Its Now September 11th

[bristolcityup]

Question this if you like but for me the most memorable event for me in my life was watching the tragic events of 9/11 happen in 2001 on TV. Whilst we were watching it on TV many of still think that day was just something that happend only on the tv and many of us still don't beleive it even happend but it did..Visit Ground Zero if you ever get the chance because thats when it hits you that 9/11 did happen and changed the world forever. Thousends of people lost here lifes, many firefighters, policeman, office workers and innocent people on the ground were taken from us that day. People jumped from windows knowing there lifes were to be over in seconds, many phoned there families from the offices in the Twin Towers and even the people on the hijacked planes phoned there loved ones to say they were not coming home.

R.I.P to all those who lost there lifes and my thoughts are with the many families who lost loved ones that day in the Twin Towers, Pentagon and Pensavallia.

[giles_23_bcfc]

Question this if you like but for me the most memorable event for me in my life was watching the tragic events of 9/11 happen in 2001 on TV. Whilst we were watching it on TV many of still think that day was just something that happend only on the tv and many of us still don't beleive it even happend but it did..Visit Ground Zero if you ever get the chance because thats when it hits you that 9/11 did happen and changed the world forever. Thousends of people lost here lifes, many firefighters, policeman, office workers and innocent people on the ground were taken from us that day. People jumped from windows knowing there lifes were to be over in seconds, many phoned there families from the offices in the Twin Towers and even the people on the hijacked planes phoned there loved ones to say they were not coming home.

R.I.P to all those who lost there lifes and my thoughts are with the many families who lost loved ones that day in the Twin Towers, Pentagon and Pensavallia.

Here here. Great post. R.I.P to all who sadly lost their lives 6 years ago today and sincerest condolences to the families of those who lost their lives on this very tragic date that will live through many generations throughout the annels of time.

[fka dagest]

Whereas, I feel sorry for all innocent victims of terror, atrocities, govt. bombing etc, I do get a p'd off with the continual waffling about 9/11. I can't help but think this date is routinely churned out as propaganda for the US govt to justify their own nasty little actions. "Terrorism" has existed for much longer than the US would have us believe. Does anyone have an estimate of how many innocent Afghanis or Iraqis have died in the last 5 years? Should we establish some sort of memorial date for them?

[Barrs Court Red]

Whereas, I feel sorry for all innocent victims of terror, atrocities, govt. bombing etc, I do get a p'd off with the continual waffling about 9/11. I can't help but think this date is routinely churned out as propaganda for the US govt to justify their own nasty little actions. "Terrorism" has existed for much longer than the US would have us believe. Does anyone have an estimate of how many innocent Afghanis or Iraqis have died in the last 5 years? Should we establish some sort of memorial date for them?

I agree. I dount the yanks gave 2 shits about the Manchester bombing, infact the US was a major source of IRA funding.

What goes around comes around.

[kevinmabbuttshair]

I agree. I dount the yanks gave 2 shits about the Manchester bombing, infact the US was a major source of IRA funding.

What goes around comes around.

Controversial to say the least. I do believe it was the single greatest loss of British lives in one incident since World War II. Tough to take every year I should imagine.

[bristolcityup]

This is something that really annoys me, terrorists are out kill innocent people all over the world, terrorist netowrks are out there at the moment, probably planning more attacks to kill.. The terrotist networks and training programmes are coming from Iraq and Afganatstain, thats been proven, that is why we are at war in these countries.. British, American troops were sent there to restore peace, but when the tropps arrived soldiers and suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanastain decided to start taking a pop at our troops, that is why so many soldiers have lost there lifes in iraq..

In any war innocent people loose there lifes, but if its a choice of remebering the innconcent people who were MURDERED from 9/11 and 7/7 who lost there lifes and the lifes of those who died trying to attack our troops then I know which ones I will remember.

To all the less inteligent people out there who just slag Bush and Blair off for the fun off it without knowing the facts there are people out there who want to murder us on busses, trains and by any sick means, and if it means troops in iraq and Afganastain in anyway trying to protect our country then I'm happy that Blair sent in the troops.

On the last note to everyone that slagged off Bush for sending in the troops so soon after 9/11 put your self his there position, 3 planes fly into a building and 1 crahes, thousends of Americas innocent people die, its know that the person behind all of this is Bin Laden and he is in Afgahnastan.. Number 1 i'd be very pissed off and number 2 i'd get all my tropps together and go and bomb the hell out of Afgahnastan..If Bush would have sat back and done nothing what would have the reaction been from the Americans? Anger comes to mind.

People don't realise that terrorists exsist and wish to kill people so thats why I hate all these anti war people who don't have a clue and may aswell go around with t-shirts saying WE LOVE TERRORISTS THEY ARE NICE PEOPLE.

[Barrs Court Red]

This is something that really annoys me, terrorists are out kill innocent people all over the world, terrorist netowrks are out there at the moment, probably planning more attacks to kill.. The terrotist networks and training programmes are coming from Iraq and Afganatstain, thats been proven, that is why we are at war in these countries.. British, American troops were sent there to restore peace, but when the tropps arrived soldiers and suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanastain decided to start taking a pop at our troops, that is why so many soldiers have lost there lifes in iraq..

I don't think that's exactly how it was I'm afraid.

In any war innocent people loose there lifes, but if its a choice of remebering the innconcent people who were MURDERED from 9/11 and 7/7 who lost there lifes and the lifes of those who died trying to attack our troops then I know which ones I will remember.

Ever heard of Congo, Sierra Leon or Rwanda? Thought not.

To all the less inteligent people out there who just slag Bush and Blair off for the fun off it without knowing the facts there are people out there who want to murder us on busses, trains and by any sick means, and if it means troops in iraq and Afganastain in anyway trying to protect our country then I'm happy that Blair sent in the troops.

Talking of knowing the facts..

On the last note to everyone that slagged off Bush for sending in the troops so soon after 9/11 put your self his there position, 3 planes fly into a building and 1 crahes, thousends of Americas innocent people die, its know that the person behind all of this is Bin Laden and he is in Afgahnastan.. Number 1 i'd be very pissed off and number 2 i'd get all my tropps together and go and bomb the hell out of Afgahnastan..If Bush would have sat back and done nothing what would have the reaction been from the Americans? Anger comes to mind.The thing is, they then going invade another country using lies to justify the invasion. Don't get me wrong, Saddam needed to be toppled but the invasion lost all credibility around the world.

People don't realise that terrorists exsist and wish to kill people so thats why I hate all these anti war people who don't have a clue and may aswell go around with t-shirts saying WE LOVE TERRORISTS THEY ARE NICE PEOPLE.I think anyone born pre 1985 probably has a fair recollection.

[One Team In Keynsham]

It is impossible to argue that 11/9/01 was not a key moment in history: all of a sudden it was deemed acceptable, it not appropriate, to use the US mm/dd date format over our standard dd/mm.

Having been a frequent visitor to NYC for the past 10 years or so, the funny thing is that the skyline actually looks better without the Twin Towers: I noticed this on my first flight in after the event and commented the same to a friend of mine who works down in Wall Street: his reaction was "you can't say that, you'll get lynched".

Much as I don't agree with the use of the the event as an excuse for a multitude of actions since, most notably supporting the spurious invasion of Iraq once an alledged link between Saddam and Al-Qaeda was announced, and the fact there have been events since that have resulted in way more casualties that are not given the same status (such as the hundreds of thousands dead in Darfur) I don't think you can glibly state "What goes around comes around" and so justify a multitude of innocents dying as just desserts.

[Barrs Court Red]

Controversial to say the least. I do believe it was the single greatest loss of British lives in one incident since World War II. Tough to take every year I should imagine.

Ah, can see how that comment looked. Don't get me wrong, no one wants to see that type of thing happen.

Ever since the London tube bombings I've had the hump about this whole sorry mess. "Britains 9/11" they said. How ###### patronising.

[Barrs Court Red]

I don't think you can glibly state "What goes around comes around" and so justify a multitude of innocents dying as just desserts.

Very true, as said just before your post I didn't mean it like that that.

You only need to look at who was involved, that is the context I was trying to get.

[One Team In Keynsham]

This is something that really annoys me, terrorists are out kill innocent people all over the world, terrorist netowrks are out there at the moment, probably planning more attacks to kill.. The terrotist networks and training programmes are coming from Iraq and Afganatstain, thats been proven, that is why we are at war in these countries.. British, American troops were sent there to restore peace, but when the tropps arrived soldiers and suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanastain decided to start taking a pop at our troops, that is why so many soldiers have lost there lifes in iraq..

In any war innocent people loose there lifes, but if its a choice of remebering the innconcent people who were MURDERED from 9/11 and 7/7 who lost there lifes and the lifes of those who died trying to attack our troops then I know which ones I will remember.

To all the less inteligent people out there who just slag Bush and Blair off for the fun off it without knowing the facts there are people out there who want to murder us on busses, trains and by any sick means, and if it means troops in iraq and Afganastain in anyway trying to protect our country then I'm happy that Blair sent in the troops.

On the last note to everyone that slagged off Bush for sending in the troops so soon after 9/11 put your self his there position, 3 planes fly into a building and 1 crahes, thousends of Americas innocent people die, its know that the person behind all of this is Bin Laden and he is in Afgahnastan.. Number 1 i'd be very pissed off and number 2 i'd get all my tropps together and go and bomb the hell out of Afgahnastan..If Bush would have sat back and done nothing what would have the reaction been from the Americans? Anger comes to mind.

People don't realise that terrorists exsist and wish to kill people so thats why I hate all these anti war people who don't have a clue and may aswell go around with t-shirts saying WE LOVE TERRORISTS THEY ARE NICE PEOPLE.

Military intervention in Taleban-controlled Afghanistan, the suspected location of Osama Bin Laden, is one thing. Fabricating evidence to justify actions to topple a regime you don't like is another.

Saddam was clearly a pretty nasty piece of work, and his regime was none too nice either. However, that is not a valid reason for the invasion. Saudi Arabia and China are pretty nasty regimes as well on the human rights front, but do you hear of the US planning invasions? No, because, amongst other reasons, the fomer nation has oil and the latter has the nuclear-equipped PLA who would probably put up a rather tasty fight (plus a host of economic and other reasons).

I would have rather more respect if Dubya had simply come out and announced something along the lines of "Saddam, I don't like you, you screwed over my dad, and there is a shed-load of oil interests in the region that are very strategic to the US, and are also a great source of revenue for my former business associates, and as such we are coming in to sort you out". Whislt I still wouldn't have agreed with the actions, at least I would have appreciated the reasons for it.

[fka dagest]

This is something that really annoys me, terrorists are out kill innocent people all over the world, terrorist netowrks are out there at the moment, probably planning more attacks to kill.. The terrotist networks and training programmes are coming from Iraq and Afganatstain, thats been proven, that is why we are at war in these countries.. British, American troops were sent there to restore peace, but when the tropps arrived soldiers and suicide bombers in Iraq and Afghanastain decided to start taking a pop at our troops, that is why so many soldiers have lost there lifes in iraq..

In any war innocent people loose there lifes, but if its a choice of remebering the innconcent people who were MURDERED from 9/11 and 7/7 who lost there lifes and the lifes of those who died trying to attack our troops then I know which ones I will remember.

To all the less inteligent people out there who just slag Bush and Blair off for the fun off it without knowing the facts there are people out there who want to murder us on busses, trains and by any sick means, and if it means troops in iraq and Afganastain in anyway trying to protect our country then I'm happy that Blair sent in the troops.

On the last note to everyone that slagged off Bush for sending in the troops so soon after 9/11 put your self his there position, 3 planes fly into a building and 1 crahes, thousends of Americas innocent people die, its know that the person behind all of this is Bin Laden and he is in Afgahnastan.. Number 1 i'd be very pissed off and number 2 i'd get all my tropps together and go and bomb the hell out of Afgahnastan..If Bush would have sat back and done nothing what would have the reaction been from the Americans? Anger comes to mind.

People don't realise that terrorists exsist and wish to kill people so thats why I hate all these anti war people who don't have a clue and may aswell go around with t-shirts saying WE LOVE TERRORISTS THEY ARE NICE PEOPLE.

What a pompous and arrogant post. It's probably worth remembering that the history of Islamic terrorism in this country begins post-Afghanistan and post-Iraq. There's a certain irony in your slagging off "less intelligent" people when you can't even spell the word. Don't you feel it's a fine line between losing your life from a "terrorist" bomb and govt bomb. Isn't the only difference a badge of authority and standard uniform? It's sad that at the beginning of this post you bleat on about the 9/11 dead, but in the last post you advocate bombing the hell out of Afghanistan. Have you considered that most people in Afghanistan are innocent people just trying to survive from day to day? How do you think they feel when they lose a loved one? Do you imagine they think, oh well it's Operation Enduring Freedom or do you think they imagine that the US/UK might be the terrorists?

[Collis]

Whereas, I feel sorry for all innocent victims of terror, atrocities, govt. bombing etc, I do get a p'd off with the continual waffling about 9/11. I can't help but think this date is routinely churned out as propaganda for the US govt to justify their own nasty little actions. "Terrorism" has existed for much longer than the US would have us believe. Does anyone have an estimate of how many innocent Afghanis or Iraqis have died in the last 5 years? Should we establish some sort of memorial date for them?

IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MIN): 71,259

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS (IRAQ): 3,774

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN AFGHAN: 78

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN IRAQ: 169

And for what?

[rayer]

"And for what?"

Oil, its all comes down to cash and power

[Barrs Court Red]

IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MIN): 71,259

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS (IRAQ): 3,774

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN AFGHAN: 78

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN IRAQ: 169

And for what?

Depends if we stay to finish the job. Perhaps in Iraq it is too late. Since the Golden Dome bombing I think Sunni and Shias are too far gone to bring back together, at least in the short term. So we remove one despot, to see the country either full under a repressive Islamic leadership. A backward step imo.

In Afghanistan if we bring stability and modern values to the country it would at least give one favourable end result, although with the Taliban ranks being filled with militant and seemingly numberless Pakistanis I just can't see us winning that war of attrition either.

[Collis]

Depends if we stay to finish the job. Perhaps in Iraq it is too late. Since the Golden Dome bombing I think Sunni and Shias are too far gone to bring back together, at least in the short term. So we remove one despot, to see the country either full under a repressive Islamic leadership. A backward step imo.

In Afghanistan if we bring stability and modern values to the country it would at least give one favourable end result, although with the Taliban ranks being filled with militant and seemingly numberless Pakistanis I just can't see us winning that war of attrition either.

I can't see any light at the end of the tunnel at the moment and even if it is resolved I expect to see those figures doubled at the very least.

I expect to see Bush impeached eventually.

[bristolcityup]

IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MIN): 71,259

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS (IRAQ): 3,774

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN AFGHAN: 78

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN IRAQ: 169

And whos fault is this? Did Blair or Bush fly those plays into those towers to start all of this? I think not. Terrorist started this war and now thaey have to pay the price for loosing 71,259 of there people. the 3,774 is because most of the AMericans are on the front line and there are many more american tropps out here that Brittish. 78 soldiers killed in Afghan and 169 in iraq, most of them killed by suiside bomers, aimed at takns and innocnet people, a few accidental plane crashes ect..Most of the soldiers that have died have died heroes being targeted at and murdered for trying to keep the peace..I live in England, I love England, Someone needs to be protecting England and standing up to the evil in the world who are prepared to kill us.Wake up people, if we were not seen to be doing anything the terrorists would be celebrating victory right now.

[scootered]

I take it you're in the services then?

[One Team In Keynsham]

IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MIN): 71,259

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS (IRAQ): 3,774

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN AFGHAN: 78

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN IRAQ: 169

And whos fault is this? Did Blair or Bush fly those plays into those towers to start all of this? I think not. Terrorist started this war and now thaey have to pay the price for loosing 71,259 of there people. the 3,774 is because most of the AMericans are on the front line and there are many more american tropps out here that Brittish. 78 soldiers killed in Afghan and 169 in iraq, most of them killed by suiside bomers, aimed at takns and innocnet people, a few accidental plane crashes ect..Most of the soldiers that have died have died heroes being targeted at and murdered for trying to keep the peace..I live in England, I love England, Someone needs to be protecting England and standing up to the evil in the world who are prepared to kill us.Wake up people, if we were not seen to be doing anything the terrorists would be celebrating victory right now.

Terrorists planned and executed the 2001 attacks on the US, and the US military started action against them in Afghanistan. Please explain the link between this and the decision of the US to invade Iraq, take out Saddam and his regime.

And be honest, if another nation invaded England without good reason, would you show your love of England by fighting the invading army, or would you simply accept it because of the acts of terrorists in another part of the world?

[Redhyde]

And be honest, if another nation invaded England without good reason, would you show your love of England by fighting the invading army, or would you simply accept it because of the acts of terrorists in another part of the world?

If my government was responsible for the deaths of 1000000 of my own people over 20 years, my family my friends, if my sister had been raped, and my brother executed for dissenting, if my child was starving to death for a previous war because my government chose to build palaces instead of giving me food then i wouldn't love my country very much. I'd be glad someone would come in and try to stop that. Then i'd be shocked and stunned that my fellow countrymen would carry on the fight and try to kill me once again for having a different belief to them. I'd want a chance to air my views and feel safe, I'd want democracy, I'd want peace.

The mistake we made was to believe that the Iraqi's themselves would want peace and democracy, we took them to be like us, they're not.

[bristolcityup]

The decision to go into Iraq and take out Saddam was a good one..Since his death people now have more freedom and a new government. Saddam Husseins regime saw thousends of innocnet iraqis tortured and murdered and he got what he deserved when he was hanged. There is now a minority of people in Iraq who were under Saddams regiem who are hell bent on suicide bombings and killing u.s and Uk troops, even beheading foreighn journalists. Those are the people we need to deal with. Alqidia groups remain in Iraq and Afgahnastain so thats why we need to stay out there and fight these evil people.

[chowie]

If you have a spare couple of hours this movie (many may have seen it) is "interesting" not saying it's true, believe everyone can have there own views on that. I found the Part I about religion the most interesting..

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

[One Team In Keynsham]

The decision to go into Iraq and take out Saddam was a good one..Since his death people now have more freedom and a new government. Saddam Husseins regime saw thousends of innocnet iraqis tortured and murdered and he got what he deserved when he was hanged. There is now a minority of people in Iraq who were under Saddams regiem who are hell bent on suicide bombings and killing u.s and Uk troops, even beheading foreighn journalists. Those are the people we need to deal with. Alqidia groups remain in Iraq and Afgahnastain so thats why we need to stay out there and fight these evil people.

Very few people are going to dispute that the removal from power of any tyrannical despot is not a good thing. However, that is not the point.

Your comment was this: "And whos fault is this? Did Blair or Bush fly those plays into those towers to start all of this? I think not. Terrorist started this war and now thaey have to pay the price for loosing 71,259 of there people"

I asked you to explain the link between the Al-Qaida attacks on the US and the requirement to invade Iraq, remove Saddam, and start a conflict that has now resulted in the death of >70,000 Iraqis, and more Americans than actually died in Al-Qaida's actions in 2001.

[bristolcityup]

I asked you to explain the link between the Al-Qaida attacks on the US and the requirement to invade Iraq, remove Saddam, and start a conflict that has now resulted in the death of >70,000 Iraqis, and more Americans than actually died in Al-Qaida's actions in 2001.

Why do we need an explanaition..Bush always wanted to take out Saddam he never made that a secret..It wasnt just one reason why Bush went to iraq there was a few, i.e Weapons of mass destruction (ok they were never found but there was no harm in looking), to end Saddams regieme, to find terror cells.. I don't know people keep bringing this up, the whole why did us and America go to Iraq.. Iraq is a country with dangerous people in, dangerous people who pose a threat to the world. Thats who we are fighting, thats why Bush and Blair sent in our troops.

Heres the link breifly outlined.. Terrorists are trained up in terror camps which have been proven to be in Iraq (and Afghan but we'l stick to iraq for noe). Osama Bin laden, Saddam Hussiehn had clear links to terror networks. on Sept 11 islamic extremeists flew 2 planes into major buildings in the USA, into the Pentagon and nearly into Washington. There were TERRORIST attacks. After Afgahnistan was hit and invaded Bush decided to invade iraq to root out the Saddam Regieme, root out the terrorist networks and to keep peace betweeen different iraqi regiemes.

[greenun]

Heres the link breifly outlined.. Terrorists are trained up in terror camps which have been proven to be in Iraq (and Afghan but we'l stick to iraq for noe). Osama Bin laden, Saddam Hussiehn had clear links to terror networks. on Sept 11 islamic extremeists flew 2 planes into major buildings in the USA, into the Pentagon and nearly into Washington. There were TERRORIST attacks. After Afgahnistan was hit and invaded Bush decided to invade iraq to root out the Saddam Regieme, root out the terrorist networks and to keep peace betweeen different iraqi regiemes.

Of course, it's extremely comforting to know how competent the US Government are at managing Iraq.

[bucksred]

IRAQI CIVILIAN DEATHS (MIN): 71,259

U.S. MILITARY DEATHS (IRAQ): 3,774

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN AFGHAN: 78

BRITISH SOLDIERS KILLED IN IRAQ: 169

And for what?

and the alternative is?

More 9/11's more 7/7's more bigotry, more hatred. Simple. These Taleban and Al Queda lunatics don't give a fk about the casualties they cause. look at Iraq, and the suicide bombers in Pakistan and Afghanistan. they preach and practice a genocidal medieval form of a religion which does not pracice the hatreds among many many of its followers. Those that don't are as much a target as us Christians, Jews, and Hindus. 55 million people died in WW2 dealing with the evils of Nazism, fascism, and Japanese imperialism. millions more died in the clash of civilizations during the Cold War. Probably millions have died in this war too.

You cannot and should not appease aggression in any shape or form. The Amis have fkd up in many many ways, but it don't make their cause wrong. what would you do if you lost your husband, wife, son, daughter or best friend in the murderous attack on the WTC (Civilians yet again). Tell ya what, if twas me, I'd want to kick their ass so hard, they wouldnt want to try it again.

Gutless politicians like Schroeder, the Vietnam war protester, but not Prague 68, and Chirac, the dilletante, have given these scum the incentive to push it had.

The price of freedom is eternal vigilance. thats the way it is.