aa_bcfc Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 Below is the 'fans view' in tonights Evening Post by Adrian Baxter of Chipping Sodbury. Please read it 'I've been looking for the real reason to think that we have the quality and consistancy to go up this year and saturdays performance has led me to believe that we don't. If we are not good enough to beat so many teams at this level' how would we survive in the championship if we were to win promotiom? Part of the problem is I am sure that the players believe the press they are given when the reality is, we are a decent team at league one level and little more. Hartlepool outplayed and outfought us, especially in the first half, and despite us having more possession in the 2nd half, we did not hurt them-a familiar story for much of this season. I am fed up with hearing that we have the best squad in the division etc, when we clearly don't and already I can't see beyond us travelling to the same old places again next season. Annoyingly I do not think one of them will be 'pool because they will be in the championship where they deserve to be and we'll be watching Yeovil overtake us.' Compare this to Tinnions quotes 'We dominated the 2nd half and had the chances to score and I felt the players deserved more than they got' The statement from Adrian Baxter was from someone who had travelled about 10 hours to see more utter rubbish totally frustrated by Saturday and numerous other games this season. Tinnions statement and the whinging about it not being a penalty was from a man who is incapeable of managing and motivating our players and is well on the way to screwing up this season. In the main I agree with Adrians comments. I would also make the following points for comment The cost of the'pool team is a fraction of ours How many players in their team would we aspire to have at City? Nelson perhaps. The wage bill at City is almost certainly several times greater than 'pool. We are supposed to have an acadamy to have a production line of stars for the future, 'pool do not. Are attendances are at least twice that of 'pool. It seems that we are doing things not quite right and 'pool have somehow managed to get it right.......a case of years of serious mismanagement in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 Are we in fact in some dire position........NO! Have we an excellent chance of promotion...YES! My view Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 My points. 1. We will not win promotion. 2. It was a stick on penalty. I was sat right in front of it and called it as soon as it happened, sad but true. 3. Phillips kept the score respectful on saturday with an inspired 1st half in which we could easily have been 3-4 1 down! 4. I also travelled for 10 hours on a coach, and find tin mans positive attitude annoying as i felt there were few positives from a game which showed how far we are away from being a good side. 5. I'd of been happy with a point FACT so why does tins go all out attack with 1/2 an hour left? Naivety. He said 2 points a game is enough a draw and a win on friday and that is your 2 points for each of those games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 Yep, I too read this with interest & also took into account Neale Coopers comments. We have got to go out Friday & pick up 3 points - in style. My choice was Cooper & Scott for replacements for DW.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenun Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 Yep, I too read this with interest & also took into account Neale Coopers comments. We have got to go out Friday & pick up 3 points - in style. My choice was Cooper & Scott for replacements for DW.! ← The trouble is Richie, it ain't going to happen. This is sadly rapidly turning into a learning curve season, which by all accounts usually end up in a near miss, "still never mind eh", "there's always next season", type of response. It'll be, "we have a talented squad who are on the verge of something". Well, it could be a clifftop the way we are going. I support Steve Lansdown's view that we all need to shovel together to get behind the team and management. Well Steve, I'll always support a genuine City fan like you who's always done his best for the club and shovel 'til my hearts content, but as for the team, why are they leaning on their earth evacuation recepticles? They're letting you, me (the fans) and the club down. Somethings got to give, and with faltering displays like Saturday, it'll be the thousands of fans who vote with their feet next season. Personally, I'd get an experienced assistant in now to aid Tins. It could be on a short-term contract until the end of the season, with an extension dependable on promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonyate Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 Are we in fact in some dire position........NO! Have we an excellent chance of promotion...YES! My view ← Will we go up no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richieb Posted January 24, 2005 Report Share Posted January 24, 2005 The trouble is Richie, it ain't going to happen. This is sadly rapidly turning into a learning curve season, which by all accounts usually end up in a near miss, "still never mind eh", "there's always next season", type of response. It'll be, "we have a talented squad who are on the verge of something". Well, it could be a clifftop the way we are going. I support Steve Lansdown's view that we all need to shovel together to get behind the team and management. Well Steve, I'll always support a genuine City fan like you who's always done his best for the club and shovel 'til my hearts content, but as for the team, why are they leaning on their earth evacuation recepticles? They're letting you, me (the fans) and the club down. Somethings got to give, and with faltering displays like Saturday, it'll be the thousands of fans who vote with their feet next season. Personally, I'd get an experienced assistant in now to aid Tins. It could be on a short-term contract until the end of the season, with an extension dependable on promotion. ← Yep,I like you have had the shovel at all the games since! I believe Tinnion could well make a good Manager, but he should have been brought in where Millen is now & then gone on from there. I can't see Tinnion accepting some outside help (Ward situation) - it hurts pride when it looks as if you arn't getting it right. Like you if we don't go up this season, the learning curve vote will be given & onwards to 05/06. But the 9000 ST's will reduce & costs with it! Tinnion will have to blood the young'uns then! Lets hope Friday brings the start of the 10 match unbeaten run???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leadman Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Below is the 'fans view' in tonights Evening Post by Adrian Baxter of Chipping Sodbury. Please read it 'I've been looking for the real reason to think that we have the quality and consistancy to go up this year and saturdays performance has led me to believe that we don't. If we are not good enough to beat so many teams at this level' how would we survive in the championship if we were to win promotiom? Part of the problem is I am sure that the players believe the press they are given when the reality is, we are a decent team at league one level and little more. Hartlepool outplayed and outfought us, especially in the first half, and despite us having more possession in the 2nd half, we did not hurt them-a familiar story for much of this season. I am fed up with hearing that we have the best squad in the division etc, when we clearly don't and already I can't see beyond us travelling to the same old places again next season. Annoyingly I do not think one of them will be 'pool because they will be in the championship where they deserve to be and we'll be watching Yeovil overtake us.' Compare this to Tinnions quotes 'We dominated the 2nd half and had the chances to score and I felt the players deserved more than they got' The statement from Adrian Baxter was from someone who had travelled about 10 hours to see more utter rubbish totally frustrated by Saturday and numerous other games this season. Tinnions statement and the whinging about it not being a penalty was from a man who is incapeable of managing and motivating our players and is well on the way to screwing up this season. In the main I agree with Adrians comments. I would also make the following points for comment The cost of the'pool team is a fraction of ours How many players in their team would we aspire to have at City? Nelson perhaps. The wage bill at City is almost certainly several times greater than 'pool. We are supposed to have an acadamy to have a production line of stars for the future, 'pool do not. Are attendances are at least twice that of 'pool. It seems that we are doing things not quite right and 'pool have somehow managed to get it right.......a case of years of serious mismanagement in my opinion. ← well said, mismanagement is our problem, the squad is there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rednready Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Yes we do have the squad, and as Tins says we have to go in with guns blazing on Friday. The slow and steady types Tins/Murray/Butler/Bell cannot start if Tins is serious. Speed from the start would be Phillips,-Smith-Coles-Ireland-Fortune, Brown-Wilkshire-Docherty-Goodfellow, Brooker-Heffernan. Bench, Cotterill-Orr-Lita-Dinning-Butler.Tins if you are serious, You cannot possibly start with those 4 slower names.......i just hope its not a media platitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rednready Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Yes we do have the squad, and as Tins says we have to go in with guns blazing on Friday. The slow and steady types Tins/Murray/Butler/Bell cannot start if Tins is serious. Speed from the start would be Phillips,-Smith-Coles-Ireland-Fortune, Brown-Wilkshire-Docherty-Goodfellow, Brooker-Heffernan. Bench, Cotterill-Orr-Lita-Dinning-Butler.Tins if you are serious, You cannot possibly start with those 4 slower names.......i just hope its not a media platitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pigbagman Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 I can't see Tinnion accepting some outside help (Ward situation) - it hurts pride when it looks as if you arn't getting it right. ← It hurts a lot more when you lose your job because you were too stubborn to accept some help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swindlered Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Yep,I like you have had the shovel at all the games since! I believe Tinnion could well make a good Manager, but he should have been brought in where Millen is now & then gone on from there. I can't see Tinnion accepting some outside help (Ward situation) - it hurts pride when it looks as if you arn't getting it right. Like you if we don't go up this season, the learning curve vote will be given & onwards to 05/06. But the 9000 ST's will reduce & costs with it! Tinnion will have to blood the young'uns then! Lets hope Friday brings the start of the 10 match unbeaten run???? ← I wish someone had told me that this was going to be a learning curve season. I wouldn't have spent all Summer dreaming about promotion and how great it would be being in the Championship. I can't be bothered to put a case together but i'm sure the law of diminishing returns sums up our season better.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slave to the rhythm Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 I wish someone had told me that this was going to be a learning curve season. I wouldn't have spent all Summer dreaming about promotion and how great it would be being in the Championship. I can't be bothered to put a case together but i'm sure the law of diminishing returns sums up our season better.... ← They certainly didn't say that it was going to be a learning curve season when they were offering season tickets for sale back in June/July. Trades Descriptions Act anybody? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyb Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 They certainly didn't say that it was going to be a learning curve season when they were offering season tickets for sale back in June/July. Trades Descriptions Act anybody? ← Would that be the 'Promotion is still the aim speech'?? This season thus far has been total and utter garbage. Now if we'd been told in the summer that after DW went we were going to have to appoont a younger mananger, make cutbacks, sell players and consoldiate for a couple of years fine - but we weren't told that - Promotion was still the aim - and it was expected to be achieved. This was backed up with another £350k of sigings plus the frees. Things started bad then got better but now have progressively got worse. We were promised exciting attacking football - i can remember 3 games of this - the rest has been as bad in quality as it was under DW but without the results to go with it. Yeah we've played well on occasions but the level of consistency is just non-existant. Only twice this season have we won 3 games in a row - that is just not even close to being good enough to get promoted. Our best performances have been folowed by Rubbish - Stockport home to Bradford away - Tranmere away - Bradford Home. One good performance in 7/8 games does not a promotion season make and this one is slipping away rapidly - home form (to his credit always good under DW) is non-existant - and whilst we've lost one in 10 away - we've only one four - and got not very memorable draws with 3 more teams in the bottom half the table. My opinion is that Tinnion's appointment was a mistake - done with much speed and very little thought. Allowing him to then employ Millen as number 2 merely compounded the error. We then had the opportunity to rectify that following Augusts crisis when Sturrock became available again - would we have the balls?? No we didnt. But Sheff Wed did - they had the balls to sack there mananger in September and get in someone to get them promoted - and hey ho 3/4 months later its working - don't be surprised to see them sneak into second place - to all those at Hillsbourough on 9th May take a look at the benches and ask yourself honestly who you'd rather have in charge. Footballs a harsh business and as nasty as it would have been to say that to Tins in August it should have been done. Surely SL must have realised when he had to go and bollock the players that we were in trouble?? No matter how hard you try when you lose the dressing room like that early on - very rarely do you recover. The performances of people like Doherty and Coles this season show this. Mismanagement from the boss and the boardroom is costing this club very dear - the big decisions have had to made and theyu weren't. Now i hope i'm wrong and we recover and do a 'Cardiff' by sneaking up from 6th place but realisitcally - unless someone with far bigger bollox than SL makes the managerial decisions round here - it aint going to happen so welcome to another couple of years down here - I'm not sure I can be arsed though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bransonmo Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Any more dissapointing results, and no promotion will have far reaching consequences. Next summer, lower sales of season tickets, players leaving or wanting to leave, even bigger pressure on Tins and the board. Sure they could throw money at it and bring in 2-3 Messiahs, but it would be easier to start winning games now, a lot of games. I believe we have the squad, i don't believe the selection process, or the ability to motivate certain players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 We certainly do not have the squad or probably the manager either, otherwise we'd be top four at worst, not eighth when the games in hand are played. The fact is though that this season will be dressed up as a learning curve for yet another season at this level under the same manager. I have consistently posted as to how so many of our players are grossly overrated on here and cost us too much and get wages they do not justify. Only two of our players made last season's PFA team and we allowed one of them to leave for free in the summer whilst rewarding over the hill squad players like Bell with yet further contracts. Also if someone can explain how giving Woodman a three year deal in the summer only to send him out on loan in October for the rest of season makes any sense then I'd be interested, either he wasn't worth keeping or we play him. There is still a soft underbelly, contracts for the favoured and so many former players kept on as mediocre coaches and aging players coming here for an easy last payday. Signing late twenty and thirty something journeymen like Dinning, have we learned nothing from the disastrous Pulis era? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmyb Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 We certainly do not have the squad or probably the manager either, otherwise we'd be top four at worst, not eighth when the games in hand are played. The fact is though that this season will be dressed up as a learning curve for yet another season at this level under the same manager. I have consistently posted as to how so many of our players are grossly overrated on here and cost us too much and get wages they do not justify. Only two of our players made last season's PFA team and we allowed one of them to leave for free in the summer whilst rewarding over the hill squad players like Bell with yet further contracts. Also if someone can explain how giving Woodman a three year deal in the summer only to send him out on loan in October for the rest of season makes any sense then I'd be interested, either he wasn't worth keeping or we play him. There is still a soft underbelly, contracts for the favoured and so many former players kept on as mediocre coaches and aging players coming here for an easy last payday. Signing late twenty and thirty something journeymen like Dinning, have we learned nothing from the disastrous Pulis era? ← And playing these people (Dinning etc...) instead of England Under 20 Midfielder Scott Brown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DANNY Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 To be fair to tinnion and the board after last season we were a decent regular goal scorer away from getting promoted and the board got us that in heff and tinnion gave lita a chance to prove he should of played more last season. But loseing Carey and more importantly Brown made his job more diffcult now weather or not tinnion knew there was a good chance they would go I don't know but neither got replaced well enough.Also you can't do anything if your better players don't perform people like doc,murray and coles haven't been at the best all season and if they need motivation to put on the red shirt and give 100% then they should leave now and save the club money, if they've got a problem with tinnion show on the pitch that we need them more than him.Also the dinning situation is diffcult I for one was glad we signed but didn't know he had a repuation for being a lazy b******d ones his contract was signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rednready Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 We certainly do not have the squad or probably the manager either, otherwise we'd be top four at worst, not eighth when the games in hand are played. The fact is though that this season will be dressed up as a learning curve for yet another season at this level under the same manager. I have consistently posted as to how so many of our players are grossly overrated on here and cost us too much and get wages they do not justify. Only two of our players made last season's PFA team and we allowed one of them to leave for free in the summer whilst rewarding over the hill squad players like Bell with yet further contracts. Also if someone can explain how giving Woodman a three year deal in the summer only to send him out on loan in October for the rest of season makes any sense then I'd be interested, either he wasn't worth keeping or we play him. There is still a soft underbelly, contracts for the favoured and so many former players kept on as mediocre coaches and aging players coming here for an easy last payday. Signing late twenty and thirty something journeymen like Dinning, have we learned nothing from the disastrous Pulis era? ← As another thread said.....who out of last weeks team would replace anyone in the Hartlepooles team. Brooker and Wiltshire perhaps, thats it. I think the 30'ish brigade are considered ok because Tins is 37 this year. As a mind set he would consider 29-33 as still having 3-4 years left to play. Younger players with good footballing skills like Brown and Gillespie cant get a start. However , that aside and i usually agree with your posts, i think we could still be competitive enough for the playoffs if the selection process was different,as mentioned in my earlier post.I think Tins contract is for 3 years, so i think we will have him at the helm for at least next season. As someone who has worked for a bookie, i would say we are slightly odds on to remain in this division. A win on Friday and a point at Hull would see even money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
port marine red Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Lets be honest, Tinnion shouldn't have been given the job in the first place. Right place, wrong man. You can't blame him. The finger must point at the board. HOWEVER, he has made some baffling team selections and substitutions so he has to shoulder some of the responsibility. We won't get promoted this season, no way. I have seen nothing yet to convince me of anything different. Again we are a so called "big side" in a very average division. It hurts that teams like Doncaster and Hartlepool can create a fortress at home, yet we continue to struggle. I know that teams raise their game when they come to Ashton Gate but with the squad we have and the money that has been made available by the board, it just isn't good enough. So, what do we do? He's on a 3 year contract (surely a years probation would have been a better option, two years to follow if a good job done)so he won't get sacked, not this season anyway. I feel that we are just treading water. In fact, we are going backwards. The table doesn't lie, just as it won't at the end of the season when we finish outside the top six Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel_Bill Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 5. I'd of been happy with a point FACT so why does tins go all out attack with 1/2 an hour left? ← Because he was desparate for a win? Lose we did, but we have to WIN games. We have drawn too many. If we don't win on Friday, then I will be worried! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Are we in fact in some dire position........NO! Have we an excellent chance of promotion...YES! My view ← Do we play dire football nearly every week......YES! Will this dire football get us promoted..........NO! My view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rednready Posted January 25, 2005 Report Share Posted January 25, 2005 Do we play dire football nearly every week......YES! Will this dire football get us promoted..........NO! My view. ← Now Greebo.....THAT IS FLAIR ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksred Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 A thought in all this chaps, and chapesses: when Tins got the job, a lot of people thought, great brill, we're up....... Still others thought noooooooooooooooooooo........ A few of us thought right choice, wrong timing....I was one of those people, and after some of the more dire performances, I've screamed for blood, with the best, but in all reality, did anyone really truthfully think Tins could acheive it.with Wondersons negative tactics, the clique of players he liked (now unfortunately another one of Tins mates has appeared), the underperforming of several players (Again no change). Reality No1, On what we've done so far, we aint good enough, end of-when we do get it right, we ARE capable of it, sadly a rare event this season. Reality No2, we don't seem able to attract quality plyers here very often, and should we fail to go up, the few we do have, realistically, will they stay? Reality No3, Tins may have the right attacking attitude, but he desparately needs an expereinced No2, someone who can get a grip on the prima donnas here.He will take time to become a good manager, its called expereince, but will, indeed can he be given the time to to this. The longer teams like ourselves stay out of Div 2 (Real money, not fancy terms), the less likely we are to be able to survive, with the difference in quality there. Another season like this will result in gates dropping, cos like it or not some people wont follow a failing team, albeit our favorite level, being in this Div. I really think we could survive in Div 2, but we gotta get there, on on what I've personally seen (And Yes I've not seen every match)we aint going anywhere. For a city the size of Bristol, its bloody appalling that NEITHER side can bloody acheive anything currently, especially our beloved City. Never say never, but er reality and all that.......Still don't want Wonderson back though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted January 26, 2005 Report Share Posted January 26, 2005 I must admit to thinking from the start that Tinnion was the wrong choice full stop, but still hope that I was wrong in that. The fact is though that he inherited a far better situation than most previous managers in recent times, people can criticise Wilson for his slow progress, but post Pulis progress it certainly was. Also so many players were out of contract last summer that there was an opportunity to clear out dead wood and bring in replacements, obviously examples being Matthews going and Peacock being moved on to create a big wage saving.To that end the decision to retain Bell still completely baffles me. Tinnion has now brought in 8 players since becoming manager (one of whom I accept is currently on loan) and has therefore had the chance to make far more changes far more quickly than Wilson did in his first three years. I also cannot accept this "Wilson had four seasons" nonsense, we specifically appointed Tinnion to "hit the ground running", he knew the players he inherited, knew the club and was supposed to deliver I would estimate within two seasons. I don't think anyone is suggesting a Wilson return, as we all know very few succeed at the same place second time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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