2023/2024 expectations for Pearson

[Kid in the Riot]

8 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I reckon this is almost exactly reflective of the current chance we have of finishing in each of these "zones".

A near 1 in 4 chance of finishing top 6? Admire the optimism... 

[ExiledAjax]

1 minute ago, Kid in the Riot said:

A near 1 in 4 chance of finishing top 6? Admire the optimism... 

Fair. Perhaps a little hyperbolic from me.

[Charlie BCFC]

2 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

11th seems reasonable if a little underwhelming. Albeit if money is spent in January do your expectations adjust accordingly?

For Lansdown’s ambition its underwhelming yes but I just think this year is stronger than before. With a couple of additions I think playoffs can be possible but I think we’ll come up short, I’d feel more confident if the quality is similar to last years Championship 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Just now, Charlie BCFC said:

For Lansdown’s ambition its underwhelming yes but I just think this year is stronger than before. With a couple of additions I think playoffs can be possible but I think we’ll come up short, I’d feel more confident if the quality is similar to last years Championship 

Fair so a bit higher than 11th and a tilt at the top 6, but still short of the playoffs with some additions?

It's a stronger League yeah- the 7th-12th on the poll seems sensible tbh.

[lenred]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

A near 1 in 4 chance of finishing top 6? Admire the optimism... 

20/1 on Sky bet (18/1 to get relegated.   Can’t even get a price for auto). 

[Charlie BCFC]

17 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Fair so a bit higher than 11th and a tilt at the top 6, but still short of the playoffs with some additions?

It's a stronger League yeah- the 7th-12th on the poll seems sensible tbh.

Yeah I’d agree with 7th to 12th, I’m just looking at that top 6 Leicester, Leeds and Southampton look guarenteed, Ipswich I think will drop off but not quite out of the top 6, Sunderland will make it (even without Mowbray) and I think for the last spot West Brom, Middlesbrough and Hull just look a bit stronger than us at the moment 

[Sir Geoff]

10 hours ago, Charlie BCFC said:

For Lansdown’s ambition its underwhelming yes but I just think this year is stronger than before. With a couple of additions I think playoffs can be possible but I think we’ll come up short, I’d feel more confident if the quality is similar to last years Championship 

But if those additions had been made in the summer we would likely have more points going in to January with a squad ready and primed for a play off push. Instead we will be playing catch up.

[Alessandro]

This thread for me, is why the Lansdowns have completely shot themselves in the foot. 

IMO there has been an uneasy, unspoken truce between the board and the fans following the financial shit show of the LJ/MA era and awful appointment of Holden.

The fans would accept the re-build, the cost cutting, selling of best players, the reduced transfers - because we had a manager in place who has a track record of building and creating success and promotions. He be left to do that job, a job which he was already doing very well, albeit with one hand behind his back.

The expectations were in check, mid table, outside chance of play offs. The fans broadly happy with that while they felt we were building in trusted hands and Pearson would be given chance to see his project through to a natural conclusion.

Then suddenly the board moves the goal posts, top 6 expectations are talked up, Pearson is sacked and we appoint another novice at this level.

Truce is over very quickly and I wonder if the board have underestimated the feeling from a lot of fans, are they out of touch again? Well they’ll soon be facing an atmosphere turning very sour quickly if results don’t stabilise soon.

[Mendip City]

The question misses the target for me NP’s team was doing whatever it was doing…. Would probably have finished better than last year and somewhere in mid-table. 
 

That was not good enough, rubbish even - or so we are told. 
This is a top-end Championship squad, JL says do, LM believes it (or why take on the job?) and presumably so does JL’s voice of football BT. 
I’m expecting a decent run of results now and charge towards the play-offs. If not JL, BT and LM deserve all the criticism they get. 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Sir Geoff said:

But if those additions had been made in the summer we would likely have more points going in to January with a squad ready and primed for a play off push. Instead we will be playing catch up.

56 minutes ago, Alessandro said:

This thread for me, is why the Lansdowns have completely shot themselves in the foot. 

IMO there has been an uneasy, unspoken truce between the board and the fans following the financial shit show of the LJ/MA era and awful appointment of Holden.

The fans would accept the re-build, the cost cutting, selling of best players, the reduced transfers - because we had a manager in place who has a track record of building and creating success and promotions. He be left to do that job, a job which he was already doing very well, albeit with one hand behind his back.

The expectations were in check, mid table, outside chance of play offs. The fans broadly happy with that while they felt we were building in trusted hands and Pearson would be given chance to see his project through to a natural conclusion.

Then suddenly the board moves the goal posts, top 6 expectations are talked up, Pearson is sacked and we appoint another novice at this level.

Truce is over very quickly and I wonder if the board have underestimated the feeling from a lot of fans, are they out of touch again? Well they’ll soon be facing an atmosphere turning very sour quickly if results don’t stabilise soon.

[The Journalist]

I expected top 12 and hoped for top 10 before the start of the season. That remains the case under Liam Manning.

But, to use Mark Ashton’s phrase, let’s be really clear… we must still hold the board to account over the sacking of Nigel Pearson and the expectations they put on this season subsequently.

We cannot let them off the hook just because we think they’re being unrealistic. One of our most experienced and popular managers in recent memory lost his job on that basis, so we’re told, and frankly the Lansdowns get away with enough as it is (the “my club” comment, the disappearing acts, the swathes of inexplicable redundancies of excellent staff, the crest changes etc etc).

I’m not letting it go!

[reddoh]

17 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

Nige made a very generic statement and what would you expect him to say at the start of the season? Most realistic supporters were happy with a top half finish being achieved.

Lansdown and Tinnion, however, made very direct, clear statements saying that we are Top 6 material, not that we have a chance of being that, we ARE that. What they also did was criticise the medical regime, saying that there was a danger of players being "de-conditioned" yet here we are weeks later and the "culprits" long gone with seventy six players on the treatment table and conceding last minute goals............

The commotion is about a pair of snakes not having the balls to say why they REALLY fired the Manager and trying to invent stuff to navigate round the real reasons, probably under the guidance of a PR Company that know **** all about football in truth. When people can see that the top of the club are telling outright lies they are prone to causing a commotion unfortunately.

Unfortunately for Liam Manning, and he wouldn't have known this upon taking the job, the crass stupidity of Messrs Tinnion and Lansdown in interviews have really put him in a very difficult position with a minority of our fanbase who simply won't give him a chance.....and when he does make a mistake, such as making ill considered comments about mentality and culture, he doesn't get cut the slack that he really should be afforded. Again, go and speak to Pinky and Perky cos they've caused this.

Leave my Bantams out of this.

[Numero Uno]

3 hours ago, reddoh said:

Leave my Bantams out of this.

Perhaps your Bantams could come and run the football side of the operation.

[Numero Uno]

3 hours ago, The Journalist said:

I expected top 12 and hoped for top 10 before the start of the season. That remains the case under Liam Manning.

But, to use Mark Ashton’s phrase, let’s be really clear… we must still hold the board to account over the sacking of Nigel Pearson and the expectations they put on this season subsequently.

We cannot let them off the hook just because we think they’re being unrealistic. One of our most experienced and popular managers in recent memory lost his job on that basis, so we’re told, and frankly the Lansdowns get away with enough as it is (the “my club” comment, the disappearing acts, the swathes of inexplicable redundancies of excellent staff, the crest changes etc etc).

I’m not letting it go!

Agreed but hounding Manning out of the club, which is a possibility with a minority who don’t put the responsibility where it lies, whilst Delboy and Rodney get away Scot Free ain’t the answer either. Recent events suggest that whilst Steve is ultimate paymaster it’s now Jon’s toy, sorry I meant football club.

[W-S-M Seagull]

15 hours ago, The Journalist said:

I expected top 12 and hoped for top 10 before the start of the season. That remains the case under Liam Manning.

But, to use Mark Ashton’s phrase, let’s be really clear… we must still hold the board to account over the sacking of Nigel Pearson and the expectations they put on this season subsequently.

We cannot let them off the hook just because we think they’re being unrealistic. One of our most experienced and popular managers in recent memory lost his job on that basis, so we’re told, and frankly the Lansdowns get away with enough as it is (the “my club” comment, the disappearing acts, the swathes of inexplicable redundancies of excellent staff, the crest changes etc etc).

I’m not letting it go!

I've been confused by people saying "you don't actually believe the board when they say that was the reason Pearson was sacked do you?" 

I don't care if that's the reason or not. That's the reason they've given us and therefore they will be held to account on that. If its not the reason, then it's even worse because they have lied to us. Either way isn't good! 

This club likes to share that it is a caring club. Does a lot for the community etc etc. However if speculation is to be believed, one of the reasons Pearson was sacked was because of his health. I don't like that. It destroys any credit the owners may have had. 

For me it's not so much about Pearson being sacked. It's the whole way he was sacked. It wasn't just Pearson that was sacked either, it was Fleming, Euell and Rennie too. Really good people. How things have been handled since has further angered me. 

For me we were asked to be patient the past few years whilst we went through the reset. They asked us to still buy season tickets and support the club during that time. That's what I did. 

I was absolutely fully on board with what they were doing. What I'm angry really angry about is I'm now being asked is to once again invest emotionally and financially into another rebuild because this time they think they've got it right. Even tho the previous plan was almost going to plan. 

I'm angry that one plan has been ripped up for another plan. It's not so much about Pearson being sacked. It's the deviation from the plan.

I can get past Pearson being sacked. But then we had a really good opportunity to appoint someone who could take Pearsons work forward. The squad and club was all set up for that. So my anger centres around this could be a lost opportunity and that we could potentially have another couple of years of rebuilding to get the squad back into such a good state. 

It's the lost opportunity that I'm focused on. 

It goes without saying that I hope Manning is a tremendous success here. But my concerns are that this board don't have a bloody clue. 

Edited December 7, 2023 by W-S-M Seagull

[Garland-sweden]

Sacking NP was more then stupid as someone wrote. Was optimistic, with some luck we had the chance for top six. Today, think we will be lower table. Manning got to feel this is not right, feel sorry for him, its not his fault. Nige had built something with the players and fans. 

[robinforlife2]

Sorry, but I don't buy this nonsense abouut Pearson afforded some rope for his comments, because we then sold Scott.

Alex Scott OPENLY has said in interviews since he left, he had a meeting with Nigel Pearson at the end of last season, and made it clear he wanted to move on. He spoke how he said nothing to the press at the time, as the club weren't standing in his way and he didn't want to be disrespectful to the fans and club.

But there isn't a cat in hells chance, Nige or anyone at the club expected Scott to be here this season. Any comments made in the media re Scott by Nige and the Club, were to protect his value, to play a hard ball to get as much money as possible. Every single one KNEW it was happening, and you're totally deluded if you think otherwise.

The club was preparing and buying players in preparation for Scott's departure. If he's not been replaced, it's because we recruited poorly.

Pearson has signed some okay players, but has also signed some average ones too. Lets not make out Cornick and Mehmeti who are struggling at this level, were panic signings in January at the loss of Semenyo. The club stated at the time, these were signings we wanted to make in the summer but brought them forward due to the money from Semenyo.

Nige isn't the messiah some make him out to be. He done the job he was brought in to do, but we were not progressing and he was not the long term answer. Time will tell if Liam Manning is going to build on the foundations or not, but in all reality, we have been underperforming and still are, we've recruited poorly on the whole and we are a mid table Championship side, which isn't going to change any time soon. 

[W-S-M Seagull]

58 minutes ago, robinforlife2 said:

Sorry, but I don't buy this nonsense abouut Pearson afforded some rope for his comments, because we then sold Scott.

Alex Scott OPENLY has said in interviews since he left, he had a meeting with Nigel Pearson at the end of last season, and made it clear he wanted to move on. He spoke how he said nothing to the press at the time, as the club weren't standing in his way and he didn't want to be disrespectful to the fans and club.

But there isn't a cat in hells chance, Nige or anyone at the club expected Scott to be here this season. Any comments made in the media re Scott by Nige and the Club, were to protect his value, to play a hard ball to get as much money as possible. Every single one KNEW it was happening, and you're totally deluded if you think otherwise.

The club was preparing and buying players in preparation for Scott's departure. If he's not been replaced, it's because we recruited poorly.

Pearson has signed some okay players, but has also signed some average ones too. Lets not make out Cornick and Mehmeti who are struggling at this level, were panic signings in January at the loss of Semenyo. The club stated at the time, these were signings we wanted to make in the summer but brought them forward due to the money from Semenyo.

Nige isn't the messiah some make him out to be. He done the job he was brought in to do, but we were not progressing and he was not the long term answer. Time will tell if Liam Manning is going to build on the foundations or not, but in all reality, we have been underperforming and still are, we've recruited poorly on the whole and we are a mid table Championship side, which isn't going to change any time soon. 

Pep has done the job that Man City brought him in to do. So not sure why you are using that stick to beat Nigel with. Quite bizarre. 

What you're suggesting is that unless a manager does a better job than they were brought in to do, then there has been no progress? 

Of course you are entitled to have the opinion that we were not progressing however my opinion is that despite not receiving any of the Scott money to spend and with a depleted injury hit squad, we had progressed from last season. 

Mine and yours idea of progression may be different but what was noticeable to me this season was that we were fitter and we had developed a throw your body on the line sort of mentality. Whilst we lost at both Leicester and Leeds the fighting spirit we displayed made me very proud. 

I don't think we did under perform either last season or this season. I did however feel we didn't quite get what we should have got but not sure that's considered underperforming. 

[Son of Fred]

5 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

It goes without saying that I hope Manning is a tremendous success here. But my concerns are that this board don't have a bloody clue

I'd say ditto - although imo the hierarchy have clearly demonstrated that they are clueless

Edited December 7, 2023 by Son of Fred

[Mendip City]

23 hours ago, The Journalist said:

I expected top 12 and hoped for top 10 before the start of the season. That remains the case under Liam Manning.

But, to use Mark Ashton’s phrase, let’s be really clear… we must still hold the board to account over the sacking of Nigel Pearson and the expectations they put on this season subsequently.

We cannot let them off the hook just because we think they’re being unrealistic. One of our most experienced and popular managers in recent memory lost his job on that basis, so we’re told, and frankly the Lansdowns get away with enough as it is (the “my club” comment, the disappearing acts, the swathes of inexplicable redundancies of excellent staff, the crest changes etc etc).

I’m not letting it go!

Agree with all of that but I’d add that we hold the board AND Liam Manning to account. He’s bought into it, believes it… otherwise why take the job. We need to hold them all to account when the inevitable “rebuild”, “mentality”, “fitness”, “3 window” stuff starts getting spouted. This is a top end squad or so we’re told… a comfortable top half finish will be easily achieved, surely????

I’m not letting it  go either! 

[Mendip City]

5 hours ago, Garland-sweden said:

Sacking NP was more then stupid as someone wrote. Was optimistic, with some luck we had the chance for top six. Today, think we will be lower table. Manning got to feel this is not right, feel sorry for him, its not his fault. Nige had built something with the players and fans. 

I’ve a feeling Liam could be our Liz Truss….  Has he done 40 odd days yet???

I’ll pop out and get a lettuce later

[Robbored]

4 hours ago, Son of Fred said:

I'd say ditto - although imo the hierarchy have clearly demonstrated that they are clueless

It’s clear to anyone that Nige is a straight talking individual who in my view clashed with hierarchy at AG with his appraisal of the state of the club and that may well of offended them; JL in particular who around this time last year commented that (paraphrase) ‘things were not going as well as expected’ At the time many of us thought that that was a premature comment but looking back that was first time that the writing was on the wall for Nige.

Its very disappointing and such a shame that JL sacked him - a schoolboy error.

Now we have an inexperienced manager at Championship level and all we can do is try and get behind him.

[luke_bristol]

6 hours ago, robinforlife2 said:

Nige isn't the messiah some make him out to be. He done the job he was brought in to do, but we were not progressing and he was not the long term answer. Time will tell if Liam Manning is going to build on the foundations or not, but in all reality, we have been underperforming and still are, we've recruited poorly on the whole and we are a mid table Championship side, which isn't going to change any time soon. 

We made season by season increases in points under NP, yes they were very modest increases, but that’s good against a backdrop of massive decreases in player budget and the loss of our best players. 

He wasn’t the messiah but we did well, I think the financial context is crucial. We were a mid table side under NP but heading in the right direction; if that’s unlikely to change under LM I don’t see the point in the change. They should at least have made this clear when the change was made instead of the bollocks about having a top 6 squad (assembled by NP with very little money!). They have set LM up to fail.

[Davefevs]

Imagine being allowed just £7.5m to use in transfer fees over 5 windows, whilst reducing the wage bill by at least a third, and then being told you’ve only made some “okay” signings.  At worst, there’s 1 loan fee (TGH) to add to that sum.

Isn’t Knight a good signing? Isn’t TGH a good signing? Isn’t Dickie a good signing?  Isn’t Atkinson a good signing?  Isn’t James a good signing?  Isn’t Tanner a good signing?

In Dickie and Knight’s case, they are fantastic signings.  Especially when you look at their fees (£700k and £1.75m) and their ages.  One at the start of his peak years, the other nowhere near his peak, with so much upside.

And don’t forget, recruitment is a team effort…they aren’t really Nige’s signings.  They do highlight improved recruitment.  Personally I put that down to having a recruitment strategy based around a clear player profile…something that Nige (and RG) put the donkey work into.

When you overlay this context on top of Academy progression and gradual improvement, Nige deserves more respect than what he was given.

And nobody on here calls him the messiah, it’s just a lazy way of avoiding the debate with those who judge him on the all-round job he did.

[GrahamC]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Imagine being allowed just £7.5m to use in transfer fees over 5 windows, whilst reducing the wage bill by at least a third, and then being told you’ve only made some “okay” signings.  At worst, there’s 1 loan fee (TGH) to add to that sum.

Isn’t Knight a good signing? Isn’t TGH a good signing? Isn’t Dickie a good signing?  Isn’t Atkinson a good signing?  Isn’t James a good signing?  Isn’t Tanner a good signing?

In Dickie and Knight’s case, they are fantastic signings.  Especially when you look at their fees (£700k and £1.75m) and their ages.  One at the start of his peak years, the other nowhere near his peak, with so much upside.

And don’t forget, recruitment is a team effort…they aren’t really Nige’s signings.  They do highlight improved recruitment.  Personally I put that down to having a recruitment strategy based around a clear player profile…something that Nige (and RG) put the donkey work into.

When you overlay this context on top of Academy progression and gradual improvement, Nige deserves more respect than what he was given.

And nobody on here calls him the messiah, it’s just a lazy way of avoiding the debate with those who judge him on the all-round job he did.

You omitted Sykes, we haven’t made a better free transfer signing than him since Bradley Orr in my opinion.

I say that as a huge admirer of Wilbs but he was (incredibly) effective one level down from the Championship & was nowhere near the long term signing Mark Sykes is.

[Davefevs]

17 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

You omitted Sykes, we haven’t made a better free transfer signing than him since Bradley Orr in my opinion.

I say that as a huge admirer of Wilbs but he was (incredibly) effective one level down from the Championship & was nowhere near the long term signing Mark Sykes is.

Shocking omission on my part. Ta

[Mendip City]

8 hours ago, GrahamC said:

You omitted Sykes, we haven’t made a better free transfer signing than him since Bradley Orr in my opinion.

I say that as a huge admirer of Wilbs but he was (incredibly) effective one level down from the Championship & was nowhere near the long term signing Mark Sykes is.

Agree about Sykes but presumably you meant “long term signing…. for Bournemouth”???

[Mendip City]

8 hours ago, Davefevs said:

Imagine being allowed just £7.5m to use in transfer fees over 5 windows, whilst reducing the wage bill by at least a third, and then being told you’ve only made some “okay” signings.  At worst, there’s 1 loan fee (TGH) to add to that sum.

Isn’t Knight a good signing? Isn’t TGH a good signing? Isn’t Dickie a good signing?  Isn’t Atkinson a good signing?  Isn’t James a good signing?  Isn’t Tanner a good signing?

In Dickie and Knight’s case, they are fantastic signings.  Especially when you look at their fees (£700k and £1.75m) and their ages.  One at the start of his peak years, the other nowhere near his peak, with so much upside.

And don’t forget, recruitment is a team effort…they aren’t really Nige’s signings.  They do highlight improved recruitment.  Personally I put that down to having a recruitment strategy based around a clear player profile…something that Nige (and RG) put the donkey work into.

When you overlay this context on top of Academy progression and gradual improvement, Nige deserves more respect than what he was given.

And nobody on here calls him the messiah, it’s just a lazy way of avoiding the debate with those who judge him on the all-round job he did.

Great post. 
Taking NP out of it slightly, one of my biggest frustrations is the inevitable amount of ripping up of this good work we will see.
You can bet your life the squad will be bigger soon… no doubt not increased by players better than we have but by squad fillers. In turn, there will be fewer opportunities for young players (which has already started, where’s Yeboah gone? Not filling the bench with kids but choosing to leave spaces…. Strange). 

[robinforlife2]

On 07/12/2023 at 05:47, W-S-M Seagull said:

Pep has done the job that Man City brought him in to do. So not sure why you are using that stick to beat Nigel with. Quite bizarre. 

What you're suggesting is that unless a manager does a better job than they were brought in to do, then there has been no progress? 

Of course you are entitled to have the opinion that we were not progressing however my opinion is that despite not receiving any of the Scott money to spend and with a depleted injury hit squad, we had progressed from last season. 

Mine and yours idea of progression may be different but what was noticeable to me this season was that we were fitter and we had developed a throw your body on the line sort of mentality. Whilst we lost at both Leicester and Leeds the fighting spirit we displayed made me very proud. 

I don't think we did under perform either last season or this season. I did however feel we didn't quite get what we should have got but not sure that's considered underperforming. 

Sorry for not replying sooner, have been unwell since wrote my comment. You make some good comments, but miss my point slightly;

"Pep has done the job that Man City brought him in to do. So not sure why you are using that stick to beat Nigel with. Quite bizarre. 

What you're suggesting is that unless a manager does a better job than they were brought in to do, then there has been no progress? "

This is where you assume wrong. Pep was brought in to Man City to win trophies, and try and win the Champions League. Pep has done this, so there is no comparison. At a point Pep fails to have them winning trophies or the league, he will be dispensed of I'm sure. In the case of Nige, he was brought in to sort of clear out the backroom clutter, stabilise the teams position through a sticky financial period, and effectively guide us through a transition. All of which Nige done a very good job at and done the task ask of him. However, during his 3 years through constraints, we have maintained our position as a mid table side, and despite being able to bring in his own players over the last 3 windows, albeit on a small budget, the team were showing little signs of being able to be better than mid table. Nige commented in the summer, that he felt the team could be competitive. We have heard from Tinnion, that Nige was happy with the squad, when asked if he wanted to add one more when Scott was sold. Now granted, many will say he didn't have a choice, and that we wouldn't of signed anyone, but none of us  truly actually know. But we were again looking a mid-table team albeit that can be pointed at the injuries. Pearson succeeded at the tasks he was given, but now the club wants to move in the direction of progressing out the league, and build a squad capable of promotion and achieve that. This was never Pearson's task, and the club do not believe he was the right person to do so.
Whether Liam Manning is or not firmly falls on JL and BT's shoulders, but this is the decision they made. 
If I own a company and I want to make 200K of sales each year, and I have a taskforce who do that, they are doing their job, but at some point I may want to expand and aim for 500K of sales. In doing so, I may bring in a new sales manager, fresh vision etc. It's not being disrespectful to the previous sales team, but I've decided that a new team stand a better chance of succeeding in what I now want as a company owner.
This is where I have some agreement with JL & BT. Nigel Pearson completed the task he was brought in to do, but that doesn't give you security that if the plan changes, or new goals are set, that you are going to be the person tasked to do them. When the club decided to move from transition and stability, to progress, and aim for promotion, Nige in their eyes no longer was saw as the man for that job, which is why he was replaced. I don't know if Liam can do the new task, it's far too early to judge, but in any business you have to have a back them or sack them mentality, and if you don't believe that person managing the situation is the one to bear fruits, you can't back them and you have to sack them to progress, so I get why the club have done what they have done. Whether Nigel had afforded a crack at the new targets / roles is beside the point, those who make the decisions decided that he didn't fit the task in hand, so they made the right decision if that's the way they feel. In any successful business, you can't afford to be sentimental. You have to be a little ruthless. One could argue those at the top don't know what they are doing, and they may have got it wrong, and that this is what the fans feel, but that is why BT and JL will be held accountable for any slump, as they misjudged the situation, but if Manning does have us competitive and then promoted in due course, then the board would have been proved right in their decision making. Only time will tell on this one, and it's far too early to reserve any judgement. 

[robinforlife2]

On 07/12/2023 at 13:20, Davefevs said:

Imagine being allowed just £7.5m to use in transfer fees over 5 windows, whilst reducing the wage bill by at least a third, and then being told you’ve only made some “okay” signings.  At worst, there’s 1 loan fee (TGH) to add to that sum.

Isn’t Knight a good signing? Isn’t TGH a good signing? Isn’t Dickie a good signing?  Isn’t Atkinson a good signing?  Isn’t James a good signing?  Isn’t Tanner a good signing?

In Dickie and Knight’s case, they are fantastic signings.  Especially when you look at their fees (£700k and £1.75m) and their ages.  One at the start of his peak years, the other nowhere near his peak, with so much upside.

And don’t forget, recruitment is a team effort…they aren’t really Nige’s signings.  They do highlight improved recruitment.  Personally I put that down to having a recruitment strategy based around a clear player profile…something that Nige (and RG) put the donkey work into.

When you overlay this context on top of Academy progression and gradual improvement, Nige deserves more respect than what he was given.

And nobody on here calls him the messiah, it’s just a lazy way of avoiding the debate with those who judge him on the all-round job he did.

I would agree that Sykes, Dickie, and Knight are good signings, and they fit the model of the buy to sell type players. TGH, is on loan, we have not signed him yet. I'm sure it will become permanent in January, but at present, he is only a temporary player.

I wasn't laying any poor recruitment at Nigels feet, but the recruitment team. This is a collective of people. Ironically the same recruitment team will work with Manning, whether they identify diamonds in the rough or turds in the meadow remains to be seen.

I do think though, that there has been a few poor additions. Lets not forget Kyle Wilson who was in and gone within a year. Cornick who looks a league one player at best, Mehmeti who doesn't look up to the task. Now not every signing will be successful, but whilst praise can be given when you find a gem, it would appear, people are willing to ignore the same recruitment strategy that found that gem, also found a few duds, or a few possible duds.

You can also ask, did we need Andy King & Danny Simpson? Could their wages have been utilised better elsewhere? I am not going to judge Atkinson, because he has been a bit hit and miss for me, but is now injured. McCrorie we've not seen. Tanner, I like going forward, but defensively he worries me a little.

I think in Nige's time there was good and bad recruitment, like with any manager, but of his signings since Janaury and there have been 7 of them, I would argue only Knight, Dickie & TGH look as if they are good enough for this level on what we have seen, and if 4/7 in 12 months are questionable or failures, then you are not creating a progression, as more haven't done a job, then have done a job. That is of course my own opinion.