Bristol R*vers dustbin thread

[pongo88]

1 hour ago, Midlands Robin said:

They're still hoping the value of the land the Mem sits on is enough to pay for the construction of a new stadium at the Fruit Market. This also overlooks the fact that the stadium is designated a asset of community value which means that Wally can't just offer it up as a swap deal for a few bricks in new stadium. 

In the interview Hussain Al-Saeed states that he hopes the developer will build the stadium for them in return for getting the Memorial Stadium site. Out of interest, does anyone know the value of the land at Horfield?  Rovers are talking about getting a 17,000 seater stadium but the figures don’t add up. As a comparison, York City’s new 8,500 capacity ground cost £44m to build, and work started on that 6 years ago. 

[Eddie Hitler]

6 minutes ago, slartibartfast said:

You always seem to be the bearer of bad news !

 

I look at it that they're copying us, and imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

[bert tann]

10 minutes ago, slartibartfast said:

You always seem to be the bearer of bad news !

But the Führer hasn't taken account of losses on the eastern front ( Olney, Buckinghamshire)

Nationwide Finance Ltd still have their multi million pound loan outstanding for the bunker that never was.

[Port Said Red]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

It is indeed registered as an ACV by Bristol City Council.

https://memorialgroundbristol.wordpress.com/2015/11/09/an-asset-of-community-value/

Wally and his new friend will have to be careful how they verbalise the arrangements if/when its transferred to the Fruit Market developers, but it shouldn't make much difference.

But if that covenant as mentioned in the above article could be found/proven, they'd be royally ******.

 

54 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

 

I hadn't read anything about a covenant before. Is that not a huge block to the FM deal?

Not easy to over turn I think, especially with the hugely sensitive nature of the background to it?

Nor me, but that looks like there must be newspaper records from the time at a bare minimum. The Council should have something in their vaults too.

For those adverse to links,  the section we are discussing.is at the bottom of this post.

And in case you are wondering, it appears we "all" would get a vote on whether the covenant is overturned, assuming the Bristol Public are identified as the Covenant Holder.

 

"Checking back through a property’s history may also uncover if it has been removed previously. If the beneficiary of the covenant can be identified, you can either negotiate a release of the covenant or a variation of the deed containing the covenant and this will then be registered with the Land Registry.

There are certain criteria that a restrictive covenant must meet in order to still have a useful purpose. If you believe that the one on your property no longer has a function, you can potentially challenge it through the Lands Tribunal. Your solicitor will check whether any of the grounds contained in section 84 of the Law of Property Act 1925 can form the basis of a claim"

Presumably the Rovers Board will have their lawyers looking at the subsequent paragraph.

 

Edited August 14, 2023 by Port Said Red

[The Gasbuster]

It would appear that even when they “pool” their resources; Wally Al Qaeda & Saddam Hussain still can’t afford to build the Fruitihad.

Edited August 14, 2023 by The Gasbuster

[slartibartfast]

21 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

In the interview Hussain Al-Saeed states that he hopes the developer will build the stadium for them in return for getting the Memorial Stadium site. Out of interest, does anyone know the value of the land at Horfield?  Rovers are talking about getting a 17,000 seater stadium but the figures don’t add up. As a comparison, York City’s new 8,500 capacity ground cost £44m to build, and work started on that 6 years ago. 

It's all fruit pie in the sky !

[bcfc01]

24 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

In the interview Hussain Al-Saeed states that he hopes the developer will build the stadium for them in return for getting the Memorial Stadium site. Out of interest, does anyone know the value of the land at Horfield?  Rovers are talking about getting a 17,000 seater stadium but the figures don’t add up. As a comparison, York City’s new 8,500 capacity ground cost £44m to build, and work started on that 6 years ago. 

Rule of thumb used to be that each seat costs 2k for a reasonable build standard.

I would guess that is closer to 3k these days.

So a 17k seater would be in the region of 50m.

Best of luck to them...

[Lanterne Rouge]

1 hour ago, chinapig said:

Too advanced. I'm thinking Janet and John build a football stand.

We should get in touch with those lads who do the updated and extremely funny Ladybird books. They could get a couple of volumes out of this.

[bcfc01]

23 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

 

Nor me, but that looks like there must be newspaper records from the time at a bare minimum. The Council should have something in their vaults too.

For those adverse to links,  the section we are discussing.is at the bottom of this post.

And in case you are wondering, it appears we "all" would get a vote on whether the covenant is overturned, assuming the Bristol Public are identified as the Covenant Holder.

 

"Checking back through a property’s history may also uncover if it has been removed previously. If the beneficiary of the covenant can be identified, you can either negotiate a release of the covenant or a variation of the deed containing the covenant and this will then be registered with the Land Registry.

There are certain criteria that a restrictive covenant must meet in order to still have a useful purpose. If you believe that the one on your property no longer has a function, you can potentially challenge it through the Lands Tribunal. Your solicitor will check whether any of the grounds contained in section 84 of the Law of Property Act 1925 can form the basis of a claim"

Presumably the Rovers Board will have their lawyers looking at the subsequent paragraph.

 

Bit more;

Perpetuity – the Covenant

It had taken considerable post-war effort to revive the game, as survivors of the Great War trickled back to the city. The founders and trustees of The Memorial Ground intended that it should remain a sports or recreational facility permanently, as evidenced by these restrictive covenant sections, quoted from the Land Registry (Title Number BL58342):

“(c) That the land hereby conveyed shall not be used for any purpose which shall or may be or become a nuisance or annoyance to the occupiers of houses erected at any time on land belonging to the said Testator Provided and it is hereby expressly agreed that nothing herein contained is intended to prevent the land hereby conveyed from being used for football or any other athletic sport or recreation.”

and

“…grant unto the said Francis Nicholas Cowlin his heirs and assigns full Licence and permission to erect and to maintain and continue upon the said land within the before mentioned distance of Twenty yards of the North Eastern boundary of the said land but not nearer than Fifteen yards of the said North East Boundary any erection or building of any height which the said Francis Nicholas Cowlin his heirs or assigns may deem necessary or desirable for or in connection with the use of the said lands as Football Athletic Sports or Recreation Ground…” (5).

https://memorialgroundbristol.wordpress.com/history/

[Bristol Rob]

15 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Rule of thumb used to be that each seat costs 2k for a reasonable build standard.

I would guess that is closer to 3k these days.

So a 17k seater would be in the region of 50m.

Best of luck to them...

Would say £50mil would get them something tidy, but if they are looking to build in a residential area, either the cost of the new builds will reflect the hassle of living by a stadium, or the stadium itself would need to be over engineered to minimise impact.

The developer will be all about profit, so if the numbers don't stack up, the first thing you do is drop the stadium, build another 200 flats and stick 10k on the asking price of everything.

[Numero Uno]

4 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

Rule of thumb used to be that each seat costs 2k for a reasonable build standard.

I would guess that is closer to 3k these days.

So a 17k seater would be in the region of 50m.

Best of luck to them...

The issue is, and the new guy has admitted it, the Few are totally reliant on the Developers of the site being able to make it work. If the numbers don’t stack up things will either be delayed until they do or worse for them the Developer could just flip the site, get their money back and run. It’s not uncommon.

A proper stadium of 20k seats, if done properly, could easily set the Developer back £50m plus. It won’t have dawned on our blue cousins that there is a lot of work to be done before a design is tabled let alone a spade put in the ground. You’re also looking at a the best part of two years to build it.

No wonder the newbie is asking for patience. Could be five years away if there aren’t huge obstacles to overcome.

[weepywall]

1 hour ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

From Gaschat, politics on their side with voter numbers apparently:-

10000+ active Bristol Rovers fans (many based/voting in Bristol) and 40,000+ passive 'fans' based on Wembley attendances..

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

[milo1111]

12 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

What are you talking about?? Everyone absolutely adores them. 

[BetterRedthanBlue]

14 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

The issue is, and the new guy has admitted it, the Few are totally reliant on the Developers of the site being able to make it work. If the numbers don’t stack up things will either be delayed until they do or worse for them the Developer could just flip the site, get their money back and run. It’s not uncommon.

A proper stadium of 20k seats, if done properly, could easily set the Developer back £50m plus. It won’t have dawned on our blue cousins that there is a lot of work to be done before a design is tabled let alone a spade put in the ground. You’re also looking at a the best part of two years to build it.

No wonder the newbie is asking for patience. Could be five years away if there aren’t huge obstacles to overcome.

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

[Bristol Rob]

25 minutes ago, weepywall said:

Those inflated Wembley attendances they continuously harp on about FFS, I know plenty that went to Wembley with Rovers just for a day out, they would have no interest in watching them for a game against Barnsley, Port Vale etc...its the same with us, we have actually taken over 40k to Wembley but plenty of that 40k wouldn't regularly watch us....deluded is an understatement.

It's a family day out, one die hard wants to take the kids, which in turn means the Doris, who then decides she ought to invite her parents along to share the burden of the kids, but it would be wrong to not invite his folks as well and before you know it, one fan turns in to 8 tickets.

[1960maaan]

42 minutes ago, pongo88 said:

In the interview Hussain Al-Saeed states that he hopes the developer will build the stadium for them in return for getting the Memorial Stadium site. Out of interest, does anyone know the value of the land at Horfield?  Rovers are talking about getting a 17,000 seater stadium but the figures don’t add up. As a comparison, York City’s new 8,500 capacity ground cost £44m to build, and work started on that 6 years ago. 

Going back to Sainsbury days, they were willing to pay over the odds because of the size and where it was. When that fell through the only other interest that I remember was housing which was around £20m. 
Now I don't know how land values have move since 2015, but the cost of building has gone up and that surely means profits are reduced so no one will be throwing money around. Even if you think that land has risen by half, £30m is well short of a decent stadium, as others have said you'd be looking at around £2.5k - £3k per seat , for a decent Stadium.
Brentford's ground (17,200) cost £70m.
Wimbledon ( 9,300) £30m +
Anyone taking the Memorial site as payment would want to make a profit even if they were fans. Plus as has been said  "The Covenant on the land, explicitly states that it should be used for sport or recreation, for the benefit of the community, in perpetuity" 
The figures don't seem to add up.
I wonder if they regret not becoming renters at the UWE.

[bcfc01]

Just now, BetterRedthanBlue said:

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

London prices for Brentford and Wimbledon.

 

[Bristol Rob]

3 minutes ago, bcfc01 said:

London prices for Brentford and Wimbledon.

 

Cost of the land is a MASSIVE factor. And also part of the reason I struggle to watch Four In A Bed on Channel 4.

Yes, you can charge £25 for a night in your B&B in Blackpool because the building cost you a pigeon, 2 loaves of Hovis and a greyhound. But why moan about the fella offering a night in London for asking £125 for a similar experience when his guest house cost 2mil+

[Lanterne Rouge]

Brentford`s was a bugger to build as well given what was around it.

[bcfc01]

1 minute ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

Brentford`s was a bugger to build as well given what was around it.

Must be one of the smallest footprints for a stadium in the country.

Luton may rival it.

[pillred]

It looks like a young construction worker has died at the building of the new Everton stadium very sad news.

[Numero Uno]

22 minutes ago, BetterRedthanBlue said:

Brentford's 17k seater cost £71m. Plough Lane which is 9k cost £34m.

I'd say you'd be looking at £65-80m for the stadium as costs will have gone up since Brentford built their stadium.

With a developer building it I can see the gas stadium coming in a bit cheaper but it won’t be the shiny glossy, better than they gurt teds model they are expecting. It certainly won’t be 28k capacity either.

[pillred]

3 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

With a developer building it I can see the gas stadium coming in a bit cheaper but it won’t be the shiny glossy, better than they gurt teds model they are expecting. It certainly won’t be 28k capacity either.

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

[Quedgeley Exile]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

Covenant paperwork conveniently not able to be found at the time of the Sainsbury farce.

 

Rovers binned everything belonging to Bristol Rugby when they took control or the ground.  

[The Gasbuster]

1 minute ago, pillred said:

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

Using sag logic, then yes.

Actual total for AG rebuild was £45M-£50M.

[Numero Uno]

5 minutes ago, pillred said:

Didn't the Lansdown stand cost £90 million alone?

They will get what the developer can afford to build them. That reality won’t hit them for a while………

[Bonkey Dollocks]

27 minutes ago, Bristol Rob said:

Cost of the land is a MASSIVE factor. And also part of the reason I struggle to watch Four In A Bed on Channel 4.

Yes, you can charge £25 for a night in your B&B in Blackpool because the building cost you a pigeon, 2 loaves of Hovis and a greyhound. But why moan about the fella offering a night in London for asking £125 for a similar experience when his guest house cost 2mil+

Oddly specific

I can think of hundreds of reasons not to watch Four in a Bed on Channel 4. Cost of the land is way down the list tbf

[Open End Numb Legs]

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

[Port Said Red]

3 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

First they have to find a stand to film in.  

[chinapig]

4 minutes ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

Rovers media team are filming a spin off series - Four in a Stand.

Shouldn't that be Forty Thousand in a Stand?