Allardyce till the end of the season !

[CodeRed]

Leeds this time, set to be announced today according to BBC Radio Leeds .Gracia and the DoF to leave immediately.

Edited May 2, 2023 by CodeRed

[One Team]

Bielsa to Allardyce in two seasons, wow….

That said he’s probably the sort of person who can get something out of them in 4 games and may just keep them up. 

[Merrick's Marvels]

What a ridiculous state to get yourselves into. Couldn't be funnier. Never mind.

Just another example that football, fundamentally, is about recruitment, recruitment, recruitment.  

[BanburyRed]

If you ship 23 goals in the month of April, then you're in serious trouble....

[Super]

5 minutes ago, BanburyRed said:

If you ship 23 goals in the month of April, then you're in serious trouble....

With Man City and Newcastle the next 2 games.....

[W-S-M Seagull]

12 minutes ago, One Team said:

Bielsa to Allardyce in two seasons, wow….

That said he’s probably the sort of person who can get something out of them in 4 games and may just keep them up. 

Bielsa is part of the the reason they are in the mud now. 

Should have got rid of him as soon as they got promoted imo. He had one way of playing and that was it and the recruitment was based around that. I really don't understanding the love in with him. I'd rather have Allerdyce over Bielsa. . 

[Super]

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Bielsa is part of the the reason they are in the mud now. 

Should have got rid of him as soon as they got promoted imo. He had one way of playing and that was it and the recruitment was based around that. I really don't understanding the love in with him. I'd rather have Allerdyce over Bielsa. . 

I certainly wouldn't.

[Bristol Rob]

9 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Bielsa is part of the the reason they are in the mud now. 

Should have got rid of him as soon as they got promoted imo. He had one way of playing and that was it and the recruitment was based around that. I really don't understanding the love in with him. I'd rather have Allerdyce over Bielsa. . 

Mental isn't it. A manager wanting to strengthen his squad with players who will fit in with their preferred style of play.....

[chinapig]

3 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Bielsa is part of the the reason they are in the mud now. 

Should have got rid of him as soon as they got promoted imo. He had one way of playing and that was it and the recruitment was based around that. I really don't understanding the love in with him. I'd rather have Allerdyce over Bielsa. . 

Would have been odd to sack him at that point. They finished 9th in their first season back.

The issue with recruitment is down to Victor Orta. He was the man who wanted Marsch and recruited to fit his style. And indeed recruited half the USA team of whom only Tyler Adams has been any good.

The Athletic did a very good podcast on Leeds yesterday covering all this and more.

[luke_bristol]

Hilarious, really.

If Allardyce fails to get enough points to stay up from the next four games, which includes Man City away and Newcastle at home, will they sack him as well? 

[2015]

10 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Bielsa is part of the the reason they are in the mud now. 

Should have got rid of him as soon as they got promoted imo. He had one way of playing and that was it and the recruitment was based around that. I really don't understanding the love in with him. I'd rather have Allerdyce over Bielsa. . 

Really? I suppose if you prefer a pragmatic style and view Football solely as a Results game then fair enough but Bielsa kept Leeds up in his first season quite comfortably.

For me the football the likes of Bielsa and Pep try and play is the football I want to see played every week. The likes of Pulis, Allardyce, Moyes and Warnock will thankfully be relics of the past in the next couple of decades.

[Coxy27]

3 minutes ago, luke_bristol said:

Hilarious, really.

If Allardyce fails to get enough points to stay up from the next four games, which includes Man City away and Newcastle at home, will they sack him as well? 

You'd assume he's a temporary appointment and won't be there next season regardless of the outcome...?

[Bristol Oil Services]

22 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

What a ridiculous state to get yourselves into. Couldn't be funnier. Never mind.

Just another example that football, fundamentally, is about recruitment, recruitment, recruitment.  

Yes. Or, as SO'D would have it, in his Black Country mumble: decision making. Decision making on the field, decision making off the field.

 

[robinforlife2]

4 minutes ago, luke_bristol said:

Hilarious, really.

If Allardyce fails to get enough points to stay up from the next four games, which includes Man City away and Newcastle at home, will they sack him as well? 

Why would they need to sack him, he's only been given the job until the end of the season.

To be honest, they clearly think they are going down with the current set up, and have no confidence in Garcia to keep them up, so  relieving him of his duties, is hardly madness, it's a sensible thing to do as it gives them a chance of survival they don't believe they have under Garcia. They clearly don't see Big Sam as a long term answer, but if he keeps them up they start next year in the top flight and they can hire someone to build a team to maintain that. If they go down, they will appoint someone to try and get them straight back up. I wouldn't say it's hilarious, if anything they waited too long. 

[Bristol Oil Services]

I just wish Everton were playing Leeds on the last day, with the loser going down. It would be the angriest game in the history of English football. Although, for the women and children, and assorted minorities, of them two places, it's probably good they're not. 

[ScottishRed]

7 minutes ago, chinapig said:

Would have been odd to sack him at that point. They finished 9th in their first season back.

The issue with recruitment is down to Victor Orta. He was the man who wanted Marsch and recruited to fit his style. And indeed recruited half the USA team of whom only Tyler Adams has been any good.

The Athletic did a very good podcast on Leeds yesterday covering all this and more.

Marsch was a huge error. I understand why they sacked Bielsa but I suspect had they stuck with him they would have stayed up.

All this proves, yet again, that staying in the EPL is a desperate business as far as owners are concerned.

All of which is driven by money and the madness of the sums involved.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Allardyce can get a bit of an unfair press. Built something at Bolton that is easily and perhaps wrongly pigeon holed into long ball hoof- yes there was some of that especially vs the bigger sides but he was a pragmatist. Hierro, Campo, Djorkaeff, Okocha wouldn't play for a pure hit and hope merchant. Speed too and one of the only managers to get a tangible return out of Diouf.

Would vary within a basic framework depending on opposition. Anyway they may as well try something but what can anyone do in just 4 games, probably should have backed Bielsa more in January 2022 tbh.

Edited May 2, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[REDOXO]

Any reference to Allardyce automatically makes me think of the non football forum! 

However I am not afraid to say if it keeps Leeds up at the expense of Everton I would be quietly happy!

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

15 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Really? I suppose if you prefer a pragmatic style and view Football solely as a Results game then fair enough but Bielsa kept Leeds up in his first season quite comfortably.

For me the football the likes of Bielsa and Pep try and play is the football I want to see played every week. The likes of Pulis, Allardyce, Moyes and Warnock will thankfully be relics of the past in the next couple of decades.

I can understand that but if you're a fan of Bielsa you have to understand that you'll never see him managing your side for very long. His 4 years at Leeds was the longest tenure he's had at club level. 

[2015]

6 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Allardyce can get a bit of an unfair press. Built something at Bolton that is easily and perhaps wrongly pigeon holed into long ball hoof- yes there was some of that especially vs the bigger sides but he was a pragmatist. Hierro, Campo, Djorkaeff, Okocha wouldn't play for a pure hit and hope merchant. Speed too and one of the only managers to get a tangible return out of Diouf.

Would vary within a basic framework depending on opposition. Anyway they may as well try something but what can anyone do in just 4 games, probably should have backed Bielsa more in January 2022 tbh.

He's the best out of the 'dinosaurs' that are left remaining. I just find it sad that sides are so scared to get relegated to the EFL that they go for a win at all costs approach rather than sticking to their more progressive style of play, which for clubs like Brighton and Fulham it has worked.

[2015]

1 minute ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I can understand that but if you're a fan of Bielsa you have to understand that you'll never see him managing your side for very long. His 4 years at Leeds was the longest tenure he's had at club level. 

The man is very intense and the style his sides play are super intense. This cannot be sustained for a long period, which is why he wont be at club's for a long time. However, his entertaining style of play is great to watch from a neutral POV and Leeds fans were very lucky to have him until the final season. They can't say they were not enjoying the ride under Bielsa. 

One day I hope English football becomes more Latin in the way we approach football rather than playing for the percentages and set pieces.

[chinapig]

4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Allardyce can get a bit of an unfair press. Built something at Bolton that is easily and perhaps wrongly pigeon holed into long ball hoof- yes there was some of that especially vs the bigger sides but he was a pragmatist. Hierro, Campo, Djorkaeff, Okocha wouldn't play for a pure hit and hope merchant. Speed top and one of the only managers to get a tangible return out of Diouf.

Would vary within a basic framework depending on opposition. Anyway they may as well try something but what can anyone do in just 4 games, probably should have backed Bielsa more in January 2022 tbh.

He was an innovator in his early days at Bolton and rarely gets credit for that it's true. More recently he has become a bit of a parody of a "proper football man".

It's been a while since he's gone down well with fans of clubs he's managed certainly. Will be interesting to see what Leeds fans think.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 minute ago, 2015 said:

He's the best out of the 'dinosaurs' that are left remaining. I just find it sad that sides are so scared to get relegated to the EFL that they go for a win at all costs approach rather than sticking to their more progressive style of play, which for clubs like Brighton and Fulham it has worked.

Yeah agreed. Ironically Leeds have a bonus of up to £40m that is only due in the event of survival so...then again their takeover may hinge on staying up.

[W-S-M Seagull]

17 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Really? I suppose if you prefer a pragmatic style and view Football solely as a Results game then fair enough but Bielsa kept Leeds up in his first season quite comfortably.

For me the football the likes of Bielsa and Pep try and play is the football I want to see played every week. The likes of Pulis, Allardyce, Moyes and Warnock will thankfully be relics of the past in the next couple of decades.

Didn't they take a few hammerings? 

Pep and Bielsa can't be spoken about in the same breath. Bielsa has his teams playing all put gung-ho football. He was found out in the Premier league for being tactically inept. He had no plan b. He was unable to adapt.

Because of his gung-ho style of football and his bizarre training methods, he put the players welfare at risk. They had huge injury problems due to this of which there is still a hangover from that today. 

Pep is a tactical master. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

4 minutes ago, 2015 said:

He's the best out of the 'dinosaurs' that are left remaining. I just find it sad that sides are so scared to get relegated to the EFL that they go for a win at all costs approach rather than sticking to their more progressive style of play, which for clubs like Brighton and Fulham it has worked.

Calling Allerdyce a dinosaur is hilarious. 

He was actually a pioneer. He helped to modernise the English game. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, chinapig said:

He was an innovator in his early days at Bolton and rarely gets credit for that it's true. More recently he has become a bit of a parody of a "proper football man".

It's been a while since he's gone down well with fans of clubs he's managed certainly. Will be interesting to see what Leeds fans think.

Prozone and Analytics was the one most spoken about.

Would also add, less spoken about he was one of the first PL managers to regularly use 4-3-3/4-5-1. One of the first to cotton on that the advantage in CM can outweigh that of the 2nd striker.

He's probably regressed a bit and past his best now.

[mozo]

I personally think this culture of sacking managers shows that owners of clubs have zero understanding of football. 

How they expect a rotten culture, confidence issues and poor form to be turned around in a matter of weeks, just bemuses me.

If a team is capable of being revived, it will do so irrespective of the manager change.

I know Villa sticks out as having instant success, but they've gone from a rookie manager to a top proven winner. Most of the sackings do not mirror those circumstances. Typically clubs are just bouncing from one punt to another punt and it's the recruitment of those managers that is to blame.

Edited May 2, 2023 by mozo

[chinapig]

4 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Pep is a tactical master. 

And regards Bielsa as an inspiration.

[2015]

3 minutes ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Didn't they take a few hammerings? 

Pep and Bielsa can't be spoken about in the same breath. Bielsa has his teams playing all put gung-ho football. He was found out in the Premier league for being tactically inept. He had no plan b. He was unable to adapt.

Because of his gung-ho style of football and his bizarre training methods, he put the players welfare at risk. They had huge injury problems due to this of which there is still a hangover from that today. 

Pep is a tactical master. 

Didn't Bielsa win Leeds the Championship with 93 points with his gung-ho football and in his first season in the Prem have them finishing 10th by playing this way?

Fair enough you like a more pragmatic approach to Football that's up to you, but I'd be bored shitless if the whole aim whilst being in the Prem was just to simply survive every season which is what most of the bottom half are doing right now.

You forget that Bielsa was a mentor to Pep Guardiola during the 2000's in Mexico and is a highly respected coach across Europe and South America. I have nothing against Allardyce because like has been said he has been a pioneer for his tactical insight and methods, but his style aint for me.

[chinapig]

4 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Prozone and Analytics was the one most spoken about.

And sports science. Wenger wasn't the only one to change English football.