Garry O'Neil.

[Davefevs]

15 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Personally I’m massively reassured that Jon Moss is now in charge here.

In his last ever game as a ref he denied Huddersfield two blatant penalties in the playoff final against Forest, so someone with a record of favouring the bigger club will be right at home with whitewashing the “controversial” decisions that United & Liverpool consistently get.

Been crap since Culture Club disbanded.  They’re all victims!

[Curr Avon]

14 hours ago, Fordy62 said:

Honestly. I can’t believe it. I have no affiliation to Wolves but that’s beyond a joke. 

Me too, bloody embarassing.

Meanwhile over at VAR central at Stockley Park, its the 97th minute, and...

[Mr Popodopolous]

5 hours ago, ChrisBW said:

Handball - Preston received an apology for it not being given. 

Did they.

Was Preston's goal vs us which contained a handball actually allowable under the ever changing rules or was that an error against us.

[GrahamC]

24 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Been crap since Culture Club disbanded.  They’re all victims!

Certainly crap, last season in the games I saw he consistently struggled to keep up with play.

Poor ref who retires & gets rewarded with plum job, no wonder standards are seemingly at an all time low.

[cidercity1987]

1 minute ago, GrahamC said:

Certainly crap, last season in the games I saw he consistently struggled to keep up with play.

Poor ref who retires & gets rewarded with plum job, no wonder standards are seemingly at an all time low.

I did find it a bit strange from a ref whose last game was to deny Huddersfield two blatant penalties in the play off final

[Sir Geoff]

We got penalised, a couple of years ago, for exactly the same type of incident when 'Bents clattered into a forward after the ball had gone. Result.....penalty.

[SBB]

2 hours ago, ChrisBW said:

They also get paid a ridiculous amount which isn’t justifiable with such poor decisions.

Premier league referee’s are the lowest paid referees from the top 5 leagues. Still a decent salary but under half of their la liga counterparts.

2 hours ago, ChrisBW said:

Edited August 15, 2023 by SBB
Double post

[Numero Uno]

3 hours ago, B1ackbird said:

If it was the other way around VAR would be falling over themselves to award a penalty...

I think the Premier League has a serious integrity problem, whether that be unconscious bias or blatant bias. Decisions like last night could be EITHER to be honest. You are absolutely spot on, if it's Wolves 1-0 up and that happens it's a penalty 100 times out of 100. If the Wolves player did what the keeper did, the ball breaks and they equalise with the keeper prostrate on the floor it gets disallowed 100 times out of 100.

Apparently the referees and VAR officials have been demoted for the next round of matches - totally insufficient imo, I think it should be a month for the referee and the closest assistant to teach them that they really shouldn't be missing something so blatant and a minimum of 12 weeks for the VAR officials to teach them a proper lesson that you have to ignore the shirt on the players backs when a clear and obvious foul in the penalty area is committed. The assistant down the other end of the pitch wouldn't get demoted if it was my decision.

I'm not saying the game is bent but if it did come out years down the line that decisions like that were being made deliberately in favour of selected clubs based on their size and standing in the game it wouldn't be the biggest shock ever.

[ChrisBW]

40 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Did they.

Was Preston's goal vs us which contained a handball actually allowable under the ever changing rules or was that an error against us.

Rules state that they’re goal was right to stand. 

Edited August 15, 2023 by ChrisBW

[elhombrecito]

1 hour ago, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

I lost count of the number of foul throws in the Spain/Sweden women’s’ match today.  

I lose count of the amount of foul throws in every City game. I honestly don't think it's an exaggeration to say that the majority of throw-ins in modern football are technically foul throws.

[ChrisBW]

12 minutes ago, SBB said:

Premier league referee’s are the lowest paid referees from the top 5 leagues. Still a decent salary but under half of their la liga counterparts.

So? 

1 minute ago, elhombrecito said:

I lose count of the amount of foul throws in every City game. I honestly don't think it's an exaggeration to say that the majority of throw-ins in modern football are technically foul throws.

They are. Pros don’t batter an eyelid. Level 7 in the local park people go mad.

[Rob k]

25 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

 

I'm not saying the game is bent but if it did come out years down the line that decisions like that were being made deliberately in favour of selected clubs based on their size and standing in the game it wouldn't be the biggest shock ever.

I think with VAR it’s getting harder to actually argue with people that say football is corrupt - some of the decisions are just so bad you can’t even begin to justify them.

At least before you had the ‘he only had one look’ line as a defence. 

[REDOXO]

38 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

I think the Premier League has a serious integrity problem, whether that be unconscious bias or blatant bias. Decisions like last night could be EITHER to be honest. You are absolutely spot on, if it's Wolves 1-0 up and that happens it's a penalty 100 times out of 100. If the Wolves player did what the keeper did, the ball breaks and they equalise with the keeper prostrate on the floor it gets disallowed 100 times out of 100.

Apparently the referees and VAR officials have been demoted for the next round of matches - totally insufficient imo, I think it should be a month for the referee and the closest assistant to teach them that they really shouldn't be missing something so blatant and a minimum of 12 weeks for the VAR officials to teach them a proper lesson that you have to ignore the shirt on the players backs when a clear and obvious foul in the penalty area is committed. The assistant down the other end of the pitch wouldn't get demoted if it was my decision.

I'm not saying the game is bent but if it did come out years down the line that decisions like that were being made deliberately in favour of selected clubs based on their size and standing in the game it wouldn't be the biggest shock ever.

Bigger clubs get favorable decisions. I don’t think it’s overt but I do think referees give major decisions way to often to the bigger club, in their head!

31 minutes ago, elhombrecito said:

I lose count of the amount of foul throws in every City game. I honestly don't think it's an exaggeration to say that the majority of throw-ins in modern football are technically foul throws.

I only said this to Mrs Oxo the other day. Horrifying how foul throws are being let go. 

9 minutes ago, Rob k said:

I think with VAR it’s getting harder to actually argue with people that say football is corrupt - some of the decisions are just so bad you can’t even begin to justify them.

At least before you had the ‘he only had one look’ line as a defence. 

I’m not sure it’s particularly corrupt until it comes to the money slopping around. 
 

But bad decisions are now highlighted and in some cases not corrected. 
 

Last night was akin to an assault 

[And Its Smith]

The only question is whether the bias is conscious or unconscious 

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

This whole debate is because of VAR. If VAR wasn't present we'd just be talking about another mistake by a ref. Tough luck on Wolves but that's how it goes. Add in VAR however and it fuels the debate on corruption in the game. 

It is clear what I think of VAR, it's an abomination, but it's not the technology at fault but the interpretation. Technology used correctly can he an aid to sport. Goal line technology is a boon but then like hawkeye in tennis it's black and white. The problem with VAR is it's being administered by the most incompetent set of officials the English game has seen in over 50 years. PMGOLs only purpose seems to be to hand out letters of apology for the sheer incompetence of those under it's control. Certainly there is no evidence that it is doing anything to improve standards. 

[kit]

47 minutes ago, ChrisBW said:

Rules state that they’re goal was right to stand. 

How about Vyner, as I saw it, his hand/arm were supporting his body and the ball struck it. Unless the rules have changed, I didn't think that was a penalty.

As an aside as well, it seems nuts that the rules can be such that if the ball hits your hand and then you score its a foul, but if you then play a square pass to someone to knock into an open goal its not a foul. Surely its a foul or not a foul and what you go on to do next should have no determination on it.

[Rob k]

20 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

Bigger clubs get favorable decisions. I don’t think it’s overt but I do think referees give major decisions way to often to the bigger club, in their head!

I only said this to Mrs Oxo the other day. Horrifying how foul throws are being let go. 

I’m not sure it’s particularly corrupt until it comes to the money slopping around. 
 

But bad decisions are now highlighted and in some cases not corrected. 
 

Last night was akin to an assault 

How do you explain last night? And I’m no conspiracy theorist but I’m struggling with some of these decisions 

[downendcity]

19 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

I think the Premier League has a serious integrity problem, whether that be unconscious bias or blatant bias. Decisions like last night could be EITHER to be honest. You are absolutely spot on, if it's Wolves 1-0 up and that happens it's a penalty 100 times out of 100. If the Wolves player did what the keeper did, the ball breaks and they equalise with the keeper prostrate on the floor it gets disallowed 100 times out of 100.

Apparently the referees and VAR officials have been demoted for the next round of matches - totally insufficient imo, I think it should be a month for the referee and the closest assistant to teach them that they really shouldn't be missing something so blatant and a minimum of 12 weeks for the VAR officials to teach them a proper lesson that you have to ignore the shirt on the players backs when a clear and obvious foul in the penalty area is committed. The assistant down the other end of the pitch wouldn't get demoted if it was my decision.

I'm not saying the game is bent but if it did come out years down the line that decisions like that were being made deliberately in favour of selected clubs based on their size and standing in the game it wouldn't be the biggest shock ever.

Demoted to Bristol City v Birmingham!

On the wider issue of VAR,  I've commented before that the principle behind VAR was completely sound. Developments in technology meant that it was possible to aid the on field referee and avoid erroneous decisions. 

 If the referee has access to tv replays to enable him to review an contentious incident in order to come to the right decision, then that would be the correct use of technology and retains the integrity of the on field officials.

The problem is that since it's introduction, it seems that increasingly it is the VAR officials that are making the final decision and not the on field officials. Decisions such as in the Man U v Wolves game cannot but increase the feeling that there is a real danger of VAR being the means by which outside influence can affect the outcome of games rather than events on the pitch..

 

[eardun]

Last night reinforces my dislike of VAR. I’m glad we don’t have it in the Championship. I’m not looking forward to it if and when we get to the Prem. It takes away the immediacy and spontaneity of celebrating a goal. Just imagine if we had had VAR last Saturday v Millwall? And to cap it all, the VAR refs make errors. Leave it to the ref on the pitch to get it right or wrong. 
 

[Numero Uno]

35 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

The only question is whether the bias is conscious or unconscious 

Totally agree, it's not even a discussion imo whether the bias exists or not. It clearly does.

Last night's decision can only be one of three things - absolute incompetence caused by being incompetent, absolute incompetence caused by unconscious bias or bent. I don't think you get to the level of a Premier League referee by being that incompetent so that narrows it down to two in my eyes.

[downendcity]

In the games I've watched, it does seem that in the Women's WC the referees are looking at pitch side monitors to review a decision a lot more than we tend to see in domestic games.

[johnbytheriver]

1 hour ago, ChrisBW said:

So? 

They are. Pros don’t batter an eyelid. Level 7 in the local park people go mad.

How do you batter an eyelid?

[REDOXO]

48 minutes ago, Rob k said:

How do you explain last night? And I’m no conspiracy theorist but I’m struggling with some of these decisions 

The referee didn’t give it and the VAR bloke decided not to make him review it is the short answer. 
 

The long answer it was a bad original decision. But referees have become dependent on VAR officials to review and recommend. The VAR guy completely wrongly didn’t think the  decision was clearly and obviously wrong. He was completely and utterly wrong in that decision.
 

Two bad decisions compounded and yet again favoring Man Utd at home, which most of us are used to. 

I think I said up the thread there is IMO an underlying issue of referees giving benefit to the team that is perceived to be bigger. To be frank I’m sick of it across the Premier league and to some extent in favor of relegated clubs in our division. Nigel Pearson would typically be the first to say that, but gave up. In order for City to get a penalty last season a player had to rugby tackle one of ours. I’m sure there are quite a few other clubs who feel the same. 
 

 

[Davefevs]

56 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Totally agree, it's not even a discussion imo whether the bias exists or not. It clearly does.

Last night's decision can only be one of three things - absolute incompetence caused by being incompetent, absolute incompetence caused by unconscious bias or bent. I don't think you get to the level of a Premier League referee by being that incompetent so that narrows it down to two in my eyes.

You pretty much said what I was going to.  If it’s unconscious bias, then they are the right person to do the job.

[Porto Red]

1 hour ago, REDOXO said:

I only said this to Mrs Oxo the other day. Horrifying how foul throws are being let go. 

I bet Mrs Oxo was fascinated. I can imagine her response: "That's nice, dear."

[REDOXO]

Just now, Porto Red said:

I bet Mrs Oxo was fascinated. I can imagine her response: "That's nice, dear."

You got that right!

[Porto Red]

41 minutes ago, downendcity said:

In the games I've watched, it does seem that in the Women's WC the referees are looking at pitch side monitors to review a decision a lot more than we tend to see in domestic games.

You've been warned about going in the women's WC 

38 minutes ago, johnbytheriver said:

How do you batter an eyelid?

Breadcrumbs?

[maxjak]

Looks like Onana will fit in well at Manure............stated after the match, that it was just "the coming  together of two big guys, and i knew it wasn't a penalty"  Not even an apology or a concession that he  COULD have been in the wrong?    Classy Guy?

[REDOXO]

27 minutes ago, maxjak said:

Looks like Onana will fit in well at Manure............stated after the match, that it was just "the coming  together of two big guys, and i knew it wasn't a penalty"  Not even an apology or a concession that he  COULD have been in the wrong?    Classy Guy?

If I was his manager and he admitted it was a penalty I would find him two weeks wages. That would be my job. 
 

However it clearly was and everyone will forget about it in a few days. 

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, REDOXO said:

If I was his manager and he admitted it was a penalty I would find him two weeks wages. That would be my job. 
 

However it clearly was and everyone will forget about it in a few days.......

........or until the next favourable penalty decision goes Man U's way.