Sheff Utd, Burnley & Luton

[slartibartfast]

18 hours ago, Port Said Red said:

Luton, Sheffield Utd and Burnley all coming back and some previously big names coming up from League One. It's going to be a tough one again.

You can bet there'll be three teams who show us how it's done !

[Mr Popodopolous]

35 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Dunno!  Major, minor, somewhere in between?

It's a very situation to someone wanting to leave to get 3x / 4x their wage as part of a step-up.  Hard to stand in their way then.  Twine has 2 years left on his contract, on sensible wages, so wages wise I doubt there’s an issue.  But it’s not like we are gonna blow Burnley out of the water with a wage either.

I’ve yet to hear a player questioned about his current club (signing, loan, contract) say he doesn’t want to be at said club either.  So we’ve really no idea who Twine prefers to play for.  Nor if he became available do I think Bristol City would be the only Champ club in for him.  So if Burnley are still insisting on £5m like they were in January, we need to decide to stump up or pull out early.  Unless we think we can wait to do another loan later in the summer.  That would be foolish to wait in that imho, but that’s just my thoughts.

But I think a lot of people have convinced themselves that he wants to leave Burnley (we’ve no idea) and that we’d be doing them a favour by taking him off their hands for £2m.

If we do manage to pull it off at that price, fantastic. My gut feel is that we won’t, because we had two goes in January, and Burnley didn’t budge then.  But then again, I could see us overpaying (imho) £5m too, to give support to LM, because that’s the kind of thing we do!

We definitely won't get Twine for £2m, £5m is excessive.

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

18 hours ago, Bristol Rob said:

Wonder where this leaves Forest financially.

Every season in the premiership they're getting away with the crime of the century.  Very little time for them, hope they crash and burn  

[Nogbad the Bad]

51 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

We definitely won't get Twine for £2m, £5m is excessive.

Quick deal or no deal on Twine imo - a very early agreement at our limit (we must have one and it surely won't be anywhere near 5m) or quickly move on (Rudoni?) imo.

The last thing we want is for Twine negotiations to drag out so that our other targets are taken by the time an impasse becomes clear.

While I like Twine I don't like him at Burnley's reported valuation so I hope City will be really decisive here.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

6 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Quick deal or no deal on Twine imo - a very early agreement at our limit (we must have one and it surely won't be anywhere near 5m) or quickly move on (Rudoni?) imo.

The last thing we want is for Twine negotiations to drag out so that our other targets are taken by the time an impasse becomes clear.

While I like Twine I don't like him at Burnley's reported valuation so I hope City will be really decisive here.

 

£2.5-3m tops or is even that a bit much?

Would be a slap in the face given the events of Summer 2023 onwards too.

[ORANGE500]

21 hours ago, RollsRoyce said:

Ipswich save the day 

Ipswich have won the prize of being at the bottom of the league  all next season with more than  a few heavy defeats along the way.signing over priced overpaid mostly foreign players and sacking their manager(currently a hero) around christmas time or perhaps even before.Very cynical view I acknowledge but very true all the same probably why I've never craved premier league football for Bristol City as some of the fans obviously do.

21 hours ago, RollsRoyce said:

Ipswich save the day 

Ipswich have won the prize of being at the bottom of the league  all next season with more than  a few heavy defeats along the way.signing over priced overpaid mostly foreign players and sacking their manager(currently a hero) around christmas time or perhaps even before.Very cynical view I acknowledge but very true all the same probably why I've never craved premier league football for Bristol City as some of the fans obviously do.

[bcfcredandwhite]

21 hours ago, Red-Robbo said:

Straight up straight down just adds to the farce of the PL. 

To be fair RR, this is only the second time in the history of the Premiership that all 3 promoted sides came straight back down. 
The last (and only other) time was way back in 1998. 

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, bcfcredandwhite said:

To be fair RR, this is only the second time in the history of the Premiership that all 3 promoted sides came straight back down. 
The last (and only other) time was way back in 1998. 

What we have seen as a trend over recent years as each tv deal get renegotiated is less non-PP clubs getting promoted, and more coming back down.

Since the 2015/16 season, the last of the old / lower PP, which was just over half of the current PP deal, and even more since 2020/21 when it went up a bit more, the number of clubs flip-flopping in and out of the PL has increased.

Top 3 rows - promoted teams (dark green, straight back up, light green promoted with PPs)

Bottom 3 rows - relegated teams (pink, straight down)

[bcfcredandwhite]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

What we have seen as a trend over recent years as each tv deal get renegotiated is less non-PP clubs getting promoted, and more coming back down.

Since the 2015/16 season, the last of the old / lower PP, which was just over half of the current PP deal, and even more since 2020/21 when it went up a bit more, the number of clubs flip-flopping in and out of the PL has increased.

Top 3 rows - promoted teams (dark green, straight back up, light green promoted with PPs)

Bottom 3 rows - relegated teams (pink, straight down)

Absolutely - and I was NOT trying to say the current arrangement is all sweetness and light. 
There is also a similar thing happening between L1 and the Championship - with Rotherham and Peterborough in particular flip flopping up and down. 
The gulf between the leagues is becoming bigger each season. 

Edited May 12 by bcfcredandwhite
Add words

[Nogbad the Bad]

13 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

£2.5-3m tops or is even that a bit much?

Would be a slap in the face given the events of Summer 2023 onwards too.

No, I agree. 2.5-3m is probably a bit more than we'd ideally pay but it's a significant reduction on Burnley's reported valuation and I suspect at that price we'd do the deal.

Mind you I've no idea how much Rudoni would cost with 2 years left on his contract, but I'm assuming he (or alternative targets) would be less than Twine, and lower wages too, but that may not be the case.

Rudoni certainly seems to be highly rated by those on here who've followed his career, and, who knows, may even be the better bet of the 2 anyway.

 

[Davefevs]

7 minutes ago, bcfcredandwhite said:

Absolutely - and I was NOT trying to say the current arrangement is all sweetness and light. 
There is also a similar thing happening between L1 and the Championship - with Rotherham and Peterborough in particular flip flopping up and down. 
The gulf between the leagues is becoming bigger each season. 

Yep, the distribution model is wrong all over.

[Nugget]

Was thinking earlier it could be an easier Championship next season with these coming down but having second thoughts, gonna be a tricky league. Despite my hopes we’ll make it some day I do prefer the Championship to the Premiership, it’s a solid league, lets see how we build the squad eh.  

[cheese]

And this demonstrates what's wrong with Parachute payments.  Sheff Utd are coming down but are linked with paying £8m for a goalkeeper!!!

 

[Lrrr]

55 minutes ago, cheese said:

And this demonstrates what's wrong with Parachute payments.  Sheff Utd are coming down but are linked with paying £8m for a goalkeeper!!!

 

Does the position really matter? Different teams will place more importance on different positions as to have valuable they believe they are, in theory Sheffield Utd could see a GK as one of their most important positions on the pitch and are therefore willing to pay it, would there be the same commotion if it were a CM or winger?

[Ronnie Sinclair]

35 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

Does the position really matter? Different teams will place more importance on different positions as to have valuable they believe they are, in theory Sheffield Utd could see a GK as one of their most important positions on the pitch and are therefore willing to pay it, would there be the same commotion if it were a CM or winger?

They certainly need a new one, Foderingham has been hopeless this season (as was his replacement Grbić)

[GrahamC]

1 minute ago, Ronnie Sinclair said:

They certainly need a new one, Foderingham has been hopeless this season (as was his replacement Grbić)

But Wilder only bought Grbic in late January for £2m from Athletico Madrid.

Typical parachute payments club behaviour, sign a player then discard him almost immediately & buy another.

Not a luxury that Preston, Millwall or ourselves have.

[Lrrr]

8 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

But Wilder only bought Grbic in late January for £2m from Athletico Madrid.

Typical parachute payments club behaviour, sign a player then discard him almost immediately & buy another.

Not a luxury that Preston, Millwall or ourselves have.

He could have a clause allowing him to leave on relegation for all anyone knows

[GrahamC]

2 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

He could have a clause allowing him to leave on relegation for all anyone knows

Yep, but he’s been on the bench for the last four, Foderingham has got back in, so appears to be out of favour already.

[Lorenzos Only Goal]

I tell you what, I think Luton has played this whole process perfectly. They have improved their squad and will if they retain some of their signings, have a strong season next year.

[hinsleburg]

17 minutes ago, Lorenzos Only Goal said:

I tell you what, I think Luton has played this whole process perfectly. They have improved their squad and will if they retain some of their signings, have a strong season next year.

I agree, they seem to have a squad and work ethic with a few additions that could do very well again and put them in a better spot if they manage to go up again.

Other than Barkley, I'm not sure they will lose many players so the core is already there so would back them to have a good season. That being said though it can sometimes be much harder going into games as favourites rather than underdogs, teams will be happy to sit back and defend and play on the counter like Luton themselves have done. 

Either way, I don't think they'll need to spend big to push for playoffs but think Sheff Utd and Burnley probably would. Burnley's recruitment was mental, very limited Prem Experience and seemingly trying to sign players of a similar calibre and playstyle. I tipped them when they went up to have a good year, thought Kompany would be savvy, invest well and tweak the playstyle to suit the higher standard. As it turns out, they did none of those things and other than the past few weeks have been shite.

[Lanterne Rouge]

6 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Yep, but he’s been on the bench for the last four, Foderingham has got back in, so appears to be out of favour already.

The other thing is that if they do buy him then at least another English Championship club will get the money and it won`t all fly out of the English game. Sunderland will spend it, hopefully on someone else from the EFL.

[22A]

A panel of studio experts on Radio 5 were discussing Burnley this evening.

Last season they acquired 101 points losing just three games. In the Summer they spent £100 million and have been relegated. Apart from wins over their fellow relegated clubs, Burnley only had two wins over the other 17 Prem clubs.

It was also mentioned that the last time the three promoted clubs were immediately relegated was 25 years ago. We should be concerned if that becomes a regular occurrence.

[Lanterne Rouge]

23 hours ago, 22A said:

A panel of studio experts on Radio 5 were discussing Burnley this evening.

Last season they acquired 101 points losing just three games. In the Summer they spent £100 million and have been relegated. Apart from wins over their fellow relegated clubs, Burnley only had two wins over the other 17 Prem clubs.

It was also mentioned that the last time the three promoted clubs were immediately relegated was 25 years ago. We should be concerned if that becomes a regular occurrence.

We should. And even more so if the three relegated clubs go straight back up regularly.

[SecretSam]

And while the parachute payments merry-go-round continues, the same names will go up and down, with the odd surprise coming through (eg Luton, Ipswich, Brentford)

The game is truly ******

[SecretSam]

On 13/05/2024 at 14:09, Lorenzos Only Goal said:

I tell you what, I think Luton has played this whole process perfectly. They have improved their squad and will if they retain some of their signings, have a strong season next year.

Agreed, their season in the PL will have helped pay for the new stadium, if it ever comes. At least we won't have to listen to brain deads fawning over shitty little grounds like Kenilworth Rd so much now.