Sunderland

[Wanderingred]

Sunderland fans have thrown the towel in and feel that it's all over for them after Brum's win at Bolton put them 8 points from safety. For anyone who likes a bit of schadenfreude or for those that need some perspective at our current run, have a peek at their fans forum. We've had a bad run lasting a couple of months... It's more like two whole seasons for this lot! Two home wins in 18 months, years since they managed back to back wins, parachute payments completely wasted.. A once proud club reduced to an absolute shambles. Things could be a lot lot worse lads!!

https://www.readytogo.net/smb/forums/pure-football.86/

[Olé]

They've also had years of the Premiership, and even Europe.

Nothing specifically against Sunderland, but I don't have it in me to feel sorry for anyone who has had their turn. Back of the queue now please. 

[Redstart]

Yep - truly gone are the days when a club was 'too big to go down'

[Robbored]

20 minutes ago, Wanderingred said:

Sunderland fans have thrown the towel in and feel that it's all over for them after Brum's win at Bolton put them 8 points from safety. For anyone who likes a bit of schadenfreude or for those that need some perspective at our current run, have a peek at their fans forum. We've had a bad run lasting a couple of months... It's more like two whole seasons for this lot! Two home wins in 18 months, years since they managed back to back wins, parachute payments completely wasted.. A once proud club reduced to an absolute shambles. Things could be a lot lot worse lads!!

https://www.readytogo.net/smb/forums/pure-football.86/

Who owns Sunderland and who makes the decision to sack one manager after another? 

At a guess I'd say they're owned by an overseas purchaser.

Thankfully we have SL as our owner.

 

[Lanterne Rouge]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

Who owns Sunderland and who makes the decision to sack one manager after another? 

At a guess I'd say they're owned by an overseas purchaser.

Thankfully we have SL as our owner.

 

Ellis Short. I think he`s American and is looking to offload the club but wants his money back so won`t sell them cheap.

He might have to cut his losses now though although if they tear up League 1 they`ll start getting good crowds at the SOL again irrespective of the opposition and their value could rise.

Personally I think when he does get rid there may be a lot of questions asked about where the parachute payments went in a Blackpool sense.

[sephjnr]

2 hours ago, Wanderingred said:

for those that need some perspective at our current run

Three wins since Boxing Day. The only thing separating us from Sunderland was our run until then. On last season's run until then, we would probably be in Sunderland's position right now.

Being grateful for what we have blinds us from both what we expect, and also what we'd like. You may as well extend that to "At least we can't go down, and look at the Man U game. LOOK AT IT. Never mind how it all turned to mush after Christmas, LOOK AT THE THING WE DID. YAY US."

Save that train of thought for five years time, not five weeks. 

 

1 hour ago, Red Right Hand said:

Personally I think when he does get rid there may be a lot of questions asked about where the parachute payments went in a Blackpool sense.

If Short was on the FA board like Oyston, no questions would be asked at all, move along, nothing to see here.

[BRISTOL86]

Should be a stark eye opener for just how quickly it can go to pot when throwing endless cash (and a string of managers) at ‘the dream’ and forsaking any kind of sustainability or planning. 

Wouldn’t surprise me to see them continue to struggle in League One.

[Bar BS3]

3 minutes ago, sephjnr said:

Three wins since Boxing Day. The only thing separating us from Sunderland was our run until then. On last season's run until then, we would probably be in Sunderland's position right now.

Being grateful for what we have blinds us from both what we expect, and also what we'd like. You may as well extend that to "At least we can't go down, and look at the Man U game. LOOK AT IT. Never mind how it all turned to mush after Christmas, LOOK AT THE THING WE DID. YAY US."

Save that train of thought for five years time, not five weeks. 

So we aren’t allowed to look back fondly at the good parts of the season and we have to fabricate non existent stats to show where we’d be if we hadn’t had the good bits..? Seems fair..! 

[frenchred]

2 hours ago, Wanderingred said:

Sunderland fans have thrown the towel in and feel that it's all over for them after Brum's win at Bolton put them 8 points from safety. For anyone who likes a bit of schadenfreude or for those that need some perspective at our current run, have a peek at their fans forum. We've had a bad run lasting a couple of months... It's more like two whole seasons for this lot! Two home wins in 18 months, years since they managed back to back wins, parachute payments completely wasted.. A once proud club reduced to an absolute shambles. Things could be a lot lot worse lads!!

https://www.readytogo.net/smb/forums/pure-football.86/

You could also go the other way and see what teams like Huddersfield, Watford and Burnley etc have done that we appear incapable of doing under our current owner and/or coach. Just for a bit of perspective

[RUSSEL85]

2 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Should be a stark eye opener for just how quickly it can go to pot when throwing endless cash (and a string of managers) at ‘the dream’ and forsaking any kind of sustainability or planning. 

Wouldn’t surprise me to see them continue to struggle in League One.

Agreed. They could well struggle in league 1, but they will be able to attract any player (of that level) they want so it maybe a complete clear out and start again with young, hungry league 1/bottom end champ players. It will be weird seeing a 48,000 seater stadium in that division though. Accrington Stanley away opening game of the season will bring it all home for them!

[sephjnr]

1 minute ago, Bar BS3 said:

So we aren’t allowed to look back fondly at the good parts of the season and we have to fabricate non existent stats to show where we’d be if we hadn’t had the good bits..? Seems fair..! 

We absolutely can.

But not now. Because the job's not done yet,

And as for "fabricating" it's really not much of a stretch to suggest how things could have been a ton worse, especially as the team hasn't changed drastically since then. It's certainly no more unrealistic than OP's rose spectacles approach.

[BRISTOL86]

4 minutes ago, RUSSEL85 said:

Agreed. They could well struggle in league 1, but they will be able to attract any player (of that level) they want so it maybe a complete clear out and start again with young, hungry league 1/bottom end champ players. It will be weird seeing a 48,000 seater stadium in that division though. Accrington Stanley away opening game of the season will bring it all home for them!

Indeed. Basically what they should have done in the Championship (and IMO had they had the balls to stick with their man in Grayson, that’s exactly what would have happened. They’d have tread water this season and had a total rebuild once he’d had chance to clear the dead wood)

I’m a big advocate of managers being given time to actually enact change and they bottled it when results went against Grayson. He’d have easily kept them up.  

Good riddance IMO

[Bar BS3]

1 minute ago, sephjnr said:

We absolutely can.

But not now. Because the job's not done yet,

And as for "fabricating" it's really not much of a stretch to suggest how things could have been a ton worse, especially as the team hasn't changed drastically since then. It's certainly no more unrealistic than OP's rose spectacles approach.

Results will peak & dip throughout the season of most teams. The exceptions usually being those that get promoted or relegated. 

Of course, if we’d have had the same form pre Christmas as post Christmas, we’d be struggling. 

If we’d had the post Christmas form of Pre Christmas, we’d probably be on the verge or automatic promotion. 

I guess that’s why the league format is what it is, with 2 games against each other team, one Home, one away, so that the form over 9 months finds out who is best suited to go up, go down, improve, go backwards etc. 

We’d all have liked to repeat the first half of the season, but there are 23 other clubs all trying to stop us. 

[sephjnr]

1 minute ago, Bar BS3 said:

Results will peak & dip throughout the season of most teams. The exceptions usually being those that get promoted or relegated. 

Of course, if we’d have had the same form pre Christmas as post Christmas, we’d be struggling. 

If we’d had the post Christmas form of Pre Christmas, we’d probably be on the verge or automatic promotion. 

I guess that’s why the league format is what it is, with 2 games against each other team, one Home, one away, so that the form over 9 months finds out who is best suited to go up, go down, improve, go backwards etc. 

We’d all have liked to repeat the first half of the season, but there are 23 other clubs all trying to stop us. 

And if you intended a serious reply you'd be stating how I was wrong. Especially - to repeat - as we don't have a drastically different side or tactics.

[Malago]

The worst is yet to come.  A visit to the tented village in N Bristol.  Then they'll really know they've hit rock bottom.

[BigTone]

13 minutes ago, Malago said:

The worst is yet to come.  A visit to the tented village in N Bristol.  Then they'll really know they've hit rock bottom.

Who ?  The residents of the tented village or Sunderland ?

[Wanderingred]

1 hour ago, sephjnr said:

We absolutely can.

But not now. Because the job's not done yet,

And as for "fabricating" it's really not much of a stretch to suggest how things could have been a ton worse, especially as the team hasn't changed drastically since then. It's certainly no more unrealistic than OP's rose spectacles approach.

What rose spectacles? My intention was to highlight the plight of Sunderland and how a traditionally big club has fallen into disarray. I didn't even mention us other than things could be a lot worse.

[Wanderingred]

1 hour ago, sephjnr said:

Three wins since Boxing Day. The only thing separating us from Sunderland was our run until then. On last season's run until then, we would probably be in Sunderland's position right now.

Are you for real? Turn that the other way round and say "the only thing separating us from Wolves is our run since christmas. On that run until now, we would be in their position". See how utterly ridiculous that sounds?

If I'm wearing rose tinted specs, you're wearing shite tinted ones. 

[Londoner]

1 hour ago, BRISTOL86 said:

Should be a stark eye opener for just how quickly it can go to pot when throwing endless cash (and a string of managers) at ‘the dream’ and forsaking any kind of sustainability or planning. 

Wouldn’t surprise me to see them continue to struggle in League One.

They didn't throw endless cash. They just made some very poor decisions.

[BRISTOL86]

4 minutes ago, Londoner said:

They didn't throw endless cash. They just made some very poor decisions.

They paid massive wages in the Premier League - reckless for a team that spent so long flirting with the drop. Everyone knew it was only a matter of time before they got relegated.

The result is a squad of disinterested shit players on massive contracts that don’t want to be there. Even their loan striker did a runner ASAP  

No sympathy with clubs that prepare so badly for the inevitable. They’re like the guy next door with the flashy car on a crippling lease and living the footballer’s lifestyle on the credit card, only a matter of time before it all comes crumbling down. 

Don’t think there’s any guarantee of them making a quick spring back to this level when they do go down. 

[BRISTOL86]

Their wage bill in the season they came down was nearly £2m pounds per week 

Put another way, every point they gained last season cost them nearly £4m in wages, for a truly awful squad of players. 

[BanburyRed]

14 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

They paid massive wages in the Premier League - reckless for a team that spent so long flirting with the drop. Everyone knew it was only a matter of time before they got relegated.

The result is a squad of disinterested shit players on massive contracts that don’t want to be there. Even their loan striker did a runner ASAP  

No sympathy with clubs that prepare so badly for the inevitable. They’re like the guy next door with the flashy car on a crippling lease and living the footballer’s lifestyle on the credit card, only a matter of time before it all comes crumbling down. 

Don’t think there’s any guarantee of them making a quick spring back to this level when they do go down. 

There was a topic on talkSport earlier in relation to Ronaldo's overhead kick for Real Madrid last night and the response of the Juve fans in applauding, a Man Utd fan rang in to mention a Champions League game and (Brazilian) Ronaldo giving the Utd back 4 a torrid evening until he got subbed and left to a standing ovation. 'Ronaldo ripped John O'Shea a new one that eve....'.

The same John O'Shea playing for Sunderland being torn to shreds every week.....

[Olé]

1 hour ago, Bar BS3 said:

We’d all have liked to repeat the first half of the season, but there are 23 other clubs all trying to stop us. 

Although, at the risk of starting a separate debate, I think a lot of us had looked at the fixture list earlier in the season and expected specifically that the second half of our season would be easier. After New Years Day we had played 3 of the current top 4 away, and had already got both fixtures against the runaway leaders out of the way.

Admittedly trips to Boro and Millwall now appear far tougher, but only due to our own recent poor form. The long standing top six teams (I include us in that) that we had worried about all season, we weren't disgraced against. Our recent issue has been vs 4 of the bottom 5, which is why peaks and dips in form won't wash with some people*.

*Not saying that's me, I was amazed at the meltdown over the Sunderland and Leeds games which I considered freak results. But the manner of non-performance including and since Burton is probably more inexplicable and alarming than last season given prior form, so I understand why some won't buy that it's just the balance of the season.

 

 

[CyderInACan]

43 minutes ago, BRISTOL86 said:

They’re like the guy next door with the flashy car on a crippling lease and living the footballer’s lifestyle on the credit card, only a matter of time before it all comes crumbling down. 

I hope your neighbour isn't reading this . . . 

[BRISTOL86]

1 minute ago, CyderInACan said:

I hope your neighbour isn't reading this . . . 

I hope he is, the flashy**** (only kidding, my neighbours are lovely)  

[Bar BS3]

5 minutes ago, Olé said:

Although, at the risk of starting a separate debate, I think a lot of us had looked at the fixture list earlier in the season and expected specifically that the second half of our season would be easier. After New Years Day we had played 3 of the current top 4 away, and had already got both fixtures against the runaway leaders out of the way.

Admittedly trips to Boro and Millwall now appear far tougher, but only due to our own recent poor form. The long standing top six teams (I include us in that) that we had worried about all season, we weren't disgraced against. Our recent issue has been vs 4 of the bottom 5, which is why peaks and dips in form won't wash with some people*.

*Not saying that's me, I was amazed at the meltdown over the Sunderland and Leeds games which I considered freak results. But the manner of non-performance including and since Burton is probably more inexplicable and alarming than last season given prior form, so I understand why some won't buy that it's just the balance of the season.

 

 

I agree that since Burton it’s been concerning. I also agree that I wasn’t too bothered about Sunderland or Leeds (especially Leeds) 

Of course form and the other that it arrives in, changes the complexion of a season. But the facts are that bar a disastrous last 6 games, we will finish in the top half this season. That’s progress indeed. Of course, it doesn’t overshadow that there are currently concerns about next season, if we don’t regain a bit of form during the next 6 games. 

[Monkeh]

3 hours ago, RUSSEL85 said:

Agreed. They could well struggle in league 1, but they will be able to attract any player (of that level) they want so it maybe a complete clear out and start again with young, hungry league 1/bottom end champ players. It will be weird seeing a 48,000 seater stadium in that division though. Accrington Stanley away opening game of the season will bring it all home for them!

coventry said the same, look where they are

[GrahamC]

5 hours ago, Robbored said:

Who owns Sunderland and who makes the decision to sack one manager after another? 

At a guess I'd say they're owned by an overseas purchaser.

Thankfully we have SL as our owner.

 

Have you never heard of “Google” could save you lots of time..

[sephjnr]

2 hours ago, Wanderingred said:

Are you for real? Turn that the other way round and say "the only thing separating us from Wolves is our run since christmas. On that run until now, we would be in their position". See how utterly ridiculous that sounds?

It doesn't, not at all. Both viewpoints are technically correct. The real issue is another club's plight being used primarily by yourself to downplay the arse falling out of our season. We really should be looking at our own plight on its own merit, as others in this thread are trying to do. Bar BS3 clearly isn't interested, perhaps you might lend a hand by stating anything that I've said is categorically wrong?

[Robbored]

16 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Have you never heard of “Google” could save you lots of time..

Couldn't arsed as I'm not that bothered.