal with the inner workings and finer detail and in that time I've been exposed to policy making and new ideas.

First of all the idea the retailer gets full benefit of a transaction when received in cash is fanciful. You try taking that to the bank and a cash handling charge in addition to time involved soon evens things up, particularly as card spend is higher and faster too. 

The cost of card payment acceptance was regulated in favour of consumers and businesses by the EU in 2016 (the evil EU with all their meddling rules...) and capped by about two thirds, and there is ongoing work to get costs down further (eventually free).

As an unrelated aside, the EU also prevented surcharging of cards in the interests of consumers, even though when you use your credit card part of the fee is effectively an insurance policy against Thomas Cook going bust and you wanting your money back!

I share that last point only as an illustration of the lack of understanding of payments and assumption everything is malevolent when in fact it is consumer driven. See Daily Fail/Express "rip off credit cards" one week "where are our reward points" the next.

Football clubs going cashless is a throughput thing (I'm saying that as someone who knows the vendors of solutions at several grounds and even new innovations like finger-vein payments in Man City corporate). Every second saved is an extra pint served.

Chances are the people moaning about new technology are the same ones who moan about queues at half time. Funnily enough the one thing that both participants in the transaction will benefit from equally is speed - and fumbling about with cash ain't it.

On 01/10/2019 at 09:58, WolfOfWestStreet said:

I'm not a tin foil hat sort of person but I'm a little bit uncomfortable with all my purchases being tracked digitally. 

In terms of privacy, unless you register your card number at a retailer (or club) alongside your personal data, they know the square root of F all about you, only your bank does, and they can't just sell that data or use it to market to you (GDPR - another EU law).

Like most things data is exchanged for value and the companies (and I've worked with some of them) that are using payments data to profile consumers, do so to power loyalty rewards and other incentives. Again this is consumer driven not malevolent.

Making payments simpler and respecting privacy are two mutually exclusive things - you can retain your privacy rights and take advantage of greater convenience of payment. The irony is cashless payments are full of rules to protect consumers. Cash isn't.

On 01/10/2019 at 10:08, Bristol Rob said:

Only a matter of time me thinks, before 'season ticket discount' is replaced with the 'Bristol Sport Charge Card' where you lodge your cash, that will be held to the clubs advantage (probably offshore) earning interest, and you are encouraged to save £££s by using their apps/plastic.

I take your point as this was/is something a few vendors have looked at, but there isn't a lot of evidence the "prepay" model (sometimes nicknamed "Oyster") is the direction of travel. Contactless has reduced the venue demand for a one-tap, stored value card.

But again, if such a model existed, if it was to be used openly across different football stadiums, it would be considered legally as E-money, and by law this is protected and must be held as user funds regulated by the FCA, not squirrelled away by the operator. 

On the other hand if this was just a "Bristol Sport charge card", yes they could do what they like with the money, but it would reduce Bristol Sport's individual payment handling charges further and I would hope they'd pass on those savings to us as consumers.

 

All taken together, payments innovation is not some machiavellian ruse to screw over consumers. We live in a free market, payment processes will only succeed if consumers adopt them and they are fair to retailers. Anything else will fail and has failed before.

Finally with respect to a contingency for technology failing, for all my fan-girling of cashless payments, I have a pretty straightforward approach and it has nothing to do with tech. I carry cash as a courtesy to shop/pub owners, as it should always be their choice.

[Bristol Rob]

Further to the points made by @Olé there is a sub-economy that stands to lose out due to a largely cashless society, and that's the homeless.

Whilst some Big Issue vendors are able to accept card payments, some people who are really down on their luck and trying to scrape together cash, either for a roof over their head, a meal or to help them service an addiction are probably going to find it harder to meet their target.

Wonder if this will result in a change in crime patterns?

[Eddie Hitler]

1 hour ago, Olé said:

Full disclosure: payments and in particular cashless payments has been my job and my professional passion for almost all of my working life. I deal with the inner workings and finer detail and in that time I've been exposed to policy making and new ideas.

First of all the idea the retailer gets full benefit of a transaction when received in cash is fanciful. You try taking that to the bank and a cash handling charge in addition to time involved soon evens things up, particularly as card spend is higher and faster too. 

The cost of card payment acceptance was regulated in favour of consumers and businesses by the EU in 2016 (the evil EU with all their meddling rules...) and capped by about two thirds, and there is ongoing work to get costs down further (eventually free).

As an unrelated aside, the EU also prevented surcharging of cards in the interests of consumers, even though when you use your credit card part of the fee is effectively an insurance policy against Thomas Cook going bust and you wanting your money back!

I share that last point only as an illustration of the lack of understanding of payments and assumption everything is malevolent when in fact it is consumer driven. See Daily Fail/Express "rip off credit cards" one week "where are our reward points" the next.

Football clubs going cashless is a throughput thing (I'm saying that as someone who knows the vendors of solutions at several grounds and even new innovations like finger-vein payments in Man City corporate). Every second saved is an extra pint served.

Chances are the people moaning about new technology are the same ones who moan about queues at half time. Funnily enough the one thing that both participants in the transaction will benefit from equally is speed - and fumbling about with cash ain't it.

In terms of privacy, unless you register your card number at a retailer (or club) alongside your personal data, they know the square root of F all about you, only your bank does, and they can't just sell that data or use it to market to you (GDPR - another EU law).

Like most things data is exchanged for value and the companies (and I've worked with some of them) that are using payments data to profile consumers, do so to power loyalty rewards and other incentives. Again this is consumer driven not malevolent.

Making payments simpler and respecting privacy are two mutually exclusive things - you can retain your privacy rights and take advantage of greater convenience of payment. The irony is cashless payments are full of rules to protect consumers. Cash isn't.

I take your point as this was/is something a few vendors have looked at, but there isn't a lot of evidence the "prepay" model (sometimes nicknamed "Oyster") is the direction of travel. Contactless has reduced the venue demand for a one-tap, stored value card.

But again, if such a model existed, if it was to be used openly across different football stadiums, it would be considered legally as E-money, and by law this is protected and must be held as user funds regulated by the FCA, not squirrelled away by the operator. 

On the other hand if this was just a "Bristol Sport charge card", yes they could do what they like with the money, but it would reduce Bristol Sport's individual payment handling charges further and I would hope they'd pass on those savings to us as consumers.

 

All taken together, payments innovation is not some machiavellian ruse to screw over consumers. We live in a free market, payment processes will only succeed if consumers adopt them and they are fair to retailers. Anything else will fail and has failed before.

Finally with respect to a contingency for technology failing, for all my fan-girling of cashless payments, I have a pretty straightforward approach and it has nothing to do with tech. I carry cash as a courtesy to shop/pub owners, as it should always be their choice.

Excellent post.

It's always good to hear from an expert.

[Hunsupport]

Few interesting topic for me to browse here but for this one I can actually post to share my experience. In our new stadium (Ferencváros, stadium was built in 2014) in order to fight against this "Balkan, agressive fanbase" stereotype You can only enter if You register first (except VIP ticket holders). You get a fan card with Your name, You get a pin code (sort of) by scanning Your palm and when You buy a ticket (season or single game is the same) online it goes to You fan card. Then You can enter the stadium by scanning Your card and palm ét voila! You're in. And after that what correlates to this topic is that You can ONLY buy cashless in the stadium WITH Your fan card: You can either put cash on it via the stewards circulating in the stadium or straight through credit card. And at the end of the season let's say theres 5 pound left on the card it goes straight to the bank account of Ferencváros' youth teams.

I have to say I like this system: there was a big fight with the ultras about that palm scanning ( for 3 years they didn't show up in the stadium) but the management negotiated with them and they're back now. And the athmospere is way better than ever, really became much more cultured and You only need 1 fan card for everything: thats Your ticket and paying card as well, You get it once and don't ever have to again mess with paper ticket, money, etc. Of course it's still a possibility to buy a ticket in person if You want to have it for example as a memory. And the away end remains as normal, cash at the buffet.