Id Cards For Away Travel!

[Rob k]

Tell that to those that under police escort on Saturday didn't get to the ground until 3.30pm and were initially refused entry even though they had tickets.

Alternatively stay blinkered to the problem and delude yourself it will just go away.

Thats nothing about having ID, there were no problems sat yet there was still a massive police escort - what difference would ID cards have made? The police were a pain and nothing will change that, If i was a holligan then all i would do was buy an ID card to get tickets and leave it at home on the day of the game along with all other id - how many people were arrested on sat or at palace??? as ive said what would the point in ID cards be?

[Milo]

[Barrs Court Red]

It hasn't stopped Stokes boys traveling! Their youngsters turned up at our place this season! Already we're talking about a £10 fee, something else that was a perk of season ticket holders to be taken away.

Add to the fact that there would be "police checks". Do we really want the police to have easy access to a database of traveling fans? We're already seen how they can abuse their powers at Walsall.

The whole ID card scheme seems yet another way of sanitising supporters.

[Always Believesham]

Last season v Swansea was the first coach only trip I'd been on in a while.

I was surprised how well run it was to be honest.

My experience was on the contrary.... a bad example i guess but millwall...i personally looked forward to the game all season and from about october really hoped it would be the game we went up...it was all going well, until we passed reading....

the rest they say is history

(whichg i should be doing now)

[CiderJar]

Thats nothing about having ID, there were no problems sat yet there was still a massive police escort - what difference would ID cards have made? The police were a pain and nothing will change that, If i was a holligan then all i would do was buy an ID card to get tickets and leave it at home on the day of the game along with all other id - how many people were arrested on sat or at palace??? as ive said what would the point in ID cards be?

Your points are clearly thought out and well made. I'm not disputing anything you say. What I am asking for is a suggested solution. You intimated that the problem was only a small one ("Keep things as it is which 95% of the time are fine.") I'm suggesting that the experience of away matches at Wolves, Crystal Palace and QPR suggests otherwise. 3 out of 15 matches suggests 20% of matches have an element of serious trouble whether caused by our own fans or the police.

If ID cards aren't the solution why not suggest a better one? Doing nothing is not an option, there have been many City fans affected by this whether you want to see it or not. There doesn't seem much point in rubbishing what was only, after all, a topic for debate without giving an alternative answer to a problem which exists.

(CJ is at home now and commenting at his own expense because the servers at work have gone into meltdown)

[CiderJar]

Well this thread seems to have died a death with no-one offering an alternative suggestion to the ID card for away travel. I have a radical suggestion......

If you are sick to death of all the posturing between our fans and away fans or our fans at away matches. Or if you are sick to death of the over reactions of local police to situations that you think can be controlled differently then ......... and here is the radical bit .......... why not speak out?

Report the offender to the appropriate authorities. The police have a complaints department, how many people who have complained on here about their actions have ever actually filed a complaint? How many people have seen an act of "hooliganism" (sic) and reported it? Take a description, a time and location of an incident and shop the b*st*rds.

Worried about being seen as a "Grass"? Worried about what you've seen on The Football Factory? B*ll*cks to that, it is all b*ll*cks. If you are a witness to an offence it is your duty to report it. Tell a steward, tell a police officer or write to the football club involved, or write to the police.

Do you want to be herded like an animal at every football match you go to? If so then carry on, you probably think it makes you look big and clever too. If that is the case there is no hope for you. If like me you are sick of it, and sick of its' association with Bristol City Football Club and to football in general ........ then report it. If 10,000 of us do this then something will have to be done. If ten of us do it will be progress.

I may not have had much support on here, but believe me I have had several private messages supporting this view and saying that something must be done. Well DO IT!! It can be done privately and anonymously too.

Ready to be knifed in the back over this one.

Have a read of this

Over to you.

[cockney dave]

Are we getting to the point where we should be looking at an ID card system for away travel similar to the Stoke City fans?

It would certainly stop the trouble makers.

just a point for discussion! No! We are getting to the point where some of our so called away fans should look at themselves and see what a disservice they are doing to our club.They are costing the club a lot of money virtually every game.A lot of people are put of with the big mouth louts who think they are all Mr Bigs.I don't like being herded like sheep on away games,but when you see the loud mouth so called tough guys you can understand why.Why don't they sod off and let the real fans enjoy the football

[Hicksy-BCFC]

My experience was on the contrary.... a bad example i guess but millwall...i personally looked forward to the game all season and from about october really hoped it would be the game we went up...it was all going well, until we passed reading....

the rest they say is history

(whichg i should be doing now)

Yeah I heard Millwall was a shambles from my cousin.

I think the reason i thought Swansea was so good because i expected service similar to Millwall.

We got to Winterstoke Car Park on time, all coaches were waiting, my old man, my brother and I all sat same area of coach, tickets handed out, met by the old bill, escorted in.

In and out with the usual assortment of crap thrown by the friendly welsh trolls and back to Bristol.

What made it a little bit more special was that the cops blocked off every roundabout and junction to wave the City convoy through to the M4. We later learned this caused 2 hour gridlock in Swansea with tempers fraying everywhere between the Welsh left behind.

I just thought the clubs gets hammered (and often rightly so) for schite arrangements but credit where its due.

[Frome Valley]

Well this thread seems to have died a death with no-one offering an alternative suggestion to the ID card for away travel. I have a radical suggestion......

If you are sick to death of all the posturing between our fans and away fans or our fans at away matches. Or if you are sick to death of the over reactions of local police to situations that you think can be controlled differently then ......... and here is the radical bit .......... why not speak out?

Report the offender to the appropriate authorities. The police have a complaints department, how many people who have complained on here about their actions have ever actually filed a complaint? How many people have seen an act of "hooliganism" (sic) and reported it? Take a description, a time and location of an incident and shop the b*st*rds.

Worried about being seen as a "Grass"? Worried about what you've seen on The Football Factory? B*ll*cks to that, it is all b*ll*cks. If you are a witness to an offence it is your duty to report it. Tell a steward, tell a police officer or write to the football club involved, or write to the police.

Do you want to be herded like an animal at every football match you go to? If so then carry on, you probably think it makes you look big and clever too. If that is the case there is no hope for you. If like me you are sick of it, and sick of its' association with Bristol City Football Club and to football in general ........ then report it. If 10,000 of us do this then something will have to be done. If ten of us do it will be progress.

I may not have had much support on here, but believe me I have had several private messages supporting this view and saying that something must be done. Well DO IT!! It can be done privately and anonymously too.

Ready to be knifed in the back over this one.

Have a read of this

Over to you.

Fans who are banned cannot travel and commit an offence if they do. The police have wide ranging powers to prevent banned fans travelling.

Radical is not needed just proffessional and consistent policing.

[CiderJar]

Fans who are banned cannot travel and commit an offence if they do. The police have wide ranging powers to prevent banned fans travelling.

Radical is not needed just proffessional and consistent policing.

.... but a bit of help from a law abiding general public is not really radical more community spirited.

The term radical was being used sarcastically. I apologise for that. It is the lowest form of wit.

[cider head]

ID cards are a bad idea and will cut the away following.

with comments like Scroobs below about the police, why is it i should be pushed in to

spending more money (on top of my season ticket, away ticket and travel costs) for

an ID card when the club have our season ticket details ie: eastend fans and why

should i have an ID card if the away from home problems are kicked off by police??

nothing happens at ashton gate with police or away fans so it not needed.

no thank you........

QUOTE (Scroobs @ Feb 4 2008, 10:48 AM)

I live in London. I also happen to live with a policeman who is joined to the TSG. He also happened to be working the game on Saturday. He told me the police actions on Saturday was totally OTT. He works a lot of grounds on Saturday's.......Millwall, Charlton, Chelsea, Tottenham. Apparently another group of TSG were pulled from the Tottenham v Man U game on Saturday as the potential for trouble at Loftus Road was far greater than White Hart Lane. He admitted he'd never seen his group out in such numbers and again agreed that a lot of the problems on Saturday were caused by the police.

He did say that he'd spoken with a couple of City supporters and said to them what he'd told me. Apparently they asked him who he supported........he in-fact supports Chelsea, but living in the same house as him over the years I have converted him to be also a Bristol City supporter. Also let me just say he is not your average Police Officer (meaning the thug type) he is joined to the TSG but is due to leave soon because and I quote "I can no longer put up with the TSG's thuggish behaviour" (the TSG are the officers that are dressed as if they're going to war). Says it all really - and I'll tell you he also comes home with some quite un-believable stories of the kind of things his colleagues get up too.

He came home on Saturday soon after I got in from Loftus Road and told me all - btw, and for the record, the escort that you got from O'neils/Walkabout were the TSG that were drafted in from White Hart Lane. Apparently that particular team of the TSG (remembering they always work with the same team) are the biggest bunch of thugs to walk the earth...........that was his words.

[Lita For Congo]

If we got ID cards, that would be the end of our amazing away following. I wouldn't bother going to half the away games i go to a season as it would just be too much trouble. Its a bit like the east end. Fair play to the boys thats in their, but for me, a bit of a lazy 'un, it was too much messing about for me to get in their as i needed to sort out a season ticket in their for more than i paid for my normal one.

ID cards aren't the answer. Really is a bit of an extreme idea.

[CiderJar]

Yet again the two points made above say no to ID cards. Fantastic. We've established that.

So what do you suggest we do?

[cider head]

Yet again the two points made above say no to ID cards. Fantastic. We've established that.

So what do you suggest we do?

Nothing! it is fine as it is for fans....

3 places where there has been so say problems; wolves, palace and qpr

both area's have problems with police, west midlands and the MET are well known for problems.

The way those area's are policed IS THE PROBLEM not the fans as the same people are at ashton

gate without nothing happening and the police in bristol do not have a great deal

to do, why? becuse they don't go looking for things that is not there! both in

the west midlands and london problems started when fans were forced out of pubs (STOPPED SERVING)

and bullied towards the stadiums, away fans at ashton gate get escorted in and out without

fuss and there are no complaints about our police, sorry fella' but this is an old bill problem

at away grounds and i'm fed up with it being pinned on the fans.

The o'neals pub area was covered in cctv, those fans there just wanted a drink and a drink only.

[CiderJar]

Nothing! it is fine as it is for fans....

3 places where there has been so say problems; wolves, palace and qpr

both area's have problems with police, west midlands and the MET are well known for problems.

The way those area's are policed IS THE PROBLEM not the fans as the same people are at ashton

gate without nothing happening and the police in bristol do not have a great deal

to do, why? becuse they don't go looking for things that is not there! both in

the west midlands and london problems started when fans were forced out of pubs (STOPPED SERVING)

and bullied towards the stadiums, away fans at ashton gate get escorted in and out without

fuss and there are no complaints about our police, sorry fella' but this is an old bill problem

at away grounds and i'm fed up with it being pinned on the fans.

The o'neals pub area was covered in cctv, those fans there just wanted a drink and a drink only.

Good.

As I have said a few times now, the police add to the problem. Have you reported them?

Have a read of this

[cider head]

Good.

As I have said a few times now, the police add to the problem. Have you reported them?

Have a read of this

thanks, i'll have a gander.

[bucksred]

I'd get one. It wouldn't do any harm at all. I go to games, I watch the game, I go home. If I had a card would I get priority for tickets? It's a good idea.

Only time it did last time CJ, was for the Leyland DAF finals 86 & 87?)... otherwise it was a waste of time, and didnt really stop those who wanna cause problems doing so.

'Tis easy, for those who are worried/bitching about it-don't fkn go, if your worried about trouble, Met Plod are an absolute nightmare to deal with anyway

Most of us are used to it...its part of the "experience". hey ho. and its sod all like the bad old days anyway.

[ciderup]

Indeed, the same guy who actually stated he'd like City fans to die.

Sorry to drag this horrible post to the top!

I have given MLA more than enough time to answer this post and feel obliged to make it public that I have NEVER SAID THIS!

A pm has been sent to MLA asking for a posted apology otherwise I will be asking for MLA to be banned from this forum!

No-one should be posting such rubbish about a fellow fan!

Please moderators, decide which poster should be banned as I am utterly disguted by the 'keyboard warrior' response my 'POINT FOR DISCUSSION' recieved!

U REDS

[CiderJar]

Only time it did last time CJ, was for the Leyland DAF finals 86 & 87?)... otherwise it was a waste of time, and didnt really stop those who wanna cause problems doing so.

'Tis easy, for those who are worried/bitching about it-don't fkn go, if your worried about trouble, Met Plod are an absolute nightmare to deal with anyway

Most of us are used to it...its part of the "experience". hey ho. and its sod all like the bad old days anyway.

You are right it is easy. As is carrying an ID card. I still carry my old ones, I have a nice white one with red writing on it and a badge with a red robin sitting on a ball next to the suspension bride; it is No. 000144. I have a nice red one from 1998/99; I was full member no. 000928. I've also got a nice white one with the words "MILLENNIUM SEASON 1999/2000" on it; the membership number has rubbed off. I've also got a an old phone card with a picture of Tinnion and others on it.

In our loft I've got a programme from my first City match City V Totenham in September 1977. We won 1-0 with a Peter Cormack penalty. Chris Garland had a goal disallowed for punching the ball in the net. Since then I have visited 82 league grounds watching City. Some of the teams no longer exist. Some of the teams are non-league. But I watched practically every game from the first to the fourth division and fully intend to watch practically every game on the way back up.

I have not been near any trouble apart from being headbutted in the Cumberland Basin by a Millwall fan. I find that generally if you step to the right or left a neanderthal whether he is a hoolie or a police officer will get confused and keep running. In fact I remember once one such thug was running straight at me, I stepped to one side and he ran head first straight into a wall. It didn't do him any harm at all. Maybe that is the answer?

Repeatedly I have backed down on this and asked people to come up with an alternative suggestion. Not one of you has, but you are definitely against carrying a piece of plastic in your pocket. Enjoy your "experience", you are a tool (the strongest otib will allow I believe).

[WTFiGO!?!]

ID Cards ??

Tell you what - once Gordon Brown come's along an sucks on my willy I won't be sumissive to any of the bullshit..... till then... shtum

[CiderJar]

ID Cards ??

Tell you what - once Gordon Brown come's along an sucks my willy I'll be sumissive to any of the bullshit..... till then... shtum

Disappointed that you of all people haven't read the thread WTFiGO!?!. We moved on from ID cards a while ago. We are now looking for alternatives. I'll give you a while to catch up, then get back to me okay?

[WTFiGO!?!]

Disappointed that you of all people haven't read the thread WTFiGO!?!. We moved on from ID cards a while ago. We are now looking for alternatives. I'll give you a while to catch up, then get back to me okay?

Get in touch with the hopelessly lead corrupt toff/snob crown court etc etc ??.....such was the case at QPR

....alternatively take up Rugby spectatorship or get ITK with the PC Police

I WILL REITERATE FOR YOU: As soon as I sign up to any Away ID Form I do fully expect Gordon Brown not to mention Colin Sexston, representantives from the The A+S Police, The MET Police etc ect.... to be knocking on my door, on their hands and knees with their gobs wide open an gagging for it

.....till then, I expect civil liberty.

It's what my recently deceased Grandfather faught the NAZI's for.

[CiderJar]

.....till then, I expect civil liberty.

It's what my recently deceased Grandfather faught the NAZI's for.

Sorry to hear of your loss.

I'm pleased you are up to speed on the thread. As I've said it doesn't bother me either way. I hope to be nowhere near Gordon Brown's gob, but if it floats your boat.... What does bother me is my civil liberty being infringed by mindless police as a direct result of mindless individuals representing our teams supporters. Maybe the police should join in with the Hoolie Warehouse (you will have seen I have suggested it earlier) leaving me to get near the ground, find a pub, have a few drinks and a chat, go and watch a game of football, go back to the same pub knowing it will still have windows, have a few more drinks and a bit more of a chat before going home. Most of the time I do this anyway.

[cider head]

With identity theft on the rise the last thing i want is another card with my mug on it to go along with

the expence of my driving licence, passport, work id card.

Plus credit cards, season tickets etc, if the club don't know it's fan base by now they never will,

i don't need another card to risk losing for some pikey to pick up and try and use....

no alternatives, leave it alone it is not needed, it was tried in the enclosure in the 80's

50p back then but it died of death, it went from 1,000 people to 200 in there, the grounds

home and away got masses of cctv now and if they can't get that right there is no hope.

If the club or police are wary of certain games then do the cardiff

thing, season ticket holders on coaches but even that is extreme.

The police need to chill out and stop beliving the hype.

[bucksred]

You are right it is easy. As is carrying an ID card. I still carry my old ones, I have a nice white one with red writing on it and a badge with a red robin sitting on a ball next to the suspension bride; it is No. 000144. I have a nice red one from 1998/99; I was full member no. 000928. I've also got a nice white one with the words "MILLENNIUM SEASON 1999/2000" on it; the membership number has rubbed off. I've also got a an old phone card with a picture of Tinnion and others on it.

In our loft I've got a programme from my first City match City V Totenham in September 1977. We won 1-0 with a Peter Cormack penalty. Chris Garland had a goal disallowed for punching the ball in the net. Since then I have visited 82 league grounds watching City. Some of the teams no longer exist. Some of the teams are non-league. But I watched practically every game from the first to the fourth division and fully intend to watch practically every game on the way back up.

I have not been near any trouble apart from being headbutted in the Cumberland Basin by a Millwall fan. I find that generally if you step to the right or left a neanderthal whether he is a hoolie or a police officer will get confused and keep running. In fact I remember once one such thug was running straight at me, I stepped to one side and he ran head first straight into a wall. It didn't do him any harm at all. Maybe that is the answer?

Repeatedly I have backed down on this and asked people to come up with an alternative suggestion. Not one of you has, but you are definitely against carrying a piece of plastic in your pocket. Enjoy your "experience", you are a tool (the strongest otib will allow I believe).

Insults, the refuge of someone who has no answer! Try lookin' in a mirror. I have been following city since 85, with your precious idea of ID, of which I had one, the same as you, or without one, and in my experience it hasn't changed a thing. It also didn't change things at Chelsea which also had a scheme, at the time. Banning orders are the only things which have worked.

If you want ideas how to stop hooliganism, theres only one way: lock the little fkrs up. however in our touchy feely, pc, human rights obsessed age, lawyers ensure the pond life don't go to jail. As that aint going to happen, then its part of being a travelling fan.

I've been hassled by the Met, Bedfordshire, Thames Valley and A & S plod, at football, and a whole load more as a biker. I am not now, ever been or ever will be a hoolie, or whatever they call them these days. That sort of individual is not someone I aspire to be, wish to emulate, nor do I think they are "heroes". Christ anyone who knows me would laugh at that thought! With the 12 years military service, I completed, somehow, I don't think, it would be in my interests to be one, know what I mean fella?

The only teams. we've played, where I have witnessed trouble at are Milwall, the Sags, Swindle,and Sjoke. every other teams fans I've spoken to, have been normal people, even QPRse

However due to their baleful influence, life is less than pleasant as a football fan. If you wont accept the reality, thats your problem. Cos thats what it is, and its why I wouldn't touch being an England supporter with a 10 foot bargepole, far too many idiots. however supporting my club, there is not the problems to such a degree. I don't love been locked in after games, or being hassled by plod while there, or seeing the boneheads either, but if I go, thats the experience, some good, some bad.

You show me something useful, which gets rid of pondlife, then I'm interested. ID cards do not prevent trouble, but can get real fans in a whole shitload more trouble. If they worked, then we'd all be carrying 'em.