Good Players, who became good managers?

[SomeRandomBristolian]

I was doing some thinking on the coach on the way back from Southampton last night. It got me thinking how many really successful players have gone onto become really successful managers? 

IMO just because they were a great player doesn't necessary mean they will be a successful manager, (or head coach.)

I know Pep has done a great job wherever he has gone, and Arteta at Arsenal. But a lot of really great players who have won multiple titles as a player struggled when making the transition to a manager. 

Looking at Rooney at Birmingham, obviously not doing so great at the moment, looking how Gary and Phil Neville got on when they went to  Valencia, to coach and failed. Didn't Paolo Di Canio go to Swindon a few years back now? 

When you look at people like Eddie Howe, Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, who didn't have the most ground breaking playing career went onto become very good football managers. 

What's peoples thoughts?

 

[Son of Fred]

12 minutes ago, SomeRandomBristolian said:

I was doing some thinking on the coach on the way back from Southampton last night. It got me thinking how many really successful players have gone onto become really successful managers? 

IMO just because they were a great player doesn't necessary mean they will be a successful manager, (or head coach.)

I know Pep has done a great job wherever he has gone, and Arteta at Arsenal. But a lot of really great players who have won multiple titles as a player struggled when making the transition to a manager. 

Looking at Rooney at Birmingham, obviously not doing so great at the moment, looking how Gary and Phil Neville got on when they went to  Valencia, to coach and failed. Didn't Paolo Di Canio go to Swindon a few years back now? 

When you look at people like Eddie Howe, Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, who didn't have the most ground breaking playing career went onto become very good football managers. 

What's peoples thoughts?

 

The recently departed El Tel & Bobby Robson come to mind as top players that became top managers

[Gazred]

Carlo Ancelotti probably the GOAT in terms of player and manager.

Won multiple leagues and cups, domestically and in Europe as both.

[Mr Popodopolous]

About opportunities and timing of those opportunities too isn't it 

Take Scott Parker for example..he gained 2 promotions in 2 Championship seasons with clubs bolstered with wealthy owners and Parachute cash. He got promotion less easily than he should too.

Kompany and Maresca albeit the latter wasn't anything special as a player- again Parachute bolstered. In the case of Leicester especially a side who on paper IMO looked fairly likely to stay up anyway, he's retained a decent number and added some of his own.

Lampard, well he inherited a side in and around the top 6, some changes sure but Tomori, Mount and Wilson who people often forget about in the case of the latter- they finished 6th.

Otoh Carrick perhaps could have something about him..he hasn't been parachuted into a free spending club he turned around a tough start to this season.

[BigTone]

23 minutes ago, SomeRandomBristolian said:

I was doing some thinking on the coach on the way back from Southampton last night. It got me thinking how many really successful players have gone onto become really successful managers? 

IMO just because they were a great player doesn't necessary mean they will be a successful manager, (or head coach.)

I know Pep has done a great job wherever he has gone, and Arteta at Arsenal. But a lot of really great players who have won multiple titles as a player struggled when making the transition to a manager. 

Looking at Rooney at Birmingham, obviously not doing so great at the moment, looking how Gary and Phil Neville got on when they went to  Valencia, to coach and failed. Didn't Paolo Di Canio go to Swindon a few years back now? 

When you look at people like Eddie Howe, Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, who didn't have the most ground breaking playing career went onto become very good football managers. 

What's peoples thoughts?

 

Very few i think

[Eddie Hitler]

My impression is that the very best managers tend to be those who have had poor or injury shortened playing careers because they haven't had the long and successful playing career of others.

Brian Clough was a successful player but had a career ending injury at 29.

The three you cite had unspectacular careers as you say, whereas people who have been highly successful as players don't seem to cut it as managers: Bobby Moore, Dean Saunders, Sol Campbell, Alan Shearer and so on.

I was personally pleased that we didn't get Steven Gerrard that time because for all his great playing skills he had achieved very little as a manager.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Eddie Hitler

[GrahamC]

There’s no rule.

Cruyff, Beckenbauer, Ancelotti were all top players (even if the latter wasn’t in the same category as the first two, hardly anyone who ever played the game is & he had a stellar career) then all won loads as managers/coaches, too.

Guardiola too.

Edited November 30, 2023 by GrahamC

[Harry]

I suppose for starters, since 1966 the following managers have played at international level and won the World Cup. 
Mario Zagallo, Helmut Schon, Cesar Minotti, Enzo Bearzot, Franz Beckenbaur, Aime Jaquet, Vincente Del Bosque, Didier Deschamps, Lionel Scaloni. 
 

Extending that to managers who played international football and have won the Champions League :

Guardiola, Ancelotti, Zidane, Enrique, Heynkes, Flick, Di Matteo, Rijkaard, Capello, Cruyff. 

Premier league managers who played international football :

Arteta, Iraola, Kompany, Pochettino, Edwards, Pep, Ange  

 

[East Londoner]

Kenny Dalglish won the double at Liverpool and the league with Blackburn and was some player 

[Show Me The Money!]

Dean Saunders

… think he won a match once as manager

[Midred]

Joey Barton ?

[Merrick's Marvels]

Harry Thickett.

England International (Full Back), then managed City to an FA Cup final and highest ever finishing position in the football league (finishing 2nd on both occasions but what the heck).

Not as thick as he sounds, clearly. More like a miracle worker.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Merrick's Marvels

[Crackers Corner]

Joey Barton?

 

[cidered abroad]

2 hours ago, SomeRandomBristolian said:

I was doing some thinking on the coach on the way back from Southampton last night. It got me thinking how many really successful players have gone onto become really successful managers? 

IMO just because they were a great player doesn't necessary mean they will be a successful manager, (or head coach.)

I know Pep has done a great job wherever he has gone, and Arteta at Arsenal. But a lot of really great players who have won multiple titles as a player struggled when making the transition to a manager. 

Looking at Rooney at Birmingham, obviously not doing so great at the moment, looking how Gary and Phil Neville got on when they went to  Valencia, to coach and failed. Didn't Paolo Di Canio go to Swindon a few years back now? 

When you look at people like Eddie Howe, Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, who didn't have the most ground breaking playing career went onto become very good football managers. 

What's peoples thoughts?

 

In fact Mourhino hardly played at all. His father was a goalkeeper at Setubal. Mourhino got into football management via a job as a translator with Bobby Robson when he went to Sporting Lisboa. From there to management over a few years when he won Champions League with O Porto.

Edited November 30, 2023 by cidered abroad

[cidercity1987]

The best players are multi multi millionaires , not really any incentive to work afterwards is there 

[tin]

Deschamps is another to add to the list, certainly at international level.

Simeone was also a top player in the ‘90s who’s done well with Atleti. 

Conte’s another one who’s won plenty as a manager. 

The list is pretty endless in all fairness. 

[Maltshoveller]

Hoddle

Cruyff

Beckenbauer

[pongo88]

What about Terry Cooper? He had a fantastic career for  Leeds and England before becoming City’s manager.  (I’ll ignore his brief spell at Eastville). Although his time managing City was in the 4th and 3rd division what he achieved, in the dire circumstances of those times, was amazing 

[transfer reader]

While Pep is clearly a great coach, he's hardly had a difficult path to walk in his managerial career.

Barcelona, great squad and huge budget, Bayern great squad and biggest budget in the league, Man City great squad, huge budget and a large chunk of the 115 violations.

[downendcity]

Easy to forget/overlook Alf Ramsey

As a player, he won the league title with Spurs and was an England international 

As manager, he took Ipswich from division 3 to 1st division champions. Although his career went downhill thereafter! 

[Midlands Robin]

Brian Clough's record as a player was great (296 appearences, 267 goals and 2 England Caps) but it was cut short by a knee injury however, his managerial record is well known.

[beaverface]

13 hours ago, pongo88 said:

What about Terry Cooper? He had a fantastic career for  Leeds and England before becoming City’s manager.  (I’ll ignore his brief spell at Eastville). Although his time managing City was in the 4th and 3rd division what he achieved, in the dire circumstances of those times, was amazing 

Mentioning TC got me thinking that some managers are better when it's an "us against the World mentality". Back then TC didn't have a pot to pee in, and everything he did was based on squeezing every last drop of something out of a situation or player. Every penny counted.

I thought LJ out stayed his time with us eventually, but when we had players missing through suspension\injury, the players he made do with seemed to galvanise the team, and provided some of the best football under him at that time.

Likewise, (I think) something similar with Lampard at Chelsea when he had to rely on the players in his squad and couldn't make signings.

NP got on with the job in hand also, and never moaned about things publicly. I thought he did a great job considering.

Sometimes adversity really makes a player, team and manager, and creates that stubborn\can do attitude.

[Riaz]

There arent many - this is why it bugs me when people want names like Frank Lampard - who has nothing but failure on his managerial CV

When judging a manager, you have to totally ignore their playing career.

[Clutton Caveman]

20 hours ago, SomeRandomBristolian said:

I was doing some thinking on the coach on the way back from Southampton last night. It got me thinking how many really successful players have gone onto become really successful managers? 

IMO just because they were a great player doesn't necessary mean they will be a successful manager, (or head coach.)

I know Pep has done a great job wherever he has gone, and Arteta at Arsenal. But a lot of really great players who have won multiple titles as a player struggled when making the transition to a manager. 

Looking at Rooney at Birmingham, obviously not doing so great at the moment, looking how Gary and Phil Neville got on when they went to  Valencia, to coach and failed. Didn't Paolo Di Canio go to Swindon a few years back now? 

When you look at people like Eddie Howe, Alex Ferguson, Jose Mourinho, who didn't have the most ground breaking playing career went onto become very good football managers. 

What's peoples thoughts?

 

I think the best coaches are ex players who were not naturally gifted like Gaza or Cantona but players who really had to work hard on their skills and win using the experience.

[BCFC_Dan]

There are many more mediocre players than great ones. Statistically it would make sense that more successful managers come from mediocre playing backgrounds than great ones, simply because more managers do full stop.

Furthermore, great players attract much more attention when they do become managers, so it's harder for them to learn on the job without being heavily scrutinized.

[Lanterne Rouge]

6 hours ago, beaverface said:

Mentioning TC got me thinking that some managers are better when it's an "us against the World mentality". Back then TC didn't have a pot to pee in, and everything he did was based on squeezing every last drop of something out of a situation or player. Every penny counted.

I thought LJ out stayed his time with us eventually, but when we had players missing through suspension\injury, the players he made do with seemed to galvanise the team, and provided some of the best football under him at that time.

Likewise, (I think) something similar with Lampard at Chelsea when he had to rely on the players in his squad and couldn't make signings.

NP got on with the job in hand also, and never moaned about things publicly. I thought he did a great job considering.

Sometimes adversity really makes a player, team and manager, and creates that stubborn\can do attitude.

Neil Warnock`s managerial career in a nutshell!

[Bris Red]

On 30/11/2023 at 16:18, Gazred said:

Carlo Ancelotti probably the GOAT in terms of player and manager.

Won multiple leagues and cups, domestically and in Europe as both.

Ancelotti, only manager to win the Prem, LaLiga, Bundesliga and Ligue 1.. as you said undoubtedly the GOAT if we are talking greatest managers and players of all time IMO.