Tins on RB

[City oz]

3 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

My hope is there won’t be that much change in defence and midfield in the summer, bar the business already done.

I agree James and King are off but I think we’d need at least one more midfielder or the squad would be thin and I can see that being a new deal for Williams 

I think it will be hard to keep Conway and I reckon Wells could go if we got two new forwards in. I reckon we could keep everyone else - bar Twine - and I think it would be a good strategy to do so as it would enable the recruitment to focus on the two positions that desperately need it.

I can see our squad next year being:

GKs

1. O’Leary 

2. Poss Bajic if Manning genuinely rates him. 
3. HWR or whoever is next on conveyer belt if HWR isn’t kept on

Defenders 

1. Tanner

2.McCrorie

3.Pring

4.Roberts

5.Naismith

6.Atkinson

7.Dickie

8.Vyner

 

Midfield:

1.Bird

2.Knight

3.Murphy

4.Williams

5.TGH

 

Attacking midfielders/Wide forwards

1. Key signing 

2. Stokes

3. Mehmeti

4. Sykes

5. Mebude (if a success)

Forwards

1. Key signing 

2. New back-up or Wells

3. Bell

 

Moved on:

Conway 

James

King

Cornick

Weimann

Maybe moved on too:

Wells (I rate Wells - this is just a hunch)

Bajic

HWR

You are on the correct path. You have forgotten one vital component Mr Lansdown

[Floatn Over]

10 hours ago, Dr Balls said:

A tomorrow that never comes to anything - except yet another rebuild!

This is the point I’m struggling with now that “the future” is back as the catchphrase and the narrative has been smoothly changed for us to lap up again.

In 1976 I was there watching Clive Whitehead’s goal deliver the prize.

Different times of course but is repeating this really the aim or “rinse and repeat” and continually sell the gems to the likes of Bournemouth.

[And Its Smith]

5 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

My hope is there won’t be that much change in defence and midfield in the summer, bar the business already done.

I agree James and King are off but I think we’d need at least one more midfielder or the squad would be thin and I can see that being a new deal for Williams 

I think it will be hard to keep Conway and I reckon Wells could go if we got two new forwards in. I reckon we could keep everyone else - bar Twine - and I think it would be a good strategy to do so as it would enable the recruitment to focus on the two positions that desperately need it.

I can see our squad next year being:

GKs

1. O’Leary 

2. Poss Bajic if Manning genuinely rates him. 
3. HWR or whoever is next on conveyer belt if HWR isn’t kept on

Defenders 

1. Tanner

2.McCrorie

3.Pring

4.Roberts

5.Naismith

6.Atkinson

7.Dickie

8.Vyner

 

Midfield:

1.Bird

2.Knight

3.Murphy

4.Williams

5.TGH

 

Attacking midfielders/Wide forwards

1. Key signing 

2. Stokes

3. Mehmeti

4. Sykes

5. Mebude (if a success)

Forwards

1. Key signing 

2. New back-up or Wells

3. Bell

 

Moved on:

Conway 

James

King

Cornick

Weimann

Maybe moved on too:

Wells (I rate Wells - this is just a hunch)

Bajic

HWR (only listed as his contract is up and I have no idea where the club feel he is in terms of his development)

Agree with all of that but would add Palmer-Houlden to the forwards list. Takes it to 25. 

[FNQ]

I reckon Pring could be snapped up before Tommy…either way both will move on to greener pastures.

[Bat Fastard]

1 hour ago, Ryan said:

We also send a lot of players to places like Bath City who never make the first team. In fact most of them dont make it, so as much as I admire your confidence, I dont share it. 

Of course some will not make it because the Championship is a very demanding level. Most will have some kind of career in the game and the 10% to 15% who do make the grade will eventually make the academy profitable.  Young players already playing regularly in men’s football at a level higher than Bath City are playing at a level that is more demanding than playing in our U21s. Young players who are exceptionally good at this level must be worthy of consideration because they are arguably already ahead of our academy players. Yes, I remain optimistic that this is a good place to find potential first team players - albeit they may need extra physical development and coaching.

[fisherrich]

21 hours ago, Alessandro said:

Bristol City - "Building for tomorrow, when we'll build for tomorrow again"

This club is going backwards. Disappointing.

[Red-Robbo]

1 hour ago, RedM said:

Yes clubs always have to look ahead. (Not quite like F1 when drivers for 2025 have been signed before 2024 has even started). But I think the point that many fans are getting frustrated with is that our tomorrow never seems to come.

We get good players but fail to be able to keep them, the pull of the Premier League is obviously too strong. But they also must believe that we aren't going there any time soon either.

 

This will always be the issue while we remain a consistent midtable side. 

[GrahamC]

1 hour ago, LondonBristolian said:

My hope is there won’t be that much change in defence and midfield in the summer, bar the business already done.

I agree James and King are off but I think we’d need at least one more midfielder or the squad would be thin and I can see that being a new deal for Williams 

I think it will be hard to keep Conway and I reckon Wells could go if we got two new forwards in. I reckon we could keep everyone else - bar Twine - and I think it would be a good strategy to do so as it would enable the recruitment to focus on the two positions that desperately need it.

I can see our squad next year being:

GKs

1. O’Leary 

2. Poss Bajic if Manning genuinely rates him. 
3. HWR or whoever is next on conveyer belt if HWR isn’t kept on

Defenders 

1. Tanner

2.McCrorie

3.Pring

4.Roberts

5.Naismith

6.Atkinson

7.Dickie

8.Vyner

 

Midfield:

1.Bird

2.Knight

3.Murphy

4.Williams

5.TGH

 

Attacking midfielders/Wide forwards

1. Key signing 

2. Stokes

3. Mehmeti

4. Sykes

5. Mebude (if a success)

Forwards

1. Key signing 

2. New back-up or Wells

3. Bell

 

Moved on:

Conway 

James

King

Cornick

Weimann

Maybe moved on too:

Wells (I rate Wells - this is just a hunch)

Bajic

HWR (only listed as his contract is up and I have no idea where the club feel he is in terms of his development)

Good post & I think a lot of what you say will happen.

My hunch is Wells will stick around & see out the last year of his deal though. Think he’s settled here & if Conway goes it will be useful to have an experienced, proven back up to whoever we sign as our main CF.

If Knight moves back into a more conventional centre mid role than maybe him, Bird & TGH is enough if we see Murphy as a possible. The lesser spotted Naismith has another year & could play there as well.

If one of the midfielders OoC is going to be offered anything it is almost certainly as you said, going to be Williams.

Re the keepers I’m pretty sure Wiles-Richards is out of contract & I don’t expect he’ll get another. Impossible to know the thinking on Bajic as through no fault of his own he hasn’t played.

Edited February 4 by GrahamC

[Natchfever]

11 hours ago, Dr Balls said:

But we still get the media fluff, promoted by the club, that Manning is a “bright young coach”, while of course the club were quite happy for Pearson to be painted as an aging dinosaur, when the truth was nothing of the sort. Personally I would prefer experience over promise, but of course that doesn’t suit the owners!

Always a gamble signing an inexperienced player from L1, so no reason why the same shouldnt apply to a coach  particularly when his overseer/mentor is a dud like Tinnion.

He may well succeed of course, or he could be indulged like Johnson and nearly ruin us.

Time will tell as Manning is here unless relegation is a real danger in the seasons to come. The Lansdowns dont acknowledge failiure easily do they.

[Davefevs]

2 hours ago, red panda said:

It's amazing how successful the club has been in spreading this myth that LM is well-respected, sought-after, bright young coach etc right across all of our independent national media. Especially as in all other respects, many posters seem to think those running the club are completely useless.

Or, just a thought, may be all of those independent media outlets actually say what they think. Surely not? 

Remember when 442 magazine wrote that LJ was the 7th best young coach in Europe…LJ quoted it himself!

[TomSutton]

2 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

My hope is there won’t be that much change in defence and midfield in the summer, bar the business already done.

I agree James and King are off but I think we’d need at least one more midfielder or the squad would be thin and I can see that being a new deal for Williams 

I think it will be hard to keep Conway and I reckon Wells could go if we got two new forwards in. I reckon we could keep everyone else - bar Twine - and I think it would be a good strategy to do so as it would enable the recruitment to focus on the two positions that desperately need it.

I can see our squad next year being:

GKs

1. O’Leary 

2. Poss Bajic if Manning genuinely rates him. 
3. HWR or whoever is next on conveyer belt if HWR isn’t kept on

Defenders 

1. Tanner

2.McCrorie

3.Pring

4.Roberts

5.Naismith

6.Atkinson

7.Dickie

8.Vyner

 

Midfield:

1.Bird

2.Knight

3.Murphy

4.Williams

5.TGH

 

Attacking midfielders/Wide forwards

1. Key signing 

2. Stokes

3. Mehmeti

4. Sykes

5. Mebude (if a success)

Forwards

1. Key signing 

2. New back-up or Wells

3. Bell

 

Moved on:

Conway 

James

King

Cornick

Weimann

Maybe moved on too:

Wells (I rate Wells - this is just a hunch)

Bajic

HWR (only listed as his contract is up and I have no idea where the club feel he is in terms of his development)

Do wonder whether this team has the potential to lack experience pros.

could possibly see Naismith being moved on too not down to ability but more his availability concerns.

If Naismith was to move on your most experienced players within the squad would be Dickie, Vyner, Williams (if kept on), O Leary and Sykes.

This of course is in terms of age and not games played but having played under different managers and systems can be all the more beneficial to the squad like King is atm, evidenced by how he appears to be always one of the first to greet the new player and take them out socialising with the squad. 

By no means do I think that moving on the likes of Weimann, king, James is the wrong decision but we do not want to end up with a squad solely made up of 20-25 year olds I personally feel.

[redsquirrel]

5 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

 

Time will tell as Manning is here unless relegation is a real danger in the seasons to come. The Lansdowns dont acknowledge failiure easily do they.

weird innit, they dont like good successful ones either

[LoyalRed]

23 hours ago, luke_bristol said:

Interesting that they’re buying for next season and essentially writing this season off.

Interesting that “writing off the season” halfway through the season seems to be the norm these days but we are all expected to still by season tickets 

[TomSutton]

1 minute ago, LoyalRed said:

Interesting that “writing off the season” halfway through the season seems to be the norm these days but we are all expected to still by season tickets 

Suppose it’s all done on hope really,

Always the part that kills you.

[Natchfever]

2 minutes ago, redsquirrel said:

weird innit, they dont like good successful ones either

I do find it odd that a man with so much money and a desire to be loved seems hellbent on leaving a meh legacy.

[Glen hump]

3 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

I do find it odd that a man with so much money and a desire to be loved seems hellbent on leaving a meh legacy.

I find it astonishing that a man who’s been so successful continues to make the same mistakes over and over when it comes to the football club, the penny never seems to drop, it’s almost like he’s ego won’t let him change.

[TDarwall]

1 minute ago, Glen hump said:

I find it astonishing that a man who’s been so successful continues to make the same mistakes over and over when it comes to the football club, the penny never seems to drop, it’s almost like he’s ego won’t let him change.

I think he desperately wants success. However he won't relinquish control & that's what's held us back.

He should have looked a BCFC like a business acquisition where he was buying into a sector where he had no knowledge.  The smart thing to do would be to hire the best people you can afford to run the club & then get out of the way & let them get on with it.

 

[LondonBristolian]

1 hour ago, GrahamC said:

Good post & I think a lot of what you say will happen.

My hunch is Wells will stick around & see out the last year of his deal though. Think he’s settled here & if Conway goes it will be useful to have an experienced, proven back up to whoever we sign as our main CF.

If Knight moves back into a more conventional centre mid role than maybe him, Bird & TGH is enough if we see Murphy as a possible. The lesser spotted Naismith has another year & could play there as well.

If one of the midfielders OoC is going to be offered anything it is almost certainly as you said, going to be Williams.

Re the keepers I’m pretty sure Wiles-Richards is out of contract & I don’t expect he’ll get another. Impossible to know the thinking on Bajic as through no fault of his own he hasn’t played.

You could well be right re Wells. I certainly would be neither surprised or unhappy if he was here next year and, in many ways, it would be better to focus on bringing one forward in and getting the budget for that right.

It's an interesting one re Williams - in a way 4 midfield options plus Naismith is enough but, in another, the squad I listed out still comes to 24 (25 if you count Palmer-Houlden, who @And Its Smith pointed out could well be in contention too. In isolation, I think 8 defenders is enough and I think 4 midfielders plus a defender who can cover is enough but I'm not sure if 12 players across those 6 positions gives us enough cover across the season so I'd still keep Williams, especially as Murphy's development is a bit of an unknown.

15 minutes ago, TomSutton said:

Do wonder whether this team has the potential to lack experience pros.

could possibly see Naismith being moved on too not down to ability but more his availability concerns.

If Naismith was to move on your most experienced players within the squad would be Dickie, Vyner, Williams (if kept on), O Leary and Sykes.

This of course is in terms of age and not games played but having played under different managers and systems can be all the more beneficial to the squad like King is atm, evidenced by how he appears to be always one of the first to greet the new player and take them out socialising with the squad. 

By no means do I think that moving on the likes of Weimann, king, James is the wrong decision but we do not want to end up with a squad solely made up of 20-25 year olds I personally feel.

This might be a good reason why Wells does stay, and it's why I reckon Naismith could too. As you say, Naismith's availability is a concern but less so if there are decent numbers in the squad - plus his availability could also make it harder to get another team to get on his contract so we might end up paying a chunk of his wages even if he departed so I think it is pragmatic to keep him. 

In terms of James and King, for me it's less so about wrong or right so much as what I expect. I rate James and can see what King brings as a presence in the squad but, based on King's partner's comments and the signing of Bird, I just don't reckon either will be here next season. Like you, I don't necessarily think that it's the wrong decision but I'm yet to decide that I think it is the right one either. 

[Dr Balls]

6 minutes ago, Glen hump said:

I find it astonishing that a man who’s been so successful continues to make the same mistakes over and over when it comes to the football club, the penny never seems to drop, it’s almost like he’s ego won’t let him change.

Well in the case of LJ and MA, perhaps there are even bigger bullshitters in football than there are in finance and business. Which having seen the interview episodes on the Apprentice, when their CVs are scrutinised, really makes me wonder!

The problem is that frequently SL has gone for managers with potential, who have had a bit of short-term form, without actually achieving anything significant (McInnes, Johnson Jr, Manning) or the cheap internal option (Tinnion, Millen, Holden). Strangely the only ones who I would have described as successful from his list of managers are those with previous tangible success (Johnson Sr, Cotterill, Pearson) although I accept that Coppell was a miss, while SO’D was a useless manager, but he did lay the groundwork for the Academy and some of the players that shone under Cotterill and LJ.

The point is that none a single one of them has gone on to bigger and better things elsewhere, which again suggests a poor record for picking managers.

[GrahamC]

24 minutes ago, TomSutton said:

Do wonder whether this team has the potential to lack experience pros.

could possibly see Naismith being moved on too not down to ability but more his availability concerns.

If Naismith was to move on your most experienced players within the squad would be Dickie, Vyner, Williams (if kept on), O Leary and Sykes.

This of course is in terms of age and not games played but having played under different managers and systems can be all the more beneficial to the squad like King is atm, evidenced by how he appears to be always one of the first to greet the new player and take them out socialising with the squad. 

By no means do I think that moving on the likes of Weimann, king, James is the wrong decision but we do not want to end up with a squad solely made up of 20-25 year olds I personally feel.

I can’t see any value in keeping King, obvious that he’s not getting a coaching gig now Nige has left & whilst his availability to be a sub this year has been useful, he’s 36 next season & we need a better option.

Personally I’d keep James even in front of Williams (Weimann has effectively already left) but I’d be amazed if we did.

[supercidered]

On 03/02/2024 at 11:37, Leabrook said:

This summer could see us lose James, Williams, Conway, Wells, Pring, Twine, Cornick and King from the current squad. Some rightly and some wrongly but that is 8 senior players.  Another summer of overhaul.  

And then cue the same old lines from whoever within the club (take your pick). 

We've lost some players (see above) and we have some targets to bring in.

We can't compete with teams in this league with our budget.

We are looking to strengthen early so they get a full pre season and then bed themselves in to how we play.

Evolution not revolution.

We are making progress and getting the messages across in good training sessions.

Lets look at the Academy first.

Our aim is to be at least in the top 6 come May 2025.

I could go on but I think you get my drift.

[TomSutton]

1 minute ago, GrahamC said:

I can’t see any value in keeping King, obvious that he’s not getting a coaching gig now Nige has left & whilst his availability to be a sub this year has been useful, he’s 36 next season & we need a better option.

Personally I’d keep James even in front of Williams (Weimann has effectively already left) but I’d be amazed if we did.

Agree on King gone, without Pearson who was allowing him to transition into his coaching role and to be moderated while coaching I imagine with the academy boys which is necessary to complete your FAW and FA coaching badges like Kings done, it means he has no real role currently. From my understanding he’s a very popular figure but as is Williams and they cannot simply be kept on because of this.

I remember reading on Bristol Live when LM first came in that King was strictly a player as Manning wanted to be in complete control around who coaches the first team hence Hogg and Krause coming in. It is clear that Kings legs have gone so I doubt he will play 2 or more games again this season (possible cameo against forest?) 

With AW OOC as well as MJ and JW all our more experienced players within the squad this will leave us 4 players over the age of 28 at the start of next season under contract these being.

Wells (34)

Dickie (28) 

Cornick (29) 

Naismith (32) 

Bar that we have many players entering the “prime” of their careers RE Vyner, Pring, Sykes and co but that will not leave us with many experienced heads who can act as a point of call for both the management to consult with (haha as if) or players to turn to for guidance like with Alex Scott and King.

[Davefevs]

14 minutes ago, TomSutton said:

Agree on King gone, without Pearson who was allowing him to transition into his coaching role and to be moderated while coaching I imagine with the academy boys which is necessary to complete your FAW and FA coaching badges like Kings done, it means he has no real role currently. From my understanding he’s a very popular figure but as is Williams and they cannot simply be kept on because of this.

I remember reading on Bristol Live when LM first came in that King was strictly a player as Manning wanted to be in complete control around who coaches the first team hence Hogg and Krause coming in. It is clear that Kings legs have gone so I doubt he will play 2 or more games again this season (possible cameo against forest?) 

With AW OOC as well as MJ and JW all our more experienced players within the squad this will leave us 4 players over the age of 28 at the start of next season under contract these being.

Wells (34)

Dickie (28) 

Cornick (29) 

Naismith (32) 

Bar that we have many players entering the “prime” of their careers RE Vyner, Pring, Sykes and co but that will not leave us with many experienced heads who can act as a point of call for both the management to consult with (haha as if) or players to turn to for guidance like with Alex Scott and King.

I think he’s missing a huge trick in not keeping King around.

Assuming James goes, he is the one person in the whole of the club with PL nous, how to get to the PL, and what makes a PL player.  A city fan too!

It would make sense to retain that in whatever shape and form he can….hes low cost.  He has his badges, he might even bring practical experience to a head-coach who’s never played professionally, a coach-analyst (Krause) who hasn’t either and the assistant (Hogg) who had a minor career at Hibs.  He’d also provide that young player / new signing mentoring, he is young at heart too.  And although his legs may have gone when he has played he’s shown that the brain is just as important.

But I can understand the threat of a Nige-man in the camp.  Although the best teams handle that for the good if the team.  Good teams like challenge, weak teams have followers.  I sense that Manning, Hogg and Krause are so aligned they may not see the things that an “outsider” might.

Maybe Kingy doesn’t want to stay.

From the outside looking in it looks like an error.

Edited February 4 by Davefevs

[TomSutton]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think he’s missing a huge trick in not keeping King around.

Assuming James goes, he is the one person in the whole of the club with PL nous, how to get to the PL, and what makes a PL player.  A city fan too!

It would make sense to retain that in whatever shape and form he can….hes low cost.  He has his badges, he might even bring practical experience to a head-coach who’s never played professionally, a coach-analyst (Krause) who hasn’t either and the assistant (Hogg) who had a minor career at Hibs.  He’d also provide that young player / new signing mentoring, he is young at heart too.  And although his legs may have gone when he has played he’s shown that the brain is just as important.

But I can understand the threat of a Nige-man in the camp.  Although the best teams handle that for the good if the team.  Good teams like challenge.  I sense that Manning, Hogg and Krause are so aligned they may not see the things that an “outsider” might.

Maybe Kingy doesn’t want to stay.

From the outside looking in it looks like an error.

I can’t see a way he stays on, seemed very clear that Manning didn’t take King being suggested as a coach too kindly and shut it down instantly.

From my perspective it appears to be he has a close circle of people he can trust and delegate responsibility too but if your not in that, then it’s extremely difficult to get into and that is where I believe king is now.

I am imagining King would ideally want to have at least a house here still in the south west and if we were to offer him a deal as a coach I’m sure he would accept it I wonder whether theoretically he could aid with the u18s who appear to be a very talented group (5th round of FA youth cup coming up). His experience as a guy who’s had both success in his career as well as difficult times like in Belgium can only enhance his ability to guide the younger lads.

will it happen probably not, would I like him to be kept on as a youth coach yes, would King see himself as just a youth coach though or would he want a more managerial role up to him in the end.

*Also agree on having the premier league experience and is a great point of call for those in the first team looking to get there 

Edited February 4 by TomSutton

[maxjak]

2 hours ago, fisherrich said:

This club is going backwards. Disappointing.

Haven't you herd about our "Tremendous potential?"  &  "A Premiership club in waiting"   Considering we have owned those opinion's for 20 years? 

[Davefevs]

3 minutes ago, TomSutton said:

I can’t see a way he stays on, seemed very clear that Manning didn’t take King being suggested as a coach too kindly and shut it down instantly.

From my perspective it appears to be he has a close circle of people he can trust and delegate responsibility too but if your not in that, then it’s extremely difficult to get into and that is where I believe king is now.

I am imagining King would ideally want to have at least a house here still in the south west and if we were to offer him a deal as a coach I’m sure he would accept it I wonder whether theoretically he could aid with the u18s who appear to be a very talented group (5th round of FA youth cup coming up). His experience as a guy who’s had both success in his career as well as difficult times like in Belgium can only enhance his ability to guide the younger lads.

will it happen probably not, would I like him to be kept on as a youth coach yes, would King see himself as just a youth coach though or would he want a more managerial role up to him in the end.

*Also agree on having the premier league experience and is a great point of call for those in the first team looking to get there 

Don’t get me wrong I don’t see him staying on either…Mrs King’s insta infers that it’s already decided.

I just think it’s a bad decision.

[Redtucks]

3 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

My hope is there won’t be that much change in defence and midfield in the summer, bar the business already done.

I agree James and King are off but I think we’d need at least one more midfielder or the squad would be thin and I can see that being a new deal for Williams 

I think it will be hard to keep Conway and I reckon Wells could go if we got two new forwards in. I reckon we could keep everyone else - bar Twine - and I think it would be a good strategy to do so as it would enable the recruitment to focus on the two positions that desperately need it.

I can see our squad next year being:

GKs

1. O’Leary 

2. Poss Bajic if Manning genuinely rates him. 
3. HWR or whoever is next on conveyer belt if HWR isn’t kept on

Defenders 

1. Tanner

2.McCrorie

3.Pring

4.Roberts

5.Naismith

6.Atkinson

7.Dickie

8.Vyner

 

Midfield:

1.Bird

2.Knight

3.Murphy

4.Williams

5.TGH

 

Attacking midfielders/Wide forwards

1. Key signing 

2. Stokes

3. Mehmeti

4. Sykes

5. Mebude (if a success)

Forwards

1. Key signing 

2. New back-up or Wells

3. Bell

 

Moved on:

Conway 

James

King

Cornick

Weimann

Maybe moved on too:

Wells (I rate Wells - this is just a hunch)

Bajic

HWR (only listed as his contract is up and I have no idea where the club feel he is in terms of his development)

No mention of Ayman Benarous???

 

[Northern Red]

1 minute ago, Redtucks said:

No mention of Ayman Benarous???

 

Because he hasn't played for 2 years and we have absolutely no idea how he'll come back, if he even does.

[The Swan and Cemetery]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I think he’s missing a huge trick in not keeping King around.

Couldn’t agree more. Fine to argue about whether or not Pearson/Rennie/James/King were getting the job done, but having some folk around with PL experience seems likely to be helpful! And King isn’t a fancy dan, his unique record of L1/Championship/PL winning with the same club says to me that giving up that unique experience is foolhardy, particularly given he’s a City fan as well. Also agree he’s going, but think it’s a poor decision.  

[Sir Geoff]

Swapped loads of PL experience for some League one experience. mmmmm wonder where that will lead ?