chinapig Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Yet again the cliche "they'll be like Derby" was trotted out on 606 last night about anybody who might get promoted from the Championship this year (though naturally Alan Green excepted West Brom because he's heard of one of their players and knows where the Hawthorns is). The point about Derby is that they were a club in crisis when they got promoted. Big debts, conflict in the boardroom, the manager constantly arguing with the Board, uncertainty about possible takeovers etc. They proceeded to sack the manager and went through a protacted takeover. They have spent around £16m but much of it in a state of panic and brought in some has-beens and ego-maniacs after a boost to their pension fund. Would you swap Marvin for Savage? FFS they even signed Lauren Robert! It seems to me one of the keys to survival is stability. We have that from top to bottom, along with proper long-term planning on and off the pitch. Combine a shrewd (and wealthy) Chairman and the most astute Manager outside the Prem and you have a chance. IF we go up of course! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DrFaustus Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I don't buy this 'City will do a Derby' mantra. Your manager and chaiman are wise enough to know the financial implications of staying up and Johnson will be given the resources by Mr Lansdown to ensure that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tales From The Front Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Yet again the cliche "they'll be like Derby" was trotted out on 606 last night about anybody who might get promoted from the Championship this year (though naturally Alan Green excepted West Brom because he's heard of one of their players and knows where the Hawthorns is). The point about Derby is that they were a club in crisis when they got promoted. Big debts, conflict in the boardroom, the manager constantly arguing with the Board, uncertainty about possible takeovers etc. They proceeded to sack the manager and went through a protacted takeover. They have spent around £16m but much of it in a state of panic and brought in some has-beens and ego-maniacs after a boost to their pension fund. Would you swap Marvin for Savage? FFS they even signed Lauren Robert! It seems to me one of the keys to survival is stability. We have that from top to bottom, along with proper long-term planning on and off the pitch. Combine a shrewd (and wealthy) Chairman and the most astute Manager outside the Prem and you have a chance. IF we go up of course! The first thing to say to anyone who says "you'll do a deby" is "so you acknowledge City are going up then?" It's all hypothetical boll*x to be honest, for the club to continue grow, it will at some stage need Premiship football. The real question is to ensure that the current way is maintained, with good team / work ethic, spending some money but opperating within the club's means. You have very well defined the pitfall of spending money on journey men yo yo championship / Premier League players. Gary Johnson in the main has bought young and hungry players with good attitude, however some experience and quality would be needed. But for the time being let's just concentrate on getting there, which will be hard enough. Yesterday was unbelievable and a bit lucky if we are all honest but hopefully it's the boost needed to move on. But Saturday's game is the most important and I'm sure all the staff will be concentrating on that and not to much else at this stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MaloneFM Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I don't buy this 'City will do a Derby' mantra. Your manager and chaiman are wise enough to know the financial implications of staying up and Johnson will be given the resources by Mr Lansdown to ensure that. You said this down the Pilly last monday night and I thought it was the cheese and onion talking. Although you didn't use the names Johnson and Lansdown. Very gynocological ain't we HD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 What's the difference between us and Derby? Gary Johnson and Steve Lansdown. What's the difference between us and Reading? The stadium, which is on the way. And not being plastic cockney glory hunters of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Anything the likes of Portsmouth can do, this club can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pewsham Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I must confess to watching MOTD on occasions and thinking "how are City going to live with that?". I was looking at the tables though, and a thought occured to me about the number of games actually won. Man United (top of Premier League) have won 75% of their league games. City (top of Championship) have won 46% of their league games. I'm not sure how fair that comparison is, but fairness doesn't come into Football. If it did, the TV cash would be distributed more fairly. It's certainly food for thought though. The nearest win record to ours in the Premier League is Pompey (who are having a bloody good season themselves), but no one would suggest they could cut into the Top 4. If City get promoted, every last TV Pundit would have us for relegation fodder, and I rather feel we would struggle to stay up. The Premier League is played by different teams at an alien pace with bucketloads more accuracy than we currently do. Failure to improve will result in a "Derby" type humiliation. It'd be interesting to see what people think about what players they feel would City realistically sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tales From The Front Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I must confess to watching MOTD on occasions and thinking "how are City going to live with that?". I was looking at the tables though, and a thought occured to me about the number of games actually won. Man United (top of Premier League) have won 75% of their league games. City (top of Championship) have won 46% of their league games. I'm not sure how fair that comparison is, but fairness doesn't come into Football. If it did, the TV cash would be distributed more fairly. It's certainly food for thought though. The nearest win record to ours in the Premier League is Pompey (who are having a bloody good season themselves), but no one would suggest they could cut into the Top 4. If City get promoted, every last TV Pundit would have us for relegation fodder, and I rather feel we would struggle to stay up. The Premier League is played by different teams at an alien pace with bucketloads more accuracy than we currently do. Failure to improve will result in a "Derby" type humiliation. It'd be interesting to see what people think about what players they feel would City realistically sign. I think I would be inclined to agree, but the league is not all about the top 4. A bloke of the radio last night quite rightly said that the divison in split into three leagues of 8 and for City it would in all probability be about doing well in the bottom league of 8, which is not as daunting as you may think. Look at the teams involved and you will see that City have spent many seasons battling against these teams, Reading, Fulham, Wigan, Bolton, Birmingham. Make no mistake it would not be eass but as I said before City have got to get there first, let's hope it's our time as it is what I have wanted since we fell from grace in the early 80's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Humble Realist Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 If I'm honest i really think we may do worse than Derby as things stand at the moment and would be extremly surprised if we avoided relegation even with 4 or 5 strong signings. At the end of the day Norwich outplayed us and theyre halfway up the league! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tales From The Front Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 If I'm honest i really think we may do worse than Derby as things stand at the moment and would be extremly surprised if we avoided relegation even with 4 or 5 strong signings. At the end of the day Norwich outplayed us and theyre halfway up the league! But people said we wouldn't get promoted last season, people said we would get relagated this season. We have got to get there first then we we can worry about it, financialy though it is a no brainer, with Stadium development a must for progress all revenue streams, from where ever they come is a must. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I thought Dowie made an interesting observation yesterday lunch time. He said that if he had his time at Palace all over again he would have brought in TWO or THREE players of REAL Premier League QUALITY (it would have to be a Centre Half, Centre Midfield and Centre Forward) and put trust in the fighting spirit in the rest of the squad rather than 7 or 8 players who only improved slightly on what he had but who still weren't good enough anyway. The difficult bit would be to find and then persuade those quality players to join us. Still, it wouldn't be a bad problem to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lita For Congo Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I thought Dowie made an interesting observation yesterday lunch time. He said that if he had his time at Palace all over again he would have brought in TWO or THREE players of REAL Premier League QUALITY (it would have to be a Centre Half, Centre Midfield and Centre Forward) and put trust in the fighting spirit in the rest of the squad rather than 7 or 8 players who only improved slightly on what he had but who still weren't good enough anyway. The difficult bit would be to find and then persuade those quality players to join us. Still, it wouldn't be a bad problem to have. And thats probably what Jonno will do. He wont go mad signing has-beens and journeymen, he will get 3 or 4 real quality players in the positions we need then maybe a 'vasko' or two, unknown young foreigners with potential. I don't think we will stay up but we will certainly be in a better than position than Derby are this time next year IF we go up. We are a stable club and i think if we do stick with the boys we could do alot worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tin Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I don't buy this 'City will do a Derby' mantra. Your manager and chaiman are wise enough to know the financial implications of staying up and Johnson will be given the resources by Mr Lansdown to ensure that. Can't believe I'm agreeing with one of you lot but I do! IF we go up, City will not 'do a Derby' because: SL is canny enough not to put the club's future at stake but SL will put enough money at it to reinforce the squad substantially.GJ has a unique team spirit going on down here that will again be worth it's weight in gold in any struggle that may happen.The Premier League Primadona's won't like coming to an old skool ground like the Gate, instead of the soulless bowl Derby have. Look at Fratton Park at some of the results they've had down there to back that up.If we were to struggle like Derby, I severely doubt SL would press the panic button and sack GJ like Derby did with Davies.I seriously think that with a few quality additions, we could give the lower Premier League sides a run for their money. We've shown we can compete with Boro, Man City etc and I'm sure we would go toe-to-toe with sides like Fulham, Birmingham Bolton and Sunderland. Just got to get there first! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yeovilmac Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Just say for a moment that you do go up. And I ought to point out that I hope you do despite the fact that it might impact slightly on us. GJ in his two promotions with Yeovil gave the players 10/12 games at the start of the season to see who could make the step-up and who couldn't. This threw up a few surprises as players who you might think had reached their natural level suddenly found an extra gear while others who you would have staked your last pound on being able to cope, took fright and never made it. Do you think GJ can afford ( results wise ) to do that this time? Trouble is, do you make wholesale changes in the summer and enter the Premier League with almost a new team or does he stick with his method and find himself staring up from a position like Derby have been in all season. Either way, good luck. This green will be rooting for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tunley Legend Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Just say for a moment that you do go up. And I ought to point out that I hope you do despite the fact that it might impact slightly on us. GJ in his two promotions with Yeovil gave the players 10/12 games at the start of the season to see who could make the step-up and who couldn't. This threw up a few surprises as players who you might think had reached their natural level suddenly found an extra gear while others who you would have staked your last pound on being able to cope, took fright and never made it. Do you think GJ can afford ( results wise ) to do that this time? Trouble is, do you make wholesale changes in the summer and enter the Premier League with almost a new team or does he stick with his method and find himself staring up from a position like Derby have been in all season. Either way, good luck. This green will be rooting for you. In the Premier League you need quality down the spine of your team - end of story. So, as has been said previously, Johnson would have no option than to buy the three or four players required. In my opinion you then use the GJ method of 15 or so games to have a look at everyone else. By the January window, and assuming a bit of fighting spirit allied to the quality we would have bought gives us enough points to have a realistic chance of staying up, we would then know for certain which positions we need to strengthen. Or, if we were in a Derby position, we could then proceed in a manner which would make us a contender in the Championship the following season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack(anowski) Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 [*]GJ has a unique team spirit going on down here that will again be worth it's weight in gold in any struggle that may happen. How much does our team spirit weigh? My mate is going to Ireland on a football tour tomorrow; they have plenty of team spirit. For the ferry alone they have 3 bottles of vodka! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aa_bcfc Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I thought Dowie made an interesting observation yesterday lunch time. He said that if he had his time at Palace all over again he would have brought in TWO or THREE players of REAL Premier League QUALITY (it would have to be a Centre Half, Centre Midfield and Centre Forward) and put trust in the fighting spirit in the rest of the squad rather than 7 or 8 players who only improved slightly on what he had but who still weren't good enough anyway. The difficult bit would be to find and then persuade those quality players to join us. Still, it wouldn't be a bad problem to have. A bit like us when we went up in '76 Cenre back - Hunter Centre midfield - Cormack. (and already had Gow who was top division quality in midfield). Centre Forward - Royle Some other squad signings but most of the rest of the team was that what went up. I think we would really struggle if we went up. Perhaps with some embarrrassing results. Still unless we get there we will never know. Even the worst will be season 2009 /10 in the championship with hopefully an improved squad and financial security. That cant be bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pewsham Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 In the Premier League you need quality down the spine of your team - end of story. So, as has been said previously, Johnson would have no option than to buy the three or four players required. In my opinion you then use the GJ method of 15 or so games to have a look at everyone else. By the January window, and assuming a bit of fighting spirit allied to the quality we would have bought gives us enough points to have a realistic chance of staying up, we would then know for certain which positions we need to strengthen. Or, if we were in a Derby position, we could then proceed in a manner which would make us a contender in the Championship the following season. The problem is that by the January transfer window, Premier League class players may not want to come because they may think we are already doomed... in which case we'd have to rely on Championship class players. It'd be wrong to sign overpriced journeymen who couldn't give a hoot anyway, so I think GJ would have to play the market shrewdly pre season. I'd like to pose a couple of questions: How long do you think it would take Derby to recover from complete shell shock? It could well take our players the same amount of time to recover if it all goes wrong. If we failed to go up this year, would we do as well in 08/09? I'm sure that like everyone else who follows this Club, I don't want us to become a Bradford a Swindon or a "Bristol City in old money" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 I think I'm going to put 'Premier League' in the word filter. No such thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudgeRed Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Either way it wil be one hell of a ride if we make it. But one thing is for sure Pre Evo soccer (2009) (X box 360) sales will sore in the aria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4eveREDDy Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Yet again the cliche "they'll be like Derby" was trotted out on 606 last night about anybody who might get promoted from the Championship this year (though naturally Alan Green excepted West Brom because he's heard of one of their players and knows where the Hawthorns is). The point about Derby is that they were a club in crisis when they got promoted. Big debts, conflict in the boardroom, the manager constantly arguing with the Board, uncertainty about possible takeovers etc. They proceeded to sack the manager and went through a protacted takeover. They have spent around £16m but much of it in a state of panic and brought in some has-beens and ego-maniacs after a boost to their pension fund. Would you swap Marvin for Savage? FFS they even signed Lauren Robert! It seems to me one of the keys to survival is stability. We have that from top to bottom, along with proper long-term planning on and off the pitch. Combine a shrewd (and wealthy) Chairman and the most astute Manager outside the Prem and you have a chance. IF we go up of course! Thank god there are people on here that are positive, reading some of these posts depress me, we are having a brilliant season with every chance of going up and i really do believe that if we get there we have a great chance of staying in the top flight. with GJ and SL we have a very solid base to build a very good team, ok the first season may prove to be a struggle but have we not suprised everyone this year with our performance in the championship, at the end of the day,take away the top 8 clubs in the prem and i can see no reason with a couple of new signings why we would not be able to get established, and to build on from there, with eveything that is happening at city, new stadium around the corner, exciting times, and i refuse to be anything but positive :Believe: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleMissVicky Posted March 30, 2008 Report Share Posted March 30, 2008 Thank god there are people on here that are positive, reading some of these posts depress me, we are having a brilliant season with every chance of going up and i really do believe that if we get there we have a great chance of staying in the top flight. with GJ and SL we have a very solid base to build a very good team, ok the first season may prove to be a struggle but have we not suprised everyone this year with our performance in the championship, at the end of the day,take away the top 8 clubs in the prem and i can see no reason with a couple of new signings why we would not be able to get established, and to build on from there, with eveything that is happening at city, new stadium around the corner, exciting times, and i refuse to be anything but positive :Believe: Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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