Progression

[frenchred]

Does anyone think that we have made ANY progression under Tinnion? If you look at the playoff team/squad we had when we played Brighton I would argue that man for man we have gone backwards despite the huge (by this leagues standard) financial backing given to our esteemed management.

Goalkeeper - Stayed the same (No problems with that)

Defence - Another year older another year slower and no First ball center half, definately weaker this season by a long way.

Midfield - Another year older another year slower (Murray), Doherty is shot to pieces, Goodfellow don't know if he is coming or going, journeymen loan signings, lack of pace, lack of vision, lack of know how, I'm not saying we had all this last year(Far from it) but we are a million miles away in Midfield at the moment.

Attack - The only part of the team that has been improved, although they often have to feed on scrapes due to the dross behind them!

Management - Last season we had a manager and assistant

So Tinnion In my eyes you have dismantled a team that was very very close to promotion, slowed them down, played poo football and now we have the rewards!

Many thanks

Please go

[MAGILLA]

Does anyone think that we have made ANY progression under Tinnion? If you look at the playoff team/squad we had when we played Brighton I would argue that man for man we have gone backwards despite the huge (by this leagues standard) financial backing given to our esteemed management.

Goalkeeper - Stayed the same (No problems with that)

Defence - Another year older another year slower and no First ball center half, definately weaker this season by a long way.

Midfield - Another year older another year slower (Murray), Doherty is shot to pieces, Goodfellow don't know if he is coming or going, journeymen loan signings, lack of pace, lack of vision, lack of know how, I'm not saying we had all this last year(Far from it) but we are a million miles away in Midfield at the moment.

Attack - The only part of the team that has been improved, although they often have to feed on scrapes due to the dross behind them!

Management - Last season we had a manager and assistant

So Tinnion In my eyes you have dismantled a team that was very very close to promotion, slowed them down, played poo football and now we have the rewards!

Many thanks

Please go

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Very much in agreement. Tinnion inherited a team good enough to finish 3rd in a better division than this one and has turned it into a side that could well finish 14th. That is regression - it's not even stagnation. And if he turned a 3rd placed team into a mid-table team then could he then turn a mid-table team into a relegation threatened team?

He started the season off with one formation, then another, then another, then 3 in the same game, slagged the players off in public while all the while claiming that he was learning from his mistakes but no patent evidence of sustained improvement nor clear thinking from the management/coaching set-up.

Furthermore, he started the season with, in effect, DW's team but couldn't motivate them nor coach them into being a consistently effective team. So bye, bye to Roberts, Woodman, Hill, Amankwaah, Butler, Miller, Gillespie, Goodfellow and very nearly Coles and Tommy.

Then, his own team (Brooker, Orr, Dinning, Smith, Heffernan, Ireland, Bell, Murray etc) could not be motivated nor coached into being a consistently effective team (with the exception of Brooker and the disgracefully under-used Heffernan).

And now, the youngsters are being thrown in willy-nilly, as a last act of desperation (for no-one can seriously blame 17 and 18 year olds for poor/nervous performances) and still they under-perform, are poorly motivated and are out-played by our supposed rivals.

This season would have been tolerated by many if signs of improvement, direction and planning were evident but where have they been? BT has, in effect, tried three different teams with at least as many formations and shown he can motivate nor coach any of them.

It's time for SL to admit he made a mistake, eat some humble pie and make a good managerial appointment for once but bear in mind that this is the man who wanted Fawthrop instead of Taylor and Moyes; who wanted Pulis instead of Taylor and Moyes; who appointed BT instead of advertising the post and interviewing more experienced and more worthy candidates; who feels that a new stand may arrest our current malaise; who uses crass and flippant replies such as 'it's only a badge'; and who will no doubt use words such as 'transition' and 'rebuilding' in the next few months.

The omens are not good.

[bucksred]

Yes we've had love flowing exciting football on offer all season..every game is a joy to watch....lods of goals, and cards, and.......and...........and.....

Fork it I'll get me coat

[Pete1975Legend]

Very much in agreement.  Tinnion inherited a team good enough to finish 3rd in a better division than this one and has turned it into a side that could well finish 14th.  That is regression - it's not even stagnation.  And if he turned a 3rd placed team into a mid-table team then could he then turn a mid-table team into a relegation threatened team?

He started the season off with one formation, then another, then another, then 3 in the same game, slagged the players off in public while all the while claiming that he was learning from his mistakes but no patent evidence of sustained improvement nor clear thinking from the management/coaching set-up.

Furthermore, he started the season with, in effect, DW's team but couldn't motivate them nor coach them into being a consistently effective team.  So bye, bye to Roberts, Woodman, Hill, Amankwaah, Butler, Miller, Gillespie, Goodfellow and very nearly Coles and Tommy.

Then, his own team (Brooker, Orr, Dinning, Smith, Heffernan, Ireland, Bell, Murray etc) could not be motivated nor coached into being a consistently effective team (with the exception of Brooker and the disgracefully under-used Heffernan).

And now, the youngsters are being thrown in willy-nilly, as a last act of desperation (for no-one can seriously blame 17 and 18 year olds for poor/nervous performances) and still they under-perform, are poorly motivated and are out-played by our supposed rivals.

This season would have been tolerated by many if signs of improvement, direction and planning were evident but where have they been?  BT has, in effect, tried three different teams with at least as many formations and shown he can motivate nor coach any of them.

It's time for SL to admit he made a mistake, eat some humble pie and make a good managerial appointment for once but bear in mind that this is the man who wanted Fawthrop instead of Taylor and Moyes; who wanted Pulis instead of Taylor and Moyes; who appointed BT instead of advertising the post and interviewing more experienced and more worthy candidates; who feels that a new stand may arrest our current malaise; who uses crass and flippant replies such as 'it's only a badge'; and who will no doubt use words such as 'transition' and 'rebuilding' in the next few months.

The omens are not good.

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And not forgetting a certain Aussie international from the DW team.

[richieb]

Very much in agreement.  Tinnion inherited a team good enough to finish 3rd in a better division than this one and has turned it into a side that could well finish 14th.  That is regression - it's not even stagnation.  And if he turned a 3rd placed team into a mid-table team then could he then turn a mid-table team into a relegation threatened team?

He started the season off with one formation, then another, then another, then 3 in the same game, slagged the players off in public while all the while claiming that he was learning from his mistakes but no patent evidence of sustained improvement nor clear thinking from the management/coaching set-up.

Furthermore, he started the season with, in effect, DW's team but couldn't motivate them nor coach them into being a consistently effective team.  So bye, bye to Roberts, Woodman, Hill, Amankwaah, Butler, Miller, Gillespie, Goodfellow and very nearly Coles and Tommy.

Then, his own team (Brooker, Orr, Dinning, Smith, Heffernan, Ireland, Bell, Murray etc) could not be motivated nor coached into being a consistently effective team (with the exception of Brooker and the disgracefully under-used Heffernan).

And now, the youngsters are being thrown in willy-nilly, as a last act of desperation (for no-one can seriously blame 17 and 18 year olds for poor/nervous performances) and still they under-perform, are poorly motivated and are out-played by our supposed rivals.

This season would have been tolerated by many if signs of improvement, direction and planning were evident but where have they been?  BT has, in effect, tried three different teams with at least as many formations and shown he can motivate nor coach any of them.

It's time for SL to admit he made a mistake, eat some humble pie and make a good managerial appointment for once but bear in mind that this is the man who wanted Fawthrop instead of Taylor and Moyes; who wanted Pulis instead of Taylor and Moyes; who appointed BT instead of advertising the post and interviewing more experienced and more worthy candidates; who feels that a new stand may arrest our current malaise; who uses crass and flippant replies such as 'it's only a badge'; and who will no doubt use words such as 'transition' and 'rebuilding' in the next few months.

The omens are not good.

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Top post again MAGILLA.

Its hard not to argue with these facts.

But it some fans still believe that the 'fans' are at fault for not getting behind the team & encouraging more - especially at home !!

We have been told that there are many positives to move forward with.

Cotterill, Lita & Brown - I think the list stopped there.

The next two games will show how far we have come.

[BCFC_Dan]

Wilson would have lost Brown, Carey and Hill whatever, and probably kept Peacock.

Based on his appalling record at finding decent players, I would suggest that we would have a weaker squad had Wilson stayed, rather than a stronger one. We would certainly have no Brooker, no Heffernan, no Scott Brown, and quite possibly no Leroy Lita either.

It is important to face the fact that Wilson could do no better than 3rd place in this league and that the squad he built was already starting to fall apart when he left.

Whether you think Tinnion has done well or not, it is important to remember that we would not necessarily be doing any better this season under Wilson. We'd definitely have spent more money though.

[PhatWill]

Wilson would have lost Brown, Carey and Hill whatever, and probably kept Peacock.

How do you know that?

Based on his appalling record at finding decent players, I would suggest that we would have a weaker squad had Wilson stayed, rather than a stronger one. We would certainly have no Brooker, no Heffernan, no Scott Brown, and quite possibly no Leroy Lita either.

How do you know that?

It is important to face the fact that Wilson could do no better than 3rd place in this league and that the squad he built was already starting to fall apart when he left.

Why was it falling apart?

Whether you think Tinnion has done well or not, it is important to remember that we would not necessarily be doing any better this season under Wilson. We'd definitely have spent more money though.

Again, how do you know that?

It's interesting how you've completely ignored the subject of the original post (have we progressed since last season?) and gone off on a tangent about Danny Wilson!

[Guest Slinky]

Top post again MAGILLA.

Its hard not to argue with these facts.

But it some fans still believe that the 'fans' are at fault for not getting behind the team & encouraging more - especially at home !!

We have been told that there are many positives to move forward with.

Cotterill, Lita & Brown - I think the list stopped there.

The next two games will show how far we have come.

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No, not top post, just a long post that is well written. It's full of flaws, but as they have been discussed so many times I won't bother covering old ground again.

There are some fans who still believe supporters play no part and can't grasp a basic concept like collective responsibility. Amazing isn't it.

There are even fans who claim to be supporters but who are threatening to take their bat and ball home because things haven't gone as well as hoped this season. Still, a herd becomes stronger when the weaker ones are picked off, so it's not all bad news.

[BCFC_Dan]

How do you know that?

How do you know that?

Why was it falling apart?

Again, how do you know that?

It's interesting how you've completely ignored the subject of the original post (have we progressed since last season?) and gone off on a tangent about Danny Wilson!

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I don't know anything. That's impossible. All I can do is make an educated guess based on history. I think what I have said is fair.

Hill, Brown and Carey all wanted to play in a higher division. They all said as much and they all left to do so. Peacock left because Tinnion didn't want him there. I think it's fair to say what I did.

Wilson's record at finding players was hopeless. Miller and Wilkshire were good signings but not the type of player he needed/wanted, and Butler was recommended to him by someone else. I cannot think of a single Wilson purchase that I would describe as a "bargain". I have no confidence at all that he'd have bought players good enough to replace those he lost.

I say the squad was falling apart because it was at its peak in the 02/03 season. A year later it was significantly worse and the trend was a downward one.

And the reason for going off on a tangent is to demonstrate that it is not as simple as saying "last year we finished 3rd, this year we're 8th so Tinnion is hopeless", which is what some people seem to be hinting at.

[atyeoboy17]

Does anyone think that we have made ANY progression under Tinnion? If you look at the playoff team/squad we had when we played Brighton I would argue that man for man we have gone backwards despite the huge (by this leagues standard) financial backing given to our esteemed management.

Goalkeeper - Stayed the same (No problems with that)

Defence - Another year older another year slower and no First ball center half, definately weaker this season by a long way.

Midfield - Another year older another year slower (Murray), Doherty is shot to pieces, Goodfellow don't know if he is coming or going, journeymen loan signings, lack of pace, lack of vision, lack of know how, I'm not saying we had all this last year(Far from it) but we are a million miles away in Midfield at the moment.

Attack - The only part of the team that has been improved, although they often have to feed on scrapes due to the dross behind them!

Management - Last season we had a manager and assistant

So Tinnion In my eyes you have dismantled a team that was very very close to promotion, slowed them down, played poo football and now we have the rewards!

Many thanks

Please go

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yes you can say ll that bit apparently there is some youngsters coming up next season that would show up the likes of dave cotteral and scott brown should be interesting cause we wont be keeping the likes of scott murray who had another crap game against bournemouth

[Guest WillsbridgeRed]

It's the clubs fault we don't have 20,000 turning up (even though we cant fit that many in)

It's not the fault of those that don't come along, its the clubs fault for not attracting them through the turnstiles.

[richieb]

I'm not so arrogant as to suppose I have the answers. You?

No, not collective responsibility from the fans. Collective responsibility from all those connected with the club (I assumed the word "collective" gave that away).

Just to reiterate for the umpteenth time, in the vain hope you get it. I am not saying mistakes aren't made by everyone at the club. They are human beings (some seem to forget that in their desire to spout vicious bile), so they happen. But a successful club is as reliant on its fans as anyone else connected with the club. They have a part to play in helping the club be a success (running away when it gets tough isn't one of those parts).

I'm sure you know the point I am making.

You think that fans staying away has no influence on big decisions made at the club? So, you are saying that if 20,000 turned up every week to support, that decisions about the quality of players we could bring in wouldn't be affected?

I get the feeling you want the club to fail just to give you some self-satisfaction. As I say, just a feeling I get from your posts.

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Assumptions

We all know that this club has failed for many seasons & just as we were getting that little closer,we go & blow it with an appt,that to date has failed to inspire.

As fans we all have a right to be concerned/happy we what we pay good money to see.

I for one won't ever walk away from this club & I don't think any fan who has made a view intends to.

Just because a fan decides not to renew a season ticket or begin to pick his games is far from a crime. It really reflects the concern that fans have with what has been seen this season.

I don't boo, I don't shout abuse at the management & don't attempt to tear up my season ticket in front of the Chairman.

I want to feel proud of the team that goes out on that pitch & feel as if we are making good progress in getting out of this division.

I gave BT time to make his mark & while it's still possible to get into play-offs,I for one am NOTinspired by what I have seen under his management.

Not just the performances, but his whole management style.

Now if this dosn't sit within your thoughts - then fine. But it dosn't make me any less a supporter

My Grandad bought me a £10 season ticket when the Dolman Stand first opened & I have been there ever since. (not everyday - in the same stand !!)

I have seen it all & the highs have gone with the low's.

There have been too many low's & I feel that the squad we had under DW was good enough to get out of this p0xy divsion this season.

I wanted the Managers job offered openly to see who was available to take us that final step.(BCFC is a big prize for up a mananger)

I didn't expect us to be struggling to even get into the play-off positions this season.

Yep,I am concerned at what I have seen & what has happened & no one (including you Slinky) has convinced me that sticking with BT is the answer.

We have seen the start of a Supporters Trust. Had this idea even got moving if we had an established Management team who were moving us forward?

[Guest Slinky]

Assumptions 

We all know that this club has failed for many seasons & just as we were getting that little closer,we go & blow it with an appt,that to date has failed to inspire.

As fans we all have a right to be concerned/happy we what we pay good money to see.

I for one won't ever walk away from this club & I don't think any fan who has made a view intends to.

Just because a fan decides not to renew a season ticket or begin to pick his games is far from a crime. It really reflects the concern that fans have with what has been seen this season.

I don't boo, I don't shout abuse at the management & don't attempt to tear up my season ticket in front of the Chairman.

I want to feel proud of the team that goes out on that pitch & feel as if we are making good progress in getting out of this division.

I gave BT time to make his mark & while it's still possible to get into play-offs,I for one am NOTinspired by what I have seen under his management.

Not just the performances, but his whole management style.

Now if this dosn't sit within your thoughts - then fine. But it dosn't make me any less a supporter

My Grandad bough me a £10 season ticket when the Dolman Stand first opened & I have been there ever since.

I have seen it all & the highs have gone with the low's.

There have been too many low's & I feel that the squad we had under DW was good enough to get out of this p0xy divsion this season.

I wanted the Managers job offered openly to see who was available to take us that final step.

I didn't expect us to be struggling to even get into the play-off positions this season.

Yep,I am concerned at what I have seen & what has happened & no one (including you Slinky) has convinced me that sticking with BT is the answer.

We have seen the start of a Supporters Trust. Had this idea even got moving if we had an established Management team who were moving us forward?

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It's a vicious circle. Fans don't come, so the money isn't there to make the set up stronger. The set up isn't as strong as we'd like so we don't walk to promotion and fans don't come.

You say you won't walk away, but you have also said you may not renew your season ticket. Ok, you don't consider it walking away (I don't see what else you can call it), but how will your actions benefit the club you have said on numerous occasions that we all want the best for?

[andy g]

It would have been interesting to see what would have happened if Wilson HAD stayed. (Although it was never going to be possible - after last seasons failure there would have been too much pressure on him from fans and chairman.)

I think we would have lost players too and we might not have seen the emergence of Lita or Brown.

BUT its not all about players !

Look at the squads which teams like Luton, Bournemouth and Hartlepool have ! They've just got good managers. And thats what we are sorely lacking this season. Whatever his faults I find it impossible to believe that Wilson would be doing as badly as we are. Because he did know how to organise a team.

You don't finish third twice by accident and in both campaigns we came very close to automatic promotion.

After Wilsons departure we desperately needed an experienced manager who could give us this 'progression'. And instead the job was given to a complete novice who has taken us back four years. Its all about getting a good manager.

Thats why we havent made any progression.

[richieb]

It's a vicious circle. Fans don't come, so the money isn't there to make the set up stronger. The set up isn't as strong as we'd like so we don't walk to promotion and fans don't come.

You say you won't walk away, but you have also said you may not renew your season ticket. Ok, you don't consider it walking away (I don't see what else you can call it), but how will your actions benefit the club you have said on numerous occasions that we all want the best for?

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I will pay as I go & that way I may pay that little bit more & thus keep putting in my funds.

Its a few weeks off yet & I will see what the club say to intice me to buy a season ticket.

Are you replacing your ticket & really looking forward to much of the same ?

Or just getting a ticket as the club could do with the money?

We have a potential season ticket base of 12/15000 But it needs something to entice those fans to part with good cash.

Facilities ? Good quality football ?

Well the club know what is needed, lets hope the message is the right one come the end of May.

BT has achieved one thing. And that is to get fans off their seats. But I don't think he mean't to walk out early.

[Guest Slinky]

I will pay as I go & that way I may pay that little bit more & thus keep putting in my funds.

Its a few weeks off yet & I will see what the club say to intice me to buy a season ticket.

Are you replacing your ticket & really looking forward to much of the same ?

Or just getting a ticket as the club could do with the money?

We have a potential season ticket base of 12/15000    But it needs something to entice those fans to part with good cash.

Facilities ? Good quality football ?

Well the club know what is needed, lets hope the message is the right one come the end of May.

BT has achieved one thing. And that is to get fans off their seats. But I don't think he mean't to walk out early.

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I'm replacing my season ticket because I support Bristol City. That's all the enticement I need.

You've described Bristol City as a "great club" on this forum on numerous occasions. What is great about it and if you consider it great, why wouldn't you continue to support it as you have done for so many years?

[richieb]

I'm replacing my season ticket because I support Bristol City. That's all the enticement I need.

You've described Bristol City as a "great club" on this forum on numerous occasions. What is great about it and if you consider it great, why wouldn't you continue to support it as you have done for so many years?

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I am supporting it & will continue to support it.

I need to lay out over £1000 each season for season tickets.

All I am saying is that this money might not being going into the club all at once.

I have many customers who have to part with cash to buy the products my company can supply them.

If the quality,quantity,service etc etc drops off, they ain't to happy to part with their hard earned cash.

We have to convince & entice them with good PR & QUALITY products to keep the relationship alive.