Birmingham City away match day thread

[lenred]

No gold plating anything tonight.  No excuses, thought we did ok first half but it was really really poor second half. They weren’t very good and to lose 3/0 to that standard is very disappointing.  Not expecting much from Saturday either. Big big work needed over the international break. Just need to keep above the relegation line this year - that’s the reality of the situation. 

[Supersonic Robin]

5 minutes ago, cityexile said:

Getting dicked by WBA, not great, but it is what it is.

Getting dicked by a very average B’ham…most disappointing result of the season.

Thought we were well in it at half time. Time and time again however the other team finds it far to easy to create chances against us. If we cannot defend well we are dead in the water. Difficult to know what to say really. 

Agree, really pissed about this one.

Very winnable game on paper, but not really turned up. Shouldn't be losing 3-0 to them IMO. 

[sludge]

1 minute ago, bexhill reds said:

Perhaps but there are rarely good players to be bought in Jan without parting with silly money.

Appreciate that but we have done it before in Jan with the likes of Tomlin and Odemwingie if I recall

[Jeez]

I feel sorry for Martin, he can’t sub himself but it’s painful watching him play the full 90.

[maxjak]

8 minutes ago, Cornwall red said:

Back to the High Performance Centre to try again

That title is such an embarrassing misnomer?  Surely they are in danger of a very large fine under the Trades Description Act?

[old_eastender]

3 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Partially agree with you, but the issue is looking at our bench today what else would you have done? In the Kalas example, Vyner and Atkinson in a back two? Yikes.

Without Wells or Martin up front it'd be kids from the U23s pretty much.

I totally agree we need an overhaul (although we might disagree on who should survive it), and I'm sure it's coming, but it has to be done in stages. We have two of our back line who have barely played above L2 starting every game currently. Our best player in the middle is 20, alongside a new signing from the summer. Up front are the 2 you've mentioned. It's chaos.

Maybe you're right and we could just throw caution to the wind, but I have no idea what that'd do to the squad harmony or dressing room - or the development of the kids we'd be chucking in there. You can't just drop half the squad 1/3 of the way into the season. Rock and a hard place for me, unfortunately!

It's not pretty though, is it. As you said, we need to get to the long term, but imo we can't totally destroy everything in one go to get there.

and you think they could be less effective?  Rather seem them offering commitment, enthusiasm, and some pace than our seasoned pros.

[steviestevieneville]

1 minute ago, Bodiesaffer said:

We need a Roy Keene, and a Bully up top..

Yeah . We need a Ben Pearson in midfield definitely . I’m lost for words really about vyner s performance  . This is what I mean about fans just pointing the finger at Pearson . Some of the players are terrible . He can’t ship them all out at once with no money to replace them. 

[maxjak]

1 minute ago, Red Alert said:

I feel sorry for Martin, he can’t sub himself but it’s painful watching him play the full 90.

If he was a horse....they would shoot him?

[TV Tom]

10 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said:

You haven’t got a clue you stupid *** 

What a complete and utter plank you are

[Sturny]

1 minute ago, lenred said:

No gold plating anything tonight.  No excuses, thought we did ok first half but it was really really poor second half. They weren’t very good and to lose 3/0 to that standard is very disappointing.  Not expecting much from Saturday either. Big big work needed over the international break. Just need to keep above the relegation line this year - that’s the reality of the situation. 

NP couldn’t sort the squad out over the summer, I have zero faith things will change over a small international break. 

[samo II]

7 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

Partially agree with you, but the issue is looking at our bench today what else would you have done? In the Kalas example, Vyner and Atkinson in a back two? Yikes.

Without Wells or Martin up front it'd be kids from the U23s pretty much.

I totally agree we need an overhaul (although we might disagree on who should survive it), and I'm sure it's coming, but it has to be done in stages. We have two of our back line who have barely played above L2 starting every game currently. Our best player in the middle is 20, alongside a new signing from the summer. Up front are the 2 you've mentioned. It's chaos.

Maybe you're right and we could just throw caution to the wind, but I have no idea what that'd do to the squad harmony or dressing room - or the development of the kids we'd be chucking in there. You can't just drop half the squad 1/3 of the way into the season. Rock and a hard place for me, unfortunately!

It's not pretty though, is it. As you said, we need to get to the long term, but imo we can't totally destroy everything in one go to get there.

I guess I’m of the mind that if we don’t blow it up, where are we going?

The alternative is… this? That tonight was relegated side-quality football, but in early November; that’s an awful sign.

Plus; we literally look worse now than we did a couple of months ago - and that’s not just down to available players, as they are broadly the same.

We don’t have the luxury of time or money that NP’s predecessors maybe had, and if we sleepwalk into relegation because we wouldn’t take the risk of blooding kids/pulling vets and trying something different, the situation won’t improve.

And I truthfully don’t care about the dressing room - good ones grown and thrive at these moments, so if there isn’t the spirit there now to fight back, it’s already broken so to hell with it; shake them up.

edit: and yes, I’d play under 23 players instead of at least Martin - he’s done; offers next to nothing.

Edited November 2, 2021 by samo II

[old_eastender]

Just now, steviestevieneville said:

Yeah . We need a Ben Pearson in midfield definitely . I’m lost for words really about vyner s performance  . This is what I mean about fans just pointing the finger at Pearson . Some of the players are terrible . He can’t ship them all out at once with no money to replace them. 

Half agree, but NP picked Vyner so should the finger not be pointed at NP for doing that. We all know how weak he can be at CB, why didn't NP?

[And Its Smith]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

1st half summary:

Its the best we've knocked it about fo weeks, but as usual, some of you just want to moan.  The player opinion agendas out in force, can't wait to type a critical post, ignoring anything decent a player does.

We've played alright.

Brum knock an excellent cross....good challenge to make it difficult - OTIB they should score

Dasilva does the same - we haven't created anything.

"Vyner playing in the middle - WTF" - how has he done?  How has it helped us get Kalas on the ball getting forward?  Take the blinkers off...and some of you the sheepskin noseband too!!! Arghhh.

What a bunch of miserable tosseurs we have on here.  Eff me.

A bit more care with the final pass and we can get something, there have been some good bit of build-up.  Need to be less naive with the challenges on Deeney who has ref Hooper in his pocket.

Looking forward to your full time analysis Dave! Never seen you post like this before.  Tensions running high 

[IAmNick]

Just now, old_eastender said:

and you think they could be less effective?  Rather seem them offering commitment, enthusiasm, and some pace than our seasoned pros.

I don't know if they'd be less effective, hard to imagine how sometimes - but if we're thinking about the long term then what is scrapping around every game in ones like we watched today going to do for their development?

First proper games in pro football, just chucked in week in week out to this? Would be madness imo.

Just play all the kids is a nice idea, but it's never going to work from any angle as far as I can see it. They need careful management, not their confidence and everything else shot within the first month.

[The Swan and Cemetery]

We absolutely lack a goal threat, but all 3 goals tonight were defensively farcical in one way or another. The two in the second half seemed simply to require the extraordinary skill from their players of… running.

[WessexPest]

8 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said:

What concerns me is that we seem worse than we were at the start of the season - and we weren't very good then. 

Even in the five games we won we only looked at best decent in patches. Could’ve drawn them all. Just one clean sheet all season.

We’ll get marmalised at Coventry Saturday.

[steviestevieneville]

1 minute ago, harrys said:

What a complete and utter plank you are

Look sunshine . You’re obviously a  bit embarrassed that you’ve little idea about the game & how players are rested to save them from injury. It’s fine , don’t worry . Goodnight 

[054123]

15 minutes ago, BasSavage88 said:

Been fun again lads. 2 and a half more years

 

I’ve already put up with 35, the last 20 of which we’ve had a billionaire in charge.

2 and half years isn’t going to make much difference.

 

[Red-Robbo]

1 minute ago, WessexPest said:

Even in the five games we won we only looked at best decent in patches. Could’ve drawn them all. Just one clean sheet all season.

We’ll get marmalised at Coventry Saturday.

 

Yep. As has been posted already tonight: Still waiting for that first "good" performance. 

[steviestevieneville]

2 minutes ago, old_eastender said:

Half agree, but NP picked Vyner so should the finger not be pointed at NP for doing that. We all know how weak he can be at CB, why didn't NP?

He does, but he wanted to match up with 3 at the back. Baker out & Pring with a knock , he had little choice . 

[Bodiesaffer]

1 minute ago, steviestevieneville said:

Yeah . We need a Ben Pearson in midfield definitely . I’m lost for words really about vyner s performance  . This is what I mean about fans just pointing the finger at Pearson . Some of the players are terrible . He can’t ship them all out at once with no money to replace them. 

Exactly, Vyner, Backinson, Martin. For starters.  Bentley too, great shot stopper, but the rest of his game is dogs shit, that’s why Brentford let him go. But I’d keep for a season more.

[Banjo Island]

12 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

Maybe the problem is that all of our High Performances happen at the High Performance Centre. Rename AG "The Really High Performance Centre" and we'll be sorted.

Or just rename it the very low performance centre

[old_eastender]

2 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

I don't know if they'd be less effective, hard to imagine how sometimes - but if we're thinking about the long term then what is scrapping around every game in ones like we watched today going to do for their development?

First proper games in pro football, just chucked in week in week out to this? Would be madness imo.

Just play all the kids is a nice idea, but it's never going to work from any angle as far as I can see it. They need careful management, not their confidence and everything else shot within the first month.

I'm not suggesting chucking them all in, but when Wells, Martin, Weimann is not working and you have options on the bench, FFS we need to use them - what it the point them being there otherwise!

[hollydog]

16 minutes ago, keflav said:

I have backed Pearson so far, but this could be a turning point for me it's just not working. We have no creativity, no goal threat and defend like rank amateurs.

Bakinson & vyner should no where near the first team there an absolute liability, no idea what Pearson see it them....

Reflects my view entirely. Can’t understand why Pearson would pick them. Quite simply they cannot do the basics. 

Whilst the squad is poor it is also the most expensive - by some margin - than any we have had yet the end product is non existent. Pearson has to take some blame. 

[samo II]

1 minute ago, IAmNick said:

I don't know if they'd be less effective, hard to imagine how sometimes - but if we're thinking about the long term then what is scrapping around every game in ones like we watched today going to do for their development?

First proper games in pro football, just chucked in week in week out to this? Would be madness imo.

Just play all the kids is a nice idea, but it's never going to work from any angle as far as I can see it. They need careful management, not their confidence and everything else shot within the first month.

I’d counter being a young player watching from the sidelines on this team, seeing the absolute garbage the ‘senior pros’ are putting out and still having them starting over you would be discouraging.

We don’t seem to have any leaders on this team; I’d rather be rooting for young players trying the damnedest every week and failing than whatever crap that was tonight. I literally never want to see Martin pull on our shirt again.

[TV Tom]

I’ve had enough of this manager, have we actually deserved to win a single game since he’s been in charge? The standard of football is as bad as any time I can remember

[lenred]

2 minutes ago, Sturny said:

NP couldn’t sort the squad out over the summer, I have zero faith things will change over a small international break. 

Maybe clutching a bit but the summer was hectic in terms of the squad churn, contract talks, Ashton saga, recruitment team etc.  This is a clear and settled run to work with a squad that needs some serious drilling in terms of shape and defensive work. Like is said maybe clutching but all we need is to stay up this season with what we have and then rebuild yet again with players he wants in the summer. Keep saying it but it’s where we’re at.  

[steviestevieneville]

Just now, Bodiesaffer said:

Exactly, Vyner, Backinson, Martin. For starters.  Bentley too, great shot stopper, but the rest of his game is dogs shit, that’s why Brentford let him go. But I’d keep for a season more.

Disagree about Bentley & I would of disagreed about Martin but he’s been really poor lately. 
vyner , Bakinson, O’dowda, Palmer we have to get off the wage bill. Palmer alone financially is draining the coffers. 

[old_eastender]

1 minute ago, steviestevieneville said:

He does, but he wanted to match up with 3 at the back. Baker out & Pring with a knock , he had little choice . 

How well did that work out?  LJ was a bugger for trying to match up to opponents rather than playing our game and letting them worry about whether they should match us up. Hard to imagine we would have had a worse result sticking to a back 4 and 3 in midfield.

[George Rs]

I don’t get why people thought big nige was gonna be class in the first place to be honest, we played 5x better football under Johnson, don’t know where we go from here tbh because he will never get backing in January to buy half decent strikers.