When Is A Transfer Window Not A Transfer Window

[easton boy]

I know that discussions have been carrying on over the last couple of days about the Transfer Window or seemingly lack of one but I thought that I would post this as it carries one or two interesting points....(well I think so)

Copied from Teamtalk

"Leicester have beaten Championship rivals Preston to the signing of highly-rated Chelsea defender Harry Worley.

The 19-year-old, who had a week-long trial with the Foxes last month, has joined the club on an initial loan deal until the end of the season when he will sign a three-year contract.

"Harry is another young player to add to some of the wonderful ones we have already got here," said Leicester manager Ian Holloway.

"We have paid a little bit of money for him.

"He chose not to stay at Chelsea even though they wanted him to sign a new deal. Preston were also in for him.

"He is 6ft 3in and is quick as hell. We see him developing into a very decent centre-half. It may seem to be a bit of a strange one considering where we are in the table, but we are looking at it long term.

"If we get any injuries and we have had a couple of weeks coaching him and working with him then who knows. We might need him between now and the end of the season, but for now he is one to tuck in and leave underneath."

Worley signed for Chelsea from Stockport in the summer of 2005 with a tribunal setting an initial fee of £150,000.

He turned professional in November 2005 and was an unused substitute in Chelsea's Community Shield defeat to Manchester United at Wembley in August."

2 points to make

1. "We have paid a little bit of money for him" - THE TRANSFER WINDOW IS CLOSED AND IF THEY PAID MONEY FOR HIM -NOT A LOAN SIGNING THEN???

2. "If we get any injuries and we have had a couple of weeks coaching him and working with him then who knows. We might need him between now and the end of the season, but for now he is one to tuck in and leave underneath."

Hardly a bloody emergency loan signing then

Since Jan 31st most clubs, except ours, have flouted the laws regarding emergency loans.

Do you think it is time that the FA should look at this?

For instance, if he or any other team(Luke Moore WBA NOT an emergency loan), sign players like this then they should be docked points for fielding inelligible players.

Makes my blood boil (end of rant)

[bh_red]

we have done it in the past, and will no doubt do it again in the future if needed, it's a loophole that has been left open since the Transfer Window is such a farce, personally I see no problem in it

very much a case of pot calling kettle black

I'm sure if on monday we signed a fairly decent forward, you wouldn't see anyone on here complaining about it at all

[easton boy]

we have done it in the past, and will no doubt do it again in the future if needed.

very much a case of pot calling kettle black

Not a dig BH Red, but when did we pay for a player outside the transfer window?

[Sir Colby-Tit]

Do you think it is time that the FA should look at this?

Isn't this all done with the FA's blessing though? I thought they allowed it as they don't agree with the emergency loan system for league clubs?

[daisybcfc]

let them sign who they want, we're bristol city and we're going up. we don't need to be lent players because ours arn't good enough.

CTID!

[easton boy]

let them sign who they want, we're bristol city and we're going up. we don't need to be lent players because ours arn't good enough.

CTID!

Agree 100% daisy, but would you feel the same way if Stoke sign Nugent and he ends up scoring the winner against us?

[daisybcfc]

Agree 100% daisy, but would you feel the same way if Stoke sign Nugent and he ends up scoring the winner against us?

hmmmmmmm... probably not, however these players do not suddenly transform teams. When Leroy signed for Charlton i was slightly disappointed he didnt come here. Then i got thinking about our season, its not individual stand out stars with us, its a team ethic and everyone works 100% for everyone else, do these so called 'stars' have the same desire as the likes of Bradley Orr, Michael McIndoe or Marvin Elliott???? Not a chance in hell! I wouldn't swap places with any other club in the land, and just because they're signing a Premiership player doesn't mean we should fear them, we should use this to show that they feel they are not strong enough with their own squad, whereas we are!

[double-trouble]

Agree 100% daisy, but would you feel the same way if Stoke sign Nugent and he ends up scoring the winner against us?

It is a loophole that needs tightening up and any loophole in any walk of life will be exploited .

Hollowhead since taking over the foxes has shown a attitude of desperation in the many signings he's made and players allowed to leave .

He's fast making a rod for his own back .

[Red_Mat]

Not a dig BH Red, but when did we pay for a player outside the transfer window?

David Noble...? Not recently, admittedly, but we did sign him up outside the window with the full expectation of him signing permanently at the end of it.

Whether we do it or not, however, is beyond the point. The point is, that the whole loan and transfer system is a joke and needs to be looked at. It plays into the hands of all the bigger clubs in each division and there is nothing 'emergency' about it.

For a start, who decides what exactly an emergency loan is or isn't?!

[cityboy]

It's not an emergency loan. The window for loans is still open for the football league so any club can loan in/out for now. As for paying money, this is not an uncommon practice to secure loan deals. It isn't against any rules, and isn't an exploitation of any loop holes. It's simply a fee to secure the temporary services of a player.

[Jack(anowski)]

1. "We have paid a little bit of money for him" - THE TRANSFER WINDOW IS CLOSED AND IF THEY PAID MONEY FOR HIM -NOT A LOAN SIGNING THEN???

Using only Football Manager as my guidance (which is usually a good guide in such matters) I think you can pay a fee for a loan signing, or indeed have an agreed future fee, as we have with Tamas Vasko (£100k according to Football Manager). From what Hollowhead has said it looks like they have done both, unless Worsley's contract runs out in the summer in which case he will be free.

[SimplyRed]

It is quite apparent to me, that the loan (or otherwise) signings mentioned above DO fall outside what is specified in the rules.

From my own interpretation of the rules (see below), unless it is an EMERGENCY loan or they were a free agent when the window closed, they cannot sign outside the transfer window:

Transfer Window Rules as per BBC website:

• Premier League and SPL clubs have until midnight on Thursday, 31 January to sign players. English Football League and Blue Square Premier (Conference National) clubs have the same deadline for full transfers, but not for loans. Clubs in the English non-league pyramid below the Blue Square Premier are not bound by the transfer window system.

• After midnight on 31 January, Premier League and SPL clubs cannot sign any players, on loan or full transfers, until the 2007/08 season is concluded in May. This window will stay open until midnight on 31 August.

• Clubs in the Football League can sign players on loan outside of the transfer windows, following a seven-day period after the transfer window closes.

• Outside of the transfer windows, any club may still sign players on an emergency basis (such as if they had no goalkeepers available) with the permission of their competition's governing body, ie the Premier League.

• Players who are out of contract and do not have a club, can be signed outside of the transfer window if they are unattached free agents when the window closes.

So how are people like Holloway circumventing the rules?

[cityboy]

You seem to have missed this part:

[*]Clubs in the Football League can sign players on loan outside of the transfer windows, following a seven-day period after the transfer window closes.

[Guest DanC]

The transfer window for the top leagues in this world is understandable. They can afford to have big squads and do have big squads so when injuries or bans happen then they already have the cover. Lets say some team like Bury has the GK injured and all the have is a 18 year old Gk who has never played a professional game as back up. Without the loan system they would be stuffed and things like that could lead to relegation and a loss of jobs to people like the ticket office staff or the tea lady. It's always them that takes the fall following relegation.

[easton boy]

You seem to have missed this part:

Yes, quite, but the date is the 7th March, not the 7th of Feb.

[easton boy]

The transfer window for the top leagues in this world is understandable. They can afford to have big squads and do have big squads so when injuries or bans happen then they already have the cover. Lets say some team like Bury has the GK injured and all the have is a 18 year old Gk who has never played a professional game as back up. Without the loan system they would be stuffed and things like that could lead to relegation and a loss of jobs to people like the ticket office staff or the tea lady. It's always them that takes the fall following relegation.

That is why it is called and EMERGENCY loan Dan, to cater for exactly that situation.

The spirit of the Emergency Loan system is being completed flouted by the likes of West Brom and Leicester; WBA who decide that their 4 or 5 strikers(that could prob walk into most teams in this division) need more competition for places(or whatever); Leicester who decide that they want enough players to field 5 teams in this division - neither of which by ANY stretch of the imagination could be called Emergency.(and yes Daisy, on Leics part it IS desperation of a club spiralling down the big white telephone).

Don't get me wrong, the TW is an absolute joke, disgrace and a flagrant restriction of trade of the employees i.e. footballers, but rules are rules and it always seems to be "bigger" teams like these that get away with it, whilst the smaller clubs get punished for blowing their noses(and no, I don't classify us as a smaller club before anyone jumps down my throat).

[cityboy]

Yes, quite, but the date is the 7th March, not the 7th of Feb.

I think you've misunderstood the rule. The way it works is this:

For 7 days after the transfer window closes no loans can be made. Following these 7 days the loan window reopens for the football league.

[easton boy]

I think you've misunderstood the rule. The way it works is this:

For 7 days after the transfer window closes no loans can be made. Following these 7 days the loan window reopens for the football league.

Fair enough mate, my apologies.

[CTID Ryback]

Using only Football Manager as my guidance (which is usually a good guide in such matters) I think you can pay a fee for a loan signing, or indeed have an agreed future fee, as we have with Tamas Vasko (£100k according to Football Manager). From what Hollowhead has said it looks like they have done both, unless Worsley's contract runs out in the summer in which case he will be free.

Lolz!!!!one!!11!!eleven!!