Attempts on target last two games

[Jerseybean]

You don’t need to be a coach or in fact know anything much about football to realise that one attempt on target (Knight’s header yesterday) in our last two games is a huge concern.

Many have commented on our lack of creativity and the backwards/sideways passing, which doesn’t threaten the opposition, the fact we have only managed one goal attempt in the last three hours plus of football has to be addressed if we are going to progress.

[Loosey Boy]

Agreed @Jerseybean but let’s not forget that previously, we put three past Hull and four past Watford - there is creativity and goals in the team but the last two games have shown a lack of consistency.

I firmly believe that a creative midfielder and striker are the two players we will look to bring in, in January - whether we can or do of course, are two different things but as you suggest, to progress in the 2nd half of the season, we must address the inconsistency.

[Silvio Dante]

The other thing to add in the mix here is that stats can be misleading.

If you take the Hull game we had 21 shots. However I’d argue that there was no real quality in the shots - the second goal (Anis) keeper should save and the third is a massive deflection. Outside of that, I recall one further Anis shot but no other major test of the keeper, so that’s probably two decent efforts - one of which was a pen.

(This isn’t to say we didn’t play well and deserve the win - we did - but we had territorial pressure as opposed to chance pressure).

I’m less concerned about the number of attempts on goal and more by the quality of said attempts - whether by working enough space or a straight good effort. And again there I go back to speed of play/thought being our best way to open up teams and to me, in a lot of games we’ve been too passive and without intent in the last 11. It allows teams to bank against us and we end up needing that slice of luck or that worldie.

[Sir Geoff]

9 minutes ago, Loosey Boy said:

Agreed @Jerseybean but let’s not forget that previously, we put three past Hull and four past Watford - there is creativity and goals in the team but the last two games have shown a lack of consistency.

I firmly believe that a creative midfielder and striker are the two players we will look to bring in, in January - whether we can or do of course, are two different things but as you suggest, to progress in the 2nd half of the season, we must address the inconsistency.

And before that 7 in 7, and 3 of those were in one game.

[Loosey Boy]

1 minute ago, Sir Geoff said:

And before that 7 in 7, and 3 of those were in one game.

Yep, hence the need to address the inconsistencies……something which LM will I’m sure be keen to do in Jan if we can

[Sir Geoff]

I don't do xg but we have scored 11 goals from open play in 11 games, not sure if that's good or bad re xg, but 6 of those came in 2 games.

[Davefevs]

6 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

I don't do xg but we have scored 11 goals from open play in 11 games, not sure if that's good or bad re xg, but 6 of those came in 2 games.

Might be different sources, but Opta had us as 8 open play goals from 10 games before yesterday, from 7.77 xG.

[Numero Uno]

51 minutes ago, Jerseybean said:

You don’t need to be a coach or in fact know anything much about football to realise that one attempt on target (Knight’s header yesterday) in our last two games is a huge concern.

Many have commented on our lack of creativity and the backwards/sideways passing, which doesn’t threaten the opposition, the fact we have only managed one goal attempt in the last three hours plus of football has to be addressed if we are going to progress.

The biggest concern, on a personal level, is that football of the standard we saw yesterday bores the absolute **** out of me. You can debate yer xG's, possession stats, passing stats, box entries, total shots, shots on target, behaviours, cultures and all the rest but football like that is not worth paying to watch and we've had three years plus of these performances on a semi-regular basis. That's not Liam's fault (nor the previous manager) but now we have steadied the ship in FFFP terms I do hope he starts to consign shite like yesterday to the dustbin very much sooner rather than later. If he does that he's in credit with me, that's for sure.

[FNQ]

19 minutes ago, Loosey Boy said:

Agreed @Jerseybean but let’s not forget that previously, we put three past Hull and four past Watford - there is creativity and goals in the team but the last two games have shown a lack of consistency.

I firmly believe that a creative midfielder and striker are the two players we will look to bring in, in January - whether we can or do of course, are two different things but as you suggest, to progress in the 2nd half of the season, we must address the inconsistency.

Where could we possibly find the creative midfielder and striker that would be good enough, available and affordable and that would make an immediate impact?  The only realistic solution would be a gamble on the loan market and perhaps pull off a short term Tammy type master stroke loan… can’t see us taking that gamble either though.

[And Its Smith]

We’ve played two teams that have sat back and we couldn’t create anything. Not a huge surprise as it’s been like that for ages.  The players we have cannot do that but they weren’t bought because they could 

[Numero Uno]

1 minute ago, And Its Smith said:

We’ve played two teams that have sat back and we couldn’t create anything. Not a huge surprise as it’s been like that for ages.  The players we have cannot do that but they weren’t bought because they could 

Liam needs backing, my concern is whether the Senior Management Team see it that way. If they don't and persist with this nonsensical myth that we are somehow a top end squad then yesterday's performance will not be anywhere near the last one of this type..........something to look forward to isn't it?!!

[And Its Smith]

Just now, Numero Uno said:

Liam needs backing, my concern is whether the Senior Management Team see it that way. If they don't and persist with this nonsensical myth that we are somehow a top end squad then yesterday's performance will not be anywhere near the last one of this type..........something to look forward to isn't it?!!

I think one or two will come in.  I actually wonder if he also needs to be a bit smarter against these teams but still 11 behind the ball.  Conway can play wide left or behind Wells if preferred and Knight can drop deeper into the midfield 2. 

[steveybadger]

3 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

We’ve played two teams that have sat back and we couldn’t create anything. Not a huge surprise as it’s been like that for ages.  The players we have cannot do that but they weren’t bought because they could 

And then throw in 4 games in 11 days which must cause a bit of lethargy, when speed of thought and movement are the things needed to break down packed defences. And absolutely, this is still really Nige’s team which was set up to be pacy and counter attacking.

[Dastardly and Muttley]

1 minute ago, And Its Smith said:

I think one or two will come in.  I actually wonder if he also needs to be a bit smarter against these teams but still 11 behind the ball.  Conway can play wide left or behind Wells if preferred and Knight can drop deeper into the midfield 2. 

He needs a plan B, as there clearly isn’t one at the moment.

Whether that’s down to a lack of tactical nous, or whether we just don’t have the players LM wants yet is hard to say.

[Numero Uno]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

I think one or two will come in.  I actually wonder if he also needs to be a bit smarter against these teams but still 11 behind the ball.  Conway can play wide left or behind Wells if preferred and Knight can drop deeper into the midfield 2. 

Short term perhaps he could do things differently but that only gets you so far imo. We need those new players in and in my view they have to be players who add quality not Oxford United players who will take three months to adjust to the level (I watched Lincoln City v Northampton Town the other night whilst away visiting family and there is a "bit of a difference", I can assure anyone of that).

[Clutton Caveman]

34 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

The other thing to add in the mix here is that stats can be misleading.

If you take the Hull game we had 21 shots. However I’d argue that there was no real quality in the shots - the second goal (Anis) keeper should save and the third is a massive deflection. Outside of that, I recall one further Anis shot but no other major test of the keeper, so that’s probably two decent efforts - one of which was a pen.

(This isn’t to say we didn’t play well and deserve the win - we did - but we had territorial pressure as opposed to chance pressure).

I’m less concerned about the number of attempts on goal and more by the quality of said attempts - whether by working enough space or a straight good effort. And again there I go back to speed of play/thought being our best way to open up teams and to me, in a lot of games we’ve been too passive and without intent in the last 11. It allows teams to bank against us and we end up needing that slice of luck or that worldie.

It seems we have a 1 trick pony as a manager. When teams figure us out and adjust at half time we change the personnel but not the tactics. Yesterday the opposition played 2 up front so supposedly we had a man spare somewhere. When things were not happening we took off Conway and replaced him with Wells rather than switching to 2 up front for a change. When Sykes went off I thought this was the perfect stage for Yeboah as at least he can cause a bit of chaos against huge defenders but instead we put the headless chicken on with typical results. We are very predictable and really a plan b & c when a is not working.

[Davefevs]

Yeboah wasn’t in the 20 yesterday btw.

[Silvio Dante]

4 minutes ago, Clutton Caveman said:

It seems we have a 1 trick pony as a manager. When teams figure us out and adjust at half time we change the personnel but not the tactics. Yesterday the opposition played 2 up front so supposedly we had a man spare somewhere. When things were not happening we took off Conway and replaced him with Wells rather than switching to 2 up front for a change. When Sykes went off I thought this was the perfect stage for Yeboah as at least he can cause a bit of chaos against huge defenders but instead we put the headless chicken on with typical results. We are very predictable and really a plan b & c when a is not working.

I think the subs yesterday were “safe”. We didn’t change what we were doing (trust the process) but just changed player A for player B. All very formulaic and smacked of just hoping for the best rather than an intent (which is a word I keep using at the moment) to positively impact the game.

[Rocking Red Cyril]

25 minutes ago, FNQ said:

Where could we possibly find the creative midfielder and striker that would be good enough, available and affordable and that would make an immediate impact?  The only realistic solution would be a gamble on the loan market and perhaps pull off a short term Tammy type master stroke loan… can’t see us taking that gamble either though.

Could maybe that youngster we moved on. I think called Alex Scott and that other hopeful  Semenyou made a difference?

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, Jerseybean said:

You don’t need to be a coach or in fact know anything much about football to realise that one attempt on target (Knight’s header yesterday) in our last two games is a huge concern.

But prior to Birmingham we averaged 4.44 shots on target per game under Manning. This was a big increase over the 3.07 we averaged under Pearson this season.

Do two games in 4 days against two teams that specifically set up to nullify our attack mean that the preceding games are irrelevant?

Not in my opinion.

1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said:

The other thing to add in the mix here is that stats can be misleading.

If you take the Hull game we had 21 shots. However I’d argue that there was no real quality in the shots - the second goal (Anis) keeper should save and the third is a massive deflection. Outside of that, I recall one further Anis shot but no other major test of the keeper, so that’s probably two decent efforts - one of which was a pen.

(This isn’t to say we didn’t play well and deserve the win - we did - but we had territorial pressure as opposed to chance pressure).

I’m less concerned about the number of attempts on goal and more by the quality of said attempts - whether by working enough space or a straight good effort. And again there I go back to speed of play/thought being our best way to open up teams and to me, in a lot of games we’ve been too passive and without intent in the last 11. It allows teams to bank against us and we end up needing that slice of luck or that worldie.

Against Hull yes our quality of chance created was low at 0.079 xG per shot (the general average across football is something like 0.11 xG per shot). Birmingham we were at 0.12 and Millwall 0.11, so those chances were, as an average, fine. 

Overall our chances created are not quite as potent as they have been in seasons past, but there's really been very little change in that metric since Manning joined. Much the same.

Personally I don't think there is much to be concerned about right now. If the dirth of SoT continues against Preston (ignore West Ham as that's an irregular match) then perhaps we should be concerned.

Edited January 2 by ExiledAjax

[Sir Geoff]

25 minutes ago, steveybadger said:

And then throw in 4 games in 11 days which must cause a bit of lethargy, when speed of thought and movement are the things needed to break down packed defences. And absolutely, this is still really Nige’s team which was set up to be pacy and counter attacking.

They didn't have a packed defence, yesterday. We just didn't have the guile to pass the ball forward.

I'm pretty sure every other Championship side has played 4 games in 11 days. If tiredness is a problem perhaps we should have had a week off to re charge during the last International break.

[Silvio Dante]

3 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

 

Against Hull yes our quality of chance created was low at 0.79 xG per shot (the general average across football is something like 0.11 xG per shot). Birmingham we were at 0.12 and Millwall 0.11, so those chances were, as an average, fine. 

 

Can I assume you mean 0.079 as the above would indicate we were creating phenomenal chances?

[ExiledAjax]

Just now, Silvio Dante said:

Can I assume you mean 0.079 as the above would indicate we were creating phenomenal chances?

You can. 

0.79 is basically a penalty shootout.

[Silvio Dante]

1 minute ago, Sir Geoff said:

They didn't have a packed defence, yesterday. We just didn't have the guile to pass the ball forward.

I'm pretty sure every other Championship side has played 4 games in 11 days. If tiredness is a problem perhaps we should have had a week off to re charge during the last International break.

[Bat Fastard]

I wonder if LM thinks that fans are entertained by watching our team endlessly passing the ball along the back line.  Now he has that strategy firmly established, maybe he could  concentrate on movement and space creation in the midfield. Maybe after that he could "teach" the players how to pass to our lone forward being shepherded by two  huge central defenders.  

[Shauntaylor85]

1 hour ago, Jerseybean said:

You don’t need to be a coach or in fact know anything much about football to realise that one attempt on target (Knight’s header yesterday) in our last two games is a huge concern.

Many have commented on our lack of creativity and the backwards/sideways passing, which doesn’t threaten the opposition, the fact we have only managed one goal attempt in the last three hours plus of football has to be addressed if we are going to progress.

The way we play under Manning is very odd, he’s trying to be too clever, Knight almost playing as a CF or left winger.  Feel we have another LJ on our hands here, 3.4.1.2 is our best formation with players we have. Let’s have two strikers up top, Wells and Tommy. They were excellent last season. McCrorie needs to be fit asap, I cannot take much more of Tanner! 

[Numero Uno]

1 hour ago, Jerseybean said:

You don’t need to be a coach or in fact know anything much about football to realise that one attempt on target (Knight’s header yesterday) in our last two games is a huge concern.

You absolutely don't. People with more football knowledge may understand the reasons why but the basic premise is simple........you pay for your season ticket or matchday ticket and you expect to see better than that irrespective of the reasons why. The reasons why do not somehow make it alright when the entertainment value on offer is zero. Yesterday was just that, no clever analysis required on this occasion!!

[FNQ]

41 minutes ago, Rocking Red Cyril said:

Could maybe that youngster we moved on. I think called Alex Scott and that other hopeful  Semenyou made a difference?

Sure, but as you say they’ve moved on.. who have you got in mind that could replace them?

[Dr Balls]

9 minutes ago, FNQ said:

Sure, but as you say they’ve moved on.. who have you got in mind that could replace them?

Firstly define what kind of player you need. Secondly look around at who might be available and affordable. Form a list and rank them and then see who you can get. Most likely, it will either be someone not currently getting a game at this level with not much time left on their contract, or a player from a lower league either home or abroad. That’s the long and short of it, and the problem is there is no guarantee that what you really want even exists, which is where you may have to compromise. Cornick strikes me as a “compromise buy” as a replacement for Chris Martin. But as we now know his strike rate makes Martin look like Pele!

Edited January 2 by Dr Balls

[robin_unreliant]

40 minutes ago, Shauntaylor85 said:

The way we play under Manning is very odd, he’s trying to be too clever, Knight almost playing as a CF or left winger. 

Agree with this. TC is too isolated and I am not convinced Knight is best utilised that far forward. Weimann only seems to contribute when he is played as a striker yet he gets put on the wing.

Just not sure Manning is playing what we have in the way of attacking players in their most effective positions. Mehmeti on the left having to constantly cut back onto his right foot being particularly frustrating.