Weekend Nazis

[fka dagest]

In my opinion the documentary was crap. The BBC are obviously keen to to try and illustrate their dynamic journalistic credentials. It seemed to me that all this docu illustrated was David Irving and a few pissed blokes spouting anti-muslim crap in a dark tent. Hardly the "Night of Long Knives" was it?

If the BBC are really bothered with rising right wing sentiment why don't they pop long to the Daily Mail offices and ask why they frequently print anti-immigrants stories?

Any thoughts?

[bucksred]

In my opinion the documentary was crap. The BBC are obviously keen to to try and illustrate their dynamic journalistic credentials. It seemed to me that all this docu illustrated was David Irving and a few pissed blokes spouting anti-muslim crap in a dark tent. Hardly the "Night of Long Knives" was it?

If the BBC are really bothered with rising right wing sentiment why don't they pop long to the Daily Mail offices and ask why they frequently print anti-immigrants stories?

Any thoughts?

agreed Dagest. Also be worth going to some of the extremist hideyholes of every type of extremist, mosques, synagogues, churches, temples, party congresses, and not some half arsed and half baked events. Also as far as I know, it is your right to be an extremist, until you break the law. allegedly.

[OC 1645]

In my opinion the documentary was crap. The BBC are obviously keen to to try and illustrate their dynamic journalistic credentials. It seemed to me that all this docu illustrated was David Irving and a few pissed blokes spouting anti-muslim crap in a dark tent. Hardly the "Night of Long Knives" was it?

If the BBC are really bothered with rising right wing sentiment why don't they pop long to the Daily Mail offices and ask why they frequently print anti-immigrants stories?

Any thoughts?

The totally unaccountable Crown Prosecution Service lawyers are the totally corrupt NAZI legal filth of this country and yet the BBC are too shite scared to broadcast a documentary about this fact.

[Barrs Court Red]

I don't see why the British media are so obsessed with a far right movement that is so small and inconsequential that it might aswell not exist.

[OC 1645]

I don't see why the British media are so obsessed with a far right movement that is so small and inconsequential that it might aswell not exist.

It's not the far right that concerns me but the 'mainstream' Labour and Tory parties that concern me most - they rip us off at every opportunity and then tell us 'we've never had it so good'. :noexpression:

Balls to the Daily Mail, read "Toff with their heads" - the latest Class War Summer 2007 edition it even has a royal wedding sick bag and is free to download online at the link below - great stuff..... .......

http://www.classwaruk.org/

[fka dagest]

It's not the far right that concerns me but the 'mainstream' Labour and Tory parties that concern me most - they rip us off at every opportunity and then tell us 'we've never had it so good'. :noexpression:

Balls to the Daily Mail, read "Toff with their heads" - the latest Class War Summer 2007 edition it even has a royal wedding sick bag and is free to download online at the link below - great stuff..... .......

http://www.classwaruk.org/

I read that Ian Bone might be returning to Classwar. Have you read his Bio? Regardless of the politics it's very amusing read.

[OC 1645]

I read that Ian Bone might be returning to Classwar. Have you read his Bio? Regardless of the politics it's very amusing read.

That Classwar magazine is written by pretty wayward and free thinking individuals. A totally different perspective on British politics than that offered by mainstream politicians. Last I heard of Ian Bone was that he's living in a semi detached house on the outskirts of Bristol - can't remember where exactly.

[Barrs Court Red]

That Classwar magazine is written by pretty wayward and free thinking individuals. A totally different perspective on British politics than that offered by mainstream politicians. Last I heard of Ian Bone was that he's living in a semi detached house on the outskirts of Bristol - can't remember where exactly.

Where you put "free" thinking, surely you meant "far left" thinking.

It's interesting that they promote and threaten direct action, maybe the BBC could offload its left wing bias and "report" on this lot.

[OC 1645]

Where you put "free" thinking, surely you meant "far left" thinking.

It's interesting that they promote and threaten direct action, maybe the BBC could offload its left wing bias and "report" on this lot.

'Moomin Liberation Army' - does that mean 'liberating' the toffs and snobs that occupy every position of power in this country from legitimate dissent ???????!!!!!!!!!

There's nothing left wing about disliking Royalist toffs and snobs as even 'right wing' Adolf Hitler as well as 'left wing' Stalin were committed to ending the stranglehold the toffs and snobs had in their respective countries. Hitler, after the 1944 failed bomb plot against him, famously remarked that the plot would mean the end of the Prussian aristocracy and his SS were sent in to exterminate that aristocracy.

[Barrs Court Red]

'Moomin Liberation Army' - does that mean 'liberating' the toffs and snobs that occupy every position of power in this country from legitimate dissent ???????!!!!!!!!!

There's nothing left wing about disliking Royalist toffs and snobs as even 'right wing' Adolf Hitler as well as 'left wing' Stalin were committed to ending the stranglehold the toffs and snobs had in their respective countries. Hitler, after the 1944 failed bomb plot against him, famously remarked that the plot would mean the end of the Prussian aristocracy and his SS were sent in to exterminate that aristocracy.

Hitler courted German aristocracy, as well as our own during the 30's. He used to go fox hunting amongst other things. The Nazis attack on the bougios was linked to it's Jewish hatred, rather than class war.

The backbone of the Nazi general staff was Prussian. Fine military men who would follow orders. It was only later that the army was further Nazified. Unsuprisingly it is at that point a force unrivaled on land became hamstrung.

Indeed the German middle class did rather well form themselves, despite harsh labour laws.

Anyways, it would be interesting to see the demographics of "class war"and how they define "working class".

[Spud55]

Hitler courted German aristocracy, as well as our own during the 30's. He used to go fox hunting amongst other things. The Nazis attack on the bougios was linked to it's Jewish hatred, rather than class war.

The backbone of the Nazi general staff was Prussian. Fine military men who would follow orders. It was only later that the army was further Nazified. Unsuprisingly it is at that point a force unrivaled on land became hamstrung.

Indeed the German middle class did rather well form themselves, despite harsh labour laws.

Anyways, it would be interesting to see the demographics of "class war"and how they define "working class".

Exactly, Without the aristocracy (particularly the Prussian aristocracy) Hitler would have been buggered, almost all of his best field commanders, Von Manstein, Von Mantuffel, Guederian were Prussian aristocrats, and they were the ones that drove Germany forward Guederian and Mastein particularly were areguably his best, the fact that Guederian held Manstein in high regard is testament to this, he thought he was the best field marshal they had, and guederian was an egomaniac and thought he was the mutts nuts. Even when they did Nazify the army they still found some decent commanders, Model was a commited Nazi and Hitlers ideal general.

Even After the 1944 plot all that slowed the Soviet and Allied advance was the sheer military brilliance of the Prussian aristocracy, the fact that they managed to hold the Soviets until 1945 is testament to this, after Bagration had destroyed army group centre and for all intents and purposes destroyed the Wermacht bar the shouting people like manstein at all still managed to hold back what was arguably the best army in the world now the germans had had theirs all but wiped out.

Had it not been for Mansteins purussian stubornness Hitler would have been removed before the July plot took place, iirc, Rommel, Geuderian and others were all ready to turn round and have their Panzer armys roll into berlin and forcibly remove Hitler from power, all they were waiting for was the support of manstein who had the loyalty of pretty much the whole wermacht, to which manstein replied "Prussian generals do not commit Mutiny"

[OC 1645]

Even After the 1944 plot all that slowed the Soviet and Allied advance was the sheer military brilliance of the Prussian aristocracy, the fact that they managed to hold the Soviets until 1945 is testament to this, after Bagration had destroyed army group centre and for all intents and purposes destroyed the Wermacht bar the shouting people like manstein at all still managed to hold back what was arguably the best army in the world now the germans had had theirs all but wiped out.

German Army Group Centre collapsed because they didn't defend properly - Hitler blamed - maybe rightly - the Prussian aristocracy for that collapse as it was Prussian officers leading Army Group Centre. The German army were primarily specialists in Blitzkrieg attacks and not defence. The fighting elite of Germany were the Waffen SS divisions recruited from lower middle and working class German families whom the Prussian military aristocracy had little control over. Had Rommel not committed suicide for his involvement in the plot against Hitler then SS Gestapo Police would have executed his whole family.

Interesting also that Adolf Hitler himself was a member of a Communist type party immediately after world war one and that party was led by a prominent Jew. Hitler then helped set up the German Workers' Party later to become the NSDAP NAZI party. Exactly when and why the left wing type German Workers' Party later became the ultra right NSDAP NAZI party I'm not sure - intervention from German industrialists and financiers ???

[Barrs Court Red]

Hitler spied on them for the Army. While undertaken his mission he found himself to be sypathetic of the nationalist rhetoric and joined. The leaders of the party soon realised his talent for public speaking whch saw him rise through the ranks.

Wiemar Germany is such a murky subject. I have always wondered what would have happened if the communists had one the day, rather than the nationalists.

[bucksred]

'Moomin Liberation Army' - does that mean 'liberating' the toffs and snobs that occupy every position of power in this country from legitimate dissent ???????!!!!!!!!!

There's nothing left wing about disliking Royalist toffs and snobs as even 'right wing' Adolf Hitler as well as 'left wing' Stalin were committed to ending the stranglehold the toffs and snobs had in their respective countries. Hitler, after the 1944 failed bomb plot against him, famously remarked that the plot would mean the end of the Prussian aristocracy and his SS were sent in to exterminate that aristocracy.

Hitler used the Prussian junkers like he used everybody else in the Reich. Several Prussians were Nazis, Von Reichenau (responsible for the Nazi pledge of allegiance for the Wehrmacht), Von Dem Bach Zalewski (The destroyer of the Warsaw Ghetto, and Warsaw Uprising), Count Von Puchler (Eisatzkommando commander-mass murder squads in Russia), Goering (Luftwaffe chief) ,his successor Von Griem, Hausser father of the Waffen SS, Paulus the 6th Army commander, for example. One Prussian baron Von Sayn von Wittgenstein was a top Nazi, another one in the same family, his cousin, a top Nachtjagdfleiger (Night fighter ace) was an anti Nazi.

Whiles its true the junkers were heavily represented in the anti Nazi resistance, it was far from only them. they, and the military elite were fully aware of the impending disaster in Russia-and being indecisive cost them and Germany extremely dearly. The Scholls the Kreisenau Circle, and the church were all anti Nazi, and were composed of the whole spectrum of german society, bar the Reds. they had their own resistance movements.

The proleteriat were heavily Nazi, Dietrich, Model, Schoerner, Steiner, Kesselring, Lohr, Rendulic, Eicke, Muller, Himmler, Goebbels, Julius Streicher, Albert Speer, Eichmann, Skorzeny, Hans Rudel & Ribbentrop ( He bought his von title when he got married).

Austrians and S Germans were also disproportinatley represented there too, whereas Prussians, Saxons, and other N Germans were not there in such numbers. The north of Germany, including Prussia had, indeed still has significant links to the UK, the south does not.

[OC 1645]

Hitler used the Prussian junkers like he used everybody else in the Reich. Several Prussians were Nazis, Von Reichenau (responsible for the Nazi pledge of allegiance for the Wehrmacht), Von Dem Bach Zalewski (The destroyer of the Warsaw Ghetto, and Warsaw Uprising), Count Von Puchler (Eisatzkommando commander-mass murder squads in Russia), Goering (Luftwaffe chief) ,his successor Von Griem, Hausser father of the Waffen SS, Paulus the 6th Army commander, for example. One Prussian baron Von Sayn von Wittgenstein was a top Nazi, another one in the same family, his cousin, a top Nachtjagdfleiger (Night fighter ace) was an anti Nazi.

Whiles its true the junkers were heavily represented in the anti Nazi resistance, it was far from only them. they, and the military elite were fully aware of the impending disaster in Russia-and being indecisive cost them and Germany extremely dearly. The Scholls the Kreisenau Circle, and the church were all anti Nazi, and were composed of the whole spectrum of german society, bar the Reds. they had their own resistance movements.

The proleteriat were heavily Nazi, Dietrich, Model, Schoerner, Steiner, Kesselring, Lohr, Rendulic, Eicke, Muller, Himmler, Goebbels, Julius Streicher, Albert Speer, Eichmann, Skorzeny, Hans Rudel & Ribbentrop ( He bought his von title when he got married).

Austrians and S Germans were also disproportinatley represented there too, whereas Prussians, Saxons, and other N Germans were not there in such numbers. The north of Germany, including Prussia had, indeed still has significant links to the UK, the south does not.

Top marks (excuse the pun) for bucksred - an excellent analysis of the leading figures during Hitler's Reich.

My dear old Grandfather used to remark - "Hitler did a great job for Germany" - what he meant was that Hitler brought total ruin to Germany. My Grandfather hated Germans with a passion for them bombing Bristol and for WWI that saw his Uncles perish on the Western Front.

[Eddie Hitler]

Back to the topic it actually looked quite fun. Running around firing guns in a wood in summer and then getting pissed in the beer tent in the evning. The BBC were looking for something that wasn't there.

My 'umble theory as to why people prefer to be nazi soldiers than allied is the post war tv and films on the subject.

Think British soldiers you think Dad's Army or Spike Milligan. Bumbling, ineffectual.

Germans are always portrayed as ruthless military machines.

Hmmm.. wonder why people pick the Germans?

It's different for other eras - Zulu and Sharpe show British soldiers being heroic. The British war effort in WWII seems to have been hijacked by comedians.

[fka dagest]

Back to the topic it actually looked quite fun. Running around firing guns in a wood in summer and then getting pissed in the beer tent in the evning. The BBC were looking for something that wasn't there.

My 'umble theory as to why people prefer to be nazi soldiers than allied is the post war tv and films on the subject.

Think British soldiers you think Dad's Army or Spike Milligan. Bumbling, ineffectual.

Germans are always portrayed as ruthless military machines.

Hmmm.. wonder why people pick the Germans?

It's different for other eras - Zulu and Sharpe show British soldiers being heroic. The British war effort in WWII seems to have been hijacked by comedians.

I was amazed when the reporter was asking where all the references to the Holocaust were. What was he expecting - people acting as emaciated naked corpses lying on top of each other?

I honestly think it just comes down to the uniform- the Nazis wore snazzier uniforms and even their helmets looked better.

[OC 1645]

Germans are always portrayed as ruthless military machines.

Hmmm.. wonder why people pick the Germans?

The historical truth is that the 'mighty' German military were smashed by the Soviet Red Army, the German populace in their cities and their war factories were bombed into the stone age by the British and Americans. The ruthless German war machine was smashed to pieces under that onslaught.

The Red Army keeping the Red Flag flying high !!!!! Over the ruins of Berlin......

I bet those terrified looking NAZI Germans wished they hadn't bombed Bristol and Ashton Gate ......

[Eddie Hitler]

The historical truth is that the 'mighty' German military were smashed by the Soviet Red Army, the German populace in their cities and their war factories were bombed into the stone age by the British and Americans. The ruthless German war machine was smashed to pieces under that onslaught.

The Red Army keeping the Red Flag flying high !!!!! Over the ruins of Berlin......

I bet those terrified looking NAZI Germans wished they hadn't bombed Bristol and Ashton Gate ......

Yes, but the historical truth is not the Hollywood truth.

Name a British WWII unit you genuinely look up to. I can't. Though there were lots of brave Brits fighting and dying for their country. TV & Film Producers are (sadly) writing history.

[OC 1645]

Yes, but the historical truth is not the Hollywood truth.

Name a British WWII unit you genuinely look up to. I can't. Though there were lots of brave Brits fighting and dying for their country. TV & Film Producers are (sadly) writing history.

I looked up to my Grandfather and he served in the Royalist Air Force. They bombed the crap out of the Third Reich and lost about 50,000 men in the process. Thankfully, my Grandfather survived to tell the tales. I wish he was alive now to help me answer your question.

[kevinmabbuttshair]

Yes, but the historical truth is not the Hollywood truth.

Name a British WWII unit you genuinely look up to. I can't. Though there were lots of brave Brits fighting and dying for their country. TV & Film Producers are (sadly) writing history.

How about the 7th armoured division or the crews of the X craft midget submarines that attacked the Tirpiz in Norway and anyone who fought and was captured the Japanesse just to name 3. Not to mention the numerous commando raids on Norway and the Channel Islands

[Barrs Court Red]

As stated, the 7th Armour (Desert Rats)

The Chindits.

[bucksred]

The historical truth is that the 'mighty' German military were smashed by the Soviet Red Army, the German populace in their cities and their war factories were bombed into the stone age by the British and Americans. The ruthless German war machine was smashed to pieces under that onslaught.

The Red Army keeping the Red Flag flying high !!!!! Over the ruins of Berlin......

I bet those terrified looking NAZI Germans wished they hadn't bombed Bristol and Ashton Gate ......

Thats what happens when you pick a war with the three world superpowers of the day. Ordinary Germans knew they lost the war the minute they invaded Russia, and Adolf declared war on the US. by then three separate plots to kill Hitler, two by the junkers and Army, and one by the reds, had been foiled. They knew what would happen to their country. Sadly they failed and 55 million people died as a result.

My dad n mum HATED the Nazis, but not ordinary Germans. My dad was sunk three times during WW2, in the Royal Navy, and my mum left Brizz the day it was blitzed, to work in London during their blitz

[OC 1645]

My dad n mum HATED the Nazis, but not ordinary Germans. My dad was sunk three times during WW2, in the Royal Navy, and my mum left Brizz the day it was blitzed, to work in London during their blitz

It was the ordinary Germans during the war that were the NAZIs. Half the Germans alive today were not around during the war but that didn't stop a German coming over to me while I was on holiday in Tunisia a few years back and stating in perfect English "the next war we win !!!!!!". In reply, I should have given him the picture postcard below showing the flags of just some of the countries that stood against Germany in WWII.

One of Stalin's shock troops hoists The Soviet Red Flag over the ruins of Hitler's Berlin......

[bucksred]

It was the ordinary Germans during the war that were the NAZIs. Half the Germans alive today were not around during the war but that didn't stop a German coming over to me while I was on holiday in Tunisia a few years back and stating in perfect English "the next war we win !!!!!!". In reply, I should have given him the picture postcard below showing the flags of just some of the countries that stood against Germany in WWII.

One of Stalin's shock troops hoists The Soviet Red Flag over the ruins of Hitler's Berlin......

not really fair Gobbers, but they were on the losing side. I know a few that were sure as hell not Nazis, but they loved their country, right or wrong.

Do like the poster though, top one! Where did ya get that one?