downendcity Posted July 12, 2018 Report Share Posted July 12, 2018 45 minutes ago, Neo said: Doesn’t say anything - just a video of him in a car - presumably being driven there or back looking very full of himself and assured. Could be smug happiness. Could be don’t give a toss arrogance. Who knows Could be spitting in the face of authority? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 The trouble is, if they do overturn the ban, they lose all credibility in future cases. What I think will happen is that the evidence will be deemed inconclusive and his ban will be reduced to something like two matches in an attempt to save face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 I can remember the game and the incident and there was no reaction from the player to suggest he had been spat at, nothing after the game and nothing before he got banned. its all a bit bizarre so I’m sure that must be some TV evidence of some sort to get a ban to stick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 Diedhou or Diedhou not ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View from the Dolman Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 9 hours ago, ncnsbcfc said: I reckon it must have been the 4th official. In which case we would need strong evidence to over turn the original decision. The charge will have been for something not seen by any match official. If the fourth official had seen it, he'd have reported it to the referee and would have been sent off at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Red Right Hand said: The trouble is, if they do overturn the ban, they lose all credibility in future cases. What I think will happen is that the evidence will be deemed inconclusive and his ban will be reduced to something like two matches in an attempt to save face. ...but this is Bristol City so it is just as likely they will find a way to punish Fammy, and us, even more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 14 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said: The charge will have been for something not seen by any match official. If the fourth official had seen it, he'd have reported it to the referee and would have been sent off at the time. Given some of the strange and unaccountable decisions at the WC, perhaps they were trailing VAR at the Brum match! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DT The Optimist Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 Having read this thread it is all bizarre and you trust someone will be allowed to say what did happen and how it got to a six match ban either the following must apply a player complained A member staff complained who witnessed it an official saw it A spectator saw it captured on film somewhere There simply had to be ‘evidence’ from someone to say he spat at opponent to get him banned. We might never know what it was but the club will know to defend it but not allowed to talk about it. We will find out soon I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 9 minutes ago, DT The Optimist said: Having read this thread it is all bizarre and you trust someone will be allowed to say what did happen and how it got to a six match ban either the following must apply a player complained A member staff complained who witnessed it an official saw it A spectator saw it captured on film somewhere There simply had to be ‘evidence’ from someone to say he spat at opponent to get him banned. We might never know what it was but the club will know to defend it but not allowed to talk about it. We will find out soon I think Absolutely there has to be some evidence somewhere and I can`t imagine if it was any of the first three on your list action would not have been taken at the time so it leaves the last two. The spectator thing I find hard to believe and I also can`t imagine that the FA have either the time or the inclination to go through the video of every match played just to see if something like this happened that was missed at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOZZYBCFC Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 Do you think Famara will play tomorrow? Will his inclusion / exclusion indicate the result of the appeal? Has anyone heard anything? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 5 hours ago, Red Right Hand said: Absolutely there has to be some evidence somewhere and I can`t imagine if it was any of the first three on your list action would not have been taken at the time so it leaves the last two. The spectator thing I find hard to believe and I also can`t imagine that the FA have either the time or the inclination to go through the video of every match played just to see if something like this happened that was missed at the time. It's a quasi-judicial process so they had better have conclusive evidence or they are open to a challenge in court I would think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 hour ago, DOZZYBCFC said: Do you think Famara will play tomorrow? Will his inclusion / exclusion indicate the result of the appeal? Has anyone heard anything? 1. Yes 2. No 3. No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC11 Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 If any official witnessed it at the time including the 4th official then the referee would of been told at the time and he’d of been sent off there and then. The thing that strikes me the most about all of this is IF Famara did spit at David Davies then he’s the type of character who’d be incensed and wouldn’t take it lightly at all, something clearly happened but going by DD reaction it wasn’t him being spat at. IF FD has done it then fair enough he deserves whatever punishment comes his way but as has been said by many others from the start this whole thing is abit fishy to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoystonFoote'snephew Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 hour ago, chinapig said: It's a quasi-judicial process so they had better have conclusive evidence or they are open to a challenge in court I would think. The only way this would see a courtroom (if the ban is upheld) would be if Famara would be prepared to file a civil action. But when it would actually reach court would be anyone’s guess. The UK courts are really not interested in becoming involved in internal football disciplinary matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC11 Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 8 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said: The only way this would see a courtroom (if the ban is upheld) would be if Famara would be prepared to file a civil action. But when it would actually reach court would be anyone’s guess. The UK courts are really not interested in becoming involved in internal football disciplinary matters. They should be after seeing some of the decisions The FA come out with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC11 Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 Same goes for FIFA fining the FA £50k for England players wearing ‘unauthorised’ socks this coming AFTER they fine the Russian FA a paltry £16k for racist chanting!! I find it absolutely incredible how they come to these decisions and how they decide on how much each association should be fined, whether or not anyone can look into this I don’t know but someone needs to as it’s a disgrace. Sorry for going off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoystonFoote'snephew Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 The thing is if matters ever reach the UK courts it is viewed more like an industrial tribunal. They don’t want to try the case, they just want to be assured that the correct disciplinary process was followed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 27 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said: The only way this would see a courtroom (if the ban is upheld) would be if Famara would be prepared to file a civil action. But when it would actually reach court would be anyone’s guess. The UK courts are really not interested in becoming involved in internal football disciplinary matters. It's a bit of a dilemma as the FA or EFL as the case may be is not the employer, rather more a regulatory body so it's not a matter for an Employment Tribunal. I suppose the Civil Court could take an interest in whether the process is reasonable and complied with but judges are not keen as you say. The risk otherwise is that there is a breach of natural justice, something of a kangaroo court, if the evidence is not clear cut and transparent. Not that I'm any kind of lawyer but I have never been comfortable with a body like the FA being effectively free from scrutiny by the courts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 hour ago, chinapig said: Not that I'm any kind of lawyer but I have never been comfortable with a body like the FA being effectively free from scrutiny by the courts. Two quite high profile and very experienced (in football matters) lawyers were recently appointed to the FA’s disciplinary panel....they had been involved in the Hillsborough case, sexual abuse in football cases, the alleged Bruce Grobbelaar bribery case etc etc....so I’m sure the FA aren’t ‘free from scrutiny’ by any court.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 13, 2018 Report Share Posted July 13, 2018 27 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Two quite high profile and very experienced (in football matters) lawyers were recently appointed to the FA’s disciplinary panel....they had been involved in the Hillsborough case, sexual abuse in football cases, the alleged Bruce Grobbelaar bribery case etc etc....so I’m sure the FA aren’t ‘free from scrutiny’ by any court.... I'm not querying the credentials of the FA lawyers, rather that as a body it in effect has it's own court whose procedures and decisions the Civil Courts are reluctant to get involved in. In other contexts individuals and companies have access to the Civil Courts so it seems anomalous that a body like the FA is in practice free from the scrutiny of the same courts. If an individual or club believes an injustice has been done what further recourse do they have? If none, what does that mean for natural justice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 7 hours ago, chinapig said: I'm not querying the credentials of the FA lawyers, rather that as a body it in effect has it's own court whose procedures and decisions the Civil Courts are reluctant to get involved in. In other contexts individuals and companies have access to the Civil Courts so it seems anomalous that a body like the FA is in practice free from the scrutiny of the same courts. If an individual or club believes an injustice has been done what further recourse do they have? If none, what does that mean for natural justice? In my profession I am subject to audits and regulation by an oversight body and could be subject to disciplinary action by them if I transgress so much like the FA`s role in football. If this happens and I am unhappy with their decision I can take my case to an independent adjudicator with no connection either to me or the regulatory body - a bit like an ombudsman in the public sector. I`m not sure if the FA operate a similar system or not but they should do. It would be interesting if anyone on here is in a profession (legal?, financial?, medical?) who is subject to similar regulatory systems as I am, to find out what happens in those where a disciplinary decision goes against the accused and they are not satisfied with it - after all, a footballer is in effect just another skilled professional. The other consideration is would the PFA get involved? If not they should do and maybe they already are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loco Rojo Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 On 13/07/2018 at 06:20, Red Right Hand said: The trouble is, if they do overturn the ban, they lose all credibility in future cases. That's assuming they had any credibility in the first place! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asfred Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 35 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: In my profession I am subject to audits and regulation by an oversight body and could be subject to disciplinary action by them if I transgress so much like the FA`s role in football. If this happens and I am unhappy with their decision I can take my case to an independent adjudicator with no connection either to me or the regulatory body - a bit like an ombudsman in the public sector. I`m not sure if the FA operate a similar system or not but they should do. It would be interesting if anyone on here is in a profession (legal?, financial?, medical?) who is subject to similar regulatory systems as I am, to find out what happens in those where a disciplinary decision goes against the accused and they are not satisfied with it - after all, a footballer is in effect just another skilled professional. The other consideration is would the PFA get involved? If not they should do and maybe they already are. There is The Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS), which is an independent body that provides services to resolve sports related disputes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS3_RED Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 Banned upheld. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selred Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 There must be evidence and we have to accept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 9 minutes ago, Selred said: There must be evidence and we have to accept it. The club are describing it as very limited evidence. If the FA believe it is sufficient to convict I assume they will publish their decision so we can all know what the evidence is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selred Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 Just now, chinapig said: The club are describing it as very limited evidence. If the FA believe it is sufficient to convict I assume they will publish their decision so we can all know what the evidence is. Why should they? They have had enough to charge him, and for it Diedhiou to remained banned. We have to accept it and move on now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoystonFoote'snephew Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 Does anyone know what the disciplinary panel looks at on appeal? I suspect they don’t look again at the whole case, but instead only look at whether there is sufficient evidence on appeal to overturn or reduce the original ban. The onus therefore may not have been on the FA to prove it’s case, but on City to prove otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jayjay Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 BP states that ban has been upheld. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric04 Posted July 14, 2018 Report Share Posted July 14, 2018 Statement on the OS. It was posted yesterday so has no one noticed it until today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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